Stupid America...

[mickeyfan2]

As a member of a union, I can tell you that my union is still needed. There is good and bad in almost everything. Interesting how people who pooh pooh media information will embrace it when it supports their already formed belief system.

Well my Aunt and Uncle are both teachers and they say the union is a problem. They are teacher's union members and want the ability to fire teacher earsier and the power of the union weakened or completely eliminated. So not all union members think they are a good thing.

 

[mickeyfan2]

Nobody is talking about the senior who could not read a simple book. They spent over 100,000 on his education and it failed him. DH and I loved the meeting around the table where the principle said he was making great gains. What gains??? They send him to Sylvan learning centers for two weeks and he raised his reading level by over two years. So he CAN learn to read. But why teach him to is you get paid the same and cannot get fired for his not being able to read.

The number one complaint of students were their teachers were boring. Just droning on and on.

 

[lillygator]

unions ~ need to go........period.

 

[chobie]

unions ~ need to go........period.

Not going to happen in our lifetime. And I'll be right out there fighting to keep them going.

 

[chobie]

Well my Aunt and Uncle are both teachers and they say the union is a problem. They are teacher's union members and want the ability to fire teacher earsier and the power of the union weakened or completely eliminated. So not all union members think they are a good thing.

Yes, I have known teachers who were against the union also, until they needed them of course.

At the last school my DH taught at two teachers were fired for sexually harrassing students. It did not take years; but it did take several months for them to complete the investigation to make sure the allegations were true.

It's a little thing we call "Due Process".

 

[disneyjunkie]

Nobody is talking about the senior who could not read a simple book. They spent over 100,000 on his education and it failed him. DH and I loved the meeting around the table where the principle said he was making great gains. What gains??? They send him to Sylvan learning centers for two weeks and he raised his reading level by over two years. So he CAN learn to read. But why teach him to is you get paid the same and cannot get fired for his not being able to read.

The number one complaint of students were their teachers were boring. Just droning on and on.

Should all the blame be placed on the school system? How could the parents sit back and allow the sytem to pass this child on year after year?

 

[declansdad]

I have been a teacher since 1982. When I started teaching, salaries averaged $17,000 per year. They now average close to $40,000 per year, a much more effective "living wage" even adjusted for inflation. When I started teaching, virtually ALL of my classes contained at least 30 students. The really big classes would have 35. Now, the average class has 22 students in it. A really big class has 27. Do these things affect student performance? You bet your life they do! An intelligent young person starting out is much more likely to be attracted to our profession by an annual salary of $40K than by one of $20K. A middle-aged woman with a family to help support and with a lot of experience in the classroom is much more likely to stay in the field if the compensation is adequate and the working conditions are pleasant. You'd have to be a real dunce at math to not understand why having 20 students in a classroom is better than having 30 students. Every single day, I get to sit down and work with every single student in each of my classes. Incidentally, instead of teaching six classes like I did when I first started teaching in 1981, I now teach 3 -- we're on a block schedule which gives us more time with our students. So, I've gone from herding 180 students a day to teaching 60!
What do unions have to do with this? Well, I don't know about where YOU live or about where John Stossel lives, but where I live, I can tell you that change does not occur without impetus. NEA and AEA have kept constant pressure on the legislature of our state to change things for the better. Is our union powerful? Yes. Does it always use its power well? No. Right now, for instance, the education fund in our state has a one time surplus. AEA is lobbying to use the surplus for teacher pay raises. It doesn't make sense to use a one-time surplue for pay raises. But, would we be where we are today without the generally positive use of power that this organization has displayed in our state? No way. When our director makes a choice that is unwise, our state is full of independent, stubborn people who happily ignore him (as is happening right now with the pay raise issue).
So, when people like John Stossel whine about "those evil teachers and their unions," I just shake my head. I remember what it was like when I had 34 students crammed in a room that had been designed for 20. I remember what it was like to not have enough textbooks because politicians were too cheap to buy them for my students. I know that someone has to speak up for me and for my children. It doesn't sound like John Stossel will be doing that any time soon.

Julie
A Teacher

 

[BuckNaked]

I'm of the opinion that unions have outlived their usefulness, but to lay all of the problems of public education at the feet of the teachers unions is ridiculous. I agree that the teacher unions are partially responsible, but only partially. There is plenty of blame to go around, including parents, administrators, school boards, and students themselves.

