The Genie Usage, Tips and Strategy ONLY Thread

[monkeybug]

I have to make dining reservations tomorrow morning so I'm trying to finalize my park plans today. Is planning to rope drop a park and then hop to a different park in the afternoon a good strategy with Genie+? Is there a park where Genie+ works better if you don't hop?

We will have 5 day tickets so could do one morning and one evening at each park and then have a day to hit up things we want to revisit. Our resort qualifies us for Extra Evening hours in Epcot and MK and early entry (SOG). No little kids in our group either.

 

[Jedimike]

You understand correctly, that post was incorrect. it's 2 hours after park open.

Just checking my understanding for this SDD example. If you book SDD at 7 AM and get a later window, closer to 11 AM, and tap into SDD at 10:55 AM, you can book another LL at 10:55 post-SDD tap in, then again at 11:00 AM, post-2 hour rule?

 

[elgerber]

Just checking my understanding for this SDD example. If you book SDD at 7 AM and get a later window, closer to 11 AM, and tap into SDD at 10:55 AM, you can book another LL at 10:55 post-SDD tap in, then again at 11:00 AM, post-2 hour rule?

No, that is incorrect. You can only book the 2nd, if you didn't use the first one yet. You would have to wait until 11 to book (two hours after park open) then tap in to SDD and book a 2nd.

 

[Jedimike]

No, that is incorrect. You can only book the 2nd, if you didn't use the first one yet. You would have to wait until 11 to book (two hours after park open) then tap in to SDD and book a 2nd.

Ahhh, I see. So if you tap in before 11 AM, then you're stuck with either waiting 2 hours from that time point or post-tap of the next LL, whichever comes first? So it seems pretty important to time your LL tap the right way!

 

[elgerber]

Ahhh, I see. So if you tap in before 11 AM, then you're stuck with either waiting 2 hours from that time point or post-tap of the next LL, whichever comes first? So it seems pretty important to time your LL tap the right way!

Correct!

 

[Jedimike]

For arrival days, if we think we'll get to MK at around Noon -- we have no option other than to just check through the morning for the LL windows to hit the Noon time frame? No way to schedule ahead, right?

 

[mab2012]

I haven’t read any pages of this forum since Sunday, so I apologize if this has already been covered:


We arrived this weekend and tried stacking on Sunday at Magic Kingdom. 2 different family groups tried with 2 sets of plans. Couldn’t get the 3rd stack to work. I have no idea what we did wrong?

My example:

-At 7:30 am booked Pirates from 10:15-11:15 (1st LL)

- At 11:00 am (120 minute rule) booked 2nd LL for Haunted Mansion @ 1:40 pm

- At 11:16 (before riding Pirates during grace period) tried booking 3rd LL.

- system said “ineligible”. Tried twice. No luck. Other family members had same problem with a separate but similar plan.

- rode Pirates during grace window and were able to use the 2 LL’s for the afternoon.

Anyone know why this may have happened?

When you book any LL pass, your eligibility timer is reset to two hours from the time of booking, or the end time of the pass you just booked, whichever is sooner. It is not based on the end time of any currently held, earlier LL passes. This has been specifically tested and confirmed.

So in your case, when you booked your HM LL at 11 am for a 1:40 pm return time, your eligibility timer would have been reset to 1 pm. You should have been able to immediately book a second LL after tapping into Pirates, which would have reset your eligibility timer again, to two hours from that time or the end time of that pass, whichever was earlier.

I don't know enough about what you did after tapping into Pirates to give specific information, but whatever your eligibility time ended up at, if you waited for that time to pass without cancelling or tapping into any additional rides, you should have been able to start another "stack" at that time.

 

[wisblue]

For arrival days, if we think we'll get to MK at around Noon -- we have no option other than to just check through the morning for the LL windows to hit the Noon time frame? No way to schedule ahead, right?

