The next country to drop the "bomb" will be?

[Viking]

I am biting my tongue so hard it is bleeding. The audacity of a German casting stones about and other nations's WWII era policy or deeds galls me to the core. I would type more... but, enough said.

OOOPS,
I nearly forgot that the American public immediately demanded interference when it learned what happened in Nazi Germany
I also forgot that Rooseveldt didn't have to fight any resistance to have the USA involved.

Just for the record:
I have posted on these boards innerable times that I'm most grateful to what teh Allied Forced did for my country and Europe. I also have posted innumerable times that even though I was born two generations after WWII I still feel shame for what happened in my country.
So posts like yours are simply unjust and unnessary rubbish.

 

[L107ANGEL]

OOOPS,
I nearly forgot that the American public immediately demanded interference when it learned what happened in Nazi Germany
I also forgot that Rooseveldt didn't have to fight any resistance to have the USA involved.

Just for the record:
I have posted on these boards innerable times that I'm most grateful to what teh Allied Forced did for my country and Europe. I also have posted innumerable times that even though I was born two generations after WWII I still feel shame for what happened in my country.
So posts like yours are simply unjust and unnessary rubbish.[/QUOTE]
The same can be said of many

 

[cardaway]

Just for the record:
I have posted on these boards innerable times that I'm most grateful to what teh Allied Forced did for my country and Europe. I also have posted innumerable times that even though I was born two generations after WWII I still feel shame for what happened in my country.
So posts like yours are simply unjust and unnessary rubbish.

Maybe if you posted that in your first post he would have never needed to post that.

 

[Viking]

Do you have anything to back that up? A guy at the bar the other night said that all Germans were behind the countries decision to perform medical tests on the Jews in the concentration camps in WWII. I told him that it's not polite to spread rumors that have no basis in fact.

It is a well known fact that there was no political reason to drop the second bomb. The unconditional surrender of the Tenno was already a certainty. The bomb dropped on Nagasaki was of a different kind then the Hiroshima-device and the data obtained during and after its use was very welcome.

Regarding your second statement:
This is one of the things I have asked my Gramps and otehr peopel of his generation many times. My Gramps i.e. was a plain soldier manning a ground-to-air cannon shooting down bombers. I asked them specifically about what happened to the jews and other minorities. The Average Joes simply didn't think much about it. Their neighbors disappeared and that was it. They even claimed to have not known about the concentration camps or what happened there. Don't get me wrong: This is not meant as an excuse, but as an explanation.
One example:
In 'Mein Kampf' you can clearly read what Hitler's plans for the jews were. Nearly every German had that book. So did my Grandparents. They received it as a gift for their wedding when the got married in 1939 when Gramps was drafted (They got mainly married then to make sure that Granny got a pension in case he was killed). I found that book deeply burried in a closet when we cleared Gramps' basement - it was still in its original wrapper, it had never been opened before that. So saying all Germans knew or approved what happend in the camps would be as fair as saying all Americans knew about the torture at Abu Ghraib.

 

[TCPluto]

OOOPS,
I nearly forgot that the American public immediately demanded interference when it learned what happened in Nazi Germany
I also forgot that Rooseveldt didn't have to fight any resistance to have the USA involved.

Just for the record:
I have posted on these boards innerable times that I'm most grateful to what teh Allied Forced did for my country and Europe. I also have posted innumerable times that even though I was born two generations after WWII I still feel shame for what happened in my country.
So posts like yours are simply unjust and unnessary rubbish.

After so many posts by you making fun of others for using improper grammar, spelling, and punctuation, I'm surprised you would not edit your own. Except they were all American, so I suppose ridiculing them was more fun for you, right?

Maybe your pompous, arrogant attitude is becoming to you, but it's not to many here...

 

[L107ANGEL]

Maybe if you posted that in your first post he would have never needed to post that.

I'm sure he is getting around to your response

 

[Viking]

Maybe if you posted that in your first post he would have never needed to post that.

