Thoughts on a good price for this HHI contract

kniquy

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There is not a ton of information on the ROFR thread for HHI. I am looking at a 100pt contract which has no points for 2016 or 2017 and will have full 100 pts for 2018. So pretty stripped. They are asking 65pp. I offered $50pp with splitting closing costs ($450 each -for some reason HHI closing costs are so much more) They countered at $60 pp w/ me paying all the closing. I feel with the contract being in such a point deficit that I don't know if it is really worth $60pp.

Any thoughts? Is there a way to look at HHI recent sales -- something like the OCC?
 
Stripped contracts are always overpriced and, for some strange reason, go for more than anyone here would value them.

While I'd value those missing points at $11 each, they only seem to discount $4 each on the resale market. You're much better off buying a loaded contract and renting out the extra points.
 
Stripped contracts are always overpriced and, for some strange reason, go for more than anyone here would value them.

While I'd value those missing points at $11 each, they only seem to discount $4 each on the resale market. You're much better off buying a loaded contract and renting out the extra points.

Agreed. Just wait for a loaded contract.
 
We had a recent purchase where we had to look pretty closely at missing points to figure out their value. If you are going to use them for travel you might have to do some math but from a practical "value" standpoint points are worth what you can rent them for (about $13 probably) minus yearly fees (about $6.50 last year) in my book. That makes them about a $6.50 value.
 

There is not a ton of information on the ROFR thread for HHI. I am looking at a 100pt contract which has no points for 2016 or 2017 and will have full 100 pts for 2018. So pretty stripped. They are asking 65pp. I offered $50pp with splitting closing costs ($450 each -for some reason HHI closing costs are so much more) They countered at $60 pp w/ me paying all the closing. I feel with the contract being in such a point deficit that I don't know if it is really worth $60pp.

Any thoughts? Is there a way to look at HHI recent sales -- something like the OCC?
Missing points really devalue a contract and as noted, the sale price generally doesn't reflect the lost value of at or over $10 a point (really over in this regard) for any points you have to pay the dues on. The dues could be a huge additional cost in this situation. As an example, this contract with a Dec UY and no dues allowance or payments in the contract would cost you an additional $1300 for dues on points you didn't get the use out of. Even if they paid the 2017 dues ahead or gave you credit for them (them minimum concession IMO), you're still overpaying in the maint fee arena.

HH is more because they require an attorney to file the closing. Here's the site for Beaufort County though I haven't looked at it very much. Personally, even at your target price, I think HH is overpriced. You're likely better off with a more loaded contract even at a slightly higher price even if it's more or less points. However, sometimes you just find the right contract in terms of UY and home resort that you're having trouble finding otherwise. What's your goal with these points?
 
Our goal is to stay here every other summer, so it does seem that HHI does require a 11 month booking window for at least June to August. Maybe I am looking at this wrong, but it seems that it would make more sense to buy in and pay $6000 with MF of approx $600-700, yearly Instead of booking and it costing $3600 or renting for close to $3000. The break even will be after 2-3 trips from rough calculations.

This particular contract was for a closing towards the beginning part of next year so the deed transfer would not occur until after the MF for 2017 are already paid. I would not have to pay until 2018. So I guess it is hit or miss if this is the right move. I buy now, hopefully working a price per point less than $60. Can't really use the contract until realistically 2019 (when I can bank and have enough for a week) or I wait and buy in a year or two - could the prices for HHI go down in a couple years? I kind of don't see them getting higher, but will likely stay stagnant for the more near future until it goes under 20 years left on the contract.
 
Our goal is to stay here every other summer, so it does seem that HHI does require a 11 month booking window for at least June to August. Maybe I am looking at this wrong, but it seems that it would make more sense to buy in and pay $6000 with MF of approx $600-700, yearly Instead of booking and it costing $3600 or renting for close to $3000. The break even will be after 2-3 trips from rough calculations.

This particular contract was for a closing towards the beginning part of next year so the deed transfer would not occur until after the MF for 2017 are already paid. I would not have to pay until 2018. So I guess it is hit or miss if this is the right move. I buy now, hopefully working a price per point less than $60. Can't really use the contract until realistically 2019 (when I can bank and have enough for a week) or I wait and buy in a year or two - could the prices for HHI go down in a couple years? I kind of don't see them getting higher, but will likely stay stagnant for the more near future until it goes under 20 years left on the contract.
If it doesn't close for another six months, they have no incentive to take a low offer now. I would put it in your pocket and offer it again closer to their closing date. Someone may come along and pay their price, but that just means you dodged a bullet.
 
