Talking Dad into a wheelchair or ECV

[lisaland]

My Dad is 61 and has congestive heart failure and Parkinson's Disease. He tires very easily and he has been known to stumble and fall. I would like for him to go with us to WDW next May. I mentioned to my parents that we would like for them to go but we'd like for him to rent a wheelchair or scooter. He said they'd love to go but NO WAY would he use a wheelchair. We went to WDW 2 years ago (before the Parkinson's diagnosis) and Dad tired out so quickly. We spent a lot of time waiting on him. (We don't mind but there are going to be 11 of us this time. ) It would be much easier on all us if he would agree to a wheelchair so that he can sit when he can't walk anymore. I believe he'll see much more and enjoy much more if he doesn't have to worry about all the walking. How do I convince him to go ahead and use the chair?

Lisa

 

[Cheshire Figment]

Please ask the following questions. Here are the suggested answers to go with them.

1. Are you disabled (even temporarily)? Yes.

2. Do the people you are traveling with, such as your family, know you are disabled? Yes.

3. Do you expect to meet anyone you know during this trip who may not know you are disabled. Probably No!

4. Do you expect to meet a bunch of people who you will probably never meet again in your life? Probably yes!

5. Is there any reason at all that you should care what these people think about you? Absolutely No!!

6. Will using a wheelchair or ECV make for a better vacation for you and your family? Absolutely YES!

 

[Forevryoung]

First off, I wish your family the best of luck with Parkinson's.

Next May meaning 2008 or 2009?

Considering his health problems and his stubbornness (what a nice combo right? ), this is what I would do:

I would stop talking about the ECV/Wheelchair for a bit. You put the idea into his head now let it stew. Plan on them going but don't mention an ECV or Wheelchair.

See how your dad is doing shortly before the trip (4-6 weeks prior, while excitement is building) and casually mention it again. Make it into an open discussion listing your reasons and letting him list his. Remind him that he will not have to stay in it at all times, that he can park it and walk when he chooses to but that he would have a better time if he had the option to grab a ride.

If he still doesn't take the offer, I would let him walk the first day with the "gentle reminder" a few hours into the day that there is a wheelchair/ecv available at the front.

Or even suggest that your parents "share" it? With the intention that your dad will use it and not your mom

good luck!

 

[thunderbird1]

BTDT with both my grandma and now my MIL. Not on WDW trips, but Las Vegas trips, which also involve a great deal of walking. What finally worked for us was asking them to try it just to get to and from the "fun parts." Then, once they tried it, there was no going back. What they found was without the wheelchair, they were tired before the fun even began. With the wheelchair to get them to and from their rooms, meals, etc., they were able to last longer and enjoy the trip more instead of expending all their energy just getting back and forth.

In your dad's case, without a wheelchair, he's liable to be exhausted before he even steps foot inside a park, and that's no way to start your day. If he's willing to ride in the chair, even if it's just until you get inside the park, he will have conserved his energy, and will be able to enjoy himself more. Of course, I don't doubt that once he's taken the ride from the parking lot or bus stop into the park, it won't be long before he's ready to ride up Main Street, through World Showcase, etc. But that's something he can figure out on his own once you're there. Getting him to take that first step (or seat, as the case may be) is 90% of the battle.

Good luck to you and your family!

 

[SueM in MN]

I´d agree with the other posters (especially the part about not mentioning about it for a while, now that the subject has been brought up.)
One suggestion I have made that many people have said worked well for convincing is to pick out a place about 2 miles from his house that he is familiar with. Ask if he could walk there. He will most likely look at you like you have grown 2 heads. If he doesn´t and says he could walk there easily; ask about walking back and then doing that every day while you are there.

Estimates range from people walking between 3 and 9 miles per day at WDW Some have actually used a pedometer to measure and most people go way more than 3 miles, especially when you consider that it´s more than a mile just to walk around World Showcase (along the water, not to go inside all the countries). And it´s a similar distance to get from the park entrance to the point of entering WS. If he doesn´t believe you, you go on google maps and actually find distances.

Another thing to think about is whether he would be able to operate an ECV in the parks. It may take a lot of effort for him to be watching for pedestrians and be steady enough to drive. In that case, a wheelchair will be better for him.