Why?
Just because some Americans can't stand criticism of their history and start spitting venom as soon as they are confronted with the dark spots on tehir country's ?

 

[Viking]

After so many posts by you making fun of others for using improper grammar, spelling, and punctuation, I'm surprised you would not edit your own. Except they were all American, so I suppose ridiculing them was more fun for you, right?

Maybe your pompous, arrogant attitude is becoming to you, but it's not to many here...

I would never riducule someone like you as you are making a much better job in that field

 

[L107ANGEL]

Why?
Just because some Americans can't stand criticism of their history and start spitting venom as soon as they are confronted with the dark spots on tehir country's ?

You know what Viking, I normally stay away from political debates, heck most debates! Fact is I can't debate my way out of a paper bag.
Your point here is infuriating! It's almost like you are trying to anger people.
I love my country as I am sure you love yours. I love my country, flaws and all! Do I think we are the perfect government and soceity? No, but I will fight till the end for the USA!
You make it a point to put this country down too often. Why would you ever want to step foot here?

 

[Viking]

Why not? I believe one of the biggest worries around countries having nuclear weapons is that the security around them might not be up to snuff. I know I don't trust everybody to keep unbreakable security around them.

IMO a scenario that involves a stolen nuke is totally plausible.

You've seen 'Project Peacemaker' one time too many

AFAIK it's not exactly an easy task to convert a stolen warhead into a backpack-bomb.
But I must conced that with all the chaos in the former Soviet Republics that it may very well be a possibilty that criminal or fanatic elements get hold of such a warhead - and that is a scary thought. As a fan of Tom Clancy I also have read 'The Sum of all Fears' and that one scared the **** out of me. especially if you take into account that Clancy also used commercial aircraft as WMD in his books (Debt of Honour/Executive Orders).
And with more and more former Soviet Repeublics falling under muslim influence it really gets scary

 

[Duckfan-in-Chicago]

It is a well known fact that there was no political reason to drop the second bomb. The unconditional surrender of the Tenno was already a certainty. The bomb dropped on Nagasaki was of a different kind then the Hiroshima-device and the data obtained during and after its use was very welcome.

Regarding your second statement:
This is one of the things I have asked my Gramps and otehr peopel of his generation many times. My Gramps i.e. was a plain soldier manning a ground-to-air cannon shooting down bombers. I asked them specifically about what happened to the jews and other minorities. The Average Joes simply didn't think much about it. Their neighbors disappeared and that was it. They even claimed to have not known about the concentration camps or what happened there. Don't get me wrong: This is not meant as an excuse, but as an explanation.
One example:
In 'Mein Kampf' you can clearly read what Hitler's plans for the jews were. Nearly every German had that book. So did my Grandparents. They received it as a gift for their wedding when the got married in 1939 when Gramps was drafted (They got mainly married then to make sure that Granny got a pension in case he was killed). I found that book deeply burried in a closet when we cleared Gramps' basement - it was still in its original wrapper, it had never been opened before that. So saying all Germans knew or approved what happend in the camps would be as fair as saying all Americans knew about the torture at Abu Ghraib.

As far as your first statement goes, I've seen that debated back and forth in numerous books, and such...this from Wikipedia:

The role of the bombings in Japan's surrender, as well as the effects and justification of them, have been subject to much debate. In the U.S., the prevailing view is that the bombings ended the war months sooner than would otherwise have been the case, saving many lives that would have been lost on both sides if the planned invasion of Japan had taken place[3]. In Japan, the general public tends to think that the bombings were needless as the preparation for the surrender was in progress in Tokyo[4].


Since this is DEBATED and not something that is agreed upon, like I said, find me a reputable source that says the US bombed Nagasaki as 'an extended field test of a new weapon' or do we play a game where we get to make up stuff to ease our guilt over our own countries actions in past wars?

