The VGF 2 pricing thread

What will 200 points at VGF2 look like at launch, with incentives included?

  • Same price as Riviera, Same point chart as VGF1

    Votes: 34 14.6%
  • Same price as Riviera, higher point chart than VGF1

    Votes: 14 6.0%
  • Same price as Riviera, lower point chart than VGF1

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • A little higher than Riviera ($1-$25 more), same point chart as VGF1

    Votes: 74 31.8%
  • A little higher than Riviera ($1-$25 more), higher point chart than VGF1

    Votes: 50 21.5%
  • A little higher than Riviera ($1-$25 more), lower point chart than VGF1

    Votes: 6 2.6%
  • A lot higher than Riviera ($26+ more), same point chart as VGF1

    Votes: 39 16.7%
  • A lot higher than Riviera ($26+ more), higher point chart than VGF1

    Votes: 14 6.0%
  • A lot higher than Riviera ($26+ more), lower point chart than VGF1

    Votes: 1 0.4%

  • Total voters
    233
  • Poll closed .
If anyone can shed some light....I usually travel in the fall. The points I used to spend are soooo much higher now. I used to get a GV for 80pts a night during the week, 88 on weekends.
Now, 3 out of the 5 "time periods" are wayyy over 80 pts and only a 2 week period in sept is just 4 points less. Looks like I have to buy another contract to get what we have usually booked. Am I unreasonable ? or is this commonly accepted ??
 
If anyone can shed some light....I usually travel in the fall. The points I used to spend are soooo much higher now. I used to get a GV for 80pts a night during the week, 88 on weekends.
Now, 3 out of the 5 "time periods" are wayyy over 80 pts and only a 2 week period in sept is just 4 points less. Looks like I have to buy another contract to get what we have usually booked. Am I unreasonable ? or is this commonly accepted ??

May be able to help if you can share what you're looking at. In 2021 DVC went from 5 to 7 seasons and I've never seen a grand villa under 112 points per night.
 
If anyone can shed some light....I usually travel in the fall. The points I used to spend are soooo much higher now. I used to get a GV for 80pts a night during the week, 88 on weekends.
Now, 3 out of the 5 "time periods" are wayyy over 80 pts and only a 2 week period in sept is just 4 points less. Looks like I have to buy another contract to get what we have usually booked. Am I unreasonable ? or is this commonly accepted ??

They are allowed to adjust for demand so what has happened is that they switched around what different times of the year cost to ensure a more equal distribution of use.

So, those who were fall visitors are going to be paying more to stay and those that go in summer will now pay less for the same trip.

You personally are on the end of paying more but another owner is on the benefit end and probably happy to be able to stay for similar amount of points that you had been staying.
 
If anyone can shed some light....I usually travel in the fall. The points I used to spend are soooo much higher now. I used to get a GV for 80pts a night during the week, 88 on weekends.
Now, 3 out of the 5 "time periods" are wayyy over 80 pts and only a 2 week period in sept is just 4 points less. Looks like I have to buy another contract to get what we have usually booked. Am I unreasonable ? or is this commonly accepted ??

What resort do you normally book the GV? It doesn't sound like you're referencing VGF based on that number of points.

But yes, DVC has the right and actually the obligation to rebalance the point charts if there are times that are proving to book much more quickly than other times of the year. For quite some time that has been most of the last 3-4 months of the year while spring and summer have not booked anywhere near as fast. There will be people who are happy about the reallocation and will have to use fewer points and those, such as yourself, who are not and will now have to use more points for the times they normally have gone.
 
Our trip in Nov at VGF now costs 19 more points a week. Ouch that hurts. :sad:
Agree! We go the same week each October in a standard 2 bedroom. It was 359 for a week in 2018. Its been going up and up. Now it is 443. Brutal. We have 500 points there which should get us that week we purchased for (not fixed oops) and another smaller trip but that's over apparently. And if I cant get my room at 11 mos. I'll be selling. It will be time to buy a condo and never look back at DVC.
 
