The Great 'Throwaway Room' Debate

[jcb]

Jack, thank you for an agreeable and informative exchange. I agree with you on most points, where we diverge is the happiness issue. Maybe one day when I have as much experience with Disney as you do then I might see examples of Disney putting $ over guest experience, but right now I do not. I just have a different perspective of the parks. People often complain Disney isn't putting money back into the parks or there's not enough attractions to absorb the crowds or any number of things you hear these days. I don't see it that way. Not enough attractions? That's why they're building Pandora, Disney Springs, and whatever is on the horizon for Hollywood Studios. Parks are crowded? That's why they implemented My Magic+.

I don't know. Maybe I have rose colored glasses on, but I have a very positive view of WDW these days.

Fair enough. Just for clarity, if you took me as saying Disney doesn't care about guest happiness, then I wasn't being clear. Disney clearly does. I just don't think Disney puts much if any emphasis on keeping the "loyal" (i.e., repeat) guest happy.

 

[SmithSmith]

Nugov,

I completely agree that reselling magic bands would be a huge hassle, but I also think booking a throwaway room is a hassle. I really didn't mean to suggest that people do this, it was just a completely random thought I had. Please don't put much thought into it.

 

[SmithSmith]

Fair enough. Just for clarity, if you took me as saying Disney doesn't care about guest happiness, then I wasn't being clear. Disney clearly does. I just don't think Disney puts much if any emphasis on keeping the "loyal" (i.e., repeat) guest happy.

Glad you cleared that up because that's how I took it.

Out of curiosity, what do you see that suggests Disney treats loyal guests differently than the average guest?

 

[nugov2]

Nugov,

If ability to book FP wasn't included in the perks of booking a throwaway room, would you still book a throwaway room?

Nope, but I'd also pay for it separately or book a throwaway for as many days of my trip to gain access. We have one booked for 2 days for our Uni/IOA portion of our trip as well. Disney set the guidelines to get FP which now is one day gets you a rolling 60 so that works for me.

For us(5 people) one room isn't going to fly for anything over 1-2 days and in all of our other short trips we get suites not a standard room. The cost of a 2bdrm at Disney is so high with minimal perks(700 a night about) it doesn't make sense to spend that when I can book off site 6 bdrms for 200-300 depending on season and add in the room somewhere else and I still have a huge savings. We don't enjoy public transportation so a car is a must regardless. Nothing else Disney offers to onsite is of interest to me or I can get even staying offsite(food at the hotel restaurants, extra experiences and even all resort activities minus pool non hotel guests are welcome).

 

[nugov2]

Nugov,

I completely agree that reselling magic bands would be a huge hassle, but I also think booking a throwaway room is a hassle. I really didn't mean to suggest that people do this, it was just a completely random thought I had. Please don't put much thought into it.

I was just mentioning that if that is what people are getting hot under the collar about it is highly unlikely someone would do that.

I don't mind that people view it differently. I find it no hassle at all and obviously within Disney guidelines. My issue or source of anger is when people compare the people who do it to crimminals. I am a very honest person and really don't understand how people view it as stealing if you aren't lying to get MB or cancelling after you book/get MB. I do enjoy a healthy respectful discussion and you have been very respectful, so I appreciate that

 

[Laketravis]

I think it would be a hospitality executive's dream to have every room in their hotel booked with guests who never set foot on the property.

For all we know, Disney is internally promoting an increased occupancy rate of campsites as a result of FP+

 

[SmithSmith]

Nope, but I'd also pay for it separately or book a throwaway for as many days of my trip to gain access. We have one booked for 2 days for our Uni/IOA portion of our trip as well. Disney set the guidelines to get FP which now is one day gets you a rolling 60 so that works for me.

For us(5 people) one room isn't going to fly for anything over 1-2 days and in all of our other short trips we get suites not a standard room. The cost of a 2bdrm at Disney is so high with minimal perks(700 a night about) it doesn't make sense to spend that when I can book off site 6 bdrms for 200-300 depending on season and add in the room somewhere else and I still have a huge savings. We don't enjoy public transportation so a car is a must regardless. Nothing else Disney offers to onsite is of interest to me or I can get even staying offsite(food at the hotel restaurants, extra experiences and even all resort activities minus pool non hotel guests are welcome).

This is interesting because in disproving one of my theories, you actually are proving a different one. That this throwaway room debate is different than the ones from the past because of the addition of MM+. You're actually confirming that a throwaway room was of no use to you until the addition of FP booking windows. So it could be seen that for a long time this practice was accepted/tolerated because it didn't have a negative impact, but with the practice becoming more popular it has a greater impact than ever before.

