This doesn’t sound good (EMH going away?)

[Ben E N]

I hope this means that the morning EMH will be moving towards having the whole park open again, and not just fantasyland and tomorrowland. By only having those two lands open, it led to longer than needed wait times for rides such as Pooh, decreasing the benefit of even having the EMH in the first place.

 

[Delirium]

Not at all worthless IMO. We attended evening EMH (10pm-12am) last Tuesday and it was awesome. The park pretty much cleared out after HEA and we were able to walk onto several rides with pretty much no wait.

Edit: Sorry, meant Wednesday, not Tuesday

Correct. They may be considered worthless to those people that don't take advantage of them, much the same as Magical Express is a 'worthless' perk to me since we always drive to Florida. But, to those of us that took advantage of Evening Magic Hours at MK, they were definitely not worthless.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Well, call me crazy, but since I want my granddaughter's grandaughter to enjoy the place just like we have, I actually prefer that Disney does make money. I prefer they reinvest (billions just like they currently are) a lot of it. And yes it might mean my past park habits are affected, but in this time of such high demand, the time is now for them to make money. It's the same as my Cub fandom and park habits were affected greatly from 2015 through the world series win and still today. The comp tickets I got are snapped up, the tickets I bought have doubled. Parking has skyrocketed. The team though has spent 800 million on the ballpark. The premium opportunities are endless with high end eating, etc. The Cubs time for making money has never been better. And they are taking advantage. It is how businesses are run. It is how they need to be run.

How is saying Disney sees DAH as profitable have anything to do with Disney as a company and their profits in the parks and resorts?

I'm not sure you understand what I'm talking about.

Remember the MK tents? Or most recently the Galactic event that got cancelled.

I think you're taking this much more personal than the original intent was.

 

[mshanson3121]

Do people plan around EMH? When we planned our trip we already had our dates planned, hotel booked and had a rough idea of which park which day before EMH was even released. Then it just happened that some had EMH while we were there. We only do one park per day so EMH is kind of luck of the draw. This seems like more of a loss for park hopper people.

Definitely some do. On another board I've seen some who are really upset about this as they planned around EEMH. We specifically chose to use them for our upcoming trip.

 

[mom2rtk]

I hope this means that the morning EMH will be moving towards having the whole park open again, and not just fantasyland and tomorrowland. By only having those two lands open, it led to longer than needed wait times for rides such as Pooh, decreasing the benefit of even having the EMH in the first place.

Yeah, good luck with that.

 

[David Gardner]

Oh I agree. I also think though that Disney feels if people keep paying extra for things why should they offer “free” things.

As much as I don't like this, it comes down to very basic economics. I think the real answer, though, is a little bit deeper than this.

Attendance keeps going up, for almost everything. Higher attendance makes for a bad experience. So what's the solution to that? You can't really continue to build more and more parks or lands, for multiple reasons. But if you start charging increasingly more for increasingly less, you limit the number of people who can and will pay for the experience, and that limits attendance and crowds while maintaining the same level of income, more or less.

The capitalist in me approves, but the Disney fan finds it despicable, and I can't help but think that, to use a worn-out phrase, Walt would not have been happy.

 

[ChipnDale79]

I can understand it -- 100,000 people at the resorts at any given time, 60 percent of them at MK for night EMHs, that would leave the MK at about 60K on those nights. You have to assume that this fall, the parks are going to be as crowded as we've seen them in at least a decade. A lot of them will be staying onsite in order to maximize their SW access. So there will be a lot of resort guests, and if they have MK EMH nights, a very large percentage of them will migrate to the MK, leaving it as crowded during EMH as it is during a lot of the days. In other words, the actual benefit that is being projected isn't actually there. And in the meantime, I doubt there are a lot of things that generate more complaints than crowded EMHs. I don't know that there's a way around it for MK, actually, and by eliminating the PM EMHs, they might be temper expectations. I know that's probably overly generous of me, but if you have a benefit that's not really proving beneficial anymore, maybe it makes sense to stop doing it, and hopefully substitute something else.

or maybe instead of taking a perk away from guests who are spending thousands of dollars on their property, they add to EMH instead of removing it all together.

 

[Anthony Vito]

I'll admit that the DAH events are something that appeals to me. I've haven't been to one yet as they didn't have them last time we went to Disney in 2016.

What interests me is the low crowds being reported at these events and having the run of the park for 3 hours. Walk on rides and no crowds to navigate in between those rides.

That is what I'm willing to pay extra for. Hopefully Disney knows this.

My concern is that over time they will slowly increase the number of tickets they sell for these DAH events and the crowds will grow and the appeal will go away. Although Disney won't admit it, it's no secret that they sell way more tickets for MVMCP now then they did years ago. The heavy crowds they have at these events now really kills the appeal for me.

My wife and I did the After Hours event last August, and we really liked it. Not only was it great that there were no lines (we rode Space Mountain at least 3 times, we rode Thunder Mountain a couple times in a row without even getting out of our seats), but the empty park was great. The Hub was awesome with so few people in it, and we got some pretty cool Photo Pass pics. I even got free espresso from Starbucks because they were so dead. At one point we were hanging out near Main Street, and I think there was a good 5-10 minutes without a single person walking down Main Street - it was awesome.

