Tickets Blocked For Entering Two Parks In a Short Timeframe

[dieumeye]

It's definitely not close to the first day. I've been seeing people report this happening for a few months. But definitely new in the sense not all CMs seem even totally aware of it and likely still tweaking it.

Still trying to locate the thread I read previously that mentioned this coming up.

Thanks for doing an experiment! I would love to see more experiments too if anyone is willing with other times between. I wanted to my last trip back in January, but it was my last trip before letting my pass lapse so I couldn't bring myself to give up the time .

Sorry. I didn’t mean that the entire idea of a ticket or pass being flagged was new, but that there are recent new/changed procedures in place that CMs are still learning.

I don’t know what the specifics of the old versus new is, other than what I was told above. But it seems like things might be a little more strict now, at least for APs, than they were. Although, like I said, it didn’t happen when I did the monorail to maingate scan. It only happened when I purposely went directly gate to gate, which is something most people would never have any need to actually do.

I am curious whether scanning in at the GCH DCA entrance and rushing directly to the Disneyland main gate would automatically trigger this. Didn’t test of that today. Maybe next time.

 

[Kender]

Sorry. I didn’t mean that the entire idea of a ticket or pass being flagged was new, but that there are recent new/changed procedures in place that CMs are still learning.

I don’t know what the specifics of the old versus new is, other than what I was told above. But it seems like things might be a little more strict now, at least for APs, than they were. Although, like I said, it didn’t happen when I did the monorail to maingate scan. It only happened when I purposely went directly gate to gate, which is something most people would never have any need to actually do.

I am curious whether scanning in at the GCH DCA entrance and rushing directly to the Disneyland main gate would automatically trigger this. Didn’t test of that today. Maybe next time.

Actually it's functioning very much like I saw reported the last few months. That it's within minutes of going from DL to DCA (or vice versa). Basically anything less than 5-10 minutes from scan to scan. It just seems that more people are getting caught in it as time goes on and more are becoming aware of it as a result.

From your experiment, monorail to maingate DL shouldn't trigger it. That's a DL gate to DL gate.

The time between DL to DCA was 30 minutes. That shouldn't trigger it either. Plenty of time between.

Then from DCA to DL was 60 minutes. Again, shouldn't trigger it.

Back to DCA from DL immediately after scanning into DL (after being in DCA for an hour) triggered it.

The way you described it explained to you was that you were showing checked in to DL. Not checked in through one DL gate or the other. It seems to be tied purely to changing parks too quickly. Which I find, as I think on it more, confusing as why keep it to only hopping? Maybe it is there, but the required time frame is even less between scans?

 

[dieumeye]

Actually it's functioning very much like I saw reported the last few months. That it's within minutes of going from DL to DCA (or vice versa). Basically anything less than 5-10 minutes from scan to scan. It just seems that more people are getting caught in it as time goes on and more are becoming aware of it as a result.

From your experiment, monorail to maingate DL shouldn't trigger it. That's a DL gate to DL gate.

The time between DL to DCA was 30 minutes. That shouldn't trigger it either. Plenty of time between.

Then from DCA to DL was 60 minutes. Again, shouldn't trigger it.

Back to DCA from DL immediately after scanning into DL (after being in DCA for an hour) triggered it.

The way you described it explained to you was that you were showing checked in to DL. Not checked in through one DL gate or the other. It seems to be tied purely to changing parks too quickly. Which I find, as I think on it more, confusing as why keep it to only hopping? Maybe it is there, but the required time frame is even less between scans?

The CM at the gate said they have recently changed the process for when/if they have to call a senior CM to do override. That’s the only part that I know has had some kind a recent change, at least according to the CM today. Now, who knows what “recent“ means, and maybe this is the first time this particular CM has run into this issue “recently“, but it was explained to her, and me, by the senior CM that the gate CMs do not have to call over a senior CM to do an override on a regular ticket, but have to call over one to do an override on an AP. Of course, these kind of things can fluctuate and change daily based on the desired scrutiny levels.

I agree that gate to gate at the same park should have the same trigger. Or even a more strict trigger. Because that’s actually more suspicious than park to park. I didn’t test that though, other than the monorail to maingate, but perhaps that few minutes was enough time.

I feel bad for the gate CMs. There is so much they seem to deal with. Just today, one of them was dealing with a huge party of at least a dozen people, had been handed an unorganized wad of wrinkled printouts, and was trying - through a language barrier – to explain to them how to enter the park while unwrinkling their papers. And I saw another CM explaining to a man at the exit that he could not go into the park if he did not have his ticket with him, even if he had been in the park earlier that day. He was not happy.

 

[Kender]

The CM at the gate said they have recently changed the process for when/if they have to call a senior CM to do override. That’s the only part that I know has had some kind a recent change, at least according to the CM today. Now, who knows what “recent“ means, and maybe this is the first time this particular CM has run into this issue “recently“, but it was explained to her, and me, by the senior CM that the gate CMs do not have to call over a senior CM to do an override on a regular ticket, but have to call over one to do an override on an AP. Of course, these kind of things can fluctuate and change daily based on the desired scrutiny levels.

