Stop Honking at Me! and other Driving Woes

Your DH may not like it and I've seen truckers block the soon-to-be closed zipper lane, but it really does work out better for everyone.

From the Minnesota DOT:
https://www.dot.state.mn.us/zippermerge/
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/traffic-lane-zipper-merge.htm
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...g-late-recommended-states-experts/1748026001/

Dh doesn’t care as long as traffic keeps moving but I have yet to hear one trucker say that it works better that way. They travel a lot of roads. They try to stop it to keep traffic moving.

Dh wasn’t trying to keep the guy from merging honestly, the guy just seemed to think he would stop or slow down. He didn’t and the guy hit him. It was ruled the car’s fault by the insurance companies.

If everyone in the moving lane stops or slows down to allow a car to merge over, it stands to reason that it’s going to cause a back up. Not everyone is even comfortable zippering in, so there will always be those that slow down or wait for a bigger opening or whatever and that is going to stop traffic.
 
Are you talking about the lane closed as in construction?

How does moving over early cause a back up? If they are going the speed of the traffic around them it shouldn't do that.

All the truckers that I hear on DH's radio, say just the opposite. Its the ones waiting until the last minute to merge over that cause the back up. Merging sooner, keeps traffic moving into the one lane.

I do know that once DH was coming up on closed lane. He had already gotten into the other lane. Some guy in a car came up the lane that was closing and try to "merge", hitting Dh's tire and a bit of the bumper. Didn't really hurt the truck but did a LOT of damage to the guy's car. When the police go there, the guy basically try to demand they give dh a ticket. The cop asked him why and he said because dh didn't let him merge. The cop told him that dh didn't have to let him merge and he should have gotten over in the open lane back when he saw the sign. Could have just been the opinion of that cop, I guess.
idk if there is a specific law to this, but the zipper merge is the way most dept of transportations say it should be done.
 
Your DH may not like it and I've seen truckers block the soon-to-be closed zipper lane, but it really does work out better for everyone.

From the Minnesota DOT:
https://www.dot.state.mn.us/zippermerge/
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/traffic-lane-zipper-merge.htm
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...g-late-recommended-states-experts/1748026001/

I was in this exact situation in 4 separate areas on the highway yesterday. 3 of the areas moved smoothly, although we were going very slow, we were moving because of the zipper merge effect.
The one that was all backed up and at a standstill was the one where a trucker decided to move over about a mile before the lane closed and blocked the rest of us in the closing lane from driving up to the merge point. People behind me then decided not to wait and instead moved over as well causing everyone to be stuck. Had the trucker just drove up to the merge point none of us would have been sitting there for 10 minutes. Someone else could have done the same thing, but this particular vehicle was a truck.
 

Dh just called for his nightly call and I asked him why do they not think the zipper merge works. (Please remember I live in an area without a huge amount of traffic. We have areas of traffic but nothing really bumper to bumper on an interstate so I don’t experience this normally).

He said, it would work. If every person on the interstate drove the same. If they left enough room ahead of them so another car can merge in and maintained speed and if all of those merging would maintain speed and move in. The problem is you have tailgaters that won’t leave space and you have nervous nellies trying to get in and then you have the real lovelies that try to get ahead of everybody and will pass several instead of merging. And when it’s trucks, they have to have a lot more space to merge in. Plus when a truck merges they not only need the length of the truck and trailer but cushion room to keep from hitting someone that hits their brakes.

It’s not the theory. It’s human nature.
 
I found Canada's Worse Driver on youtube - this show is like watching a train wreck. I'm gonna make my 15 year old watch it - they have so much good advice in it. Problem is it makes me afraid to get back on the road with the crazies!
I know, right? And if those are the ones that made national television, can you even fathom how many other "accidents waiting to happen" are out there? Right now the show is airing it's "Canada's Worst Driver EVER" version. It has all the participants from past seasons that were "the worst" of their season. It's a horror-show. :eek:

On another note, that same guy also hosts a similar show called "Canada's Worst Handyman" which is rehab for disastrous DIY'ers. It's just as shocking, just as educational and waaaaay more fun because really, nobody's life is at stake from a bad drywall patch. ::yes::
https://www.freep.com/story/money/c...iving-commute-traffic-zipper-merge/761350002/
This is one where DW and I absolutely disagree. I try to zipper merge whenever possible, citing the efficiency of it as discussed in this article. DW insists that traffic should merge as soon as the driver realizes it's necessary, even it's very far away, and zipper merging is the height of rudeness. We haven't gone to counseling over it--yet. :D
Have her get in touch with me - I'll explain it. She is capable of listening to reason, right? ;)
 
Dh just called for his nightly call and I asked him why do they not think the zipper merge works. (Please remember I live in an area without a huge amount of traffic. We have areas of traffic but nothing really bumper to bumper on an interstate so I don’t experience this normally).