I am also worried they will start increasing how many tickets they sell, and I am also worried about the new Villains After Hours. I'm not only worried that they will increase their capacity for this, but I also think that having the stage show and these things going on will get rid of that awesome quiet/chill vibe that the park had.

 

[Ben E N]

Yeah, good luck with that.

"when you wish upon a star..." Or if enough people complain loudly enough...

 

[Tigger's ally]

How is saying Disney sees DAH as profitable have anything to do with Disney as a company and their profits in the parks and resorts?

I'm not sure you understand what I'm talking about.

Remember the MK tents? Or most recently the Galactic event that got cancelled.

I think you're taking this much more personal than the original intent was.

Who took anything personal? I am just saying it's not right to "blame consumers" when consumers are doing exactly what consumers are supposed to do. Find the best way to spend their disposable income. Right now, people in America have more disposable income. That is why the parks are crowded.

And of course they see DAH as profitable because they are in the business of turning a profit. It's nobody's fault. It is great that Disney parks are of such great demand.

 

[whiporee]

They are only worthless because it's only 2 hours, 1 night a week. If they went back to 3 hours, multiple nights they would be awesome. Oh wait, they did do that, but it cost $130/person.

And ice cream used to be in half-gallon containers and airlines used to check bags for free and serve you dinner. You didn't used to have commercials at the movies. Attendants used to pump your gas and check your oil. Doctors used to make house calls. None of those things happen for free anymore, either.

The entire society is driven by profit motive and bottom line -- it turns out Gordon Gecko was more a prophecy than a warning. It's sad for all of us, but expecting WDW to behave in ways the rest of the society doesn't is perhaps a higher standard than they deserve in either good or bad ways.

The only solution I ever see about any of this stuff is that Disney should do more, just 'cause. More rides, more hours, more benefits. But look at it from a profit-motive point of view -- and we all like the returns on our IRAs -- and none of it really makes sense for them. They don't need to do it to fill the rooms. They don't need to do it to pack the parks. We just want them to provide additional services because they used to, and because we'd like to have the benefit. But I don't think any of this stuff adds to Disney's bottom line, so we're demanding they do something we demand of no one else. I wish they would, too. I wish all the parks were open until 2 every night and the crowds were much smaller. I just don't see it happening, and as much as I don't like it, I can understand why. Disney has bought into the same thing we all have -- what I want to happen is what is best for me. Sad for them, sad for us, sad for all of us, but hardly malevolent and hardly surprising.

 

[shh]

The atmosphere of MK at night is one of the big reasons we still go - night time EMH is extremely important to us. I could care less about attractions or wait times honestly. It's just being there at night. Hopefully there will be at least 1 or 2 nights during the holiday season where the park is open to at least 8 or 9pm. As APs, we already paid for park admission: having to buy a separate ticket just to hang out at night would really stink.

 

[sndral]

Well I hope Oct. is an experiment they don’t continue. I’m from the west coast and morning EMH are worthless to me - who wants to get up at 4 a.m. my time to go wait in line to get into MK and join a stampeding herd surging towards 7dmt just to gain a measly hour of MK time? It’s a vacation not boot camp!
Evening EMH, OTH were great, especially when they were 3 hours, especially w/ the MB tap to ride, the crowds melted away, you could ride the rides, the only bad part was they stopped selling food. W/ the MVMCP infestation during our annual holiday trips closing MK down early most nights, the EMH evening hours were essential just to enjoy the MK at night maybe once or twice in our 10-11 day visits. We’ve already switched to after Christmas this upcoming trip to avoid the parties eating so much into MK hours.

 

[HuskieJohn]

At this point for my families 2025 trip my kids will be old enough that I am already considering to ONLY do to the paid evening events and not actually buy regular day tickets.

Sleep in, not worry about booking FP+s or in park ADRs around those FP+s, get to the park 30-45min before Paid Ticket entry time & have 5-6 hours in the park depending on how late it goes.

That also gives us time to hit the pool every day or go to a good restaurant for lunch without feeling like we are missing our on park time.

That actually sounds like a vacation!

 

[billlaurie]

At this point for my families 2025 trip my kids will be old enough that I am already considering to ONLY do to the paid evening events and not actually buy regular day tickets.

Sleep in, not worry about booking FP+s or in park ADRs around those FP+s, get to the park 30-45min before Paid Ticket entry time & have 5-6 hours in the park depending on how late it goes.

That also gives us time to hit the pool every day or go to a good restaurant for lunch without feeling like we are missing our on park time.

That actually sounds like a vacation!

Same here plus I will consider renting a house or condo or staying at a hotel that offers free parking and free breakfast.

 

[jhoannam]

And ice cream used to be in half-gallon containers and airlines used to check bags for free and serve you dinner. You didn't used to have commercials at the movies. Attendants used to pump your gas and check your oil. Doctors used to make house calls. None of those things happen for free anymore, either.

