Teachers... why?

[snowy76]

Any child this age who gets up the "nerve" to ask to make that call, there's a signal going off. A trained educator should be sensitive enough to see this. I am very upset that this was so mishandled. How could anyone be so insensitive?

I think it depends upon the school and the community. I happened to work in a school with a lot of disciplinary issues b/c parents often brought their kids to us when they were in lots of trouble at their old schools. Many of the kids had weak parental guidance and few boundaries because dad was usually nonexistent, and mom was working all the time leaving a bunch of kids alone. Many of these students saw no reason not to call home (or mom's cell) at every instance they thought of it. I had students asking to call home to see if mom was taking them to Applebee's that night. Then they pouted when I told them they couldn't. And yes, even middle schoolers turned on the tears.

One girl kept asking to call home and when we finally said no, she borrowed a friend's cell phone and called. The mom called ME and told me to stop letting her daughter bother her at work because she was getting in trouble with her boss.

If it is a true emergency, like an illness, the parent is going to hear from the school.

 

[DisneyBlonde]

There was a teacher at my son's school who was apparently new, a young female teacher at an all boys high school. In an attempt to assert her control over the class she was very strict about who could leave the room for whatever. Last year one of the boys in his class (they are Srs now) said he didn't feel well and he had to use the restroom. The teacher would not let him go, and by the time the kid just got up and left, he soiled himself. Now this poor soul will forever be the kid who crapped his pants in class.

I told my son if he were ever in a situation like this that he should just get up and go....and I would be happy to go toe to toe with the teacher on his behalf. Of course, I don't send my son to school when he's sick, either...

 

[Tigger Fans!]

I don't think that we necessarily have the entire story on this situation. Sometimes one person's perception doesn't include all the relevant information of any given situation. I think that if a parent is upset about something that happens at school it is wise to contact the teacher directly.

IMHO I don't believe it's a good idea to encourage a child to be defiant to authority. Most teachers are very reasonable.

 

[Bojo]

Looks like some of the regular teacher bashers have jumped on this one already. But, I don't think we have enough information about this situation to make an informed judgement. Are there some times when teachers do not allow students to call home? Absolutely. Are there times when students feel it is an absolute necessity to make that call? Yes. Are there things that are trivial to adults yet hold pramount importance to adolscents? You'd better believe it.

I don't feel that we have enough information to know why the teacher (or student) acted as they did. I can only attempt to answer the OP's question:"Why?" IMHO, the teacher must have felt it was more important for the student to be in the class than in the office (or anywhere in between) making a phone call.

 

[MrsPete]

Would a teacher NOT let a kid go to the office to call home???

I don't know, but it's entirely possible that there was something going on that the other students weren't aware of. There's just not enough information here to judge.

Here's an example of something that happened in my classroom yesterday: I have a 12th grade student who has academic and behavior issues. Yesterday he decided that he just wasn't going to do anything. The class was sitting quietly doing its work, asked him if he needed help, etc. -- he just couldn't settle down. Several times I spoke to him quietly, telling him to get started on his work. He asked to go to the guidance office to check on some fees he thinks he owes; my answer: "No, you don't need to check on money that you owe next June right now during this class." Then he asked to go to the office to call his mother; my answer: "No, not until I've seen some work completed." Then he asked to go get water; my answer: "No, not until you've at least started your work."

In this case, the kid was looking for any possible reason NOT to do his work. Finally he settled down and did about a quarter of the work that the rest of the class did. After he did SOMETHING, I would've let him go do any of these things, but he didn't ask again. Once he was settled, he worked.

My point: Don't judge the teacher without knowing the whole story. Teachers juggle a huge number of things constantly, and students aren't aware of all of them. It could be that the teacher knew the drug dogs were out at the lockers and students weren't allowed to be in the hallways. It could be that this particular student has been asking to leave class constantly. Any number of things could have been going on.

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

There are NO instances where I would tell her to just up and leave the room without permission. She needs to explain to the teacher exactly what the problem is so that the teacher can make the right decision. I will never encourage my child to break the rules.

So if your 7th grade DD gets her period in class and asks to leave the room and the teacher says no, she's supposed to explain exactly what the problem is? Your child is MUCH mature than I ever was, because that would have completely upset me.

