The Liberal Thread #2 - No Debate Please

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Well, I heard this morning that Senator McCain is in a bit of a quandry money wise. I'm no expert on campaign finance (or any other finance for that matter..)
:lmao: Thats ok, by his own account neither his he!!!!!!:scared1:
Why would a Presidential candiadate say that he stinks in Economics...is beyond my comphrension!

We've already seen the tack they're going to take against Obama-"he's not patriotic, you know, he doesn't wear a flag pin. Well, if he's not patriotic, why is he running for President...oh, well, there must be some other motivation. Did you know his middle name is Hussein? I heard he went to a madrassa...."
:guilty: And people will by that "lock, stock and barrel"
 
Or are the republicans voting in the democratic primaries....thats why the democrat numbers are so high??????
Many states are allow this & register the day off. There are rumors that Wisconsin had people bussed in from Illinois for Primary day. No need to even prove your address.:eek:

Here is the Geraldine Ferrao article from the NYT yesterday. This is why the Super Delagates come into play.

http://www.nytimes.com/glogin?URI=h...uzzw-x-oovxo-x-Q22xz,l6lz6x-Q22HKuuRuzMGwQ2FB

There is no evidence (other than baseless rumor and conjecture) that Republicans are voting in Democratic primaries.

I like Ferraro, but I see the party playing this much differently. Super delegates are politicians and will do what is politically expedient.
 
Well, I heard this morning that Senator McCain is in a bit of a quandry money wise. I'm no expert on campaign finance (or any other finance for that matter..) but it appears that he originally accepted public $$, has spent nearly all of it and now wants to go private. Apparently, that's against the rules. Once you go public you can't go back. I don't know what impact this issue will have on the general election-if any.
That's been in the news for a while (don't you listen to NPR's "Morning Edition" in the morning ;)).

One of McCain's advisers, Trevor Potter, is a former FEC chairman. Potter advised McCain to apply for the public financing through the FEC and then get a loan for private campaign money. McCain was approved (or "certified") for the public money, but never touched it.

With his certification in place, he then went to Fidelity & Trust Bank to get his loan. The trick is that they did not "officially" use the public money as collateral for the private loan, but the bank required him to reapply for public funding if he lost the early primaries. The assumption here is that if he lost the early primaries then he could reapply and use the public financing money to pay his debt. I am not a lawyer, but IMO his FEC certification was a key component in getting the loan.

As of Feb 6, McCain wants out of his public financing agreement which he can do as long as (1) He has not used the funds and (2) He did not use the funds as collateral for a loan. Now, (2) is the rub, isn't it? Did he use the funds as collateral? Or did Potter's legal slight of hand work?

To add more confusion to this all, the FEC cannot do a darn thing because there are 4 vacancies on the board and the the Democrats in the Senate have been fighting over one of the nominees to the board. The Republicans want all their nominees to be voted on at one as a package (all OK or all not OK) and Democrats want to vote for them individually. It seems odd that they would not be voted on individually. But ... in the meantime the FEC can't really do a thing without a quorum and those missing members. They can't rule on McCain's request to withdrawal from public funding (although Potter thinks they don't need to meet at all, of course). They also cannot meet to discus the Democrat's objection to McCain's request to withdrawal.

I find this whole thing very interesting. I think it's another nail in the coffin of the "Straight Talker" John McCain that used to be. The one that didn't cozy up with lobbyists and who believed in finance reform.
 
That's been in the news for a while (don't you listen to NPR's "Morning Edition" in the morning ;)).

One of McCain's advisers, Trevor Potter, is a former FEC chairman. Potter advised McCain to apply for the public financing through the FEC and then get a loan for private campaign money. McCain was approved (or "certified") for the public money, but never touched it.

With his certification in place, he then went to Fidelity & Trust Bank to get his loan. The trick is that they did not "officially" use the public money as collateral for the private loan, but the bank required him to reapply for public funding if he lost the early primaries. The assumption here is that if he lost the early primaries then he could reapply and use the public financing money to pay his debt. I am not a lawyer, but IMO his FEC certification was a key component in getting the loan.

As of Feb 6, McCain wants out of his public financing agreement which he can do as long as (1) He has not used the funds and (2) He did not use the funds as collateral for a loan. Now, (2) is the rub, isn't it? Did he use the funds as collateral? Or did Potter's legal slight of hand work?

To add more confusion to this all, the FEC cannot do a darn thing because there are 4 vacancies on the board and the the Democrats in the Senate have been fighting over one of the nominees to the board. The Republicans want all their nominees to be voted on at one as a package (all OK or all not OK) and Democrats want to vote for them individually. It seems odd that they would not be voted on individually. But ... in the meantime the FEC can't really do a thing without a quorum and those missing members. They can't rule on McCain's request to withdrawal from public funding (although Potter thinks they don't need to meet at all, of course). They also cannot meet to discus the Democrat's objection to McCain's request to withdrawal.

