So, FP+ basically not affecting anyone's wait time. Now what?

[Shaden]

I don't care what some blog says, all I know is that because now I can only get 3FP's a day I will be spending much more time in SB lines. So yes, my wait time will be effected by FP+.

Note this blog, as completely flawed as its analysis is, doesn't measure how long PEOPLE are waiting in lines. They are measuring average posted wait times in standby lines. That is all.

I wouldn't really find this that surprising, I imagine that there is a predictable curve, depending on crowd levels, that people will be willing to wait for any given ride. When the ride reaches that wait time, people start skipping it, this of course is dependent on overall crowd levels and other ride availability.

Note they go on to theorize that this might be caused by the fact that people are riding less, even if its accurate.

But, this does not say you will not spend more time in line, just that the posted standby line times are not significantly longer than in 2009, though we also don't know what period they measured over ...

 

[disneydentist]

I don't care what some blog says, all I know is that because now I can only get 3FP's a day I will be spending much more time in SB lines. So yes, my wait time will be effected by FP+.

If touring plans can be believed, your wait time will be essentially unchanged. However, with only 3FP+, your total time waiting will be increased.

In this context wait time and time waiting are not interchangeable since the number of total rides is a variable.

 

[EMode]

Note this blog, as completely flawed as its analysis is, doesn't measure how long PEOPLE are waiting in lines. They are measuring average posted wait times in standby lines. That is all.

...

If touring plans can be believed, your wait time will be essentially unchanged. However, with only 3FP+, your total time waiting will be increased.

In this context wait time and time waiting are not interchangeable since the number of total rides is a variable.

I was just pointing out that the OP's title So, FP+ basically not affecting anyone's wait time. is wrong. FP+ will affect people's wait time. SB times for individual rides may not be impacted very much but the fact that now people will have to wait in more SB lines than they did with FP-, their personal time spent waiting in line will be affected.

 

[Praying Colonel]

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet, from the blog post:

Here are a couple of theories as to why headliner standby waits are lower:

1.Fewer Repeat Riders Legacy FASTPASS made it easy for savvy guests to ride headliner attractions several times a day without waiting in the standby line. With FastPass+ the rules don’t allow it. So, it may be that FastPass+ is drawing a few hundred guests a day to the less popular attractions that might have otherwise experienced a second or third ride on a Super-Headliner. With less Fastpass users later in the day, that means that the Standby lines get a little bit shorter.
2.Better Crowd Distribution Guests have more attractions to choose from with FastPass+, and these attractions are spread throughout the parks. It’s possible that by moving guests to these other attractions, FastPass+ is more evenly spreading guests around attractions. This would explain the move of guests from headliner attraction lines, which are getting shorter, to lines at secondary attractions, which are increasing.

So what we could be seeing is wait times being affected by people essentially throwing up their hands at a long wait to do a headliner again and settling for a lesser experience, instead. That may be keeping standby wait times down, but doesn't mean the guest experience is not reduced.

 

[mrsltg]

Here is the problem with the entire premise of this thread (aside from the blatant misrepresenting of the article); it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that the "small" problems that exist with the system now (inclusive of the weeks since the full-on implementation) will be exponentially greater when the larger crowds arrive. It's easy to call the system wonderful when you're at WDW in January, or when the option for double, triple, and quadruple dipping exist. However, the party is ending. For evidence of this, look no further than the return lines from Monday. Yes, it's a holiday weekend and Disney is traditionally busy then. That's the point. If they can't get a handle on the situation now, what are they going to do at Spring Break? Summer? Thanksgiving? Christmas? You are talking long lines stretching into pedestrian traffic areas. How is that going to work? Leaving aside the 3 FP+/no park hopping/tiering limits, what is Disney going to do with those bodies?

I was at WDW last month during a slow week. We had our FP+ in place. We have done the same week before, and other slow weeks throughout the years. There was a difference this year. Is it anecdotal? Sure, it was MY experience. However, it was easy to see that if there were problems during one of the slowest weeks of the entire year, Disney was about to get its tush handed back to it during the busy times. It's really not debatable. The pictures posted on social media are telling the tale. It will be interesting to see what happens over the next 6 weeks as attendance peaks. Likely those photos and experiences will also be dismissed, but oh well.

Oh, and someone asked what happens when the standby lines are too long. For my family of WDW veterans, we left the park. We went *dare I say it* offsite and dined at a non-Disney establishment. We're only one family, but if enough '1 family' do the same, it starts to add up. The next couple of months will be telling.