A teacher needs to make a judgment call based on past experience with that child. Based on the initial post, I'd say she should have allowed the kid to make the call. And yes, I tell my children that if they absolutely need to call me, then NO ONE tells them they can't, and that the teacher/principal should take it up with me afterwards. My kids are now 18 (college), 16 (Jr in HS), and 13 (MS). They are not in the habit of calling me from school...for good, bad or other reasons. And of course I expect them to follow rules. Geez.

I did get REALLY annoyed when my DD played soccer in her Freshmen year of high school. The coach was a 19 yr old girl (former student from the HS) who was so immature and got so caught up in the drama of the cliques on the team, that the team had a huge falling out one day at practice. It was ridiculous. I went to pick my DD up after practice, and the team was nowhere to be found. I drove back and forth between the field and the HS, and was a wreck. There's a path through woods between the two locations, and a slew of awful thoughts crossed my mind. Finally, I found a bunch of girls from the team, and one teammate said that the team "had a big fight, and that (my DD) was so upset that she was going to get in trouble because she didn't call me to tell me where she was." (The coach had taken them to the other side of a large field, where other teams were practicing, and I didn't see them.) And why didn't she call? Because the team had left their bags at one location, and "the fight" went on well past the end of practice, and when my DD got up during "the fight" and said she had to go get her cell phone to call me, the coach told her to sit down and wait. I was EXTREMELY annoyed. I let it go as far as the coach goes...God only knows how that immature idiot would handle it with my DD...but that's when I gave my DD the speech about how, under NO circumstances, if she needs to call me, that ANYONE tells her "no"...not the coach, not a teacher, not the police.

Of course some will say that a 19 yr old coach doesn't compare with a professional teacher. I have excellent relationships with most teachers, but, believe it or not, I've met a jerky teacher once or twice before.

DD had an accident in 2nd grade because the class was told in the library that they couldn't leave to go to the bathroom...I did, and still do, have a great relationship with the librarian. She was very apologetic, and said that SOME kids are a problem about that...always asking to go...but not DD, and she should always know that she can tell her she needs to go.

I worked the school office right before DS was born, and we had many middle schoolers come to the office to use the phone. More often than not, they wanted to ask if so and so could come to their house after school, if they could go to so and so's house, or some sort of matter that should have been sorted out AT HOME.

And the "cool kid" cried in class over that? It sounds to me like your office needed to get a handle on phone calls, but it also sounds like a very different situation that the OP.

 

[EEYOREMAMA]

I think it depends upon the school and the community. And yes, even middle schoolers turned on the tears.

If it is a true emergency, like an illness, the parent is going to hear from the school.

I totally understand and agree that each school and community is different. However, the OP's DD seemed to feel that this was an issue, which would indicate, that this does not happen everyday. If this was an ongoing situation, the DD would probably not have addressed in with mom.

It seems moot to discuss a situation that we will never have all the facts about. I guess I like my corner of the world where most kids would never think to use the phone as a ploy. I like living in LALA land.

 

[MrsPete]

There could be a LOT of reasons why he didn't want to say 'why' in front of the entire class (which is what I got from the OP). I know if I was really upset at that age, I wouldn't want the entire 7th grade knowing about it.

If a student wants to leave my class, he's going to have to tell ME why. He doesn't have to tell everyone, but he does have to tell ME. I'm accountable for where that student is during 2nd period.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Looks like some of the regular teacher bashers have jumped on this one already. But, I don't think we have enough information about this situation to make an informed judgement. Are there some times when teachers do not allow students to call home? Absolutely. Are there times when students feel it is an absolute necessity to make that call? Yes. Are there things that are trivial to adults yet hold pramount importance to adolscents? You'd better believe it.

I don't feel that we have enough information to know why the teacher (or student) acted as they did. I can only attempt to answer the OP's question:"Why?" IMHO, the teacher must have felt it was more important for the student to be in the class than in the office (or anywhere in between) making a phone call.

What's funny is that many posters are adament that the teacher did the proper thing without knowing all the facts.

Often the defense for the teacher is they must have had a good reason.

Well sometimes people in power due inappropriate things and should be accountable...

Much more extreme than this kid in class...

But what about the police who use excessive force....

What about those who should pull over but aren't sure if the cop behind them is real...

What about those bosses who just think it is a term of endearment to call their female secretary sweetie..

