Top of the World Lounge at Bay Lake Tower at Contemporary Resort - *2 New Parties Added! “Enchantment at the Top” & New “Bound to Be Bad” Dates Added

[Jenglish13]

It’s not about what Disney/dvd/Dvc CAN do, it’s about what those entities doing what is right.

Disney is an extremely liberal company in so many ways… until it comes to the folks that cannot quite afford all the extra expense.

Yes, most here can afford a direct purchase, but that extra expense may be the detriment of a college tuition, a home improvement, or retirement.
Funds are not unlimited for most folks.

I'm with you on the just because you can doesn't mean you should thing. Homer once bragged to Marge, I told you I could deep fry my shirt. And Marge replied, I didn't say you couldn't, I said you shouldn't! I don't see why this is necessary or how it diminishes the value by allowing the local home resort owners of all classes to retain access. You can still market it as a direct buy perk. Regardless of legal or business justification no one will ever convince me it's not a petty crappy thing to do. Again, not about the bar about the principle.

With that said I disagree to an extent about affordability though. Not everyone can afford a Ferrari and some of us have to buy Toyotas (proud Toyota owner here!). I don't resent those who can afford a more luxurious experience, I resent that DVD felt the need to remove the existing luxury from all to enhance the experience of the few. And as some have mentioned to console me... We don't really need to go to a rooftop bar to enjoy the overall experience. In an ironic way, the smallness of it is kind of what makes it so offensive to me.

 

[Sandisw]

I'm with you on the just because you can doesn't mean you should thing. Homer once bragged to Marge, I told you I could deep fry my shirt. And Marge replied, I didn't say you couldn't, I said you shouldn't! I don't see why this is necessary or how it diminishes the value by allowing the local home resort owners of all classes to retain access. You can still market it as a direct buy perk. Regardless of legal or business justification no one will ever convince me it's not a petty crappy thing to do. Again, not about the bar about the principle.

With that said I disagree to an extent about affordability though. Not everyone can afford a Ferrari and some of us have to buy Toyotas (proud Toyota owner here!). I don't resent those who can afford a more luxurious experience, I resent that DVD felt the need to remove the existing luxury from all to enhance the experience of the few. And as some have mentioned to console me... We don't really need to go to a rooftop bar to enjoy the overall experience. In an ironic way, the smallness of it is kind of what makes it so offensive to me.

I am going to through another question at you! Since this has always been run by Disney...not DVD...what would your response have been if Disney simply said, "We didn't make enough money so we are not interested in opening it?' It will remain closed. Like the Attic at BWV, or Reunion Station at WL.

Would you still be as bothered by the decision?

The restriction to TOTWL only FEELS different because at one point, all DVC owners could go. But, even then, it wasn't part of membership magic program. It was more Disney agreeing to keep cash guests out.

 

[tjkraz]

I don't see why this is necessary or how it diminishes the value by allowing the local home resort owners of all classes to retain access. You can still market it as a direct buy perk. Regardless of legal or business justification no one will ever convince me it's not a petty crappy thing to do. Again, not about the bar about the principle.

I don't see DVC allowing loopholes to the Membership Magic restrictions. You're focused on TOTWL access for BLT owners but there are dozens of other examples which already exist.

SSR resale owners don't get dining discounts at The Turf Club. BWV owners don't get Surrey bike rental discounts on the BW. As noted in my prior post, CCV and BRV resale owners could not participate in animation classes or wine tastings at Reunion Station.

The appropriateness of it is neither here nor there. I simply don't envision a scenario where DVC creates this wide-ranging series of exceptions where non-qualifying resale owners have access to perks at their Home resort while being blocked from others.

 

[Lumee23]

As a newer (direct) member I have never been to TOTWL and I am excited about the villain idea and hoping it works out well. That being said I think the move to cut out resale kind of sucks. While I understand Disney can do it, to me it feels bad that people who own at BLT but don't have blue card benefits can't utilize the space. Personally, I would much rather them come up with new perk ideas to give to direct members rather than taking away a perk from all members to make it direct exclusive.

I am curious though, with all the comments on TOTWL not being profitable, could DVD been forced to take it over in order to keep it open? If Disney was going to close it (or move it to a special event venue only) and the only option was to fund it through DVD marketing budget then this move would make more sense to me.

