The Liberal Thread #2 - No Debate Please

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OMG - I've just read the whole social program thread.

I had to come back "home" even if I have to read many "hillary is horrible" posts! ;)

Some of those posters are hard to stomach!! I've never seen so many unempathetic people in one place!

Well you know, that's real-American, white Christian crowd over there. They love their fellow men so long as it doesn't cost them anything. It must be a flaw in their Bible translation.

Of course when it comes to killing muslims, well heck, they don't even keep count -- not an important statistic in their lives.
:sad2:
 
I found the plagerism interesting...as for Hillary copying words from Obama they both have used each others words....but Obama used someone elses whole speech....

When he did the speech I though it was a good speech but I also thought they were his words not someone else's...and If Hillary had done that it would be all over this thread about how bad she is....

but I find since Obama did it it is of course dismissed.

and again it is turned around to hoe bad the clintons are. Personally he should have just said...As in the words of my friend who gave this speech in 2006.....and than preceded with the speech.

To make it as if it was his speech and his alone I say Shame on Obama. Do I think it will make a difference in his election....absolutely not.

Here is the speeches back to back.....http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2008/02/sweet_barack_obama_lifts_some.html
 
[QUOTE="Got Disney";23291278]I found the plagerism interesting...as for Hillary copying words from Obama they both have used each others words....but Obama used someone elses whole speech....

When he did the speech I though it was a good speech but I also thought they were his words not someone else's...and If Hillary had done that it would be all over this thread about how bad she is....

but I find since Obama did it it is of course dismissed.

and again it is turned around to hoe bad the clintons are. Personally he should have just said...As in the words of my friend who gave this speech in 2006.....and than preceded with the speech.

To make it as if it was his speech and his alone I say Shame on Obama. Do I think it will make a difference in his election....absolutely not.

Here is the speeches back to back.....http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2008/02/sweet_barack_obama_lifts_some.html[/QUOTE]

Oh please, if that's the news the Clintons want to try to spin, I say bring it. For a candidate who seems to claim to be so well versed on the issues, she rarely wants to talk about them, and instead holds conference calls about this.

I loved her attack ad in Wisconsin about Obama saying no to a WI debate - they've had 18 debates, with two more on the way. I think they've pretty much debated the issues and we'd be left with a debate mirroring what happened in SC (petty negative personal attacks). Also, didn't she skip over WI to campaign in TX until this past weekend, and then cancelled her events today in WI to leave early for TX, but only then to cancel the cancellation. I'm surprised she's campaigning in TX, since her campaign dismisses Obama wins in red states, and today called the red-state delegates, "second-class delegates."

And she wonders why 47% of the country is already dead-set against her. Oh, and I just happily gave another donation to Obama.
 
The Today show tommorrow (Tuesday) Matt Lauer interviews Obama
 

...didn't she skip over WI to campaign in TX until this past weekend, and then cancelled her events today in WI to leave early for TX, but only then to cancel the cancellation. I'm surprised she's campaigning in TX, since her campaign dismisses Obama wins in red states, and today called the red-state delegates, "second-class delegates."


I tell you this, if I were still supporting Clinton's campaign, this would make me beyond frustrated. Just exactly who is running the show over there...it all seems so chaotic and unorganised. No attack here, I just feel that it's got to be so exhausting for Hillary supporters.
 
I tell you this, if I were still supporting Clinton's campaign, this would make me beyond frustrated. Just exactly who is running the show over there...it all seems so chaotic and unorganised. No attack here, I just feel that it's got to be so exhausting for Hillary supporters.

Honestly, I think it's because they had no planning in place for a 'drawn-out' primary campaign. In the beginning, they thought they'd have the 2,025 by February 5th and have been scrambling to adjust their campaign. What I also don't understand is that, up until recently, they had no idea how the TX primary works with regards to delegate allocations.

For someone who criticized Obama's management style following the debate where they had to say something negative about themselves (and Obama said he loses papers), it's startling to see how her campaign is so badly organized.
 