 

[nugov2]

This is interesting because in disproving one of my theories, you actually are proving a different one. That this throwaway room debate is different than the ones from the past because of the addition of MM+. You're actually confirming that a throwaway room was of no use to you until the addition of FP booking windows. So it could be seen that for a long time this practice was accepted/tolerated because it didn't have a negative impact, but with the practice becoming more popular it has a greater impact than ever before.

I agree that it was of no use to me before, but lots of other's found use in it. I think WDW knew this and that for the last 10+ years this concept was something people would do with the right perks and that is exactly why they set it up the way they did. You don't get the full benefit that a completely onsite guest gets, but by paying for a room you wouldn't have otherwise they get money from people they normally wouldn't and you get a better than only offsite, but still not as good as completely onsite. It is a win, win. My biggest thing is that there is no way I believe this is some loophole Disney has no idea exists. They can block you out of EMH and parking after checkout so the only explanation(IMO) is that they intentionally made it rolling 60 days with one night hotel stay for length of ticket. I don't buy into the fact that disney is this incompetent to set it up that way unintentionally.

 

[SmithSmith]

I was just mentioning that if that is what people are getting hot under the collar about it is highly unlikely someone would do that.

I don't mind that people view it differently. I find it no hassle at all and obviously within Disney guidelines. My issue or source of anger is when people compare the people who do it to crimminals. I am a very honest person and really don't understand how people view it as stealing if you aren't lying to get MB or cancelling after you book/get MB. I do enjoy a healthy respectful discussion and you have been very respectful, so I appreciate that

I wouldn't liken it to criminal activity but I do find it to be cheating. Then again I'm also childless by choice and do not have a large family nor large vacation expenses. So I'm never going to be in a position where it's that cost prohibitive to stay onsite. It's just a shame that FW suffers because of it.

I totally agree, today's chat with everyone is so different from yesterday's. I'm actually enjoying it now, and finally feel listened to and respected. So thank you for that.

 

[SmithSmith]

I agree that it was of no use to me before, but lots of other's found use in it. I think WDW knew this and that for the last 10+ years this concept was something people would do with the right perks and that is exactly why they set it up the way they did. You don't get the full benefit that a completely onsite guest gets, but by paying for a room you wouldn't have otherwise they get money from people they normally wouldn't and you get a better than only offsite, but still not as good as completely onsite. It is a win, win. My biggest thing is that there is no way I believe this is some loophole Disney has no idea exists. They can block you out of EMH and parking after checkout so the only explanation(IMO) is that they intentionally made it rolling 60 days with one night hotel stay for length of ticket. I don't buy into the fact that disney is this incompetent to set it up that way unintentionally.

I'm sure Disney knows it exists, but I feel the slow roll out of MM+ is the reason they haven't closed the loophole. So agree to disagree.

 

[Laketravis]

It's just a shame that FW suffers because of it.

But does it?

I just checked for campsite availability thru the end of this year and the only time all 90 of them are booked solid is 4 days of Thanksgiving (11/26-11/29). There are still campsites available over Christmas and New Years and all days in between.

 

[nugov2]

I'm sure Disney knows it exists, but I feel the slow roll out of MM+ is the reason they haven't closed the loophole. So agree to disagree.

But why did they make it like that to begin with? When you develop a program it is just as easy to allow a feature as it is to block it. I could see if all onsite perks were possible after checkout or even if just the 60 days booking for length of ticket didn't change, but they would have to write that in(rolling 60 days) b/c it is different than onsite and offsite. They did that special...why would they write the system to work that way unintentionally? That is what makes me feel this is exactly what they intended. Maybe even testing to see how many do this(by monitoring one night stays with longer tickets) to see who finds this valuable. Maybe it is to see if there is a market for just a pay feature or maybe just to continue to take advantage of those who will pay, but not stay at their resort.

 

[5olearys]

Nugov,

If ability to book FP wasn't included in the perks of booking a throwaway room, would you still book a throwaway room?

Howdy. Interesting debate that will probably not see a peaceful conclusion! So many firm opinions!

I would book that. And I did. I paid for what I guess would be called a "throwaway" campsite - under thirty days out - so that we could hang out at Ft. Wilderness during the day for archery lessons, pony rides, touring the (possibly decorated) campsites, smores and a wagon ride under the stars. As a side effect we also get EMH and parking. I just don't want to camp there at this time because we have a kiddo with special needs who is in no way able to cope with sleeping outdoors, and we are not able to swing the cost of a cabin stay. I want my kids to get the feel of the resort without sleeping there.

We are staying at a different on-site resort at the beginning of our stay, and to be honest the 60 day FP thing did nothing special for us. At the time I booked, SDMT wasn't available for ANY day of our stay. We've booked four out of our family of five's FPs for that ride in the last few weeks (I still don't have one lol), and we are less than two weeks from arrival.

So...when our campsite isn't used...should they deactivate our "perks" for the rest of the stay? No one knows what happened with those empty sites. Perhaps some of them were reserved by families like us. Wanted to give you a different perspective. Just wondering what your thoughts are.