 

[mom2rtk]

Oh, and someone asked what happens when the standby lines are too long. For my family of WDW veterans, we left the park. We went *dare I say it* offsite and dined at a non-Disney establishment. We're only one family, but if enough '1 family' do the same, it starts to add up. The next couple of months will be telling.

In the short term, that might be a win for Disney. They got your money for admission, then you left and made room for someone else. Witness the way they touted the newfound ability to get 3K more guests through the gates daily over Christmas.

But in the long run, nobody can convince me that's not a lose for Disney. People aren't stupid and know they are getting less for their money. It might not impact crowds now. But how about a year from now when the previously annual visitor would be returning for their next trip?

 

[mrsltg]

In the short term, that might be a win for Disney. They got your money for admission, then you left and made room for someone else. Witness the way they touted the newfound ability to get 3K more guests through the gates daily over Christmas.

But in the long run, nobody can convince me that's not a lose for Disney. People aren't stupid and know they are getting less for their money. It might not impact crowds now. But how about a year from now when the previously annual visitor would be returning for their next trip?

That would be us, and that annual trip is likely to not happen. Or, from a die-hard devotee like me, we're considering visiting the "other side of Orlando". I feel dirty just saying it...

 

[GigiDisneyfreak]

What we did notice in the park were inefficient lines that are solely because of FP+, pirates being the worst. I have never seen stand by take up so much room of the courtyard there. The line itself took about 25-30 minutes but it was looooooong and snaked through the courtyard area at the entrance, as the entire right side is now FP+ only.

I'm not arguing with you or saying this isn't because of the new system but I have seen that wait before under the FP- system.

 

[JanaDee]

I don't care what some blog says, all I know is that because now I can only get 3FP's a day I will be spending much more time in SB lines. So yes, my wait time will be effected by FP+.

It really is that simple. Less FP rides means more time in the SB line. I don't understand why some people have such a hard time accepting that fact.

 

[SuperRob]

I find it funny you clearly didn't read whats posted in the article.

TP used POSTED wait times, not their own collected data.

That wasn't in the article, actually. "That’s according to our initial analysis of 330,000 standby wait times collected at Walt Disney World since FastPass+ went into effect in January."

I already knew TP collected their own data, so I falsely assumed that's what they meant here. It was in one of Len's follow-up comments, however, so you have a point. That said, Len also said that they do have their own wait data (not Disney's) in the same comment, and he will check with Fred to see how it compares. Regardless, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the numbers hold up. To put it plainly, I simply don't trust most of the complaining I'm seeing. Some people will complain about something changing even if the experience is demonstrably better, just because it's different. Others will complain because of something they saw (a long line) but did not experience for themselves (the line moving quickly once you're past the bottleneck).

 

[EMode]

It really is that simple. Less FP rides means more time in the SB line. I don't understand why some people have such a hard time accepting that fact.

Maybe those are the people who never utilized legacy FP to the fullest but thought they did. They were happy with 2,3 or 4 FPs a day and the rest of their time in SB so their time spent waiting isn't much different.
For us, going from an average of 6 FPs a day to 3 does not give me a warm fuzzy about the SB times that haven't changed.

 

[Golf4283]

Maybe those are the people who never utilized legacy FP to the fullest but thought they did. They were happy with 2,3 or 4 FPs a day and the rest of their time in SB so their time spent waiting isn't much different.
For us, going from an average of 6 FPs a day to 3 does not give me a warm fuzzy about the SB times that haven't changed.

yea but maybe Disney originally intended the legacy system to only be able to be used for 2-4 fastpasses per day and then as with most things people find the loopholes and the tricks to get more of them. Disney might just be closing these loopholes and go with their original plan.

We will obviously never know but I for one am glad the days of people fastpass planning and getting 6+ per day are over.

EDIT: to add to my above comments there's already a thread on this very board going over ways to take advantage of the new FP+ system.

 

[mom2rtk]

yea but maybe Disney originally intended the legacy system to only be able to be used for 2-4 fastpasses per day and then as with most things people find the loopholes and the tricks to get more of them. Disney might just be closing these loopholes and go with their original plan.

We will obviously never know but I for one am glad the days of people fastpass planning and getting 6+ per day are over.

EDIT: to add to my above comments there's already a thread on this very board going over ways to take advantage of the new FP+ system.

Disney could have programmed the legacy FP system to only distribute X passes per ticket at any time.