It was reported - I read it last night.

Quite honestly - I don't see him endorsing Hillary......

I was just reading this and so thought I would post it .....
Obama however said he does not need his endorsement because he will already have his votes....


http://thepage.time.com/halperins-take-why-john-edwards-endorsement-matters/

As to what Edwards might do in the end, several informed Democrats believe no endorsement could be the most likely outcome. ABC News reports that Edwards’ advisers believe he will decide before the March 4 primaries.
But the best reported tea leaves come from the Associated Press, whose reporting has been confirmed by The Page, regarding John and Elizabeth Edwards:
“The couple has been impressed with Clinton, who has more effectively courted them since the 2004 vice presidential nominee dropped out, people who talk to the Edwardses say. Obama has been less attentive, they say, and some of those close to the Edwardses have been annoyed that Obama has continued to ridicule him for once saying his biggest weakness is that he has a powerful response to seeing pain in others.”
 
I tell you this, if I were still supporting Clinton's campaign, this would make me beyond frustrated. Just exactly who is running the show over there...it all seems so chaotic and unorganised. No attack here, I just feel that it's got to be so exhausting for Hillary supporters.

Well I tell you - she's got quite the microscope over her campaign, reporting every little thing - it all tends to add up.

She still has a shot - albeit long - I'd like to see her pull it off - but it certainly will not be easy. It seems like everything is against her. And yes, it could be as a result of her campaign's own fault as well as having the misforture of having to compete against such a dynamic speaker. I mean look who's in the WH now...... Still - I am proud to support someone who isn't a quitter. I give her a lot of credit for that.

And who knows - maybe in the future, the next woman candidate will analyze her campaign, make the necessary corrections and win one day.......
 
[QUOTE="Got Disney";23291814]I was just reading this and so thought I would post it .....
Obama however said he does not need his endorsement because he will already have his votes....
[/QUOTE]


I think Edwards will wait until it gets a bit closer to the TX/OH primaries, see who's the stronger candidate, and throw his endorsement to the leader. However, Clinton could definitely use those 26 delegates that he carries in his pocket like so many nickels and dimes (Sollozzo ;) ), so Edwards could probably get more bang for his buck by backing the more desperate Clinton campaign should she win the nomination.
 
Well I tell you - she's got quite the microscope over her campaign, reporting every little thing - it all tends to add up.

She still has a shot - albeit long - I'd like to see her pull it off - but it certainly will not be easy. It seems like everything is against her. And yes, it could be as a result of her campaign's own fault as well as having the misfortune of having to compete against such a dynamic speaker. I mean look who's in the WH now...... Still - I am proud to support someone who isn't a quitter. I give her a lot of credit for that.

And who knows - maybe in the future, the next woman candidate will analyze her campaign, make the necessary corrections and win one day.......
She can not compete with Obamas Campaigning. He has come from the bottom of "Obama who" to having such momentum. He has run a fantastic campaign and that has made all the difference.
that is where Hillary went wrong. She thought she had it in the bag because everyone and all the polls were saying she did so she figured she did not need much money and that it would be all over by Super Tuesday so she planned nothing from there out.

So if one lesson is to be learned is to "Never under estimate your opponent when they seem to be down":thumbsup2
Bill did not help her with his stupid remarks. I think if she came full blast as Obama did it would have been even closer or even with her leading.

If she does not get the nod than i am sure that Hillary's campaign will be the one for another woman to use as an example of how not to think you have something that you may not...
I have no doubt that she is kicking herself for dropping the bag.
But in all fairness she was told over and over she was going to be the next Dem to get the nod...she should have just not thought that..if that is what she thought...
 
Just got an email invite from the Obama campaign to a rally on Wednesday at Reunion Arena in Dallas. I rsvp but it is a first come first-serve basis. In such a BIG metroplex, I may not get in but I am excited. For any other Dallas-Ft Worth area supporters, here is what the invite looks like:


"You're Invited

This Wednesday, Barack Obama will be in Dallas for a Stand for Change Rally, where he'll talk about his vision for bringing about the kind of change we can believe in.

