SUVs IN FL

[AllyandJack]

That's a false analogy-- comparing apples to oranges. Other people's abortions don't affect me or anyone else. Other people's driving choices affect us all.

I disagree. First of all, removing a potential member of a generation could have a ripple effect. What if the guy who cured polio was aborted? I would also think that the human life that is ended would disagree that the abortion has no effect on anyone. What about parents who would have wanted their teenager to keep the baby (their grandchild)? What about potential fathers who would have wanted the baby but had no say in whether it was born? I'm definitely pro-choice, but to say that ending a potential life doesn't effect anyone but the mother making the decision isn't always true.

 

[DVC-Don]

My cousin lives in FL and has a 4X4 SUV, but that's for towing his boat up wet and slippery boat ramps.

 

[Laura]

Well, I'm seeing a lot fewer SUVs lately--especially the really huge ones. That's probably due to the gas prices. I don't understand why some people I know have them because they don't use them for their Sport or Utility purposes. A lot of people seem to think it's safer in the massive SUVs when it really isn't. There is a big difference between a Suburban and a Rav4, though. Car-based SUVs aren't big gas guzzlers.

I can say I feel safe in my New Beetle; the crash tests on my car have been very good. I have front and side airbags, and the car is very agile so I can steer out of bad situations easily. But it's hard to see around SUVs, like when they pull up next to me at a light and I would practically have to enter the intersection to see if it's clear to turn right. Or when I'm in a parking lot trying to pull out of the space and I'm surrounded by big cars (vans included). And my Beetle's a pretty tall car! In it, I sit higher than most cars its size, as far as I can see.

My father was in an accident with a Ford Explorer driving his old Chevy Celebrity sedan--the other driver cut in front of him, causing the accident. The SUV got its axle broken because my father hit the wheel. My father was able to drive away in his car.

 

[CheshireVal]

I disagree. First of all, removing a potential member of a generation could have a ripple effect. What if the guy who cured polio was aborted? I would also think that the human life that is ended would disagree that the abortion has no effect on anyone. What about parents who would have wanted their teenager to keep the baby (their grandchild)? What about potential fathers who would have wanted the baby but had no say in whether it was born? I'm definitely pro-choice, but to say that ending a potential life doesn't effect anyone but the mother making the decision isn't always true.

I think you're stretching to make it work.

 

[katerkat]

Sheesh. Who cares about the environment, anyway? Why do we need nature? If I have an SUV, when there is eventually no more oil and ANWR is destroyed and the air is too yucky to breathe... at least I'll be able to live in my Suburban quite comfortably.

I mean.... I LIKE it, and it's the best choice for my family. Screw all you other families out there. I'm in it for myself. If I hit you in my SUV, you'll be dead, but I'm alive. I WIN!

My husband flies tanker airplanes - trust me, I don't feel bad about the amount of gas my SUV uses.

 

[C.Ann]

Well if anyone has their heart set on buying an SUV, now would be the time to do it.. Their sales have dropped dramatically (the new ones) and the used ones are literally overflowing the lots.. People couldn't get rid of them fast enough this past summer..

 

[AllyandJack]

I think you're stretching to make it work.

I'd like to think that the world wouldn't quite be the same without you and I in it. Sure, life would go on, but I think our friends and family would agree that aborting us would have impacted their lives in a negative way.

Yeah, maybe it's a stretch, but making judgments on people as ignorant and aggressive based on their cars is a stretch, too.

 

[CheshireVal]

Yeah, maybe it's a stretch, but making judgments on people as ignorant and aggressive based on their cars is a stretch, too.

I never called anyone ignorant or aggressive. That was someone earlier in the thread. If I were forced to label someone who drives an SUV, really the only thing I'd feel comfortable generalizing with is "not terribly concerned about the environment/oil conservation."

 

[brerrabbit]

I never called anyone ignorant or aggressive. That was someone earlier in the thread. If I were forced to label someone who drives an SUV, really the only thing I'd feel comfortable generalizing with is "not terribly concerned about the environment/oil conservation." CheshireVal

And that would make yet another generalization wrong!