As time goes on, it may be helpful to find out why he doesn´t want to use one. If he is stubborn and prideful, different methods of convincing will work than if he is afraid he can´t drive it. He may be afraid he will hold you back or he will be the only person in one, so everyone will look at him. He may be concerned about the cost. Any of those things can look like just being stubborn.
My FIL had very bad hips and knees, but would not rent an ECV for many years. Looking back, I know one of the things he was most concerned about was whether or not he would be comfortable driving one. The last few years, he did rent one, but never did feel comfortable driving one in MK because it is much more congested and there are more children.
After the first year of renting an ECV in Epcot, he said he wished he had done it years ago. It was the first time in years that he had actually enjoyed a day in the parks and ended the day without pain.

Another thing that sometimes works is thinking about energy like a checking account. Each morning, you have a certain amount in the account. Everything you do has an "energy cost" attached to it. There are things, like climbing in and out of rides, where you can´t do anything to decrease the cost (other than not riding). There are other things, like getting from place to place and waiting in line, where you can decrease the cost a LOT by using a wheelchair or ECV. Some things, like eating and sitting down to rest, puts more energy into the account. But, if too much is spent on doing things like just getting around, you end up needing too much time resting to get enough energy to finish the day or there will be no energy to have fun with. Too much energy used begins to use energy from the next day´s account, so the next day is begun with a deficit. Since most people can imagine what happens if a checking account is overdrawn, they can imagine what happens when too much energy is used.

 

[lisaland]

You each gave such wonderful suggestions. I think I will leave it alone for a little while and wait until March or so to bring it up again. I especially like the idea of making him think that he and my mom could share it. She'd go along with that just to get him to consider it. (A little child psychology) In the end...I think if he knew that we didn't expect him to sit in it all day that he'd consider it. It will be like a safety net in case he needs it. Thanks for the great suggestions!!!!!!

Lisa

 

[fla4fun]

It was hard to get my mom to rent a wheelchair or ECV the first time. The last time we went to a theme park (MK) without one, she lasted about two hours, and was totally exhausted. So the next time, we were going to Epcot, and I just went ahead and rented an ECV. I figured, I'd use it if she didn't (after all, Epcot IS a big park!). But once it was rented, and she tried it out, she was happy I'd done it, and she's been eager ever since to rent one or the other. Her energy levels are so much better, and we get a fair amount of walking in anyway, around the resort. We do OK with manual chairs at the Studios or MK, but at Epcot and AK we usually rent ECV's (just different terrain and distances).

 

[Mickiethepooh]

If it were me I would rent it offsite and it will be at the resort when you arrive, then he can use it or sit in his room. If he won't use it, he is spoiling everyone elses vacation.
That might sound harsh but it is accurate as well. Unless he is the kind that wants all the attention to revolve around him, then he has no excuse.

My personal philosophy is if you have limitations, you use whatever it takes To live your life. TO Heck with what anyone else thinks about it.

 

[earthfaries]

Do you know why he doesn't want a wheelchair? Is he embarrased? My sister has to get one when we go and she is 30. She was really self-concious about it at first being young she thought people would think she was getting one just to get on the rides quicker, but she just got over it and pays no attention to what others may think. No one knows what problems you may have no matter how young you are, or how you appear. Most problems are on the inside and if a ecv will help him, which I think it would, he really should just get one. Walking the parks is so hard, they say you walk 5-15 miles a day And for some people like my sister that is just not something they can do.

 

[SondraD11]

I had to convince myself that I needed an ECV for our family trip next month. The reason that I chose to rent an ECV from Walker Mobility (a recommended vendor) is that I will be independent of my adult children. In a wheelchair, I will be forced to go where they push me. With an ECV, I can go back to the room or actually anywhere that I want on my own without worrying about inconveniencing anyone else.

I'm 59 years old and a breast cancer survivor who is still recovering from all the chemo and radiation treatments. It's very difficult to accept that I have changed from being the group leader and encouraging everyone to keep up with me to being the one who needs assistance.

Give your Dad some time. Maybe the next time you talk about it, don't mention wheelchair but instead talk about the ECV scooter and how independent he can be with it. My guess is that he knows he needs some help but he just is having a hard time accepting it right now.

Sondra

 

[BroganMc]

Hmm, reading between the lines in your post makes me wonder what sort of message your dad is hearing from you. Is it as you intend "hey this thing will help you have a great time with us" or perhaps what he fears given his health issues "hey you know you're really a burden and gonna make everyone miserable unless you get something".

I've had chronic rheumatoid arthritis since I was 2. That pretty much means my body simply doesn't work like everyone else's. My joints don't bend or straighten right, my muscles aren't as strong and I waddle when I walk. But for 25 years I viewed a wheelchair as the penultimate sign of disability and failure to defeat my disease. It didn't matter that using one at a mall meant I could actually look at the merchandise rather than what I might trip over or where the nearest seat was.

