The Vaccine Discussion Thread

[mevelandry]

If I remember correctly you are in Canada..? I'm not sure how its going up there, but we were stretched thin and underfunded in this department even before covid...

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-...-medical-examiners-coroners-last-week-tonight
And they are prohibitively expensive:
"Autopsies are not covered under Medicare, Medicaid or most insurance plans, though some hospitals -- teaching hospitals in particular -- do not charge for autopsies of individuals who passed away in the facility. A private autopsy by an outside expert can cost between $3,000 and $5,000. In some cases, there may be an additional charge for the transportation of the body to and from the autopsy facility."

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/post-mortem/things-to-know/autopsy-101.html
For Oregon they do say that there will be an autopsy in this case, but it varies from state to state:

• Contagious diseases that may pose a public health threat

https://multco.us/health/providers/medical-examiner

If I remember correctly you are in Canada..? I'm not sure how its going up there, but we were stretched thin and underfunded in this department even before covid...

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-...-medical-examiners-coroners-last-week-tonight
And they are prohibitively expensive:
"Autopsies are not covered under Medicare, Medicaid or most insurance plans, though some hospitals -- teaching hospitals in particular -- do not charge for autopsies of individuals who passed away in the facility. A private autopsy by an outside expert can cost between $3,000 and $5,000. In some cases, there may be an additional charge for the transportation of the body to and from the autopsy facility."

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/post-mortem/things-to-know/autopsy-101.html
For Oregon they do say that there will be an autopsy in this case, but it varies from state to state:

• Contagious diseases that may pose a public health threat

https://multco.us/health/providers/medical-examiner

Here, from what I understand, it is still possible to ask for it (a doctor must signs for it) and I don’t think there are costs for the family... but right now with COVID, it can take longer. (Canadians: feel free to correct me if I am wrong). Also, I just made a short research but I think they currently don’t do autopsies when they are certain that the person died from COVID, unless there is appearance of another factor that may have caused death (ex: other symptom, accident, homicide, etc.) ...

What I can say is that some death that were originally accounted for COVID are removed from time to time.

 

[sullivan.kscott]

I think calling it “horrifying” is bit dramatic.

I have dealt with adult ECMO for the entirety of my professional career. The effects of COVID, even if you don’t reach this level, are horrific. Being hooked up to one of these bad boys for weeks or longer is detrimental to quality of life long after weaning.
I’d take the side effects or immune response of a vaccine over any of the respiratory or myriad other outcomes of COVID any day.

 

[cgolf]

I am curious how the other vaccines will hold up to the mutations. I think that the mRNA vaccines are set to hold up well because they mimic the spike protein. I haven't had time lately to read up on the others to see if the could be as effective against mutations. So I hope right now I get the Pfizer or Moderna vaccine when my turn comes.

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

If I remember correctly you are in Canada..? I'm not sure how its going up there, but we were stretched thin and underfunded in this department even before covid...

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-...-medical-examiners-coroners-last-week-tonight
And they are prohibitively expensive:
"Autopsies are not covered under Medicare, Medicaid or most insurance plans, though some hospitals -- teaching hospitals in particular -- do not charge for autopsies of individuals who passed away in the facility. A private autopsy by an outside expert can cost between $3,000 and $5,000. In some cases, there may be an additional charge for the transportation of the body to and from the autopsy facility."

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/post-mortem/things-to-know/autopsy-101.html
For Oregon they do say that there will be an autopsy in this case, but it varies from state to state:

• Contagious diseases that may pose a public health threat

https://multco.us/health/providers/medical-examiner

Not to mention it’s not exactly a delicate surgery. After witnessing one as a student, I wouldn’t choose that for someone I loved unless there were extreme circumstances where it was a real mystery as to the cause of death. By law it must be done for murder, suicide, accidental death or suspicious causes. In those cases there is no choice.

 

[sullivan.kscott]

Not everyone has an autopsy. In fact, they are being done less often than usual these days.

You’re right. I’m so used to deaths being in a care setting (hospital), that I forget that most deaths don’t occur in a place where a family or coroner might request one be completed. If your loved one passes at home or hospice, it is cost prohibitive (and the request may not even be granted if the county is overrun and under staffed).

 

[DCLMP]

View attachment 552213
I have dealt with adult ECMO for the entirety of my professional career. The effects of COVID, even if you don’t reach this level, are horrific. Being hooked up to one of these bad boys for weeks or longer is detrimental to quality of life long after weaning.
I’d take the side effects or immune response of a vaccine over any of the respiratory or myriad other outcomes of COVID any day.

Not to get off track, but that is the outcome for a very small percentage of the people that get Covid. The survival rate is very high and many people have mild to no symptoms. Lets not lose sight of that. I would not say it’s horrific for everyone.

I do agree the risks of the vaccine appear to be very low. I’m sure most people will eventually get the vaccine.

 

[sullivan.kscott]

Not to get off track, but that is the outcome for a very small percentage of the people that get Covid. The survival rate is very high and many people have mild to no symptoms. Lets not lose sight of that. I would not say it’s horrific for everyone.

I do agree the risks of the vaccine appear to be very low. I’m sure most people will eventually get the vaccine.

The problem is not knowing where you fall until it happens. Yes statistics can tell us a lot. Almost all of us at this point know a statistical outlier or two, is my only point.