We have an SUV, a Jeep, and a full size truck. I am active and contribute to CCA (Coastal Conservation Association) DU(Ducks Unlimited) and the Galveston Bay Wetlands Restoration Association. I have spent many weekends removing abandonned crab traps from Texas coastal bays, planting saltgrass, cleaning up beaches and various other activities. I own a boat and use the truck to haul it, I own cattle and use the truck and the jeep to haul feed and hay. I hunt and fish and use the jeep to access certain areas that only 4WD vehicles can get. Yes I pay a lot for gas to fill those vehicles and yes I also give a lot of money and time to conservation. To say as an SUV/Truck owner I am not terribly concerned with the environment/oil conversation would be a very inaccurate statement. To me its pretty funny that a large majority of the conservation groups with activities along the coast in Texas drive trucks and SUV's. Does this be default mean that they are not terribly concerned with the environment or that generalizations are for the most part wrong?

 

[CheshireVal]

or that generalizations are for the most part wrong?

Well..... that's another generalization, isn't it? So, if I agree, I'm contradicting myself.

 

[brerrabbit]

Pardon my inefficient wording. Not asking for a generalization. Merely saying that to make a genralization is wrong.

 

[toto2]

I started a few thread here on the DIS about SUV and the evironnement.

We , north-american , have a strange and passionnate relashionship with our cars.

One thing I always find interesting is that we , on both sides of the debate , really like to generalise , and on both side , feel really attaked by those generalisation ( well , I dont drive like that , or I do tow alot of stuff , or I have 12 chidreen or , I can put 6 beds in my minicooper....etc) And we dont look at the big picture. I tell you I want a small fuel efficient car , you tell me that my house is too big etc.

The environnement is many , many complex systhem , and to try do things right to prevent its destruction is complicated. And we do have to make choices every day. In the South-east Asia, if the coral reef and the mangoove would not have been destroyed by humans , there would have been a lot less victims. Same with the mangrove near New-Orlean.

Maybe global warming is a natural phenonenon ( It makes us a lot more comfortable thinking that the bests scientist are buffons than change our habits) , but we are helping it if it is the case. It is all our problem. Yess , but China is polluting too , and kurdsidistan too ! This is third grade whinning ! We as North-American a use 25% of all the energy in the world , we do have to do something , and yes , set an exemple. If we can do it with democraty , we can do it with pollution.

Europeens manage to have country houses , and city appartments , and carry stuff around and do stuff without the big SUVs. But guess what , they have a fantastic transportation systhem , there car are lot more fuel efficient than ours , and they dont got to have everything from the Super-Walmart !

We buy to much stuff , we consume to much stuff and we want to much stuff . And we are not neccesarelly more happy once we get the stuff.

SUV , for me , are just one more exemple of our disproportionate "need" for stuff. Until the end of the 70's , it seems , no one needed an SUV. What changed ? we dont have more childreen , we dont suddenly have more boats or skydoos to tow , we dont...etc What changed ?

 

[skiwee1]

I find it really funny that the same people who advocate for my right to choose to end a pregnancy are the same people who are against my right to choose the car I want to drive. I'm pro-choice - whether it's about cars or abortions. I, personally, would never drive something as big as an Escalade (my small SUV is fine and, honestly, I don't think I could handle it!), but it's not my place to make that decision for someone else.

Now, now. I am for choice in both instances. I feel we should have the freedom to chose in either case. Unless someone is going to support that child or buy that Prius then they need to mind their own business.

 

[toto2]

I never called anyone ignorant or aggressive. That was someone earlier in the thread. If I were forced to label someone who drives an SUV, really the only thing I'd feel comfortable generalizing with is "not terribly concerned about the environment/oil conservation." CheshireVal

And that would make yet another generalization wrong!

