So much walking for so few rides

[Queen2PrincessG]

I don't think that's true. Its a big park if you aren't used to walking but i go to the gym. Never felt like the park was too much walking and I'm not impatient so i don't mind *gasp* waiting. That's how I grew up going to the parks so its not that big of a deal to only have to do it for a few rides.

 

[tlady]

We are just back from spending a few days in the parks. This was our second time with MB but our first time with only FP+.

What a lot of walking around for only a few rides in the MK. Seriously! They need to give you A LOT more FP+ for MK. We had FP+ lined up for Buzz, SM, and Goofy coaster. We got there earlier than I had planned and waited 25 mins for Haunted Mansion. Tried to do Pirates after this (30 min wait according to app) but when we got there it was down. FP time for Buzz so we went there. Still had an hour to kill before FP time for SM so we tried for Goofy but the standby was 25mins (for a 35 second ride!) so we ended up on the train for just something to do. Went back to SM and had our ride and then the boys were tired and hot so we just went back to the room to swim.

Most lines were consistently 25-30 mins. Maybe that is the plan? They think people can tolerate 3 FP+ and 30 mins waits for everything else?

I, too, used to think that lifting some of the FP+ limitations was definitely needed. Now, I truly believe that doing so will only worsen an already bad situation. Why? Because Disney has pushed so many people onto FP+ that there simply isn't the ride capacity to handle the new demand and that's a fact. And anything they do to put more people into FP lines, more often, will only make things much worse (e.g. giving 4 FPs a day).

Were it not for the limitations, I think you'd see even longer waits in FP lines.

The entire thing (FP+) is a major fiasco perpetrated by Disney. Especially so if you enjoy riding the rides as your primary reason to be in the parks. I realize this is not the draw for some people, but for many it is. And Disney basically took the old FP system (which worked well) and blew it up to the point that FP+ doesn't work well for anyone. Unless, of course, you're content with using FP only 3x per day. Or unless you are ok with long waits in line. Or unless you're happy with only 1 headliner ride in Epcot via FP. I am not ok with any of those scenarios; not in the least.

But, again, there's no going back now that Disney has promoted FP+ to anyone and everyone.

The only true solution to the mess is for Disney to put a lot more $$$ into increasing the parks' infrastructure with many more rides. I honestly don't see them doing that in the near future, if at all. They seem hell bent on adding even more hotel rooms via DVC. Hence, even more people in the already overcrowded parks.

It's a bad situation that I expect to get worse in the years to come.

 

[tlady]

I have been at Disney all week and to be honest the standby lines are all pretty much 20 to 30 minutes in MK even for headliners. I got my FP+ times for SM and Haunted Mansion but I really didn't need them. I don't mind 30 minute standby lines at all. Its unrealistic to expect no lines at all.

Just FYI, I couldn't get a fastpass for TSMM they were all taken. I did get one for Soarin but it was for six hours later so I just waited in the standby line for 60 minutes. The headliners in EPCOT had 60 minute standby lines. IN DHS even TSMM was only at 45 minutes. ToT and the roller coaster were 30 minutes or less. I had FP+ passes but did not need them.

You're there during an historically low crowd time at WDW. I wonder what your experience would be, using FP+, during Spring Break and in the summer? My guess is a LOT, LOT worse. 20 minute waits would be nonexistent. More like 60 to 90 minute waits in standby.

 

[mom2rtk]

I, too, used to think that lifting some of the FP+ limitations was definitely needed. Now, I truly believe that doing so will only worsen an already bad situation. Why? Because Disney has pushed so many people onto FP+ that there simply isn't the ride capacity to handle the new demand and that's a fact. And anything they do to put more people into FP lines, more often, will only make things much worse (e.g. giving 4 FPs a day).

Were it not for the limitations, I think you'd see even longer waits in FP lines.

The entire thing (FP+) is a major fiasco perpetrated by Disney. Especially so if you enjoy riding the rides as your primary reason to be in the parks. I realize this is not the draw for some people, but for many it is. And Disney basically took the old FP system (which worked well) and blew it up to the point that FP+ doesn't work well for anyone. Unless, of course, you're content with using FP only 3x per day. Or unless you are ok with long waits in line. Or unless you're happy with only 1 headliner ride in Epcot via FP. I am not ok with any of those scenarios; not in the least.

But, again, there's no going back now that Disney has promoted FP+ to anyone and everyone.