Then about 5 years ago I finally grew a brain and decided it was time to try a power wheelchair. (Not a manual since you might as well stick yourself in a baby stroller and consign yourself to a caregiver.) I feared having the thing would make me look like a pathetic cripple, but my walking was so bad I couldn't leave my house on my own two feet anymore. Then I drove my powerchair in Disney World. (That was actually my first out of house trip.)

BOY what a difference reality makes! Not worrying about how far you can walk, what you might trip over or how far ahead your family is becomes a huge relief. Now, for the first time in my entire life really, I am able to go about in the world like everyone else. (It made such a difference that I was finally able to get my driver's license. Yes, my not driving was primarily because I knew I'd never be able to walk the distance of a parking lot to any destination.)

The point of my story is just to show you what might be the feelings driving your dad's reluctance. When you're dealing with a progressive disease, especially after a lifetime of normalcy, any adaptive device can be seen as waving a white flag. It's hard to get beyond that.

Now my experience helped me be able to convince both my older parents to try scooters. My mom got into it in her late 60's, just before she died of cancer. My dad (in his 70's) started using one at Disney a few years ago. Both times I encouraged them to "just try it" and "do it so we can drag race".

Those things tend to sound less threatening than "you can't keep up otherwise".

 

[NotUrsula]

I'm dealing with this too right now. After 10 years, DS finally convinced MIL to come to WDW with us. We scheduled a trip just before Christmas for optimal weather. MIL really does not have any major health problems for someone her age, other than controlled high cholesterol and some pretty much normal-level osteoarthritis. However, she is somewhat agoraphobic, and seldom leaves her home except to visit the grocery store or doctor's office, though she does still drive just fine. (She's generally OK in anonymous crowds, but doesn't like being forced to actually interact with strangers.) The result of never getting out of her one-story home is that she's horribly out of shape in terms of stamina.

So ... she started walking in her neighborhood, and was feeling proud of herself for getting up to a mile, when disaster struck. She was out walking and fainted face down on a sidewalk. She has no idea how long she was out until a good Samaritan came by and woke her up. She has no serious injuries, but her face is badly bruised up, and she has pulled right back into her house like a turtle in a shell. She is now trying to crawfish out of the trip.

We have financed this trip for her as a gift, mostly because we know that if she knew the cost details, she would have yet another excuse to balk. We don't really expect to have a good time, but DS will likely never get another chance to show WDW to his grandmother, so we're sucking it up for his sake. However, the one thing I refuse to let her do is hole up inside her hotel room, disappoint DS and waste all that money. (I'm not talking about long breaks, which I fully expect her to take; I'm talking about hiding in there and never coming out.)

Not only do I think that using an ECV will make the trip easier on her because of her stamina issues, but it also would take away the excuse of using her stamina issues to justify hiding. She would never admit it, but I know that the main reason she insists on not using an ECV is because she thinks that it will make her conspicuous. I've tried to make it clear that ECVs at WDW are as common as azaleas, but it is still an uphill battle. (She's also the queen of passive-aggression, but that's another conversation.) Do any of you know of any websites that have street pics of WDW that include a lot of scooters in use?

If DH can talk her into it, I'll rent from Randy's so that she gets the full lesson. (Do rental scooters come in beige? )

 

[bopper]

And just in case your Dad is reluctant to use an ECV:

Here are top 5 Reasons that people think they shouldn't get one when they should.

I can't drive one. Go to your local Costco/Walmart/Target or other large store. They probably have an electric cart type thing that you could use while shopping. Try it out. I bet you can drive it.

People might think I don't really need it because I can walk. Are these people going to share the pain with you at the end of the day? Do you care what they think? Save your walking energy between rides and use it for lines or getting on the rides. Enjoy your family and your vacation.

It will slow my family down. No, actually it will speed your family up. No more rests because mom is tired. No more going back to the hotel because mom/whoever is in pain. No more cranky mommy because she tried to walk miles and miles in Disney instead of renting an ECV. You are completely mobile on your own (nobody pushing you in a wheelchair). What's the slow down here?

It's expensive. Um, how much are you spending on this vacation? Don't you want to enjoy it? If money is that tight, take a day off of your trip and spend that money on the ECV so you can enjoy it!

