Thread on the Disney Camping Forum

[dianeschlicht]

I do not think that OKW destroys the brand, it simply gives more options.

How can OKW destroy the brand?????? It WAS the original brand!!!

 

[theww228]

How can OKW destroy the brand?????? It WAS the original brand!!!

Yes, that is the point. It was started with a resort (OKW/Disney Vacation Club Resort) that was/is more like a moderate than a deluxe. If that style didn't resonate with members than DVC would never have taken off.

I think other resorts like OKW will continue to be popular in DVC if the point structure matches. If OKW required the same number of points as BLT, I do not feel it would be as popular as today.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Yes, that is the point. It was started with a resort (OKW/Disney Vacation Club Resort) that was/is more like a moderate than a deluxe. If that style didn't resonate with members than DVC would never have taken off.

I think other resorts like OKW will continue to be popular in DVC if the point structure matches. If OKW required the same number of points as BLT, I do not feel it would be as popular as today.

You might be surprised. I for one will never stay at BLT, and it has NOTHING to do with point structure. Rather it has to do with it being nothing but a high rise hotel with small accommodations. There is no way I would ever trade OKW for BLT for those reasons.

 

[theww228]

You might be surprised. I for one will never stay at BLT, and it has NOTHING to do with point structure. Rather it has to do with it being nothing but a high rise hotel with small accommodations. There is no way I would ever trade OKW for BLT for those reasons.

It has nothing to do if you would ever stay at BLT, the question is:
Would you stay at OKW if it was 361 points for a 1BR for a week during dream season instead of the current 199 points? Maybe. Would most members? Probably not.

 

[Chuck S]

It has nothing to do if you would ever stay at BLT, the question is:
Would you stay at OKW if it was 361 points for a 1BR for a week during dream season instead of the current 199 points? Maybe. Would most members? Probably not.

Since there is no BLT 1 bedroom that is 361 points per week during dream season, how is this any comparison?

Plus, it seems, BLT and VGC have such high point requirements (also due tot he current economy) , they have sold slower than initially projected. Does that not also damage the brand in the perceptions of new members? New members have to perceive that there is indeed a tangible value to owning an interest in DVC.

 

[BEASLYBOO]

Yes, that is the point. It was started with a resort (OKW/Disney Vacation Club Resort) that was/is more like a moderate than a deluxe. If that style didn't resonate with members than DVC would never have taken off.

I think other resorts like OKW will continue to be popular in DVC if the point structure matches. If OKW required the same number of points as BLT, I do not feel it would be as popular as today.

But you aren't comparing apples to apples. If they built OKW today, they'd charge the same as they charged for BLT and the point structures for OKW would be proportionate to all new resorts.

It has nothing to do if you would ever stay at BLT, the question is:
Would you stay at OKW if it was 361 points for a 1BR for a week during dream season instead of the current 199 points? Maybe. Would most members? Probably not.

It certainly has something to do with it. You're comparing something new and shiny to something built in 1991. Early DVC'r bought into OKW at around $45 (?) not $104+/-.

I would still buy into a new OKW and not into a new or old BLT, BLT is just not my taste.

 

[staceymay00]

The 361 points is for a 1 BR in Magic Season, not Dream Season. Also, that is for MK view and a lot of people don't seem to think MK view is worth the points. I would not burn 361 points to stay in any DVC 1BR for one week, but I can tell you that even if BLT was about the same points as OKW for our upcoming trip I would have still picked OKW. We may try to stay at some other resorts in the future but there are many aspects of OKW that appeal to us besides the points.

Everyone is different and I think having different styles of resorts is great as long as whatever they build appeals to enough people to sell well. Some people want luxurious accommodations and amenities, and that is fine. That is not why we bought DVC, though. We bought to be able to stay on site in a 1 or 2BR villa at a more reasonable cost. We like the more laid back resorts. I'd be perfectly happy at a moderate resort if I could have a 1BR or 2BR villa.

 

[theww228]

Several things:

But you aren't comparing apples to apples. If they built OKW today, they'd charge the same as they charged for BLT and the point structures for OKW would be proportionate to all new resorts.