Stand for Change Rally with Barack Obama

Reunion Arena
777 Sports Street
Dallas, TX

Wednesday, February 20, 2008
Doors Open: 10:30 a.m.
Program Begins: 12:00 p.m.

The event is free and open to the public. Tickets are not required, but an RSVP is strongly encouraged. Admission is on a first come, first-served basis. Sign up now:

RSVP Now

http://tx.barackobama.com/dallas

For security reasons, do not bring bags. Please limit personal items. No signs or banners are permitted."
.......................................................................................................

But first things first. Tomorrow I'm heading to the polling station to vote early for Change!
 
Cross-posted on the Hillary thread:

Hi everyone!I just got back from Hillary's rally here in Madison. She is taking a page from her husband's book and she spoke for over an hour. I have to say that I agreed with everything she said. As an added bonus, I HAD to cheer her good and loud. My DD (in the picture below) cashed in on her cuteness. She was sitting on my friend's shoulder waving her Hillary sign and we were selected to sit in the bleachers directly behind Hillary only 3 rows up! At the last minute! Wow. I have to say that the support Tammy Baldwin (only Lesbian congressman and my very own congressman) and Lt Gov Barbara Lawton makes me go hhhmmmmm. Those are both women and politicians who I greatly admire.

Alas ... I gave no pictures :(. I brought my expensive $300 Canon S3 IS instead of my DD's German POS so I could take pictures from far away without them being blurry. My Obama/Mr. Bill pictures were taken with the Jenopik and I wanted something a bit nicer. I forgot to check the batteries and I lugged around a very expensive yet totally useless camera :laughing:. I took 3 really bad pictures on my cell phone. I'll post them if I can figure how to get them off my phone.

Anyway ... I shook Chelsea's hand and Hillary's hand and I got autographs on the sign for my friend who is definately voting for her.

As for me ... I think I will flip-flop until I walk into the booth tomorrow and fill in the arrow next to someone's name.
 
Cross-posted on the Hillary thread:

Hi everyone!I just got back from Hillary's rally here in Madison. She is taking a page from her husband's book and she spoke for over an hour. I have to say that I agreed with everything she said. As an added bonus, I HAD to cheer her good and loud. My DD (in the picture below) cashed in on her cuteness. She was sitting on my friend's shoulder waving her Hillary sign and we were selected to sit in the bleachers directly behind Hillary only 3 rows up! At the last minute! Wow. I have to say that the support Tammy Baldwin (only Lesbian congressman and my very own congressman) and Lt Gov Barbara Lawton makes me go hhhmmmmm. Those are both women and politicians who I greatly admire.

Alas ... I gave no pictures :(. I brought my expensive $300 Canon S3 IS instead of my DD's German POS so I could take pictures from far away without them being blurry. My Obama/Mr. Bill pictures were taken with the Jenopik and I wanted something a bit nicer. I forgot to check the batteries and I lugged around a very expensive yet totally useless camera :laughing:. I took 3 really bad pictures on my cell phone. I'll post them if I can figure how to get them off my phone.

Anyway ... I shook Chelsea's hand and Hillary's hand and I got autographs on the sign for my friend who is definately voting for her.

As for me ... I think I will flip-flop until I walk into the booth tomorrow and fill in the arrow next to someone's name.

I posted to this on the Hillary thread also....:thumbsup2 :rotfl:
 
:scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1:

IT JUST HIT ME!!! I AM OOOOOOOOOOOLD!:headache:

This never dawned on me till now...But Obama is younger than me. This is the FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE someone running for President is younger than me!!!!:scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1:

OH CRAP!
I have the same problem. I'm 4 months older. LOL.
 
[quote="Got Disney";23293451]I got ya both beat......:rotfl2: hmmmmm dont think that is something for me to brag about however :lmao:[/quote]Older than Hillary :eek: ?!?!
 