What about the teacher who belittles your child in front of the class...(happened to me in 7th grade b/c the teacher thought I had cut class--but I obeyed the administration about where to report for makeup pictures...and all she had to say was that I was a liar. She WAS a teacher I respected...the following year I was in another school and my math team beat hers in competition--and she was actually upset about it at me personally. As though I had control over my parents on where they should be residing. )

Often--someone in authoritiy feels they are doing the correct thing for that circumstance. IT doesn't always equate to the correct thing.

We can go to many more extreme examples--but it isn't it possible that the kid had some valid problem that needed attention to and his teacher just chose to ignore it?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

If a student wants to leave my class, he's going to have to tell ME why. He doesn't have to tell everyone, but he does have to tell ME. I'm accountable for where that student is during 2nd period.

What I got out of the OP (not subsequent posts)...was that the teacher didn't even bother to find out why in a way that the student could convey it without embarrassment. Just said no and that was at.

I don't for one minute think that you require your students to state their reasonings in front of the ENTIRE classroom.

Sure the student should give the teacher a valid reason--but they do have a right ot privacy and no other student in class is entitled to know the reason.

 

[gina2000]

When a middle schooler is upset, we send them to guidance. We let guidance make the decision. When a middle schooler is sick, we send them to the nurse and let the nurse make the decision. The child isn't the one to make the decision to call home.

A teacher has protocols to follow. No child should be denied a need especially if he/she is upset. Having said that, I've seen plenty of kids ask to use the bathroom, ask to get a drink and ask to go to their locker during the course of one block. Obviously, they just can't settle into their work routine. I never deny use of a bathroom unless it's every day of the week. Then I address it and try to find out from other teachers if this is a child's MO. If it is, it's stopped.

 

[teacherforhi]

Without knowing the teacher or the child, it's hard to say.

There are some students in my class that never ask to leave the room for anything. So if they say they need to go to the bathroom or need to call home, I let them.

I do have one student that would go to the bathroom 50 times a day if I let him and another that's obsessed with the school secretary and is always trying to find an excuse to go to the office. Those two are going to have to convince me and nine times out of ten, I say no.

I do agree that that they're going to have to tell me the reason though. As someone else said, they're my responsibility during that period of time, regardless of whether they're in my classroom or in the hall.

 

[Blondy876]

We can go to many more extreme examples--but it isn't it possible that the kid had some valid problem that needed attention to and his teacher just chose to ignore it?

Agreed, but from the OP I got the impression that the child had used the phone several times already. There really is no reason that the child needs to make that many calls. If he is sick then the nurse or school will call, if he couldn't reach a parent then he should leave a message. There's just no reason that a child needs to run to the office and call home repeatedly.

I think what has bothered me and several others is the assumption that the teacher is an ogre and that children should feel justified to just get up and leave. I just don't get the idea of parents telling their child that is is OK to break the rules.

Like you and other posters have said we just don't know all the details. The child may have had a very valid reason that he needed to leave the room and the teacher was wrong OR the teacher may have had a very valid reason for saying no, we just don't know.

 

[WonderfulDreamer2]

I totally understand and agree that each school and community is different. However, the OP's DD seemed to feel that this was an issue, which would indicate, that this does not happen everyday. If this was an ongoing situation, the DD would probably not have addressed in with mom.

It seems moot to discuss a situation that we will never have all the facts about. I guess I like my corner of the world where most kids would never think to use the phone as a ploy. I like living in LALA land.

I have to assume that the OP's DD is a 7th grader also. As a student of what, 12 or 13 years old, I'm sure she didn't have all the info available as no one here does either. Teachers are human beings. I don't know about the perfect world of the DIS, but when I was growing up, I was taught respect for my elders and those in authority. Do situations happen that shouldn't? Absolutely. Are there power figures who have abused that power? You betcha. But that doesn't make it acceptable to paint everyone with so wide a brush. When this child goes against the rules and leaves the school, ditches through a side door and is hit by an oncoming car while crossing the street, I wonder who will be at fault? Well...of course the school will because the teacher had no control and the kids are given free reign. I am amazed at the people I see here who strongly advocate disobeying the rules because it doesn't suit them. Right or wrong, the teacher is responsible for each student in that class, and for what happens to them outside of that classroom when they are under her watch. We already live in a world where everyone seems to have entitlement issues and authority issues and we are just pushing our kids to the next level. While teaching your kids to respect themselves, teach them a little respect for others while your at it. I wonder if this 7th grader cried because he couldn't pool hop if the OP would be so fast to say "do it....there must be a good reason, I mean he's a teenager and we all know they have it completely together."