If this is true then OKW should be the hardest ressie to get on property because it is a steal of a deal. If they did chose to build OKW today and they charged the same for points and required the same amount it would most likely never sell out.

I can tell you that even if BLT was about the same points as OKW for our upcoming trip I would have still picked OKW
You are missing the point. You say that you would stay at OKW if BLT was about the same as OKW, the question is: Would you stay at OKW if the points were about the same as BLT?

We like the more laid back resorts. I'd be perfectly happy at a moderate resort if I could have a 1BR or 2BR villa.
This is my whole point - I feel some members would like a moderate DVC if it is priced as such.

It certainly has something to do with it. You're comparing something new and shiny to something built in 1991.
Not really, age should have nothing it do with it. The Poly had been around since '71 it is still draws a premium rack rate.

 

[BEASLYBOO]

Several things:

[It certainly has something to do with it. You're comparing something new and shiny to something built in 1991.
Not really, age should have nothing it do with it. The Poly had been around since '71 it is still draws a premium rack rate.

And it's on a constant state of refurbishement since it's a hotel. Just as the Boardwalk Inn rooms are always in better shape than the BWV. Again, it's not apples to apples. Age, IMO has everything to do with it!

The only reason OKW might be considered a moderate by some is due to it's age, it's point structure resulting from it's age and original inception. With proper theming, just like a Kidani with the animals, there's nothing that says a newly built OKW would not sell out or not be considered deluxe!

 

[dianeschlicht]

It has nothing to do if you would ever stay at BLT, the question is:
Would you stay at OKW if it was 361 points for a 1BR for a week during dream season instead of the current 199 points? Maybe. Would most members? Probably not.

Absolutely, if that's what the point total was, but I find it hard to believe a 1 bedroom the size of BLT's are that much during ANY season. OKW is the best vacation resort on property as far as I'm concerned. I own at AKV too, and while I enjoy a few days there occationally, it is not my favorite type of accommodations. I prefer to have space and a "home" feel. No other one gives me that like OKW.

 

[yourMaire83]

Wow, if this rumor is true, I believe they have a lot of potential. I mean, it's such a great location. It's got me really dreaming....
I'm picturing the use of Discovery Island (mostly for upscale amenities). Obviously, you can't swim in the lake water, but they could put a wooden perimeter walkway mostly around the island. I'm from Naples, so if you're familiar with that area of FL, that's exactly what I'm picturing. They should leave (or make) it very lush and feature an infinity pool with poolside furnishings in the outdoor "living space" variety. They could have an observation tower or two, and a spa with panoramic views in the private treatment areas. I'm also picturing a Signature dining restaurant with (if it's possible) fireworks view and a double-decker porch-style breakfast/lunch restaurant. I also can't get the possibility of treehouse villas out of my head.

 

[theww228]

With proper theming, just like a Kidani with the animals, there's nothing that says a newly built OKW would not sell out or not be considered deluxe!

I agree, but in the current state OKW does not.

I understand that many people enjoy and love OKW and I understand that. This not a discussion of I like OKW better than "X" because of "Y".

I love VWL and it tends to get a bad rap and that it is "lower" quality than other resorts, that is fine. Enough poeple members feel the same way I do because it starts getting pretty full at the 7 month mark. If VWL was 30% more points per night than the current rates I would not be so enamored with it.

Many people love OKW at the current point levels (which are lower than other resorts), if the resort had points at the levels of BLT and VGC there would be less peolple enamored with OKW.

I am not bashing OKW or the members who love it. I am saying it fits well in the DVC system.

 

[theww228]

Absolutely, if that's what the point total was, but I find it hard to believe a 1 bedroom the size of BLT's are that much during ANY season.

1 BR MK view at BLT in Magic Season is 361 points in 2011.

 

[staceymay00]

Several things:

I can tell you that even if BLT was about the same points as OKW for our upcoming trip I would have still picked OKW
You are missing the point. You say that you would stay at OKW if BLT was about the same as OKW, the question is: Would you stay at OKW if the points were about the same as BLT?