I find this whole thing very interesting. I think it's another nail in the coffin of the "Straight Talker" John McCain that used to be. The one that didn't cozy up with lobbyists and who believed in finance reform.

Actually, that's where I heard it this morning!:lmao: I just found an NPR station that comes in clearly all the way to work. I really hadn't heard much about it before that.

That was really the point of the Times story too-but everyone got caught up in the sex angle. What the Times was trying to point out was that Mr Straight Talk was no different than any other Senator when it came to lobbyists and influence.
 

There is no evidence (other than baseless rumor and conjecture) that Republicans are voting in Democratic primaries.

How would something like this be proved?????:confused3
There lyes the problem with the Primaries!
 
How would something like this be proved?????:confused3
There lyes the problem with the Primaries!

It would be hard work, but possible.

Voting rolls are public information. In any given precinct, we know who (by name and address) is registered to which party and whether or not they voted.

You count up the Republicans that voted
You count up the Independents that voted
You count up the Democrats that voted

And compare those numbers to the spread of votes cast for each candidate.
 
It would be hard work, but possible.

Voting rolls are public information. In any given precinct, we know who (by name and address) is registered to which party and whether or not they voted.

You count up the Republicans that voted
You count up the Independents that voted
You count up the Democrats that voted

And compare those numbers to the spread of votes cast for each candidate.


Thats the problem. In some of the states, you dont declare your party affiliation. You just vote. In Wisconsin you just show up, dont even need to prove your Home address!

Literally ANYONE can just come in and vote, you dont even have to be a citizen!:scared1:
 
That was really the point of the Times story too-but everyone got caught up in the sex angle. What the Times was trying to point out was that Mr Straight Talk was no different than any other Senator when it came to lobbyists and influence.
I know. The problem was that he had a lobbyist "run tame" through his campaign: hanging out at his office, going to fund raising stops and flying on his jet. Unfortunately, the NY Times innuendo about a romantic relationship has eclipsed everything else. And now they are being called on the carpet for it and the real story is being swept under the carpet.
 
Thats the problem. In some of the states, you dont declare your party affiliation. You just vote. In Wisconsin you just show up, dont even need to prove your Home address!

Literally ANYONE can just come in and vote, you dont even have to be a citizen!:scared1:
Wait a minute there. You have been chatting it up with your pals over on the Conservative thread a bit too much. Did they offer you kool aid to go with your cookies?

You are 100% WRONG! I live in Wisconsin and I have worked almost every single election (both primaries and the general election) for the past 6 years as an election official. I can tell you straight up the you MUST be a US citizen to vote. You also MUST prove your Wisconsin residency when you register to vote. Don't go spouting off on stuff you don't understand. If you have any questions about Wisconsin's electoral process I will be happy to answer them.
 
Wait a minute there. You have been chatting it up with your pals over on the Conservative thread a bit too much. Did they offer you kool aid to go with your cookies?

You are 100% WRONG! I live in Wisconsin and I have worked almost every single election (both primaries and the general election) for the past 6 years as an election official. I can tell you straight up the you MUST be a US citizen to vote. You also MUST prove your Wisconsin residency when you register to vote. Don't go spouting off on stuff you don't understand. If you have any questions about Wisconsin's electoral process I will be happy to answer them.

:thumbsup2 Stop with the 'sprouting"!

This is what I heard on the radio not on the other thread!

Say I show up on primary day to vote....what do i need to show you in order to vote????
 
Thats the problem. In some of the states, you dont declare your party affiliation. You just vote. In Wisconsin you just show up, dont even need to prove your Home address!

Literally ANYONE can just come in and vote, you dont even have to be a citizen!:scared1:

Oh come on...first the bussed in from IL story and now this? It seems you are trying to subtly discount Obama's huge win there.

Drop the conservative thread kool-aid! :lmao:
 
:thumbsup2 Stop with the 'sprouting"!

This is what I heard on the radio not on the other thread!

Say I show up on primary day to vote....what do i need to show you in order to vote????

Using my dd's username.....I can answer this,, I just voted as a new voter in WI (we just moved here in Aug from Ohio)....I had to show either a WI drivers license or proof of residency of at least 10 days prior to the election (pay stub, utility bill, etc..) when I registered. I did not have to declare a party. All candidates were listed on the ballot and you just marked who you were voting for. They also asked for ID for everyone voting.

FTR, I voted for Obama!
 