 

[mevelandry]

I think calling it “horrifying” is bit dramatic.

It’s not dramatic, it’s accurate. There are plenty of documentaries and reports showing what is going on in hospitals right now and testimonies from people who have experienced severe damages due to the virus. It is very well documented.

 

[Orion Nebula]

It’s not dramatic, it’s accurate. There are plenty of documentaries and reports showing what is going on in hospitals right now and testimonies from people who have experienced severe damages due to the virus. It is very well documented.

The person said we needed to keep sight of that fact that only a certain percentage of people die from it. So in turn it's not horrific for everyone.

For better or worse I feel horrible for everyone who loses a loved one, even outside of Covid. I have a tough time creating a threshold around percentages to decide on what's considered "horrifying" or not. For me people contracting and dying from Covid is a serious problem regardless if most don't end up in the ICU.

To each their own, these are the DIS boards after all we are supposed to be happy. =)

 

[AquaDame]

Please lets keep the topic on vaccines and cruising...!

 

[mevelandry]

**Just saw the moderator‘s request**

 

[braysmommy]

For those with kids 12-17

View attachment 552213
I have dealt with adult ECMO for the entirety of my professional career. The effects of COVID, even if you don’t reach this level, are horrific. Being hooked up to one of these bad boys for weeks or longer is detrimental to quality of life long after weaning.
I’d take the side effects or immune response of a vaccine over any of the respiratory or myriad other outcomes of COVID any day.

Same! I have had my first dose and can't wait for the second and have submitted paperwork to hopefully have my 14 yr old part of a Moderna trail.

 

[sethschroeder]

Still don't see vaccines being a requirement of cruising.

As someone brought up certain vaccines are less preventative than others.

They are talking about more or less preventative against new strains as well. Even a possible annual booster requirement.

Still think it will be testing requirements for everyone. Countries may require the vaccine we will see but not DCL I highly doubt.

 

[DCLMP]

It’s not dramatic, it’s accurate. There are plenty of documentaries and reports showing what is going on in hospitals right now and testimonies from people who have experienced severe damages due to the virus. It is very well documented.

I think the stats speak for themselves. It’s probably better to stay on topic or they will shut the thread down.

 

[sullivan.kscott]

For those with kids 12-17


Same! I have had my first dose and can't wait for the second and have submitted paperwork to hopefully have my 14 yr old part of a Moderna trail.

DS13 really want to join a trial and “do his part” after watching mom and dad get the shots. Unfortunately the nearest center is about a 12 hour drive or a very inconvenient flight pattern away.
Good luck and thank you to your child! We’ll all hopefully benefit from your willingness to participate.

 

[braysmommy]

DS13 really want to join a trial and “do his part” after watching mom and dad get the shots. Unfortunately the nearest center is about a 12 hour drive or a very inconvenient flight pattern away.
Good luck and thank you to your child! We’ll all hopefully benefit from your willingness to participate.

We live in MA and the trial, if he gets in, will only be about 40 minutes away. When we first looked it was a flight to TX and I'm all for science but that is a little far.

 

[Intr3pid]

Moderna CEO says they are working on the booster shot for their vaccine.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/25/cov...d-booster-shots-for-south-african-strain.html
On the lower efficacy of the existing formulation:

The vaccine generated a weaker immune response against the South African strain, but the antibodies remained above levels that are expected to be protective against the virus, the company said, adding the findings may suggest “a potential risk of earlier waning of immunity to the new B.1.351 strains.”

On the boosters:

"Out of an abundance of caution and leveraging the flexibility of our mRNA platform, we are advancing an emerging variant booster candidate against the variant first identified in the Republic of South Africa into the clinic to determine if it will be more effective to boost titers against this and potentially future variants."

The stock is up today. Market thinks people will need a second or boosted shot later this year and the next.

 

[mevelandry]

Still don't see vaccines being a requirement of cruising.

As someone brought up certain vaccines are less preventative than others.

They are talking about more or less preventative against new strains as well. Even a possible annual booster requirement.

Still think it will be testing requirements for everyone. Countries may require the vaccine we will see but not DCL I highly doubt.

IMO, the main problem with vaccine requirement for cruising is that kids are not receiving the vaccine and possibly won’t for a very long time. All cruise lines are not like Virgin (adult only).

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

View attachment 552213
I have dealt with adult ECMO for the entirety of my professional career. The effects of COVID, even if you don’t reach this level, are horrific. Being hooked up to one of these bad boys for weeks or longer is detrimental to quality of life long after weaning.
I’d take the side effects or immune response of a vaccine over any of the respiratory or myriad other outcomes of COVID any day.

Wow, I didnt realize they had adult ECMO. Before I switched to breast imaging, I worked in pediatric xray and we’d have newborns go on it usually for meconium aspiration (inhaling feces) during delivery.
It was so sad to see and I always felt so bad for the parents. Poor little bunnies would get like 5+ chest xrays per day for weeks in the ICN just trying to keep them alive. Of course this was back in the early 1990’s so a lot has probably changed.

 

[o&smom]

Interesting story out of California:
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2021/01/23/placer-covid-vaccine-person-dies/

There have actually been 181 deaths reported to the U.S. Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting Service (VAERS). Not confirmed, but possible link being examined.