I don't want my kids/family to think I am disabled. You are either temporarily or permanently disabled in some way if you are even asking about this issue...once again, why not make it a better vacation by saving yourself from pain? Nobody is saying you have to confine yourself to a wheelchair permanently or you should not stop trying to get better. If somebody told you to go walk 4 miles, you would think they are crazy. But you are paying for the privilige when you go to Disney to do just that...why not use an ECV to make your family's vacation better?

 

[arminnie]

It's very difficult to accept that I have changed from being the group leader and encouraging everyone to keep up with me to being the one who needs assistance.

That describes me completely.

I just lost my very favorite tag "it was glorious to get up and feel great in the morning " or something to that effect. The tag fairy replaced that one with my second tag - which I like and it's cute, but I felt that other one conveyed the sense of hope and accomplishment that I had with the ECV.

I am the one who always wanted to walk futher, play tennis longer, shop more stores, etc. etc. It is hard to be the weak link now, but that ECV really evens things out.

 

[SueM in MN]

If it were me I would rent it offsite and it will be at the resort when you arrive, then he can use it or sit in his room. If he won't use it, he is spoiling everyone elses vacation.

I'd suggest being very cautious about renting an ECV for someone without their consent. A number of people thru the years have posted not too good experiences with doing that. One woman in particular comes to my mind. She had rented one for her friend who was traveling with her, thinking it would be a nice thing to do (they had discussed ECVs, but the friend was not aware she was planning to rent one). She posted that her friend would not talk to her at all for the first 2 days and after that, it was kind of an unpleasant subject they just avoided for the rest of the trip.

IHowever, she is somewhat agoraphobic, and seldom leaves her home except to visit the grocery store or doctor's office, though she does still drive just fine. (She's generally OK in anonymous crowds, but doesn't like being forced to actually interact with strangers.) The result of never getting out of her one-story home is that she's horribly out of shape in terms of stamina.

Besides helping with the stamina, an ECV might provide kind of a buffer and 'safe haven' between her and other guests.

So ... she started walking in her neighborhood, and was feeling proud of herself for getting up to a mile, when disaster struck. She was out walking and fainted face down on a sidewalk. She has no idea how long she was out until a good Samaritan came by and woke her up. She has no serious injuries, but her face is badly bruised up, and she has pulled right back into her house like a turtle in a shell. She is now trying to crawfish out of the trip.

Sorry to hear about her accident.

I've tried to make it clear that ECVs at WDW are as common as azaleas, but it is still an uphill battle. (She's also the queen of passive-aggression, but that's another conversation.) Do any of you know of any websites that have street pics of WDW that include a lot of scooters in use?

You can try just looking in the pictures DIS posters have put up on the www.wdwinfo.com site. There are so many pictures that at least some are likely to have a few ECVs on them.

If DH can talk her into it, I'll rent from Randy's so that she gets the full lesson. (Do rental scooters come in beige? )

LOL, most of the ECVs are blue or red. Nice, pretty colors, but a bit brighter than beige.
The park rental ones are 'blah' colored, but those are larger and more bulky to get around. So, what you get in unobtrusive color, you give up with larger size.

And just in case your Dad is reluctant to use an ECV:

Here are top 5 Reasons that people think they shouldn't get one when they should.

I can't drive one. Go to your local Costco/Walmart/Target or other large store. They probably have an electric cart type thing that you could use while shopping. Try it out. I bet you can drive it.

People might think I don't really need it because I can walk. Are these people going to share the pain with you at the end of the day? Do you care what they think? Save your walking energy between rides and use it for lines or getting on the rides. Enjoy your family and your vacation.

It will slow my family down. No, actually it will speed your family up. No more rests because mom is tired. No more going back to the hotel because mom/whoever is in pain. No more cranky mommy because she tried to walk miles and miles in Disney instead of renting an ECV. You are completely mobile on your own (nobody pushing you in a wheelchair). What's the slow down here?

It's expensive. Um, how much are you spending on this vacation? Don't you want to enjoy it? If money is that tight, take a day off of your trip and spend that money on the ECV so you can enjoy it!

I don't want my kids/family to think I am disabled. You are either temporarily or permanently disabled in some way if you are even asking about this issue...once again, why not make it a better vacation by saving yourself from pain? Nobody is saying you have to confine yourself to a wheelchair permanently or you should not stop trying to get better. If somebody told you to go walk 4 miles, you would think they are crazy. But you are paying for the privilige when you go to Disney to do just that...why not use an ECV to make your family's vacation better?

Nice list