And unless I missed something, child swap is the only means of working the system I've seen yet. Three is three. There is no "taking advantage" of that.

So I'm still kicking around renting a baby for our next trip.

 

[White_Sox_Fan]

Great comment from Len:

"Yeah, you’d think that $1.5 billion would have more splash.

The people who’re seeing the biggest benefits, I think, are those who stay on-site AND sleep late. They’re able to relax and still get FP+ for Toy Story, for example, which didn’t happen under the old system.

“Late sleepers” are something like 75% of Disney visitors, and on-site guests generate the most revenue for Disney. So FP+ is directed towards the majority of Disney’s biggest spenders. Also, you know, it really helps Disney with employee staffing, which saves them money and helps shareholders.

Saying that, of course, would not make for an excellent commercial."

 

[diskev]

yea but maybe Disney originally intended the legacy system to only be able to be used for 2-4 fastpasses per day and then as with most things people find the loopholes and the tricks to get more of them. Disney might just be closing these loopholes and go with their original plan.

We will obviously never know but I for one am glad the days of people fastpass planning and getting 6+ per day are over.

EDIT: to add to my above comments there's already a thread on this very board going over ways to take advantage of the new FP+ system.

Why do people keep suggesting that people who favored the previous FP system (like me) used tricks and loopholes? The system said I could get a FP now, so I got one. It told me I could get another one at X time. So I got another one then. Etc, etc. I completely fail to see the loophole or trick.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

It really is that simple. Less FP rides means more time in the SB line. I don't understand why some people have such a hard time accepting that fact.

Agreed, but the severity of the problem depends on the number of FP- used before the change and the crowd levels when traveling.

If the average person really used 6 FP-, then that is 3 rides in the SB line that would have, before, been accessed via FP. If each of those rides has a 45 minute wait, you add 2 hours of "queue" time to your day (or skip on those extra rides altogether). During slower seasons, that probably drops somewhat and during peak seasons it goes up, but let's use 45 minutes as the average.

This is real. But that 2 hours will mean different things to different people. Some will hate WDW because of the change while others adapt and move on with their day.

 

[White_Sox_Fan]

yea but maybe Disney originally intended the legacy system to only be able to be used for 2-4 fastpasses per day and then as with most things people find the loopholes and the tricks to get more of them. Disney might just be closing these loopholes and go with their original plan.

We will obviously never know but I for one am glad the days of people fastpass planning and getting 6+ per day are over.

EDIT: to add to my above comments there's already a thread on this very board going over ways to take advantage of the new FP+ system.

I don't know of any loopholes that allowed you to get more fastpasses than were allowed. Certainly there was the loophole, or accepted practice, that allowed you to use them in a way that seemed outside of the intent.

 

[KatieCharlotte]

yea but maybe Disney originally intended the legacy system to only be able to be used for 2-4 fastpasses per day and then as with most things people find the loopholes and the tricks to get more of them. Disney might just be closing these loopholes and go with their original plan.

We will obviously never know but I for one am glad the days of people fastpass planning and getting 6+ per day are over.

EDIT: to add to my above comments there's already a thread on this very board going over ways to take advantage of the new FP+ system.

<Deep breath> Getting a new FP at the time clearly stated on the bottom of the last FP was not a loophole or a trick. It was the rule set by Disney. It took very little effort to get six or more FP during a full day of ten to fifteen hours at MK. If they wanted people to get fewer, they only had to change the rules regarding how soon a ticket could be used get another FP. They could have even set a limit on the number of FP that could be obtained. Yet, for over a decade, they did not. Instead, they actually created FP at MK that were disconnected from the system, allowing people to get even more FP.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

Well, it does say it makes no difference in standby wait times.

Which will not be all that interesting to everybody who got 7-8 fastpasses a day the old way (I never did get that many) because they were not waiting in standby lines.

Disney did this in part to spread the fastpasses out (in other words make them more available to a wider number of guests) rather than allowing people to get 7-8-9 in a day.

 

[FLchick415]

Here's the way I see it (and I'm not saying any one opinion is more right or wrong than another...and I could be way, WAY off with my assessment, and I'd be happy to admit as much if that's the case)

FP- "worked" for so many people as far as pulling more than 3 because while you were pulling 6, there was another family not pulling any at all. (Whether by choice or by design, nobody knows).

The distribution is just different. You get three, and now the family that wasn't getting any gets three.

I'm not saying it's "fair" (because that's not why or how it was designed) it just IS.

I genuinely feel bad for the people that this affects the most.