He said, it would work. If every person on the interstate drove the same. If they left enough room ahead of them so another car can merge in and maintained speed and if all of those merging would maintain speed and move in. The problem is you have tailgaters that won’t leave space and you have nervous nellies trying to get in and then you have the real lovelies that try to get ahead of everybody and will pass several instead of merging. And when it’s trucks, they have to have a lot more space to merge in. Plus when a truck merges they not only need the length of the truck and trailer but cushion room to keep from hitting someone that hits their brakes.

It’s not the theory. It’s human nature.
Thanks for asking him!

He's right when it comes to normal traffic or traffic that is moving quickly :). The zipper merge really works when traffic is already jammed up, very slow or stop and go. Think of it as each lane taking turns moving forward into the open lane at the closure so both lanes move at the same rate.
 
Thanks for asking him!

He's right when it comes to normal traffic or traffic that is moving quickly :). The zipper merge really works when traffic is already jammed up, very slow or stop and go. Think of it as each lane taking turns moving forward into the open lane at the closure so both lanes move at the same rate.

If you can’t get everyone to do it and do it right, it won’t work. And that’s the problem.

The traffic stopping isn’t due to everyone being in the moving lane. The back up is from those that won’t do any kind of merge the right way. So if the moving lane has to stop to let in the blocked lane because someone ended up at the cones and didn’t move over, you have a back up. Doesn’t take long for a huge back up. And THAT is what the truckers are trying to prevent. They don’t expect everyone to move over at the first sign 3 miles back. It’s the ones that end up at the cones and can’t go forward that are causing the back ups and who they want to stop.
 
I thought 2 I didn’t see mentioned (although I may have missed it)

1) I hate it when two/three cars pace each other across all lanes of the highway. They’re usually barely going the speed limit and there’s no way to get around them.

2) when someone in the middle, or worse left lane, decide they want to take the exit right there and basically slow down to crawl in order to practically make a right turn then a left to get on the ramp. (This is only a slight exaggeration).
 
Don't get me started on Mass rotaries - we had two perfectly good ones in my part of the state, and they messed both of them up recently! There's one on Rt 44 in Middleborough that all of a sudden added an extra lane (increasing, not reducing, accidents) and one around a park in Bridgewater that suddenly grew stop signs - as if "yield" didn't make sense!

They tried fixing one in Reading/Wakefield... painted directions on the road and everything... do you think it actually helped? Haha
 
I am so with all of you on the traffic circle issues. They just put three of them on what used to be a very rural road. Most of the time, they work fine. But then you have a day like today, where the driver in front of me would enter the circle, and then slam on their brakes because someone was approaching the next point to enter the circle. And then they waited until the car got into the circle in front of them before moving again. After nearly being rear ended twice, by the third circle and the third stop, I just wanted to sit them down and explain why what they were doing was dangerous. They did put up yield signs where you enter the circle, but they don’t explain that you are supposed to yield to people already in the circle, not stop and wait for people to enter who aren’t even up to the circle yet.

As far as what to do on multi lane freeways, I always considered the far right to be for entry and exit, the far left to be for passing, and the lanes in between increase in speed as you move left (so the farther toward the left you are, the faster you are traveling). I am an obey the limit driver, so I drive in the second lane from the right unless I need to pass. If the freeway is only two lanes per side, I stay in the right lane. I have no interest in impeding anyone else’s speed. I have had to pass people occasionally though. Once I passed someone towing a high school parade float at 35mph down the Florida Turnpike where the speed limit is 70!

I also have a pet peeve about people turning right on red without stopping to see what traffic is doing. There are a couple intersections on my way home where people traveling south make a lot of legal u-turns to get unto businesses because there is no way to cross the median and access the business. People heading west who want to turn right don’t even apply their brakes, and go around the corner at the same time. I know I will see a bad accident one day because I have seen some very close calls. A part of my commute that passes through another county has signs at this type of intersection stating that right turn on red must yield to u-turns, and I don’t see so many close calls there.

I am not surprised that there are so many traffic issues here, since we get drivers from all over the world, who are used to different rules and regulations, and even cultural expectations. My sister and I used to be pretty good at guessing where people were from by how they drove, but it’s not always so easy to tell which cars are the tourist rentals these days. The locals will be the ones getting dressed, shaving or putting on makeup, and juggling a phone and a meal behind the wheel. I actually saw a woman putting on pantyhose at a red light one day. Don’t think I could do that if I tried. :rotfl2:
 
It’s the ones that end up at the cones and can’t go forward that are causing the back ups and who they want to stop.
Well, not really. It's the drivers in the open lane who are unwilling to alternate with the merging vehicles who cause the backup.
2) when someone in the middle, or worse left lane, decide they want to take the exit right there and basically slow down to crawl in order to practically make a right turn then a left to get on the ramp. (This is only a slight exaggeration)
Oh. You were driving in Boston Monday night! That driver wasn't so bad, but only because we were on a city street Instead of a highway.
They tried fixing one in Reading/Wakefield... painted directions on the road and everything... do you think it actually helped? Haha
I'm not in that rotary that often, but it seems to work. Now, you want one that's a mess? Squire Road at Route 1 in Revere.
but they don’t explain that you are supposed to yield to people already in the circle, not stop and wait for people to enter who aren’t even up to the circle yet.
Oh, shoot. You just reminded me of another peeve. Yield means cede the right of way to traffic on the main road, then proceed when and as safe. It doesn't mean you have to stop and wait for every. single. oncoming. vehicle. to be a matter like beyond you.
 