Sorry, I know you guys don't want to debate more about this primary, but this article sums up the chaos of the Democratic party this spring and summer:

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0208/8583.html

Clinton targets pledged delegates
By: Roger Simon
Feb 19, 2008 05:48 AM EST


Richmond Mayor L. Douglas Wilder predicted riots in the streets if the Clinton campaign were to overturn an Obama lead through the use of superdelegates.
Photo: AP

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Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign intends to go after delegates whom Barack Obama has already won in the caucuses and primaries if she needs them to win the nomination.

This strategy was confirmed to me by a high-ranking Clinton official on Monday. And I am not talking about superdelegates, those 795 party big shots who are not pledged to anybody. I am talking about getting pledged delegates to switch sides.

What? Isn’t that impossible? A pledged delegate is pledged to a particular candidate and cannot switch, right?

Wrong.

Pledged delegates are not really pledged at all, not even on the first ballot. This has been an open secret in the party for years, but it has never really mattered because there has almost always been a clear victor by the time the convention convened.

But not this time. This time, one candidate may enter the convention leading by just a few pledged delegates, and those delegates may find themselves being promised the sun, moon and stars to switch sides.

“I swear it is not happening now, but as we get closer to the convention, if it is a stalemate, everybody will be going after everybody’s delegates,” a senior Clinton official told me Monday afternoon. “All the rules will be going out the window.”

Rules of good behavior, maybe. But, in fact, the actual rules of the party allow for such switching. The notion that pledged delegates must vote for a certain candidate is, according to the Democratic National Committee, a “myth.”


Economy prompts GOP defections
How Hillary can still win
Weak GOP-ers eager to stump with McCain
“Delegates are NOT bound to vote for the candidate they are pledged to at the convention or on the first ballot,” a recent DNC memo states. “A delegate goes to the convention with a signed pledge of support for a particular presidential candidate. At the convention, while it is assumed that the delegate will cast their vote for the candidate they are publicly pledged to, it is not required.”

Clinton spokesman Phil Singer told me Monday he assumes the Obama campaign is going after delegates pledged to Clinton, though a senior Obama aide told me he knew of no such strategy.

But one neutral Democratic operative said to me: “If you are Hillary Clinton, you know you can’t get the nomination just with superdelegates without splitting the party. You have to go after the pledged delegates.”

Winning with superdelegates is potentially party-splitting because it could mean throwing out the choice of the elected delegates and substituting the choice of 795 party big shots.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has warned against it. “I think there is a concern when the public speaks and there is a counter-decision made to that,” she said. “It would be a problem for the party if the verdict would be something different than the public has decided.”

Donna Brazile, who was Al Gore’s campaign manager in 2000 and is a member of the DNC, said recently: “If 795 of my colleagues decide this election, I will quit [the DNC]. I feel very strongly about this.”

On Sunday, Doug Wilder, the mayor of Richmond and a former governor of Virginia, went even further, predicting riots in the streets if the Clinton campaign were to overturn an Obama lead through the use of superdelegates.

“There will be chaos at the convention,” Wilder told Bob Schieffer on “Face the Nation.”

“If you think 1968 was bad, you watch: In 2008, it will be worse.”

But would getting pledged delegates to switch sides be any less controversial? Perhaps not. They were chosen by voters, but they were chosen to back a particular candidate.

And it is unlikely that many people, including the pledged delegates themselves, know that pledged delegates actually can switch.

Nor would it be easy to get them to switch.

If, however, after the April 22 Pennsylvania primary the pledged delegate count looks very close, the Clinton official said, “[both] sides will start working all delegates.”

In other words, Clinton and Obama will have to go after every delegate who is alive and breathing.

It's a perfect example of why I do not support HRC.
 
:scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1:

IT JUST HIT ME!!! I AM OOOOOOOOOOOLD!:headache:

This never dawned on me till now...But Obama is younger than me. This is the FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE someone running for President is younger than me!!!!:scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1: :scared1:

OH CRAP!

Kinda sucks, doesn't it? :lmao:
 
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