In Minnesota, you can show up the day of the election with just your driver's license and vote. If you are registered already you don't even show your ID. You just sign by your name on the printed out list they have there.

I feel anyone can walk in there with a fake ID and vote. But I am not sure how to change the system. I don't know how other states handle things.

You don't have to claim a party either. You get a ticket with all parties on there.
 
Oh come on...first the bussed in from IL story and now this? It seems you are trying to subtly discount Obama's huge win there.

Drop the conservative thread kool-aid! :lmao:

:lmao: No kool aid here! Lets talk 'subtle" "Mr when should hillary drop out thread starter upper"!

Using my dd's username.....I can answer this,, I just voted as a new voter in WI (we just moved here in Aug from Ohio)....I had to show either a WI drivers license or proof of residency of at least 10 days prior to the election (pay stub, utility bill, etc..) when I registered. I did not have to declare a party. All candidates were listed on the ballot and you just marked who you were voting for. They also asked for ID for everyone voting.

FTR, I voted for Obama!

Thanks ohhhhhh Mystery poster!:goodvibes

What if your paystub was from another state? Did the Utility bill have to be in your name?
 
Say I show up on primary day to vote....what do i need to show you in order to vote????
I work one of the student polling places at the University.

If you are already registered all you need to do is provide your full name and address. That is cross-checked by two election officials, you are given a voter number which you exchange for a ballot. In the primaries you may vote for either party, but all your votes must be in that party. It was easier this last election because there were only presidential candidates and no other offices on the ballot. Still, we had a handful of people who voted for one democrat and one republican. Students :rolleyes1.

The great thing about WI, if that you may register the same day of the election. A full 2/3rds of our voters at the University were new registrations. If you are not registered to vote you must provide a proof of residency. You must live in WI for at least 10 days prior to the election. All of the people live in the dorms, so it makes it extra easy. The University provides us with a current list of dorm residents and we look up their names on a list. Off-campus proof of residency can be a valid Driver's License with your address on it, a utility bill in your name or a copy of your lease as well as other things. You may even have a valid elector (voter) vouch for you. That mostly happens when homeless people come into vote. In addition, if you have a valid WI DL, you must provide the number. If you don't have a valid DL, the last 4 digits of your SSN will suffice. On the form you must check the box that you are over 18 and that you are a US citizen and then sign the form. An election official verifies the proof of residency and that the person checked all the correct boxes and then signs the form. The new voter can then be added to a list of voters and get their voter number and ballot.

That's in a a nut shell.
 
In Minnesota, you can show up the day of the election with just your driver's license and vote. If you are registered already you don't even show your ID. You just sign by your name on the printed out list they have there.

I feel anyone can walk in there with a fake ID and vote. But I am not sure how to change the system. I don't know how other states handle things.

You don't have to claim a party either. You get a ticket with all parties on there.

Can you vote there if not previously registered?
 
In Massachusetts I register when I renew or change my Drivers License. I show no ID when I show up at the poll. But Then it's always Angela sitting at the check in desk, and she knows all of us anyway. ;)
 
I work one of the student polling places at the University.

If you are already registered all you need to do is provide your full name and address. That is cross-checked by two election officials, you are given a voter number which you exchange for a ballot. In the primaries you may vote for either party, but all your votes must be in that party. It was easier this last election because there were only presidential candidates and no other offices on the ballot. Still, we had a handful of people who voted for one democrat and one republican. Students :rolleyes1.

The great thing about WI, if that you may register the same day of the election. A full 2/3rds of our voters at the University were new registrations. If you are not registered to vote you must provide a proof of residency. You must live in WI for at least 10 days prior to the election. All of the people live in the dorms, so it makes it extra easy. The University provides us with a current list of dorm residents and we look up their names on a list. Off-campus proof of residency can be a valid Driver's License with your address on it, a utility bill in your name or a copy of your lease as well as other things. You may even have a valid elector (voter) vouch for you. That mostly happens when homeless people come into vote. In addition, if you have a valid WI DL, you must provide the number. If you don't have a valid DL, the last 4 digits of your SSN will suffice. On the form you must check the box that you are over 18 and that you are a US citizen and then sign the form. An election official verifies the proof of residency and that the person checked all the correct boxes and then signs the form. The new voter can then be added to a list of voters and get their voter number and ballot.

That's in a a nut shell.

Thanks!:thumbsup2

One more....What is a "valid elector"!
Ok...Two more! What happens if after the election (i gather some one double checks) people gave bad "last 4 digits" of their Social Security number?
 
Yes, you can register the day of the election. You just have to bring your ID.

Which is?????

I ask about the ID thing, cause My parents who a very much americans, and live in Pa...BUT dont have valid id.
 
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