Star Wars Tales Of The Arcolyte

[BrianL]

that is how I remember it too.. it took some real persuasion and then that fed into Anakin's resentment of the council later as well I felt.

Spoiler

I just dont think the Jedi council was quite so eager to take children against their family's will as I had originally accused them. If they were really young then yes, but older and especially when the parents are against it then i could see them passing. It was the way Indara said they (the council) already thought they interfered too much as it was when they first refused the twins.

The Jedi did not "take" children forcibly. They were identified and tested, with permission. Then they could be given up to serve with the Jedi, which most citizens of the Republic considered an honor. If the parents chose not to send their child with the Jedi, then they were forbidden to train the child in the use of The Force. Of course, that doesn't preculde them learning on their own. There were a lot of "Force Sensitive" beings out there (to varying degrees - technically all life is Force Sensitive to a tiny dgree), who were not trained as Jedi or otherwise. They didn't even identify every kid, though within the Republic, especially the core worlds, they probably did find most of them.

 

[Suger Mag]

The Jedi did not "take" children forcibly. They were identified and tested, with permission. Then they could be given up to serve with the Jedi, which most citizens of the Republic considered an honor. If the parents chose not to send their child with the Jedi, then they were forbidden to train the child in the use of The Force. Of course, that doesn't preculde them learning on their own. There were a lot of "Force Sensitive" beings out there (to varying degrees - technically all life is Force Sensitive to a tiny dgree), who were not trained as Jedi or otherwise. They didn't even identify every kid, though within the Republic, especially the core worlds, they probably did find most of them.

I concede my distrust expressed earlier was overblown. I appreciate that there was a line that the Jedi did not cross.

 

[BrianL]

I concede my distrust was misguided and overblown. I appreciate that there was a line that the Jedi did not cross.

One thing to nots is that they likely rarely, if ever, ran into cases where the parents were dead-set against it, so who knows how any individual Jedi might have reacted to that. In the Republic they probably had a 100% uptake rate.

 

[Suger Mag]

One thing to nots is that they likely rarely, if ever, ran into cases where the parents were dead-set against it, so who knows how any individual Jedi might have reacted to that. In the Republic they probably had a 100% uptake rate.

still though, the witches of Brendok had some reason to fear the Jedi.... that does not grow out of nothing

 

[BrianL]

still though, the witches of Brendok had some reason to fear the Jedi.... that does not grow out of nothing

The witches of Brendok would fear the Jedi because I think it's pretty clear that they tapped into the Dark Side to perform their magic (at least some of it). They may not think of it in those terms, but they obviously know that the Jedi do. They seem to be pretty familiar and educated about that. I get that they just wanted to be left alone, and that's fine, but they were still messing with some stuff that is pretty problematic from the Jedi point of view anyway.

 

[Suger Mag]

I also have a feeling that we have not seen the last of our spiky Mother Koril.

Perhaps more grey magic than black. The possession was definitely not a 'light' tool, but they also waited to be attacked first. Wonder how much there was really aimed at suppression of other Force users like them. They The Jedi never seemed to mess around with the Nightsisters that much.... or at least from what I remembered from the Clone Wars.

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

One thing to nots is that they likely rarely, if ever, ran into cases where the parents were dead-set against it, so who knows how any individual Jedi might have reacted to that. In the Republic they probably had a 100% uptake rate.

I see it like Muay Thai fighters. It’s considered a great honor in Thailand to be asked train to be a Muay Thai fighter. They leave there family at a very young age and go train to fight in the Muay Thai style and represent the country. I don’t think they forcibly take any kids, but it’s such an honor that very few pass up the opportunity.

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

Also being that we know GL used Asian warriors as a basis for SW……to me the Muay Thai comparison makes lots of sense.

 

[BrianL]

Man, I'm usually the first to defend it, but....


I dunno. That was weird, right? Some parts were cool, but it just didn't pay off. You know, if you are not sure that you are getting a season 2 - don't write it like you're getting a season 2! It feels kind of like Loki season 1 did - good all the way through with jsut no ending. At least in Loki's case they did know there was going to be a season 2 and taken as a whole, it pretty good. This was a rough ending.

 

[ramee]

Spoiler

Yeah. The cut away “transitions” were weird. It felt like it was going to end a couple different times but wait…here’s 4 more seconds…here’s another 4 seconds…big name and end.

Only a glimpse of something creepy…korril? that added nothing else to the episode.

The green Jedi is good, then? Seems like shell have the same problem as sol with a future guilty conscience. Oh but Qimir was scared of her.

Didn’t expect osha to force choke sol to death.

And when the “twins” were saying goodbye and Qimir handed osha the lightsaber, I thought she was going to kill mae kind of like ending a timeline since they’re the same person…? I got that wrong.

I guess it’s good to have things you wouldn’t think would happen but it felt a little all over the place.

The space rocks were pretty.