Our goal is to stay here every other summer, so it does seem that HHI does require a 11 month booking window for at least June to August. Maybe I am looking at this wrong, but it seems that it would make more sense to buy in and pay $6000 with MF of approx $600-700, yearly Instead of booking and it costing $3600 or renting for close to $3000. The break even will be after 2-3 trips from rough calculations.

This particular contract was for a closing towards the beginning part of next year so the deed transfer would not occur until after the MF for 2017 are already paid. I would not have to pay until 2018. So I guess it is hit or miss if this is the right move. I buy now, hopefully working a price per point less than $60. Can't really use the contract until realistically 2019 (when I can bank and have enough for a week) or I wait and buy in a year or two - could the prices for HHI go down in a couple years? I kind of don't see them getting higher, but will likely stay stagnant for the more near future until it goes under 20 years left on the contract.
If your goal is to stay there summer you'll probably need the home resort advantage to do it on points, either as a private rental or owning there. I'm guessing you're looking at a 1 BR for 6 nights or a 2 BR for 5 nights and using somewhere around 210 to 215 points for the trip and going every 3 years or so based on what you're posted. Owning 100 points at HH isn't that much of a savings but compared to paying cash it might be enough to justify buying. You're really talking about a savings of somewhere around $150-250 a year assuming mid June to mid August, likely less for early June or late August. Regardless, this doesn't sound like a great contract. Unless it's the perfect number of points and UY and you think you'll have problems finding what you want, I'd pass. The long term plans gives you easy patience but don't let it cause you to make a poor financial choice just because you don't need to use those points. IMO you'd be better off paying a little more and getting a more loaded contract, you can always rent the points if needed. Even with no dues until 18, you'll still be overpaying on dues then but depending on UY, it shouldn't be that much.

I doubt they'll go up but I doubt they'll get a lot cheaper in your timeframe. Since it doesn't sound like you're planning to use these points between HH and WDW both, one of the big plusses of owning DVC at HH, are you sure buying DVC is your best option for HH stays. Would a different timeshare system or just renting a condo be a better option. You can rent a 2 BR in a beachfront resort for your real costs in this situation, have control, be able to cancel and have significantly less long term risk.

You mentioned break even in 2 to 3 trips, I don't see it. I don't use the target cash option for such comparisons, esp not the non discounted one. In this case I'd compare to both the private rental cost and to the costs of comparable resorts privately, maybe the OF Marriott Properties. Even if you ignore the TMV then you've still got a cost of at least $2000 per trip, likely more in the $2500 range (guessing somewhat because you have provided all that info). So unless the rental prices go up dramatically more than dues, it'd take you at least 8-10 years or around 5 trips to break even (maybe more) and that assumes you'd get a trip close to every 2 years out of 100 points making the best assumptions I could as for number of points, villa size and frequency.
 
You mentioned break even in 2 to 3 trips, I don't see it.
I did do a better calculation of our break even point with the assumption of an annual 3% increase of both rates of hotel rooms and maintenance fees. The break even for us going every other year in a 1BR for 6 nights - would be just about our 3rd or 4th visit.

I'd compare to both the private rental cost
I am glad that you mentioned this - when you get into the disney/DVC you sometimes overlook the other options.
 
I did do a better calculation of our break even point with the assumption of an annual 3% increase of both rates of hotel rooms and maintenance fees. The break even for us going every other year in a 1BR for 6 nights - would be just about our 3rd or 4th visit.
IMO the proper comparison is a PRIVATE rental or for HH, non DVC options including condo's and timeshares. For a condo that'll be under $2500K ocean front complex in a 2 BR and around $3000 at the top timeshare on the island for a 2 BR (likely less for the week you mentioned later in July). DVC privately and DVC directly for the 1 BR should be around $3000K if you do one weekend night, actually more for a private rental than cash. Even ignoring the TMV (which is only partially offset by the inflation), you'll save around $1000 per every 207 points for a private rental or cash price, the cost of the 1 BR for 6 nights with one weekend night during the summer. And for a 2 BR condo one can easily get a good option break even for a 2 BR in a better location. Thus one would need at least 6 trips to break even with a cost of $6K plus closing and more likely at least 7 and that assumes $3000 cost per trip. In reality one may never break even on a 1 BR for HH. 6 trips is 13 years worth of points or in this cash, 15 years down the road. For DVC, the 1 BR is a tough sell in general and doubly though in HH. The studio is a better sell partly because it's half the 1 BR and most condo's are 2 or 3 BR that are worth considering.

I am glad that you mentioned this - when you get into the disney/DVC you sometimes overlook the other options.
IMO a large % of owners don't know, forget or worse, refuse to think about other options. I've seen many examples of people investigating then buying when DVC wasn't a good choice and when other timeshares were a far better single choice for them.
 



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