People cruising/Not passing in the left lane and impeding traffic behind them. It's ok to drive slower but ya gots to move over, friend. I drive daily on a 55mph 4 lane road and it never fails I get stuck behind 2 people both going the exact same 5mph under the speed limit right next to each other and a huge line piles up behind. Move right!

It is posted on NYS highways slower traffic keep right. If it's a 5 lane highway, sure any other lane besides the most left one will do...
I had to look up from where in NY you live. I’m on Long Island, NO ONE drives 5 miles UNDER the speed limit here in any lane...EVER! :laughing:
My biggest pet peeve would probably be the tailgating that occurs even when I’m driving over the speed limit. And yes, I’ll admit it, I am guilty. Sorry rule followers and law abiding citizens. Send forth your flames. When you’re driving with the flow of traffic on the LIE, you’re inevitably going over the speed limit, but some people feel like it’s the Indy 500. That gets annoying. Sorry, but I just don’t feel the need to drive 80mph so you can get to Dunkin‘ Donuts 3 minutes faster.
 
he still ranted that it's "polite" to let people in and still thought that anybody who didn't allow him to zipper merge into the traffic circle was acting like a jerk.

Well legally he is wrong, however in peak traffic here when it is bumper to bumper that is the etiquette.
When traffic is flowing though, no way.

The other problem is, most of them are too small to be effective. They've basically just replaced a standard intersection. The ones I've seen in other countries work better because they are bigger and do allow for merging/traffic flow.
We have a few of those, they really need to be large enough for 3-4 card to be around at the same time.
 
Well, not really. It's the drivers in the open lane who are unwilling to alternate with the merging vehicles who cause the backup.

Not when the car or cars in the lane that is closing won’t try to merge for whatever reason and suddenly you have a line of cars stopped at the cones. The other lane is moving so for the moving cars to let the stopped cars “merge” they too have to stop or slow considerably. That cause a back up. If they would have merged on in while they were still moving, no problem.

The computer generated videos that show this working show perfectly spaced cars going the same speed. Real life doesn’t work that way.
 
I'm not talking about people with disabilities or with large families but honestly, getting into your car, starting it and pulling out shouldn't take longer than launching the space shuttle.
Not entirely sure what you are getting at here, but another peeve of mine is people who can't just park and walk to a store that you are going to be walking around in sitting waiting for others (me) to get in their cars and leave a space. Go park in an empty space ya lazy bum. I may not be leaving or I may be the one sitting being blocked behind you while you wait forever for a space just so you don't have to walk another 15 feet.
 
I tell my kids (12 and 15) that they can never go wrong assuming the other drivers are going to do something stupid. That's the same now when they are riding their bikes and will be the same when they start driving.

I also tell them that going too slowly for the flow of traffic, thereby causing a traffic hazard, is dangerous.... just like going too quickly for the flow of traffic.

The cars that stop in the middle of the road for no reason must be the same people who stop in the middle of the walkways at Disneyland!
 
The computer generated videos that show this working show perfectly spaced cars going the same speed. Real life doesn’t work that way.
Because drivers in the open lane aren't leaving the normal recommended distance between themselves and the car in front. https://battafulkerson.com/safe-distance-between-cars-driving/
A zipper lane is supposed to work exactly like a zipper -left tooth car, then immediately right tooth/car, then immediately left tooth/car, then... You don't zip just one side of a zipper.
but another peeve of mine is people who can't just park and walk to a store that you are going to be walking around in sitting waiting for others (me) to get in their cars and leave a space. Go park in an empty space ya lazy bum.
There used to be a fitness center in a mall here. It was entertaining to watch drivers go up and down the aisles, looking for the closest space, then head in to the gym.
 
Because drivers in the open lane aren't leaving the normal recommended distance between themselves and the car in front. https://battafulkerson.com/safe-distance-between-cars-driving/
A zipper lane is supposed to work exactly like a zipper -left tooth car, then immediately right tooth/car, then immediately left tooth/car, then... You don't zip just one side of a zipper.

There used to be a fitness center in a mall here. It was entertaining to watch drivers go up and down the aisles, looking for the closest space, then head in to the gym.

I know how its supposed to work. Getting people to do that is the problem.

And I don't need a link for the safe distance between cars, I know what a safe distance is. Just remember that trucks need more than that amount of room. They have to have enough room to stop and that is a lot more than a car.

The open lane doesn't leave enough space. Those at the end of the closed lane don't "zipper" in one at a time but instead several try to jump in front of someone and THAT will cause a back up. Its not like everyone in the closed lane is "oh so smart" and trying to do it right. Until you can change human nature, it ain't going to work. And what of the big trucks in the closed lane? They try to get in and it too causes a back up. Don't let them in and it causes a back up.
 


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