That is true, but it doesn’t take that long for some attractions to get to return times after noon. For example, the Jungle Cruise return time is usually out past noon before the park opens at 9. Same for Peter Pan.

If you want one of those you should start checking right at 7 and watch the time grow out past noon. Some others like Haunted Mansion and BTMRR might be out past noon not long after 9.

Depending on what your favorites are, when MK opens at 9 AM, I would recommend booking one before 9, another right at 11 (by that time all of the major attractions will have return times past noon), and another right at 1 PM (or as soon as you use your first one between noon and 1).

Once you have more than one active LL in hand you will be in good position to take advantage of the “stacking” approach discussed in detail in this thread by booking a new LL every time you use one but before you use another one.

 

[dmunsil]

I spent another $16 today to test some more edge cases.

I haven’t learned much that’s new. I deliberately tried to see if maybe the system quietly makes you eligible if one of your existing reservations expires, even when that expiration is not set as your current eligibility return time. The short answer is that no it doesn’t. I looked at two scenarios:

A: book 65+ minutes away, wait 2 hours, book, wait for expiration of original reservation

At 7:20 Booked HM at 10:15. Eligibility time set to 11:00 as expected. At 11:00 (11:01 by my phone’s time) eligibility returned (I was continuously trying to book). Booked Jungle Cruise (via many refreshes) at 4:00. Eligibility set to 1:00, as expected. Deliberately waited until 11:17 to be comfortably past expiration. Couldn’t book, as expected.

B: book overlapping stacked rides, wait for expiration of earlier ride, book, cancel, book, wait for expiration of later one

At 11:20 canceled HM and booked Peter Pan for 12:10 (again, many refreshes). Eligibility set to 1:10 (as expected). Canceled Jungle Cruise and booked Laugh Floor for 11:25. Eligibility set to 12:25 (as expected). Waited until 12:25, eligibility returned. Booked Dumbo for 12:40. Eligibility now 1:40. Cancelled Laugh Floor, booked Magic Carpets for 1:10. Eligibility now 2:10. Waited until 1:10 when Peter Pan “expired”, no eligibility return.

I did learn that as long as a G+ reservation is still visible in your My Day list, you can cancel it, even if the grace period is gone. If you refresh your view (or the system does), expired reservations disappear at about 10 minutes after the end time. But if you lock your phone and lose track of time, and the reservation is still there when you unlock 25 minutes after the end, it’ll still let you cancel.

I totally meant to test that scenario and didn’t just mess up. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Is there another scenario folks want tested? The $16 is sunk cost now, I’m happy to try something else. I’m not in Orlando today, so I can only test cancellation, not tapping in.

 

[Jedimike]

At 7:20 Booked HM at 10:15. Eligibility time set to 11:00 as expected. At 11:00 (11:01 by my phone’s time) eligibility returned (I was continuously trying to book). Booked Jungle Cruise (via many refreshes) at 4:00...

At 11:20 canceled HM and booked Peter Pan for 12:10 (again, many refreshes). Eligibility set to 1:10 (as expected)...

When you mention the "many refreshes" -- is this similar to the older FP+ system where sometimes rides would appear that didn't initially load upon first glance? Do the ride times change with the refreshes in both directions, or only to later times?

 

[dmunsil]

When you mention the "many refreshes" -- is this similar to the older FP+ system where sometimes rides would appear that didn't initially load upon first glance? Do the ride times change with the refreshes in both directions, or only to later times?

Exactly yes. Until you tap the button and see the time on the ”select party” screen, it’s not guaranteed. If you refresh, or bounce back and forth between the tip board and select party screen, you can see earlier times pop up.

The ride times can vary both ways. Once I was trying to snag an 11:00 Jungle Cruise, and when I tapped the button it showed me a confirmation for 9:20! But more often it’s the same as or later than the tip board time.

 

[js]

Exactly yes. Until you tap the button and see the time on the ”select party” screen, it’s not guaranteed. If you refresh, or bounce back and forth between the tip board and select party screen, you can see earlier times pop up.