We have an SUV, a Jeep, and a full size truck. I am active and contribute to CCA (Coastal Conservation Association) DU(Ducks Unlimited) and the Galveston Bay Wetlands Restoration Association. I have spent many weekends removing abandonned crab traps from Texas coastal bays, planting saltgrass, cleaning up beaches and various other activities. I own a boat and use the truck to haul it, I own cattle and use the truck and the jeep to haul feed and hay. I hunt and fish and use the jeep to access certain areas that only 4WD vehicles can get. Yes I pay a lot for gas to fill those vehicles and yes I also give a lot of money and time to conservation. To say as an SUV/Truck owner I am not terribly concerned with the environment/oil conversation would be a very inaccurate statement. To me its pretty funny that a large majority of the conservation groups with activities along the coast in Texas drive trucks and SUV's. Does this be default mean that they are not terribly concerned with the environment or that generalizations are for the most part wrong?

Reading your post , it is obvious that you need the trucks , and what most people like me says regarding SUV owners are not directed toward people like you. You need the trucks to earn a living !

 

[disneylizzy]

Oh, oh .. SUV's as killer vehicles with irresponsible owners and now abortion, too!

Backing slowly away from the thread ....

 

[coolmom99]

Yes, in fact I posted scientific data suporting that SUV's are more dangerous to other vehiclals AND that SUV's ARE NOT safer than sedan's.

That data was probably provided by someone with a vested interest in decreasing SUV sales. You can get statistics to say whatever you want them to say.

 

[toto2]

Well , I prefer to get my data from them , than from those who have a vested interest of selling SUV to me !

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I never called anyone ignorant or aggressive. That was someone earlier in the thread. If I were forced to label someone who drives an SUV, really the only thing I'd feel comfortable generalizing with is "not terribly concerned about the environment/oil conservation."

This is a silly generalization.

When those who own their economic energy friendly cars live in their solar powered homes, catch rainwater for non-consumption purposes and eat 100% organic..then I would say they would have an ounce of credibility to this statement.

Not against you personally---but to make such a generalization requires one to evaluate ones energy consumption in all parts of their lives and not just the vehicle they drive.

 

[toto2]

This is a silly generalization.

When those who own their economic energy friendly cars live in their solar powered homes, catch rainwater for non-consumption purposes and eat 100% organic..then I would say they would have an ounce of credibility to this statement.

Not against you personally---but to make such a generalization requires one to evaluate ones energy consumption in all parts of their lives and not just the vehicle they drive.

I think it is unfair to expect perfection of anyone. I think that someonewho does drive an hybrid , or did make the choice to drive a fuel efficient vehicule for reason other than his/her pocket book , ( meaning , curbing pollution) he/she will have a concience about how they heat there house , what they eat , how they buy stuff. Credibbility does not come from perfectiom , but from the conscience and the effort.


One exemple: I am far from being perfect in the english language , it being a second language , but I am still credible when I use it because I make a concious effort to express my self. Perfection does not equal credibility.

To say that I will make an effort about pollution when YOU will be perfect at it is just , again in my opinion , just an excuse for not making the effort , or an excuse for not stepping out of our comfort zone.

Even in the Bible , if you are a beliver ( and I am not , but it sure is a book full of wizdom) God does not expect man to be perfect , but recognize his effort !

 

[FroggyinArk]

another thread i was avoiding,, you know what,, i am a carpenter,, i haul tools etc around all the teime in my toyota tacoma pu. its small fuel efficeint and i do fine pulling what ever load or trailer i need to. but while that is the truck i drive most often, i also own a midsized suv, my wifes blazer, we bought it because,,, gasp,, its coimfortable to ride in getes fair mileage and has cargo space when we are on theroad. i also own a 1994 full size suburban,,, and that is my truck. i love driving a larger vehicle, a feeel much saefr in the bigger vehicles and i really dont care ,, again the usa thing,, we have hte ways and means to do what we want to do with ot worry about what others say. who cares,, yeah there area lot of suvs in the south, we use them, they make life easier. they are comfortable to drive, sure the gas proices are a bit outrageous in them, a full tank for the suburban would run 100 bucks,, but ya know if i can afford it, what does it matter? i put over 50 bucks in gas into my toyota last week,, and i didnt go that far in it. so why should i be uncomfortable, or cramped, or have to tie a box on top of my tiny little car just because someone says suvs are bad?