 

[verleniahall]

I willa dmit it - I booked what ya'll are calling a "throwaway room" due to the fact that Disney gave me bad information. I called to book 1 week room-only with a military discount. I was YELLED at over the phone that the military didn't get any special perks, that they were the same as everyone else and was HUNG UP ON. This almost caused me to cancell our trip. After a long discussion with my DH, we booked off site via expedia and ended up with a Good Neighbor hotel about 5 minutes away from property. When our plans changed and we were leaving a day early, the DH suggested that we book 1 night on property. I mentioned that we would get some special perks and he was all for it. When I called and told the lady what happened, they looked up the previous phone call and it HAD been recorded - they were very sorry that it happened. We were given a room only military discount for the 1 night we stayed on property. Was I able to get 2 days of free parking? Yes I did. Was I able to reserve my FF+ in advance? Yes I was. (granted, it was 1 day at a time at 60 days each, but I got them) Did I get Magic Bands? Yes I did.


Do I feel bad about it? No. No I don't.

Its not up to YOU to decide how someone who has paid money uses their room that THEY have paid for.

 

[wdw4rfam]

I willa dmit it - I booked what ya'll are calling a "throwaway room" due to the fact that Disney gave me bad information. I called to book 1 week room-only with a military discount. I was YELLED at over the phone that the military didn't get any special perks, that they were the same as everyone else and was HUNG UP ON. This almost caused me to cancell our trip. After a long discussion with my DH, we booked off site via expedia and ended up with a Good Neighbor hotel about 5 minutes away from property. When our plans changed and we were leaving a day early, the DH suggested that we book 1 night on property. I mentioned that we would get some special perks and he was all for it. When I called and told the lady what happened, they looked up the previous phone call and it HAD been recorded - they were very sorry that it happened. We were given a room only military discount for the 1 night we stayed on property. Was I able to get 2 days of free parking? Yes I did. Was I able to reserve my FF+ in advance? Yes I was. (granted, it was 1 day at a time at 60 days each, but I got them) Did I get Magic Bands? Yes I did.


Do I feel bad about it? No. No I don't.

Its not up to YOU to decide how someone who has paid money uses their room that THEY have paid for.

 

[SmithSmith]

Howdy. Interesting debate that will probably not see a peaceful conclusion! So many firm opinions!

I would book that. And I did. I paid for what I guess would be called a "throwaway" campsite - under thirty days out - so that we could hang out at Ft. Wilderness during the day for archery lessons, pony rides, touring the (possibly decorated) campsites, smores and a wagon ride under the stars. As a side effect we also get EMH and parking. I just don't want to camp there at this time because we have a kiddo with special needs who is in no way able to cope with sleeping outdoors, and we are not able to swing the cost of a cabin stay. I want my kids to get the feel of the resort without sleeping there.

We are staying at a different on-site resort at the beginning of our stay, and to be honest the 60 day FP thing did nothing special for us. At the time I booked, SDMT wasn't available for ANY day of our stay. We've booked four out of our family of five's FPs for that ride in the last few weeks (I still don't have one lol), and we are less than two weeks from arrival.

So...when our campsite isn't used...should they deactivate our "perks" for the rest of the stay? No one knows what happened with those empty sites. Perhaps some of them were reserved by families like us. Wanted to give you a different perspective. Just wondering what your thoughts are.

Why did you book a campsite to visit FW? Isn't everything available to everyone regardless if they stay there?

 

[SmithSmith]

But why did they make it like that to begin with? When you develop a program it is just as easy to allow a feature as it is to block it. I could see if all onsite perks were possible after checkout or even if just the 60 days booking for length of ticket didn't change, but they would have to write that in(rolling 60 days) b/c it is different than onsite and offsite. They did that special...why would they write the system to work that way unintentionally? That is what makes me feel this is exactly what they intended. Maybe even testing to see how many do this(by monitoring one night stays with longer tickets) to see who finds this valuable. Maybe it is to see if there is a market for just a pay feature or maybe just to continue to take advantage of those who will pay, but not stay at their resort.

I have no idea whether it was intention or an accident But we definitely see that there's a market for it.

 

[nugov2]

Why did you book a campsite to visit FW? Isn't everything available to everyone regardless if they stay there?

Yes, all of that is available. We went on one of our off days on our last trip and did it all. Some of it is free(chip and dale campfire) some has a fee, like the pony rides and smores kit.

 

[SmithSmith]

Yes, all of that is available. We went on one of our off days on our last trip and did it all. Some of it is free(chip and dale campfire) some has a fee, like the pony rides and smores kit.

That's what I thought. So why the need to book a campsite?

 

[drclaws]

Discussion is interesting, but the one question I haven't seen answered....can you sleep six in a throwaway room??