The ride times can vary both ways. Once I was trying to snag an 11:00 Jungle Cruise, and when I tapped the button it showed me a confirmation for 9:20! But more often it’s the same as or later than the tip board time.

Great to know. Thank you for testing this and giving us your input!

 

[William B]

I spent another $16 today to test some more edge cases.

I haven’t learned much that’s new. I deliberately tried to see if maybe the system quietly makes you eligible if one of your existing reservations expires, even when that expiration is not set as your current eligibility return time. The short answer is that no it doesn’t. I looked at two scenarios:

A: book 65+ minutes away, wait 2 hours, book, wait for expiration of original reservation

At 7:20 Booked HM at 10:15. Eligibility time set to 11:00 as expected. At 11:00 (11:01 by my phone’s time) eligibility returned (I was continuously trying to book). Booked Jungle Cruise (via many refreshes) at 4:00. Eligibility set to 1:00, as expected. Deliberately waited until 11:17 to be comfortably past expiration. Couldn’t book, as expected.

B: book overlapping stacked rides, wait for expiration of earlier ride, book, cancel, book, wait for expiration of later one

At 11:20 canceled HM and booked Peter Pan for 12:10 (again, many refreshes). Eligibility set to 1:10 (as expected). Canceled Jungle Cruise and booked Laugh Floor for 11:25. Eligibility set to 12:25 (as expected). Waited until 12:25, eligibility returned. Booked Dumbo for 12:40. Eligibility now 1:40. Cancelled Laugh Floor, booked Magic Carpets for 1:10. Eligibility now 2:10. Waited until 1:10 when Peter Pan “expired”, no eligibility return.

I did learn that as long as a G+ reservation is still visible in your My Day list, you can cancel it, even if the grace period is gone. If you refresh your view (or the system does), expired reservations disappear at about 10 minutes after the end time. But if you lock your phone and lose track of time, and the reservation is still there when you unlock 25 minutes after the end, it’ll still let you cancel.

I totally meant to test that scenario and didn’t just mess up. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Is there another scenario folks want tested? The $16 is sunk cost now, I’m happy to try something else. I’m not in Orlando today, so I can only test cancellation, not tapping in.

I know you are only doing cancellations and expirations because you are not there, but I am curious about your scenario A. I book HM for 10:15. Then at 11 I book JC or whatever. I then tap into HM at 11:05. Do I get another one to replace the HM? So I could have the JC at 1 and then when I tap into HM at 11:05 get a laugh floor for 11:30 or whatever?

 

[dmunsil]

I know you are only doing cancellations and expirations because you are not there, but I am curious about your scenario A. I book HM for 10:15. Then at 11 I book JC or whatever. I then tap into HM at 11:05. Do I get another one to replace the HM? So I could have the JC at 1 and then when I tap into HM at 11:05 get a laugh floor for 11:30 or whatever?

Correct. I wrote a whole long post about this: https://www.disboards.com/threads/t...egy-only-thread.3857056/page-50#post-63517569

 

[maryj11]

Correct!

I’m confused. If we got a LL before 11:00 we still have to wait til 11:00 to book another? I thought once you tapped in you could book another.

 

[VeronicaZS]

OMG, you guys, I think I FINALLY get it, even the 120 min rule. I've read most of this thread and watched Molly's videos and it finally clicked for me at minute 17 of this video. Please let me know if I got it right, I was really worried I was going to have to turn in my Disney expert button!!! And not a moment too soon, 11 days till we are back in the magic to celebrate DH's 50th birthday.
The SECRET to Using Genie+ in Disney World's Hollywood Studios - YouTube

Basic Strategy
Book your first G+.