 

[supersnoop]

The restriction to TOTWL only FEELS different because at one point, all DVC owners could go. But, even then, it wasn't part of membership magic program.

That's not why it feels different; that's why it is different. This is the first time there was some benefit of membership that was taken away from an existing class of members. With every other resale restriction, nothing was ever taken away, but rather it was changed going forward. This is the first time that existing owners will feel a loss.

 

[Sandisw]

That's not why it feels different; that's why it is different. This is the first time there was some benefit of membership that was taken away from an existing class of members. With every other resale restriction, nothing was ever taken away, but rather it was changed going forward. This is the first time that existing owners will feel a loss.

What I was referring to is the notion that BLT owners should be given access to the lounge because they own there. Since they had access before it closed is what makes it feel like this is different situation for those resale owners....but its the same as BWV owners losing access to the Attic...or CCV/BRV losing access to Reunion Station. So, denying owners access to commercial spaces, including lounges at their home resorts is not new. And applying it to TOTWL is not unique.

What is new is that this is now being run by DVD as part of membership extras (it wasn't prior to closure...Disney operated it). ....though as posted above, Reunion Station did open only to those with membership extras.....so even then, there has been space at a resort that resale owners couldn't access.

 

[Jenglish13]

I am happy you are coming to terms with the realities and at least have been able to find a small bit of humor..the Batman and Robin picture?? OMG. Lol

But, again, how is this any different than Toppolinos for me as a RIV owner?

A reservation is what is needed and if I don’t have it, no matter how much I paid for DVC, I can’t enter.

TOTWL lounge is now BLTs Toppolinos. It requires a “reservation “ which is open ended. And what is that “reservation”? A DVC Y notation in your Magic Mobile pass.

ETA: And it’s not about the fact that at least we all can try to to Toppolinos..the end result is the same. As an owner there I get absolutely no priority over any other person, including cash guests, to go in without the necessary reservation.

Oh, I find a ton of humor in it! That's gonna be me and hilltopper up there with the grappling hooks and suction cups!

How is it different? I don't think it is technically, factually or legally. Why do I think or feel differently about it? I don't know anything about Riviera or this other restaurant aside from what you tell me, but right off the bat you're allowed to go. Reservation or no reservation I cannot go totwl. That's a big distinction. The other thing is that Riviera and toppolino are new and have always had these policies in place since the beginning (I'm assuming this). And finally in that same vein it's not something that's been taken away from anyone. I don't know anything at all about the attic at BWV, was that available to all members previously and only blue card members now? I realize these don't mean anything legally and technically, it's a psychological thing I guess. But all I can tell you is how I see it and why.

 

[Sandisw]

As a newer (direct) member I have never been to TOTWL and I am excited about the villain idea and hoping it works out well. That being said I think the move to cut out resale kind of sucks. While I understand Disney can do it, to me it feels bad that people who own at BLT but don't have blue card benefits can't utilize the space. Personally, I would much rather them come up with new perk ideas to give to direct members rather than taking away a perk from all members to make it direct exclusive.

I am curious though, with all the comments on TOTWL not being profitable, could DVD been forced to take it over in order to keep it open? If Disney was going to close it (or move it to a special event venue only) and the only option was to fund it through DVD marketing budget then this move would make more sense to me.

That is a real possibility. One of the reasons it has not yet opened is because Disney was in charge of running it. It was their profit/loss so they controlled its operation. Initially, they wanted it limited to those with DVC who were staying at BLT, but it didn't make Disney money, so they changed the rules to allow all DVC owners staying on property to go. The money it took in is what funded it. And, they simply have not had the staff (and maybe desire) to open it if they didn't feel it was going to turn a profit.

Now that DVD is running it as membership magic, the need to make money isn't the same as it was when Disney ran it. Just like the Epcot lounge makes no money for DVD, but they have to pay Disney to lease that space.

I would bet that DVD is reimbursing Disney quite a bit from their own marketing budget (or other funds) to take over the space to offer as membership extras. I think that is also way paid events for members will be offered more often here to help offset the cost of what they are now paying.

And, maybe that is the piece that makes it disappointing because prior to the closure, DVD didn't care who went because they didn't have to pay. Now that they do, they are going to treat it like any other membership extra....limit it to those eligible.

 

[hilltopper152]

It’s not about what Disney/dvd/Dvc CAN do, it’s about what those entities doing what is right.