Edited to add Qimir’s name

 

[BrianL]

Okay, I've got to unpack that a little...

Okay, so throughout the season it seemed to me that Mae had generally dark tendencies and Osha was failrly incorruptible. It seemed like Sol was a decent guy who got caught up in this big thing. I could still defend his killing of Mother Aniseya considering what was going on. I absolutely hold that the witches were using the Dark Side, whether they think if it that way or not. Then there's this episode.

Suddenly, Mae is reasonable, and Osha is so consumed with ahtred that she bleeds a Khyber crystal (that part was cool though). The change was quite sudden! If Me and Osha are the same person, it has seemed that they were flip sides of the same coin - one good, one bad. That's not the case though, but I think they could have benefitted from seeing that - like show why Osha couldn't be a Jedi. She had held on to hate, but they didn't demonstrate this. Now that I type it out, it does play okay, but it could've used soem fleshing out. Still, I think they want me to have sympathy where I don't and be critical of the actions that I support.

What is honestly a bigger problem though is the anticlamax of the whole thing. Like, we really don't get to see Vernestra break out that light whip? Really? She used it for a half-second the whole season! How can something liek that even happen? She should have confronted the Stranger. They should have shown what happened between them. They drop it like it's this huge surprise, but DUH! I mean, it was obvious that the Jedi Master who uses a Light Whip had to fight with and cast out the guy with WHIP MARKS on his back. It feels like there was more to that story, but we don't get it. Versentra was shady the whole time, and she doubles down on the lie at the end. That's not necessarily a story problem, but it makes her an awful person - and it absolutely needs to be followed up on.

And that's the thing - there is SO MUCH still hanging. I'm not saying I hated it - I WANT to know where it all leads. I'm just not sure we are going to see it. I mean, they showed Darth so-and-so there for a hot second - they're leaving us with that! If there is no season 2, then you leave that out. Since they are not sure, then they should've left it out. Again, finish the story and I'm fine with it. If they don't, this whole thing was pointless.

 

[BrianL]

Spoiler

Yeah. The cut away “transitions” were weird. It felt like it was going to end a couple different times but wait…here’s 4 more seconds…here’s another 4 seconds…big name and end.

Only a glimpse of something creepy…korril? that added nothing else to the episode.

The green Jedi is good, then? Seems like shell have the same problem as sol with a future guilty conscience. Oh but that guy was scared of her.

Didn’t expect osha to force choke sol to death.

And when the “twins” were saying goodbye and he handed osha the lightsaber, I thought she was going to kill mae kind of like ending a timeline since they’re the same person…? I got that wrong.

I guess it’s good to have things you wouldn’t think would happen but it felt a little all over the place.

The space rocks were pretty.

Yes, the space chase through the rings of the planet was very cool and well done. I am disappointed that we didn't get to see Jedi Vectors in action!

 

[ramee]

Spoiler

Oh. Well Reddit is saying plegueis. I’m too casual a fan to catch that

 

[mdmost]

Spoiler

I didn't not like the finale at all. It went from a great premise to a terrible execution with bad, backbending reasoning, terrible motivations, and the turning of Osha was terribly predictable. And I absolutely do not like the Jedi being so power hungry that they would lie not once but twice. The 2nd lie being only to hold onto power. I can accept what Indara did being that Osha would be sent away. I do not like the idea that Jedi would pin actions on a "rogue Jedi". And you rope Yoda in on it. That's not going to sit well given how beloved he is. I have zero doubt this gets greenlit for a 2nd season. There will be lots of outrage over how it ended.

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

I have been trying to tell you all this was a hot mess. Sounds like you are coming around finally.

 

[Skywalker3]

I’m still letting it all settle. My DH and I were talking earlier about whether it’s better to have all of this prolific Star Wars content even if it’s mediocre and disappointing , versus the nothing years that we lived through, from 1983 to 1999 with little substantial.
So I spent a lot of this episode thinking I’d rather have nothing thsn this disappointing series. Some scenes were awful. But I spent the other half or so thinking wow this is really tragic and appreciating the depth of these Jedi and Force users and their struggles.
And I really , really liked the ending. Somehow this show managed to get a few tears out of me tonight. Very tragic way to end .
There is an episode of Visions, season 1 , Akakiri, that this reminded me of..

While the main lightsaber duel was very well done, great action, it really seemed misplaced at first.
As with almost every other episode, the editing, cutaways , and dual storytelling was annoying and disrupted the flow and story. The confrontation between Mae and Osha was too choreographed .
I didn’t read any High Republic novels , so I didn’t come in with any knowledge of Vernestra, but I think a lot of people are disappointed in her portrayal.
I liked the you know who peeking around the corner watching Osha and Qimir.