• if your first G+ is within the first 2 hours of the park being open you will be able to book another G+ as soon as you tap into that ride (2 tap points are required) OR if your 1 hour window expires. You can continue making G+ for the rest of the day as long as you don't make a reservation more than 2 hours from when you last tapped in or your last ride window expired.
  • If you book an G+ more than 2 hours after you tapped into the last one you will be subject to the 120 min rule. For example, at 1:05pm you book an G+ for your favorite "hard to get attraction" but the time slot is 5:30pm. You will not be able to book another G+ until 3:05pm (120 min from when you last booked a ride). At 3:05 you will be able to book new G+ as described in the main bullet. You have now created a double stack.
• if your first G+ is after the first 2 hours of park open, you will not be able to make additional G+ until 120 min after park open. After that you can continue booking G+ as described in the previous scenario.

Stacking Strategy

• To start the stack, you need to let your G+ window expire and then make another G+ even if this is within the first 2 hours of the park being officially open. AFTER making another G+, tap into your expired G+ during the 15 min grace period. You can now implement the basic scenario described above but you have 2 parallel paths of G+.
• You can also start a stack by triggering the 120 min rule as described in the sub bullet above.

Advantages of Stacking

• Get through all the rides more quickly
• Hold a "hard to get" G+ for later in the day but still be able to get G+ on your parallel track while your 'later in the day G+ is in the 120 min cool down window.

When to start the G+ or Stack

• ASAP - gives you more time to get all the available rides
• 2 hours after park open or later - If you have a must ride attraction that doesn't have an G+ until later in the day and you don't want to risk missing it, book it and do other attractions in standby during the first 2 hours of park open. After 2 hours you can start booking other G+ while still holding that later in the day G+. This may also allow you to do an attraction more than once since you can only use G+ once per attraction.

I really hope I got that right! Edit: Changed ILL to G+

 

[Boardwalk III]

I don’t know what happened in your situation but here’s something that happened to us more than once:
It would say we were not eligilble until say 11:10 and the time was already 11:10. Kept trying and eventually it worked. Not sure how long it took but it could have been 1 or 2 minutes. I kept yelling at the phone it is 11:10!

Oh dear. Maybe I should have been more patient?

 

[dmunsil]

Basic Strategy
Book your first ILL.

This is a nit-pick, but Individual Lightning Lanes (ILL) are the ones you pay for a single ride. Genie+ is the one you're talking about, which people seem to just call G+LL or LL. But that doesn't really matter; we get what you're saying.

• if your first ILL is within the first 2 hours of the park being open you will be able to book another ILL as soon as you tap into that ride (2 tap points are required) OR if your 1 hour window expires. You can continue making ILLs for the rest of the day as long as you don't make a reservation more than 2 hours from when you last tapped in or your last ride window expired.
  • If you book an ILL more than 2 hours after you tapped into the last one you will be subject to the 120 min rule. For example, at 1:05pm you book an ILL for your favorite "hard to get attraction" but the time slot is 5:30pm. You will not be able to book another ILL until 3:05pm (120 min from when you last booked a ride). At 3:05 you will be able to book new ILLs as described in the main bullet. You have now created a double stack.
• if your first ILL is after the first 2 hours of park open, you will not be able to make additional ILL until 120 min after park open. After that you can continue booking ILL as described in the previous scenario.

These are almost correct but not exactly correct.

Whenever you make a G+LL reservation, an eligibility time is set (more on that below), and you lose your ability to book until one of the following happens:

• You tap into any G+LL reservation.
• You cancel any G+LL reservation.
• Your eligibility time arrives.

Once your eligibility is back, it's back. It doesn't go away until you book a new reservation, at which point a new eligibility time is set and you start over.

Your eligibility time is either the end of the arrival window of the G+LL reservation you just made, or 2 hours from the current time, whichever is earlier.

There's one exception, which is when you book the reservation before the park's official opening time. In that case, the eligibility is either the end of the arrival window of the G+LL reservation you just made, or 2 hours after the park's official opening time, whichever is earlier.

That's it. Those are the rules, as best we have collectively been able to determine them.