 

[mickeyfan2]

Should all the blame be placed on the school system? How could the parents sit back and allow the sytem to pass this child on year after year?

Well if the mother is to be believed, she kept telling them there was a problem and nothing improved. She was a poor mom so private tutors were not possible. So I believe she did her part.

 

[ItsonlyExperiment626]

There were fantastic procedures being done by some of the schools shown on the program, I can't see why the public system doesn't look at them and implement them into the system.

The one school where they students set up the lunch tables and picked up trash. What a brillant idea. It saves money and is also a teaching tool. The kids learn about working in a community, cooperation and I would think it would give them quite a bit of school spirit. This ties into the one poster who said their school hasn't been painted for years and needed. Why can't the parents, students, teachers and adminstrators get together and paint the school themselves. I believe it would set the tone of motivation for the students. If the outside of the school looks so good lets do something inside, but lets not stop there. Your school looks good inside and out, lets work on the academics.

I'm all for attaching the money to each child and giving the parent the power to choose the school. Bad schools do need to close and bad teachers need to be weeded out. Student are the ones who needs to be heard on this since they are the ones who are with the teachers day in and day out. They are the ones who know which teachers are coming up with a method in which the student can relate and understand. The segment where the high schoolers were just not paying attention to the teacher. What has he done to make what he was teaching more interesting. I'm not blaming him, but that was not included in the report. Surely there eveyone can see he needed some help and a couple parents in that classroom might have made a difference.

 

[chobie]

There were fantastic procedures being done by some of the schools shown on the program, I can't see why the public system doesn't look at them and implement them into the system.

The one school where they students set up the lunch tables and picked up trash. What a brillant idea. It saves money and is also a teaching tool. The kids learn about working in a community, cooperation and I would think it would give them quite a bit of school spirit. This ties into the one poster who said their school hasn't been painted for years and needed. Why can't the parents, students, teachers and adminstrators get together and paint the school themselves. I believe it would set the tone of motivation for the students. If the outside of the school looks so good lets do something inside, but lets not stop there. Your school looks good inside and out, lets work on the academics.

I think many parents would freak out at the idea of their little darling picking up trash at school.

 

[mickeyfan2]

There were fantastic procedures being done by some of the schools shown on the program, I can't see why the public system doesn't look at them and implement them into the system.

The one school where they students set up the lunch tables and picked up trash. What a brillant idea. It saves money and is also a teaching tool. The kids learn about working in a community, cooperation and I would think it would give them quite a bit of school spirit. This ties into the one poster who said their school hasn't been painted for years and needed. Why can't the parents, students, teachers and adminstrators get together and paint the school themselves. I believe it would set the tone of motivation for the students. If the outside of the school looks so good lets do something inside, but lets not stop there. Your school looks good inside and out, lets work on the academics.

Yes this was the school in Oakland that spent far below the national average per students. I wish all schools look at this and made a version in their own school that works for them.

 

[lillygator]

Well if the mother is to be believed, she kept telling them there was a problem and nothing improved. She was a poor mom so private tutors were not possible. So I believe she did her part.

exactly...and even in the last/latest mtg, everyone - including the school principal - thought that the child was doing well and no one in the mtg had any issues with him.

 

[chobie]

About the more money being spent on schools these days. It's a little thing called "technology"; its not enough to just provide books if we want our kids to survive in this day and age.

Also, there is this little piece of legislation called "IDEA". Providing for special needs children is very costly and of course private schools don't have to worry about that tiny detail.

 

[BuckNaked]

About the more money being spent on schools these days. It's a little thing called "technology"; its not enough to just provide books if we want our kids to survive in this day and age.

I agree, but here in DC, per pupil spending is among the highest, if not the highest, in the US, and they still have some of the crappiest schools in the country. The buildings are crumbling, and there was a story in the Post recently talking about how they didn't have all the books they need. So where is all of that money going? It certainly isn't being used to improve the education for DC students.

Also, there is this little piece of legislation called "IDEA". Providing for special needs children is very costly and of course private schools don't have to worry about that tiny detail.