Disney is an extremely liberal company in so many ways… until it comes to the folks that cannot quite afford all the extra expense.

Yes, most here can afford a direct purchase, but that extra expense may be the detriment of a college tuition, a home improvement, or retirement.
Funds are not unlimited for most folks.

They are liberal when it's convenient and conservative when it hurts them. Ha but they for sure don't care about making dreams come true for most families. They are a business and that's okay but not sure I see as many heart warming stories or public work as I use to unless it's a supportive tweet lol

 

[hilltopper152]

Oh, I find a ton of humor in it! That's gonna be me and hilltopper up there with the grappling hooks and suction cups!

How is it different? I don't think it is technically, factually or legally. Why do I think or feel differently about it? I don't know anything about Riviera or this other restaurant aside from what you tell me, but right off the bat you're allowed to go. Reservation or no reservation I cannot go totwl. That's a big distinction. The other thing is that Riviera and toppolino are new and have always had these policies in place since the beginning (I'm assuming this). And finally in that same vein it's not something that's been taken away from anyone. I don't know anything at all about the attic at BWV, was that available to all members previously and only blue card members now? I realize these don't mean anything legally and technically, it's a psychological thing I guess. But all I can tell you is how I see it and why.

I will be there with you or handing $10 to the couple that let's my family slide up as guest just so I can see the top of "my" building. Yeah most exclusive places I can still go with a reservation but here I simply cannot go unless that party thing I guess. In fact that may be what I do one time so I don't have to buy direct to check it off my list but probably not because I am too salty to hand that money over. BLT shows photos and ads highlighting the top.floor views so it feels like it is the selling point along with walking distance so that is why it feels like such a big deal to me. Yes there is room categories I can upgrade to but it will never not feel petty even if I understand the reason.

 

[hilltopper152]

You can lose all perks: "surely they want take away my access to buy alcohol at 7pm on Tuesday when I own and stay there.... Not going to worry" fast forward to PC (post covid or the great reimagining) and it's gone. I look dumb after only 2 years.

 

[Sandisw]

Oh, I find a ton of humor in it! That's gonna be me and hilltopper up there with the grappling hooks and suction cups!

How is it different? I don't think it is technically, factually or legally. Why do I think or feel differently about it? I don't know anything about Riviera or this other restaurant aside from what you tell me, but right off the bat you're allowed to go. Reservation or no reservation I cannot go totwl. That's a big distinction. The other thing is that Riviera and toppolino are new and have always had these policies in place since the beginning (I'm assuming this). And finally in that same vein it's not something that's been taken away from anyone. I don't know anything at all about the attic at BWV, was that available to all members previously and only blue card members now? I realize these don't mean anything legally and technically, it's a psychological thing I guess. But all I can tell you is how I see it and why.

The Attic was a lounge and then closed. Its only available for private parties. I tried to clarify what I said above, but I am referring to owners having access to something simply because it is located at their home resort.

I know that everyone can go to Toppolinos...that part is true. And it does make it different that no one is shut out.

But, my point is they built a restaurant up there and as an owner, I am blocked from using the deck outside. Being an owner makes no difference. If I want to go up there, I have to make a reservation to eat there.

Now, of course, TOTWL has restrictions on who can visit...and that does make it different that Toppolinos...but it doesn't make it different from the standpoint of whether as owners, we should never be blocked out from visiting any of the commercial places at our home resorts.

So, if BLT owners should be given the courtesy of TOTWL access because they are owners, regardless of the entrance rules, then I should be able to access Toppolino's outside deck without needing a reservation to eat there....CCV/BRV owners should be able to use Reunion Station, even if it is closed...the list goes on....

Again, when Disney ran it, and had to make money, they allowed all members to go there...but DVD runs it now and they changed the rules. It stinks for resale owners, and especially BLT owners, like yourself, who never really thought about loss of access.. and who knows, maybe someday they will change it so that resale owners can pay a fee each year to qualify for membership extras...it would be interesting to see what level of interest...and at what price...resale owners would do it.

The other interesting piece moving forward will be whether or not "capacity" is capped to the lounge and not the deck....it always allowed people to go up as long as the deck wasn't full...wonder know if they will limit it to actual seats?? Like they do with the Epcot lounge...if they seats are full, they don't allow members to just go up and stand....