The only true solution to the mess is for Disney to put a lot more $$$ into increasing the parks' infrastructure with many more rides. I honestly don't see them doing that in the near future, if at all. They seem hell bent on adding even more hotel rooms via DVC. Hence, even more people in the already overcrowded parks.

It's a bad situation that I expect to get worse in the years to come.

Agreed. And yes, the FP genie is definitely out of the bottle.

 

[redrosesix]

We returned 2/18 from a 10 day trip and we felt the same as above. It wasn't always convenient or possible to schedule FP+ times where we wouldn't have to criss-cross park, and while there's always stuff to do around us, there isn't always something we WANT to ride/see in the area during the waits between FP's which were pretty often. It's just too far in advance to know exactly how your day will be and too much of a pain to move things around right there and then, especially when the app only works 50% of the time Some days our FP's were gone by 1 or 2, and lines were long. Other days when our FP's were scheduled for our 2nd park, even if we got to 1st park early, lines were too long by 11 or so and with no legacy FP, what do you do?

Also just another note, we rarely wait over 20 min. for a ride; sometimes 25, MAYBE 30 depending on what it is and if its our last day in the that park, and of course there have been exceptions over the years. In the past, 25 min. or more would have definitely been a grab-a-FP ride. Our trips are usually in Oct./Nov. and we've always had many waits of only 10-15 min. on many rides at different times of the day, so I don't think it's unreasonable to at least hope for, depending on the time of year you go. Unfortunately I think FP+ is definitely making those short lines less of a possibility. We did see some 10-15 wait times on popular rides this month, all before noon.

This was us too. The FP+ return lines are now about as long as we used to wait in SB. With FP-, when you returned you just walked on. But we also found SB lines were a lot longer too -- when you have to wait at least an extra 10 minutes for rides like HM, it starts to add up after a while. Add the 15 minutes per ride for your FP+ choices and you've lost hours by the end of the day.

I don't think it's FP+ causing the longer lines, it sounds like the park is just more crowded. Assuming that the same number of FP+ are distributed per hour as FP- (as I would expect it to work this way and also as you found FP+ had "sold out" when you tried to make new selections) the FP+ line shouldn't slow the standby line down any more than FP- did.

No - it wasn't more crowded, we go at the same time every year. Many rides that now have FP+ didn't have FP- and that's where I noticed the biggest difference in SB times. As you say, you would "expect it to work this way" but it doesn't.

An honest question, I'm sort of out of touch.. is waiting 25 minutes for a ride considered long now?

I would be pretty happy. I think 60 minutes, 90 minutes that's a long line but I am used to the pre FP days so it's hard for me to gage. I sound like the "Back in the old days we walked to school uphill in the snow barefoot"..

I would love to have only 25 minutes lines at the big rides when I'm there but I grew up in 80-90's Disney and was used to the reaalllllly long lines

Not 25 minutes for big rides, 25 minutes for every ride. Most were at least 30 minutes while we were there, including POTC. Big rides were a minimum of 45 minutes wait, all day long.

 

[redrosesix]

I, too, used to think that lifting some of the FP+ limitations was definitely needed. Now, I truly believe that doing so will only worsen an already bad situation. Why? Because Disney has pushed so many people onto FP+ that there simply isn't the ride capacity to handle the new demand and that's a fact. And anything they do to put more people into FP lines, more often, will only make things much worse (e.g. giving 4 FPs a day).

Were it not for the limitations, I think you'd see even longer waits in FP lines.

The entire thing (FP+) is a major fiasco perpetrated by Disney. Especially so if you enjoy riding the rides as your primary reason to be in the parks. I realize this is not the draw for some people, but for many it is. And Disney basically took the old FP system (which worked well) and blew it up to the point that FP+ doesn't work well for anyone. Unless, of course, you're content with using FP only 3x per day. Or unless you are ok with long waits in line. Or unless you're happy with only 1 headliner ride in Epcot via FP. I am not ok with any of those scenarios; not in the least.

But, again, there's no going back now that Disney has promoted FP+ to anyone and everyone.

The only true solution to the mess is for Disney to put a lot more $$$ into increasing the parks' infrastructure with many more rides. I honestly don't see them doing that in the near future, if at all. They seem hell bent on adding even more hotel rooms via DVC. Hence, even more people in the already overcrowded parks.

It's a bad situation that I expect to get worse in the years to come.

Agreed. I don't want them to give out more FPs. Since FP+ holders have priority over SB riders, the SB waits would just increase even more.