Would the expectation be that VGF2 would carry a 50 year expiration? Or would it be linked to VGF1's.
 
I remember people asked about timing up thread; Disney’s 10K they published just last week listed “Summer 2022” as the opening for this and “2023” as the opening for Disneyland Villas.

They wouldn’t put a date in their 10K if they didn’t firmly believe it would happen as that would be a felony.
 
I remember people asked about timing up thread; Disney’s 10K they published just last week listed “Summer 2022” as the opening for this and “2023” as the opening for Disneyland Villas.

They wouldn’t put a date in their 10K if they didn’t firmly believe it would happen as that would be a felony.

Yes, they've been pretty firm about summer 2022 for VGF and the report saying "by Summer 2022" is unambiguous. Disneyland language is "expected to open in 2023" and that language is more hesitant and allows for Disney to blame whatever it wants if delayed to 2024.
 
I remember people asked about timing up thread; Disney’s 10K they published just last week listed “Summer 2022” as the opening for this and “2023” as the opening for Disneyland Villas.

They wouldn’t put a date in their 10K if they didn’t firmly believe it would happen as that would be a felony.

Summer is June 21, 2022 to Sept 22, 2022 so still not really providing a date.
 
Does Disney observe official summer? It's been on my mind because Guardians is supposed to open in summer and our dates are like June 10-17.
Right, or is Disney simply referring to the time after schools go into summer break, which is as early as May?

Another website reported that Disney executives have already taken advanced preview rides on Guardians, with WDW President Jeff Vahle stating, "I’m looking forward to seeing the finishing touches over the next several months and can’t wait for you to get a look when it opens at EPCOT next summer."
 
Prediction

nov direct sales were disappointing, riv sold below avg at 64k points. Only 36% of riv points have been sold to date

gfv2 sales price point will be $201 with better than riv incentives day 1 then incentives matching riv after initial sales

consequences of overpricing gfv

if dvc prices gfv above $201 I’d predict equal to lower than riv monthly sales. Let’s say they do 50k points a month. It would take dvc 40 months to sell all gfv points. Dvc will want to close gfv much faster than 40 months especially given any sales into gfv will reduce riv sales. So where riv did 64k points in nov, with gfv in play you can probably expect to half riv sale volumes.

so there it is, gfv goes on sale at an identical price point to riv
 
I answered a similar question in a different post, so rather than post again, I'll just reference it here:
https://www.disboards.com/threads/2023-point-charts-released.3862115/post-63597719
Points represent two things, and those two things are inexplicably linked:
(1) They represent your % ownership in a unit
(2) They represent points needed in any given season to book a particular Vacation Home Villas

An important consideration is that a unit may compromise more than one Vacation Home Villas.

That consideration is important from a legal standpoint -- and to the question as to whether or not they can move points from one Vacation Villa Type to another - because when Disney balances point charts for the year, they must do two things:
(1) Ensure the total number of points required to book the entire resort remains the same as the total number of points declared in the resort
(2) Points continue to represent the % ownership interest, which means ensuring the total number of points to book a UNIT (not villa) in a given year equals the total number of points that unit represents (based on declaration).

We talk a lot in these boards, and when it comes to point charts, about #1, but #2 must also be true.

So while your 100 points and my 100 points may allow us to book the same number of nights in a specific VILLA TYPE in the year, #2 is *not* the same: their reallocation of 2BR into THVs to raise THVs has made it so that my 100 points no longer represents my ownership interest.

I can understand why it may seem like "why does this matter? We both can do the same thing with 100 points" it matters to settle the question of whether you can take points from high point villas and move them into, say, studios. This is an especially important matter for owners at places like PVB and CCV, where point-hungry Cabins and Villas exist, and where it is important that, say, studios don't become a dumping ground to lower the cost of bungalows/cabins. In the case of THV, what they did is illegal, because my points no longer reflect my ownership interest. (And given that I bought into SSR to stay in Treehouse Villas, ensuring that the point chart for THVs represents THVs and not THVs + points used to lower 2BRs does matter to me personally, though I can get why people who may love 2BRs and love that Disney lowered 2BR costs may not be happy if this is addressed).