I agree that gate to gate at the same park should have the same trigger. Or even a more strict trigger. Because that’s actually more suspicious than park to park. I didn’t test that though, other than the monorail to maingate, but perhaps that few minutes was enough time.

I feel bad for the gate CMs. There is so much they seem to deal with. Just today, one of them was dealing with a huge party of at least a dozen people, had been handed an unorganized wad of wrinkled printouts, and was trying - through a language barrier – to explain to them how to enter the park while unwrinkling their papers. And I saw another CM explaining to a man at the exit that he could not go into the park if he did not have his ticket with him, even if he had been in the park earlier that day. He was not happy.

Oh! Okay. Yeah. I see my confusion on what you meant. That's still the same, by the way, too. Needing a senior CM to handle it. When I was reading about it a few months ago, they needed one then too as the gate CM couldn't do anything. I haven't seen reports about ticketed guests, though, so it's interesting about the gate CM being able to handle those. No idea if that's been routine or is new. But APs have definitely required someone more senior.

Definitely should be so much more suspicious going into the same park so close to scans! If you ever want to experiment again, that would be one I'd be very curious about: scanning in at maingate then, exit, then immediately scan back in at maingate. If the block exists, I'm guessing the walk from monorail to maingate might have been just enough to not trigger it?

And oh goodness yes! It's a big reason I will do my best to not make a CM's life harder (although I'll be honest experimenting like I suggested above probably doesn't help...). I have only issued a few complaints ever and never with a name. And only if I have a compliment (with a name) to give at the same time. I just can't imagine what those gate CMs go through. Especially with this entry restriction added on that has apparently not been shared with all CMs (as there are a few reports of CM confusion regarding why entry is blocked).

I do wonder when this actually went into effect. The reports have been quite sporadic.

 

[tarheelalum]

I was curious about people getting held up at the gate after entering DCA to go through to Disneyland, so I emailed Disney Guest Services and asked them about it. We have been considering staying at the Grand, or rather my wife has, and I wanted to know if this was policy or just some random thing. And it turns out this really is a new security policy.

I suspect they are suggesting to go through the Downtown Disney entrance due to it often takes more time during the day with all of the non hotel guests going in and out of the downtown Disney security entrance from DCA to look around.

But on the bright side of things, at least for me, this pretty much guarantees that we won't be staying at the grand this fall so I will save some serious money !!



##### ######## (Disney)

Apr 18, 1:53 PM EDT

Dear #####,

Thank you for contacting us regarding your Annual Pass for the Disneyland Resort.

Currently, there are no restrictions on Park Hopping when using a valid Annual Pass. It is likely that your friends were held up at the main gate due to new security policies that look for suspicious activity with Annual Pass admission. While the situation that occurred may be different, there should be no issue with using your own Annual Pass to enter either Theme Park or park hop on a valid admission day when no block outs have been listed for your pass type.

However if a delay in time to get into the parks is your concern, I may recommend if you intend to visit Disneyland and are only entering Disney California Adventure as a way to walk through to Disneyland, that you instead use the hotel's entrance into the Downtown Disney area and then either take advantage of the monorail entrance into the Theme Park or the main gate as these options would generally be faster to get into Disneyland and start your day.

I hope this information helps and that your next visit is filled with magic.

Best Regards,

##### ########
Guest Correspondence
Disneyland Resort

 

[cruisehopeful]

I guess I don't think like a criminal. I cannot imagine why going into DCA and then directly into DL would be suspicious.

 

[msteddom]

I guess I don't think like a criminal. I cannot imagine why going into DCA and then directly into DL would be suspicious.

Disney is worried about the following scenario:

I enter DCA, then (somehow) manage to hand my pass off to someone else who enters Disneyland. So there are now two people who have gained entry to a park on one pass.

I don’t really see how this could be easily done, especially because all tickets and passes have pictures associated with them, but it must happen often enough for Disney Security to put this policy in place.

 

[dieumeye]

Disney is worried about the following scenario:

I enter DCA, then (somehow) manage to hand my pass off to someone else who enters Disneyland. So there are now two people who have gained entry to a park on one pass.

I don’t really see how this could be easily done, especially because all tickets and passes have pictures associated with them, but it must happen often enough for Disney Security to put this policy in place.

You don’t have to hand off the physical ticket. One pass can be scanned into multiple phones in the app. So, if two people (siblings, friends) look similar enough, they could both have the same ticket scanned into their phones and both enter on the same ticket.

It’s something you hear about people doing, but seems like it wouldn’t really happen all that often. Yet it must happen enough that they are implementing measures to combat it.

 

[theluckyrabbit]

I would think there also is concern about the upcoming split park blockout this summer. That hasn't happened before, and with SWGE opening, I can imagine Disney wanting to make sure that they can catch guests who are trying to get around their AP blockout from DL by using someone else's pass.