I loved this idea of complicated, very imperfect Jedi, and the guilt and struggle they had to live with to for years, trying to atone for their sins. Very good idea. Very bad execution, script, and production though.
And verrry much loved the Stranger. Fascinating character, and the best acting and dialogue on the show. ,
I’ll think more on it.
I have surely enjoyed this thread and discussion.
I do not want a season 2. I would be happy if the story just continued in a book .

 

[Skywalker3]

Okay, I've got to unpack that a little...

Okay, so throughout the season it seemed to me that Mae had generally dark tendencies and Osha was failrly incorruptible. It seemed like Sol was a decent guy who got caught up in this big thing. I could still defend his killing of Mother Aniseya considering what was going on. I absolutely hold that the witches were using the Dark Side, whether they think if it that way or not. Then there's this episode.

Suddenly, Mae is reasonable, and Osha is so consumed with ahtred that she bleeds a Khyber crystal (that part was cool though). The change was quite sudden! If Me and Osha are the same person, it has seemed that they were flip sides of the same coin - one good, one bad. That's not the case though, but I think they could have benefitted from seeing that - like show why Osha couldn't be a Jedi. She had held on to hate, but they didn't demonstrate this. Now that I type it out, it does play okay, but it could've used soem fleshing out. Still, I think they want me to have sympathy where I don't and be critical of the actions that I support.

What is honestly a bigger problem though is the anticlamax of the whole thing. Like, we really don't get to see Vernestra break out that light whip? Really? She used it for a half-second the whole season! How can something liek that even happen? She should have confronted the Stranger. They should have shown what happened between them. They drop it like it's this huge surprise, but DUH! I mean, it was obvious that the Jedi Master who uses a Light Whip had to fight with and cast out the guy with WHIP MARKS on his back. It feels like there was more to that story, but we don't get it. Versentra was shady the whole time, and she doubles down on the lie at the end. That's not necessarily a story problem, but it makes her an awful person - and it absolutely needs to be followed up on.

And that's the thing - there is SO MUCH still hanging. I'm not saying I hated it - I WANT to know where it all leads. I'm just not sure we are going to see it. I mean, they showed Darth so-and-so there for a hot second - they're leaving us with that! If there is no season 2, then you leave that out. Since they are not sure, then they should've left it out. Again, finish the story and I'm fine with it. If they don't, this whole thing was pointless.

Hope to reply more soon , but agreed, those flip flops in Mae and Osha were too abrupt. There was one previous episode, maybe ep. 2, where there is a hint of this , but agree with you . Not explained well. And agree with your take on the almost complete omission of any connection between

Spoiler

Vernestra and Qimir and total lack of a confrontation and seeing that light whip. I think that could’ve been great, but then there would be more explaining to do…to the other Jedi , the council, or Qimir may have perished. So I kinda get it. At least she feels his presence.

 

[BrianL]

I have been trying to tell you all this was a hot mess. Sounds like you are coming around finally.

Ehh, it wasn't a hot mess. It was great until they didn't stick the landing. It's like, who produced this - Marvel?

 

[nancipants]

I honestly don’t know what to think about that show. There were lot of things I liked and it has a lot of promise, but the story overall was okay for me and I didn’t like Osha's fate. I needed way more motivation for her. Qimir went from a really intriguing character to just kind of there in the last two episodes he was in. Also, the ending with Mae and Osha and felt contrived just for drama's sake.

I feel like most of what I like is because it’s Star Wars, and I love the setting. I do hope there is a season two, because I don't want those two big cameos to lead to nothing, and Vernestra's motivations are VERY sus (as the kids say) and confusing. I loved the intrigue with the Senate and want waaaaay more of that.

As far as that one cameo:

Spoiler

I screamed so loud and jumped up when they showed Plagueis. Then I had to rewind it to make sure that it was Mr. Muun himself. PLEASE GIVE ME MOOOOOOOORE. I'm torn between whether I want them to use his Legends alter-ego backstory (banker Hego Damask) and have him working with the Senate guy to undermine the Jedi, or if I want Palpatine to be the first Sith with a real-life alter ego.

 

[BrianL]

Spoiler

I didn't not like the finale at all. It went from a great premise to a terrible execution with bad, backbending reasoning, terrible motivations, and the turning of Osha was terribly predictable. And I absolutely do not like the Jedi being so power hungry that they would lie not once but twice. The 2nd lie being only to hold onto power. I can accept what Indara did being that Osha would be sent away. I do not like the idea that Jedi would pin actions on a "rogue Jedi". And you rope Yoda in on it. That's not going to sit well given how beloved he is. I have zero doubt this gets greenlit for a 2nd season. There will be lots of outrage over how it ended.

Spoiler

I don't think Vernestra's lie is to hold on to power, but rather to protect Mae now that she no longer knows what she did. Her lie doesn't even fend off the Senate investigation, so it is pointless. It wouldn't surprise me if Vernestra trained Indara too - they have to be the worst two Jedi I have ever seen! The others certainly made some mistakes, but cover-ups were the real problem.