 

[DisneyfeverTN]

I teach 7th and 8th grade. I substitute in other classrooms. I am always walking around the campus and in the lunchroom. I see any student that looks upset, or not the way a child should be looking and I try to engage them in conversation. If I notice that they are unresponsive, I ask "how they're doing." If I sense that there's a problem, I address the situation. I ask them if they need to go to guidance and talk to someone.

I can't imagine a child coming to me, asking to call home and saying no. Unheard of. Any child this age who gets up the "nerve" to ask to make that call, there's a signal going off. A trained educator should be sensitive enough to see this. I am very upset that this was so mishandled. How could anyone be so insensitive?

I have 2 boys of my own around this age and I would be p****d off if their teachers wouldn't let them get hold of me. Not acceptable practice at all. The parent needs to contact administration at the school asap. Sensitivity training should be mandated!!!

ITA. You sound like a very understanding person. If a child is upset, there is a reason. I always tell my children to obey the rules and be respectful to the teachers. I would hope the teachers would be sensitive to them if they had a problem.

 

[darrose]

I am very happy to be in a wonderful school district where teachers can give their students a "hall pass" to go to the office. I would hate to think that if one of my children needed to contact me upset about something that the school officials would not let them call me.

 

[EEYOREMAMA]

When this child goes against the rules and leaves the school, ditches through a side door and is hit by an oncoming car while crossing the street, I wonder who will be at fault? Well...of course the school will because the teacher had no control and the kids are given free reign.

A little known fact. This can happen any time a child is passing from one class to another during the day. This can happen when guidance, the office, the clinic or another teacher sends for him during the day. It's okay to send the child out of the room when he is called and "trust" that he will get there without doing something stupid, but not okay when he asks to leave. I'm not sure I follow your logic.

I have tons of rules too. I also have a heart. Sometimes they can actually exist in the same space.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Agreed, but from the OP I got the impression that the child had used the phone several times already. There really is no reason that the child needs to make that many calls. If he is sick then the nurse or school will call, if he couldn't reach a parent then he should leave a message. There's just no reason that a child needs to run to the office and call home repeatedly.

I think what has bothered me and several others is the assumption that the teacher is an ogre and that children should feel justified to just get up and leave. I just don't get the idea of parents telling their child that is is OK to break the rules.

Like you and other posters have said we just don't know all the details. The child may have had a very valid reason that he needed to leave the room and the teacher was wrong OR the teacher may have had a very valid reason for saying no, we just don't know.

One parent did give such an example that is totally understandable.

I don't think the teacher is an ogre.

Quite honestly--it made me wonder if that there was some immense problem at home (i.e. someone with a medical condition that may be too sick to answer the phone or something and he kept calling hoping that person would pick up to know they were all right). What the kid probably needed was a discussion with a counselor and to not be ingnored.

Quite weird that he didn't show up the next day.

I just don't remember in my middle school days any student being that blatantly denied in class when to their peers--something seemed to be way off. I do know that they wouldn't let random calls home--i.e. to remind for a pickup, to bring a project, to see if a friend could come over, et cetera.


For those questioning rule breaking--I think those who "condoned" this--were condoning their child in question to go to the office and have them call the parents (or straight to the bathroom and then to the office if that was the emergency). Quite different by giving permission to walk off school property or to be defiant in any other way.

 

[Sandy51]

We do not have enough information to make a judgment call. I teach 7th grade. There have been instances where parents have informed me that a family member (usually a grandparent) is sick or is having surgery that day, and the child is upset. The parent wanted the child to be in school to have somewhat of a normal day. That could have been the case here. We just don't know enough.


Sandy

 

[Disney4Drew]

It's obvious here that NO ONE knows the true reason why the boy wanted to call home. Maybe, just maybe...the teacher DID know. You can't say one way or another if the boy should/should not have been allowed to call without knowing the facts.

With that said....I find the "blame the teacher" mentality that goes on in our society to be disgusting. Yes, there are some teachers who are not the best at their jobs. BUT, what about the children who are being raised with no respect for their own parents let alone the classroom teacher. I would challenge any one of you who feels you know it all about everything that goes on in a classroom to spend a week teaching in a public school. I'm sure you'd come to a very different conclusion. Teaching your child that they are always right and they are the victim of the "mean" teacher (or anyone who tells them "no" for that matter) is doing them a real disservice.