Now this guy at the bar, he said if Hitler had the bomb first everyone wanted him to drop a whole bunch of them, and it wouldn't be to end a war. If the whole plan doesn't work out, in the future, the plan was for everyone to just claim they didn't know anything that was going on when they talk about it to their families. I told this guy this is like slander against an entire country!

 

[TCPluto]

You make it a point to put this country down too often. Why would you ever want to step foot here?

His only real point is to belittle and demean the US at every turn and at all cost. He then tries to come across as morally and intellectually superior to everyone, but specifically Americans.

I agree, why would you ever want to come to the USA?

 

[Viking]

You know what Viking, I normally stay away from political debates, heck most debates! Fact is I can't debate my way out of a paper bag.
Your point here is infuriating! It's almost like you are trying to anger people.
I love my country as I am sure you love yours. I love my country, flaws and all! Do I think we are the perfect government and soceity? No, but I will fight till the end for the USA!
You make it a point to put this country down too often. Why would you ever want to step foot here?

Thank you for making my point. You are exactly one of those types I was referring to and if all American were like you I would really think twice before having my 10th US-vacation in September.

Fortunately many Americans are open-minded and can see that there are also enough dark spots in your history - with several of them added just recently.
Just because someone critizises the USA doesn't mean he or she hates your country.
Quite contrarily I really like the USA and because of that I can't eat as much as I want to puke when I see what happened to the USA since the rightwing nutcases took over.

 

[momof2inPA]

China.

 

[TCPluto]

the plan was for everyone to just claim they didn't know anything that was going

Priceless observation!

 

[WonderfulDreamer2]

Here we go again. Seem's he can read all the posts except the one asking for the rudeness and ugliness to come to a halt. This is a never ending hobby of his to comment on a country he is not a part of but act the victim the moment anyone brings up concentration camps/Hitler. Par for the course. I expect no more and no less from him.

 

[L107ANGEL]

Thank you for making my point. You are exactly one of those types I was referring to and if all American were like you I would really think twice before having my 10th US-vacation in September.

Fortunately many Americans are open-minded and can see that there are also enough dark spots in your history - with several of them added just recently.
Just because someone critizises the USA doesn't mean he or she hates your country.
Quite contrarily I really like the USA and because of that I can't eat as much as I want to puke when I see what happened to the USA since the rightwing nutcases took over.

Can you clarify this for me? I stated I love my country and that bothers you? Why would you not want me to love my country? Can anyone explain this to me?

 

[Tigger&Belle]

Makes me wonder why melon threads aren't allowed on the DIS, but this crap is. It's just argumentative, unproductive, "rubbish".

 

[Duckfan-in-Chicago]

Thank you for making my point. You are exactly one of those types I was referring to and if all American were like you I would really think twice before having my 10th US-vacation in September.

Fortunately many Americans are open-minded and can see that there are also enough dark spots in your history - with several of them added just recently.
Just because someone critizises the USA doesn't mean he or she hates your country.
Quite contrarily I really like the USA and because of that I can't eat as much as I want to puke when I see what happened to the USA since the rightwing nutcases took over.

She's one of the more open-minded people I've met on these boards. I bet if you did a survey you'd see that...unless by open-minded did you mean someone that agreeded with you?

 

[Viking]

Since this is DEBATED and not something that is agreed upon, like I said, find me a reputable source that says the US bombed Nagasaki as 'an extended field test of a new weapon' or do we play a game where we get to make up stuff to ease our guilt over our own countries actions in past wars?

Ok,
let's agree that the use of the two bombs is at least debatable.

The other issue:
I would never try to ease the guilt of my country regarding what happened '33-'45. There is NO way to ease that guilt!!!!!

But what what really nags me is that self-righteous attitude used by some Americans when it comes to their country's guilt
-The native americans did NOT commit suicide nor handed over their land voluntarily.
-The slaves didn't swim accross the Atlantic Ocean to apply as labourers on the cottonfields