I'd also like to see them try to speed up the FP return lines. I watched people using cards and they work much better than the bands when scanning at the checkpoints. And some bands don't work as well as others (we had a split stay so we had 2 sets) -- the first one my DD got worked through her sweater, and she only had to hover. The second one took 2-3 tries on every scanner and sometimes didn't work at all and we had to wait for somebody with a tablet. This takes a lot more time than FP-, where the CM just quickly took your paper FP and checked it.

 

[redrosesix]

I always find it strange in the UK that people come away from a theme park saying they didn't ride anything as all the queues were 2 hours long and they didn't want to join them. But if you get in that 2 hour queue then you will come away having ridden something, rather than just looking at all the long lines. Long standby lines are often inevitable, UK parks (more line Six Flags style) charge £10+ ($16) to skip lines on 3-4 rollercoasters and I won't pay, yet have never had a bad day despite 90 minute waits.

Even if lines are 40 minutes, sometime you have to just go for it!

I just don't think it's reasonable for people with little kids to wait 40 minutes for every attraction. Heck, I would be skipping a bunch if I had to wait 40 minutes for every attraction. We're not talking about WWoHP -- some of the queues are just boring.

 

[jon18uk]

Agreed. I don't want them to give out more FPs. Since FP+ holders have priority over SB riders, the SB waits would just increase even more.

I'd also like to see them try to speed up the FP return lines. I watched people using cards and they work much better than the bands when scanning at the checkpoints. And some bands don't work as well as others (we had a split stay so we had 2 sets) -- the first one my DD got worked through her sweater, and she only had to hover. The second one took 2-3 tries on every scanner and sometimes didn't work at all and we had to wait for somebody with a tablet. This takes a lot more time than FP-, where the CM just quickly took your paper FP and checked it.

Adding more Mickey heads at each entrance may help, so that multiple people can scan at once.

I also think that although many are saying they will never be able to tour in the same way as they did with FP- as they were able to get 4 or more FP-. But equally there were many who only got 1-2 or didn't use FastPass, this seems to be the big difference with FP+, many who didn't use it or only got 1 are now using it, spreading out the benefits to everyone.

Once the kinks are worked out with scanning quickly and they have the hourly capacities right it should be a better system. Maybe they should offer more FastPass in the mornings for pre-bookers, when Standby is usually shorter and less timeslots later to even guest flows out, day guests could still get good availability in the afternoons then or pre-bookers could move bookings on the day. I'm sure Disney are looking at all kinds of options to make guest flow better and spread people out.

I just don't think it's reasonable for people with little kids to wait 40 minutes for every attraction. Heck, I would be skipping a bunch if I had to wait 40 minutes for every attraction. We're not talking about WWoHP -- some of the queues are just boring.

Unfortunately I think the only ways to keep crowds lower and queues shorter would be to either build A LOT of new attractions to spread crowds out more (but new also attracts more people too) or to keep raising prices to so that some people are put off coming. Disney used to be a once or twice in a lifetime trip, now so many repeat visit I think the crowds are only going to get worse.

 

[d1gitman]

There was more flexibility day of, especially during busy season, to decide when to pull and when to return. What several people are reporting is that you book these 2 months out, and then have to deal with park conditions once you are there, and can't make an informed decision ahead of time. You just don't know what SB lines are going to be like for rides while you are in the parks, 2 months out. So when you are planning your FPs, you do so blindly. It seems like its smart to book them in the hour spacing you are given, but when you then get in the parks, ride your FP, and then only have a particular window of time until your next (with the inability to change it due to FPs being gone for the day) ... you can't really do much in that window.

With FP- you adjusted to conditions as they existed because you pulled FPs in that environment, at that moment.

the only thing is, I wonder how many people actually spaced out their FP's or just did one after another as the wait time for next FP was up. I can tell you that's how we did it. we didn't wait extra time to get another FP. at the end of the day it was really about X number of FP attractions and the rest was filler, whether it be stand by line or something other than an attraction. when it boils down to it, its still the same, major difference being 3 FP+'s and tiering. the rest is still filler.

I would like to see more FP+'s allotted per day, I think the 'rolling 3' would be good (even a 'rolling 2' would be more flexible than just 3 and done) and hopping should absolutely be incorporated...maybe they restrict that to you can't start FP+'ing till your in that park but either way, hopping should be incorporated.

we always did our FP- starting early and went with the flow of the crowds along the way. with the wait times apps, that helped a ton. with only 3 FP+'s per day in a single park, I see utilizing the wait times app's to more efficiently move around