 

[midnight star]

I would think there also is concern about the upcoming split park blockout this summer. That hasn't happened before, and with SWGE opening, I can imagine Disney wanting to make sure that they can catch guests who are trying to get around their AP blockout from DL by using someone else's pass.

Wow I didn’t even think of that!

 

[tarheelalum]

If this is such a big problem Disney could use technology to put a stop to this without adversely impacting any of their guests. A number of years ago we had passes at Seaworld and we used a finger print scanner to enter the park. I worked for a place 20 years ago that had a retina scanner to enter the building so the technology is in wide use and has been for years. Other then trying to do it on the cheap, there is no good reason to continuing doing it this way and impacting guest's park experience.

 

[theluckyrabbit]

The finger scanners were discussed years ago. At the time, the project was dismissed/put on hold because there wasn't a good way to keep non-guests from trying to enter the parks without the turnstiles as a barrier. Think homeless people from Harbor waltzing up to the gates. This was before security became what it is now, so I don't know if the scanner idea has been revisited. I think Dave Koenig had an article on this at the time.
Of course, if there weren't any APs trying to game the system, this policy wouldn't be necessary in the first place.

 

[only hope]

The finger scanners were discussed years ago. At the time, the project was dismissed/put on hold because there wasn't a good way to keep non-guests from trying to enter the parks without the turnstiles as a barrier. Think homeless people from Harbor waltzing up to the gates. This was before security became what it is now, so I don't know if the scanner idea has been revisited. I think Dave Koenig had an article on this at the time.
Of course, if there weren't any APs trying to game the system, this policy wouldn't be necessary in the first place.

But a place can have both fingerprint scans and a turnstile. Before the era of rf technology and Magic Bands, WDW had turnstyles and fingerprint scans. It was very strange to us at first when WDW switched to tap stations with no turnstiles. Universal Orlando still has a turnstile/fingerprint set up.

 

[Disney_Alli]

Disney is worried about the following scenario:

I enter DCA, then (somehow) manage to hand my pass off to someone else who enters Disneyland. So there are now two people who have gained entry to a park on one pass.

I don’t really see how this could be easily done, especially because all tickets and passes have pictures associated with them, but it must happen often enough for Disney Security to put this policy in place.

This would be beyond simple for me. My identical twin sister and I travel to Disneyland together and buy just one ticket or AP. I go to the gate with my ticket on my phone and scan in. 5 minutes later my sister walks up to another gate and scans in using the same ticket loaded into the app. We're twins so the picture matches and we're both in - we can't really use Fastpasses but we saved so much money on tickets who cares.


***Note I said it would be simple for me. I never said we'd ever even consider doing this and I absolutely do not advocate doing this - it's fraud and it's wrong.
***Yes I really am an identical twin and people who know us well have trouble telling us apart in pictures.

 

[wench]

I met a CM in DL park as a guest on the 60th anniversary. We got to chatting & she admitted that she was there using her twin’s AP because CMs were blocked out that day. So, it does happen. I must say in her scenario I didn’t judge. It was sad that CMs had to miss the special day. And since she came alone, her sister & her weren’t double dipping on the same pass, the same day. But for the most part, I’m a stickler on the rules & don’t understand why it can be so hard for others to just follow them.

 

[cmwade77]

Over the past few months, I've been hearing on Facebook groups that Disneyland is really cracking down on AP abuse. Started with the resellers. Now, I've consistently heard stories of people who will use their pass for a discount for a wife or husband, but if the debit/credit card doesn't match the name on the AP, your AP could get flagged (even though the passes have the same last name and under the same account). Same if you are eating in a group, the only way to get the AP discount is if the AP pays. You can't split it (I've had this happen, but thankfully all of us in the group had the same level AP so they were able to do it).

The discount rules have been in place and strictly e forced for a while, although a husband using a wife's or vice versa is usually considered acceptable, but I would stick with cash these days to be safe on that one.

 

[cmwade77]

It seems DL needs to go with thumb prints like WDW and other theme parks. Then it wouldn't matter what you look like, only that your print matches.

I agree, fingerprints are also substantially faster than the picture method.

 

[loloandstitch]

I agree, fingerprints are also substantially faster than the picture method.

Half the time I feel they don't even look at the picture...

 

[cmwade77]

we know a family with 3 blonde daughters and one pass, probably happens more than you know. I really see a lot of the Disney AP maneuvers as ways to protect paying customers. AP users can get out of hand, and it is not fair to the people who drive 12 hours and buy full price tickets

Why fingerprints should be used instead of pictures.

 

[cmwade77]

I guess I don't think like a criminal. I cannot imagine why going into DCA and then directly into DL would be suspicious.

Same here, I used to do this all the time back in the days where there was a separate reentry line. I would go into DCA when there was no line to initially enter and then immediately leave and use the reentry gate at Disneyland, which had no line when there was a massive line at all of the first time entry gates.bsaved tons of time.