The entire society is driven by profit motive and bottom line -- it turns out Gordon Gecko was more a prophecy than a warning. It's sad for all of us, but expecting WDW to behave in ways the rest of the society doesn't is perhaps a higher standard than they deserve in either good or bad ways.

The only solution I ever see about any of this stuff is that Disney should do more, just 'cause. More rides, more hours, more benefits. But look at it from a profit-motive point of view -- and we all like the returns on our IRAs -- and none of it really makes sense for them. They don't need to do it to fill the rooms. They don't need to do it to pack the parks. We just want them to provide additional services because they used to, and because we'd like to have the benefit. But I don't think any of this stuff adds to Disney's bottom line, so we're demanding they do something we demand of no one else. I wish they would, too. I wish all the parks were open until 2 every night and the crowds were much smaller. I just don't see it happening, and as much as I don't like it, I can understand why. Disney has bought into the same thing we all have -- what I want to happen is what is best for me. Sad for them, sad for us, sad for all of us, but hardly malevolent and hardly surprising.

Very sad for us. My family will enjoy our last Disney trip this summer, at least for the next few years. It was fun while it lasted. There is a big world out there and we'll just spend our vacations dollars elsewhere. I hope that Disney finds the target customers they are looking for, that's just not us anymore.

 

[LSUmiss]

Not defending Disney if they do it, but isn't the consensus pretty much that evening EMH at MK is fundamentally worthless these days? That seems to be the attitude of a lot of people around the boards. I can understand it -- 100,000 people at the resorts at any given time, 60 percent of them at MK for night EMHs, that would leave the MK at about 60K on those nights. You have to assume that this fall, the parks are going to be as crowded as we've seen them in at least a decade. A lot of them will be staying onsite in order to maximize their SW access. So there will be a lot of resort guests, and if they have MK EMH nights, a very large percentage of them will migrate to the MK, leaving it as crowded during EMH as it is during a lot of the days. In other words, the actual benefit that is being projected isn't actually there. And in the meantime, I doubt there are a lot of things that generate more complaints than crowded EMHs. I don't know that there's a way around it for MK, actually, and by eliminating the PM EMHs, they might be temper expectations. I know that's probably overly generous of me, but if you have a benefit that's not really proving beneficial anymore, maybe it makes sense to stop doing it, and hopefully substitute something else.

If you think about it, there are two things that generate complaints at WDW -- crowds and cost. Often they are inter related. So if they do this -- and I'm not convinced they are -- my guess is that it's less a money grab and more a crowd control thing. That said, it doesn't hurt their bottom line that they have parties and events to fill the night-time gaps. And as long as they don't let you book with the published expectation of EMH, they aren't being deceitful in their advertising, even if we don't like the results.

I also think there's a decent chance that HS and GE will likely have some degree of EMH, and in all likelyhood more than one a week. So for the early GE surge, they might be putting all their EMH eggs in that basket and they haven't totally plotted out their man-hour requirements this far out.

The were worthless the last time we tried to use them in 2018. They’re crowed now & there are no FPs.

 

[LSUmiss]

Sure. But if you had no one paying for them it wouldn't stick around long. It certainly wouldn't expand. To Disney it's seen as a profitable thing so why stop it. Well it wouldn't be as profitable if people wouldn't flock to it.

I don't think it's a negative towards how one opts to spend their disposable income.

It’s made to seem as a negative. Some ppl have flat out blamed those of us who choose to spend our $ on these things as the reason the “free” perks no longer exist for them. This might be true, but everyone has an equal opportunity to purchase these add-one as well. There’s also no guarantee that Disney would keep the free perks.

 

[LSUmiss]

And don't forget about decreasing the regular park hours for that EMH day and letting nonresort guests have access, which added to this worthlessness.

But it doesn’t change the fact that they are now pretty much worthless so why are ppl whining about a “perk” they no longer like or want?

 

[crvetter]

The were worthless the last time we tried to use them in 2018. They’re crowed now & there are no FPs.

I will say at Thanksgiving time, I was staying off-site, I finished a dinning reservation after park closed. So when leaving the park it was during EMH and only about 30 mins into the event, it was very light crowds and taking photos on Main Street, etc seemed super easy and people could have gotten great shots with almost no one behind you, the photopass people were out in full force too. I can't speak to the lines because we only walked down Main Street on our way out, but those aspects seemed very light. Which to some could be a really nice benefit.

Previous years when doing EMH the lines always seemed long, because a majority of the line was held outside the ride and usually the inside queue was empty, not sure if that is still the case, could be since they still employ this practice late at night to "artificially" inflate the wait times to discourage people from joining the line.

Though as someone that utilizes EMH, EMM, and maybe DAH (they never seem to have these when I travel) I don't like the benefit disappearing. If they do away with it I would like DAH to be continued at similar crowd levels now (but they might pack more people in) and offer them finally during holiday weeks since they might do away with the PM EMH offered during those week.