Special Access to the Top of the World Lounge – A Villains Lair is available to eligible Members on a first-come, first-served basis until the lounge reaches capacity. Wonder how this will be defined

Here is another tidbit I didn't really process:

Eligible Members and their guests staying on that Member’s reservation are eligible. Each eligible Membership can enjoy Top of the World Lounge access for one party per day—which can include eligible Members and guests staying on that Member's reservation. At least one Member in the traveling party must accompany the group and present their current MagicBand, digital Membership card and government-issued photo ID in order to gain admission to the lounge and observation deck. A Digital Disney Vacation Club Membership Card is also required to verify Membership eligibility

Could this mean they will limit the groups and once you leave, you can't go back? Or, your whole party on your reservation need to be present at the same time to go up? Interesting to see how it works.

 

[hilltopper152]

The Attic was a lounge and then closed. Its only available for private parties. I tried to clarify what I said above, but I am referring to owners having access to something simply because it is located at their home resort.

I know that everyone can go to Toppolinos...that part is true. And it does make it different that no one is shut out.

But, my point is they built a restaurant up there and as an owner, I am blocked from using the deck outside. Being an owner makes no difference. If I want to go up there, I have to make a reservation to eat there.

Now, of course, TOTWL has restrictions on who can visit...and that does make it different that Toppolinos...but it doesn't make it different from the standpoint of whether as owners, we should never be blocked out from visiting any of the commercial places at our home resorts.

So, if BLT owners should be given the courtesy of TOTWL access because they are owners, regardless of the entrance rules, then I should be able to access Toppolino's outside deck without needing a reservation to eat there....CCV/BRV owners should be able to use Reunion Station, even if it is closed...the list goes on....

Again, when Disney ran it, and had to make money, they allowed all members to go there...but DVD runs it now and they changed the rules. It stinks for resale owners, and especially BLT owners, like yourself, who never really thought about loss of access.. and who knows, maybe someday they will change it so that resale owners can pay a fee each year to qualify for membership extras...it would be interesting to see what level of interest...and at what price...resale owners would do it.

Not sure with current perks I would pay for a upgrade in perks unless it offered real discounts to tickets too or in park perks of some sort. My trips are more park based in nature and exclusive pieces like that may be nice.

Also maybe you can argue for Toppolinos but don't get greedy... It is already nice without it there. Maybe BLT resale owners will band together and form one ultimate "Karen" cry for special treatment. It may just work

 

[Sandisw]

Not sure with current perks I would pay for a upgrade in perks unless it offered real discounts to tickets too or in park perks of some sort. My trips are more park based in nature and exclusive pieces like that may be nice.

Also maybe you can argue for Toppolinos but don't get greedy... It is already nice without it there. Maybe BLT resale owners will band together and form one ultimate "Karen" cry for special treatment. It may just work

LOL...I think even those of us direct will be seeing changes to membership extras...I think blue card benefits are going to be the ones that we get for free now (including Sorcerer AP)...but you can upgrade to platinum for a fee...nd now get ticket discounts, including off the Incredi-pass, larger shopping and dining discounts, and some other types of enhanced services...maybe a conceirge team that will booking dining, etc. for you.

I guess we will see what the future brings! All I know is I go back to WDW July 20th and can't wait to visit!!!

 

[Wiltony]

The interesting thing about the "paid blue-card perks" rumor is that the transaction (material consideration) would put Disney in a position where it was obligated to provide those paid-for perks, as compared to now where they have complete, unilateral discretion to add/remove perks at any time. Yes it might get them a little more money, but they might not like being locked into promises that they're currently able to change at a whim.

 

[Sandisw]

The interesting thing about the "paid blue-card perks" rumor is that the transaction (material consideration) would put Disney in a position where it was obligated to provide those paid-for perks, as compared to now where they have complete, unilateral discretion to add/remove perks at any time. Yes it might get them a little more money, but they might not like being locked into promises that they're currently able to change at a whim.

That is a good point and since many of the benefits require third party agreements, they would need to be on board as well. For example, ticket discounts. DPEP would have to agree to allow those all the time. And, we have seen with the suspension of the AP, they don't make exceptions for DVC.

The current rules do state that a fee can be charged, and that they can also be eliminated at any time, without notice. So, DVD could get away with it based on what is there...but I do agree it then makes it harder to draw the line in the sand for changes or termination, when owners have paid you for something.