True, nor should private schools have to.

 

[ItsonlyExperiment626]

Chobie-I would look at it as an opportunity to teach the kids not to litter. It's their trash. I would think that the kids would learn not to litter if they knew they had to pick it at the end of the day.

 

[chobie]

[I agree, but here in DC, per pupil spending is among the highest, if not the highest, in the US, and they still have some of the crappiest schools in the country. The buildings are crumbling, and there was a story in the Post recently talking about how they didn't have all the books they need. So where is all of that money going? It certainly isn't being used to improve the education for DC students.



True, nor should private schools have to.

Well they should if we go to vouchers and they take public money.

Pssst, about the money thing -- try looking at the salaries and perks of the administrators. Not the building ones (Principals etc.) but the central office ones. Now their salaries are public info, but they have all sorts of ways of hiding the perks(car and housing stipends etc) in the contracts.

 

[chobie]

Chobie-I would look at it as an opportunity to teach the kids not to litter. It's their trash. I would think that the kids would learn not to litter if they knew they had to pick it at the end of the day.

Me too. However, the type of parents who going storming into the school board everytime their child gets a dentention(and there are tons of them) would probably not look so kindly on it.

 

[ItsonlyExperiment626]

I agree, any money given to schools goes directly to the comfort of the adminstrators and not to the kids. They don't take all the money though, they make sure they build a bigger state of the art pool or indoor track to show that they really are thinking of our children's education. Giving more money to the public school system only adds to the problem.

 

[momof2inPA]

I have been a teacher since 1982. When I started teaching, salaries averaged $17,000 per year. They now average close to $40,000 per year, a much more effective "living wage" even adjusted for inflation. When I started teaching, virtually ALL of my classes contained at least 30 students. The really big classes would have 35. Now, the average class has 22 students in it. A really big class has 27. Do these things affect student performance? You bet your life they do! An intelligent young person starting out is much more likely to be attracted to our profession by an annual salary of $40K than by one of $20K. A middle-aged woman with a family to help support and with a lot of experience in the classroom is much more likely to stay in the field if the compensation is adequate and the working conditions are pleasant. You'd have to be a real dunce at math to not understand why having 20 students in a classroom is better than having 30 students. Every single day, I get to sit down and work with every single student in each of my classes. Incidentally, instead of teaching six classes like I did when I first started teaching in 1981, I now teach 3 -- we're on a block schedule which gives us more time with our students. So, I've gone from herding 180 students a day to teaching 60!
What do unions have to do with this? Well, I don't know about where YOU live or about where John Stossel lives, but where I live, I can tell you that change does not occur without impetus. NEA and AEA have kept constant pressure on the legislature of our state to change things for the better. Is our union powerful? Yes. Does it always use its power well? No. Right now, for instance, the education fund in our state has a one time surplus. AEA is lobbying to use the surplus for teacher pay raises. It doesn't make sense to use a one-time surplue for pay raises. But, would we be where we are today without the generally positive use of power that this organization has displayed in our state? No way. When our director makes a choice that is unwise, our state is full of independent, stubborn people who happily ignore him (as is happening right now with the pay raise issue).
So, when people like John Stossel whine about "those evil teachers and their unions," I just shake my head. I remember what it was like when I had 34 students crammed in a room that had been designed for 20. I remember what it was like to not have enough textbooks because politicians were too cheap to buy them for my students. I know that someone has to speak up for me and for my children. It doesn't sound like John Stossel will be doing that any time soon.

Julie
A Teacher

That was a lovely post. I do think the NEA has had a hand in many of the improvements that have occurred in the classroom in the last 20 years. They are just an easy target. If a teacher stinks or gets in trouble for substance abuse, it's the union's fault. I'm not sure how many teachers there are in the U.S., but some will get in trouble. Some will screw up. For some reason, we don't all throw a fit about oh, say, the Republican Party when one of them gets caught with his hand in the cookie jar, and talk about people being hard to fire.. they take the cake.

As for John Stossel, he isn't a reporter, he's another conservative talking head- Limbaugh-lite (no, I didn't say light).

Good luck teaching, and thanks for all your hard work. My kids go to Catholic school, but our local public schools are excellent. The parents of children who attend them can't say enough positive things about the teachers.