Yes, even if exactly the same points I would not necessarily choose BLT. I didn't miss the point, I said "about the same" because normally when comparing DVC choices they don't match up to the exact same number of points, however for clarity I should have just said for the exact same points we would still choose OKW, unless being close to MK was important for a particular visit.

ETA: I know you are not trying to bash OKW. I'm just pointing out that the layout and style of OKW does appeal to some, and I think many stay there because that is where they want to stay, not because they want to use fewer points.

 

[theww228]

Yes, even if exactly the same points I would not necessarily choose BLT. I said "about the same" because normally when comparing DVC choices they don't match up to the exact same number of points, however for simplicity I should have just said for the exact same points we would still choose OKW, unless being close to MK was important for a particular visit.

I'm sorry, what I was trying to say:
Magic Season 1BR for a week in 2011-
BLT MK view is 361 pts
OKW is 222 pts

You said that you would stay at OKW if it was the same pts as BLT.
I agree with you, if OKW was 222 and BLT was 222 you choose OKW over BLT.
My question is: If OKW is 361 pts for a week (same as BLT) would you still stay at OKW? I am not asking if you would stay at BLT, but instead would you still feel you are getting "value" from DVC and staying at OKW? Is OKW worth 361 points a week? I feel most would say no. I feel most say it is worth 222 pts/week.

 

[Chuck S]

This thread is really going of the topic of the rumored DVC at/near the campgrounds. It needs to return to that topic to remain open.

 

[staceymay00]

My question is: If OKW is 361 pts for a week (same as BLT) would you still stay at OKW? I am not asking if you would stay at BLT, but instead would you still feel you are getting "value" from DVC and staying at OKW? Is OKW worth 361 points a week? I feel most would say no. I feel most say it is worth 222 pts/week.

To me personally, neither OKW or BLT is worth 361 pts for a week in a 1BR. I can, however, understand the resorts right next to theme parks being priced a bit higher. I would expect something at FW to require fewer points than a MK or EP resort for that reason.

 

[theww228]

I would like to see a resort themed like Liberty Square. They could have replica ships in Bay lake that would light up at night, cobblestone paths, etc.

Plus, it would kinda fit in with the campground and wilderness lodge as neighbors.

 

[Chuck S]

I would like to see a resort themed like Liberty Square. They could have replica ships in Bay lake that would light up at night, cobblestone paths, etc.

Plus, it would kinda fit in with the campground and wilderness lodge as neighbors.

I don't really see how a resort themed to the revolutionary war era would fit in with camping or the National Parks theme of WL. Plus cobblestone paths would be murder for those in wheelchairs or ECVs.

 

[Dean]

It has nothing to do if you would ever stay at BLT, the question is:
Would you stay at OKW if it was 361 points for a 1BR for a week during dream season instead of the current 199 points? Maybe. Would most members? Probably not.

I think many people are missing what I see as your underlying point, it's really basically the same one I made earlier if I'm understanding it. That is that the demand (both sales and usage) is a combination of factors. From a usage standpoint it's simply the desire vs the cost. For sales, other resort and exchange options gets factored in to a degree and dilute the issues of the resort being sold. SSR is a classic example in that a significant portion of people bought at SSR because it was what was being sold at the time, not because SSR was their desired home resort. To a degree ALL DVC resorts have this phenomena and there are a number of different ways to arrive at that point including new resorts came online after buying, one later decided they liked another resort better, one bought retail and didn't realize there were options and that one purposefully compromised due to ending date or other reasons.

Desire is based on location, amenities and the points structure plus any special incentives that might get thrown in (OKW free passes). Cost factors in the points structure a second time plus the price per point and dues. An OKW 2 BR for a week is a lot more in demand at 100 points than 1000 points to give an extreme example. The recent rebalancing to a degree acknowledges these issues though there's not a lot they can do to rebalance points and thus demand across multiple resorts. About all they can do is control amenities. The balance, or lack of, between resorts is essentially created up front based on the number of points sold. The change in points structure from OKW to BWV is a good study in a system shift related to points structure.