So for your bullet points, 2 hours from park opening is not the relevant time frame. You can make a double stack with any reservation, no matter what time it is relative to park open.

Example 1:

• At 7:00 am, you make a reservation for 9:00-10:00 on a day the park opens at 9:00.
• Your eligibility time is 10:00 (end of your window, since that's less than 2 hours away from opening)
• You could tap in as early as 9:00 and regain eligibility to book
• You can instead wait until your eligibility time, 10:00, book a new reservation, then tap in (during the grace period), become eligible again, and book another new reservation
• Now you have a double stack.

Example 2:

• At 7:00 am, you make a reservation for 10:15 - 11:15 on a day the park opens at 9:00.
• Your eligibility time is 11:00 (2 hours from open, because the end of your window is more than 2 hours away from opening)
• You could tap in as early as 10:15 and regain eligibility to book
• You can instead wait until your eligibility time, 11:00, book a new reservation, then tap in (during the regular ride window), become eligible again, and book another new reservation.
• Now you have a double stack.

Example 3:

• At 7:00 am, you make a reservation for 11:15 - 12:15 on a day the park opens at 9:00.
• Your eligibility time is 11:00 (2 hours from open, because the end of your window is more than 2 hours away from opening)
• Your first opportunity to book is at your eligibility time, 11:00, when you can book a new reservation.
• At 11:15 your window opens and you can tap in and get another reservation.
• Now you have a double stack.

The rest of your post is essentially correct - you want a double stack because it gives you more opportunities to book another reservation. You usually want to do it first thing because it kind of inevitably involves waiting longer than you need to use your first reservation. All correct.

 

[dmunsil]

I want to emphasize for everyone who is finding this complicated: You do not need to track when your eligibility time will happen. The system will tell you. Just try to book, and it will tell you when you'll become eligible. From that time, and the arrival times on your existing booked Genie+ LL reservations, you can always figure out when you'll be eligible, and decide whether you want to tap in as early as possible or wait for your eligibility time to get another stacked reservation. You might even decide to shift gears and cancel one of your reservations so you can book something different immediately.

In some cases, you'll only have one option. If the arrival time for your next reservation is more than 2 hours away, then for sure you'll be able to book before that time, so just make sure to take advantage of it.

Conversely, if your next arrival window is going to close before your next eligibility time comes, you kind of need to tap into that ride or lose your LL reservation. This can happen when you have multiple stacked overlapping reservations.

 

[Cotta]

I want to emphasize for everyone who is finding this complicated: You do not need to track when your eligibility time will happen. The system will tell you. Just try to book, and it will tell you when you'll become eligible. From that time, and the arrival times on your existing booked Genie+ LL reservations, you can always figure out when you'll be eligible, and decide whether you want to tap in as early as possible or wait for your eligibility time to get another stacked reservation. You might even decide to shift gears and cancel one of your reservations so you can book something different immediately.

In some cases, you'll only have one option. If the arrival time for your next reservation is more than 2 hours away, then for sure you'll be able to book before that time, so just make sure to take advantage of it.

Conversely, if your next arrival window is going to close before your next eligibility time comes, you kind of need to tap into that ride or lose your LL reservation. This can happen when you have multiple stacked overlapping reservations.

First off Thank you so much for all your attention to detail and helping us figure this out!! My question has to do with this sort of, so I take it the app does not offer nudge to make a new reservation so you are on your own to book. But I am not grasping how long you have to make that new reservation. So say I have a double stack going in the morning and I want to take a mid-day break. Obviously the best scenario is a much later reservation. So for instance I make a 6 pm JC at 1 pm and I have another stack open as well. So I can reserve something else whenever I want. As long as I don't tap into one of my stacks before the other I won't lose the second? And I would also be able to book a 3rd stack at 3 pm and 5 pm? But if I can not find that later reservation I will have to make and cancel reservations through out the afternoon?