Now, I believe that all of SSR units are EITHER 2x2 THVs *or* 2-BRs, and that all Studios and 1BRs at SSR are, in fact, lock-offs. If that's true, then it may be possible in SSR to move points between Studios, 1BRs, 2BRs. I would in fact have to go look at the master declaration to see what the unit makeups are, and if all SSR units are 3-2BRs. However, they cannot reallocate points between THVs and 2BRs because of the requirement that points equal % ownership.

But other resorts - say, for example, CCV, where a unit might be a cabin, or in the case of some of my contracts, one unit is 2 Dedicated 2BRs; another is 1 LO 2BR and 2 Studios; and another is a Dedicated-2BR and a LO-2BR (and my % of ownership varies even when the # of points is the same, due to the size differences in units), the point allocation probably requires points to remain within vacation villa types in order to ensure that # of points = unit % ownership
Regarding the part in bold, can you please clarify where you have found it?
The POS always talks about balancing Vacation homes and units. The Florida law always talks about Timeshare Units. I have never found a requirement regarding the whole resort.
The need to balance the whole resort was a common (I think) misconception shared on this board at the time the SSR THV reallocation was done, that's one of the reson no one complained. But I've not found it anywhere in legal documents, which doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I have always found only reference to a classic timeshare with weeks sold and for point systems just a few sentences. I have not been able to find any detailed regulation about point systems in Florida law.
 
nov direct sales were disappointing, riv sold below avg at 64k points. Only 36% of riv points have been sold to date

So Riv has been selling for 2 years? Do we feel they are ahead/behind or on schedule based on how many points RIV has to sell?
 
Prediction

nov direct sales were disappointing, riv sold below avg at 64k points. Only 36% of riv points have been sold to date

gfv2 sales price point will be $201 with better than riv incentives day 1 then incentives matching riv after initial sales

consequences of overpricing gfv

if dvc prices gfv above $201 I’d predict equal to lower than riv monthly sales. Let’s say they do 50k points a month. It would take dvc 40 months to sell all gfv points. Dvc will want to close gfv much faster than 40 months especially given any sales into gfv will reduce riv sales. So where riv did 64k points in nov, with gfv in play you can probably expect to half riv sale volumes.

so there it is, gfv goes on sale at an identical price point to riv
I suspect that when they announced VGF2 in May 2021, corporate Disney expected COVID to be winding down by now, and that there would be a surge in vacationers by now.

In May 2021, COVID rates were plunging and Disney was ending its outdoor mask mandate.

Makes me wonder if they still would have announced it if they knew there was going to be at least two more surges.
 
Covid has changed the dvc pool of buyers dramatically. There may be the odd crazy but 99% of buyers will be domestic. Even Canadians will be questioning a dvc purchase when Canada keeps threatening to shut down the boarders. Even with Omni Canada is dangling the risk of shutting the boarders. No way would I as an international risk spending my money on a dvc timeshare that I most likely wouldn’t get to use, and if i do the effort to plan a USA trip likely being quite extensive and more expensive than usual


I think it’s safe to say they are way off their numbers, proof being the cancellation of reflections and that riv is only 36% sold

i expect dvc will move forward with gfv as it’s a cheap conversion and even depressed sales results in $. But the numbers are going from bad to worse for dvc

lets play a game and say the domestic market can support 65k points a month, going off of riv sales. Adding gfv isn’t going to increase demand per say just add more supply therefore sales if evenly split between riv and gfv that gives dvc 30k and change of sales per month at each resort

that looks terrible

so let’s now play another game and say riv stays at $201 while gfv sells for $250 as some current owners hope

riv sales stay more or less stagnant while gfv sales are pitifully low. Let’s say 50k for riv and 15k a month for gfv.

this looks even worse to Disney execs. I wouldn’t want to be the poor sod who has to present monthly sales numbers with the Premier resort selling sub 20k

this all but assures gfv price point has to be inline with riv otherwise dvc lays a big goose egg and execs get fired
 

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