 

[Jenglish13]

I am going to through another question at you! Since this has always been run by Disney...not DVD...what would your response have been if Disney simply said, "We didn't make enough money so we are not interested in opening it?' It will remain closed. Like the Attic at BWV, or Reunion Station at WL.

Would you still be as bothered by the decision?

The restriction to TOTWL only FEELS different because at one point, all DVC owners could go. But, even then, it wasn't part of membership magic program. It was more Disney agreeing to keep cash guests out.

I would've been disappointed by that decision but not as upset by it because I wouldn't have felt snubbed. But no I'm not of the mind that if I can't have something I don't want anyone else to have it either. I don't get my jollies excluding others! (Sorry couldn't resist!) I do think the timing adds a degree of annoyance for me. I don't even have my points yet! Me and DVC are off to a rocky start! But it's a good lesson to learn, the provider of my product has zero respect or concern for my satisfaction. I'm nothing but a missed opportunity to them to have profited from. Although, like I said they're first official communication to me was literally a solicitation so I guess they'll keep trying! Lesson learned, I'll try to adjust my expectations going forward accordingly.

Now let me ask you... Is there any other space in all of WDW or DL (with the exception of the Epcot lounge) where white card members are not allowed to enter that blue card members are? If not, I suspect you're right there will be more coming.

 

[Mike valera]

SanDisw was Toppolinos ever a perk?
Did Dvc ever take Toppolinos away?
Then why do you keep bringing it up it was never a perk so it's not the same as totwl . Nobody is asking to go to Toppolinos if you want to go make a reservation. Last time I check dvc did not care about resale restrictions until a few years ago and grandfather in those resale members. Now they just take away!

 

[Sandisw]

I would've been disappointed by that decision but not as upset by it because I wouldn't have felt snubbed. But no I'm not of the mind that if I can't have something I don't want anyone else to have it either. I don't get my jollies excluding others! (Sorry couldn't resist!) I do think the timing adds a degree of annoyance for me. I don't even have my points yet! Me and DVC are off to a rocky start! But it's a good lesson to learn, the provider of my product has zero respect or concern for my satisfaction. I'm nothing but a missed opportunity to them to have profited from. Although, like I said they're first official communication to me was literally a solicitation so I guess they'll keep trying! Lesson learned, I'll try to adjust my expectations going forward accordingly.

Now let me ask you... Is there any other space in all of WDW or DL (with the exception of the Epcot lounge) where white card members are not allowed to enter that blue card members are? If not, I suspect you're right there will be more coming.

Currently, no. The last one was Reunion Station at WL which held special events only for those eligible....there was a fee, but not all DVC owners could attend. And, I think there have been other special events that were part of membership extras...IIRC, one occurred at TOTWL for 4th of July.

 

[Jenglish13]

I don't see DVC allowing loopholes to the Membership Magic restrictions. You're focused on TOTWL access for BLT owners but there are dozens of other examples which already exist.

SSR resale owners don't get dining discounts at The Turf Club. BWV owners don't get Surrey bike rental discounts on the BW. As noted in my prior post, CCV and BRV resale owners could not participate in animation classes or wine tastings at Reunion Station.

The appropriateness of it is neither here nor there. I simply don't envision a scenario where DVC creates this wide-ranging series of exceptions where non-qualifying resale owners have access to perks at their Home resort while being blocked from others.

Yeah I mostly get it but discounts is not the same as access. I think that's what's rubbing some the wrong way, that's the issue for me at least. SSR owners could still go to the turf club I presume?
I'll be honest with you, if they made totwl an open bar for blue card and cash bar for the rest in order to fund it, I'd be fine with that. At least there's a choice. There's just something about the whole "welcome home" thing but you're not welcome here.
I meant to ask this in response to Sandi but I forgot, if totwl was not profitable what the hell were they doing with it? Why were they restricting anyone from an unprofitable cash bar!? I guess people have said guests would just congregate and watch the fireworks and not buy anything? I'd much prefer drink/order minimums or reservations than restrictions but that's obviously because of my status. Was it always only open at night? Surprised they didn't use it for breakfast or quick service within the resort at other times. Strange not to be able to turn a profit with such a prime location.

All these other places, attic, reunion etc. is there anything special or distinguishing about them? The loss of Totwl bums me out over the views not the bar.