So close and yet...

[Cinderella624]

So here is my dilemma, I put an offer in on a resale which was accepted on 3/23/16. I signed papers the next day and my contract stated that both seller and buyer had to sign by 3/31/16. Then all the chaos started with DVC changing policy. Then today it was stated that those sent for ROFR would be grandfathered. I was so happy to hear that so I emailed my broker to see if it was true. She said yes but your seller has not sent back the signed papers yet. I was like WHAT?! So I called her and she said well sometimes it takes a little longer to get the paperwork in. Still I was close to freaking out thinking I had been sent for ROFR before 4/4/16. Well I was not and the seller will not be signing the papers till maybe this weekend or some time next week! Excuse me but WT... I am so angry! I don't know if I should just cancel and get my escrow payment back ( which I can cuz the seller was supposed to sign by 3/31) or should I just continue with the purchase? I understand it is just a timeshare but I also was so close to being a "regular member" to now just a second class member ugh! I hate that. Truthfully the only perk I really wanted was access to the TOTWL for drinks and fireworks All I can say is sometimes I just want to cry!
Thanks

 

[Coamfo]

So here is my dilemma, I put an offer in on a resale which was accepted on 3/23/16. I signed papers the next day and my contract stated that both seller and buyer had to sign by 3/31/16. Then all the chaos started with DVC changing policy. Then today it was stated that those sent for ROFR would be grandfathered. I was so happy to hear that so I emailed my broker to see if it was true. She said yes but your seller has not sent back the signed papers yet. I was like WHAT?! So I called her and she said well sometimes it takes a little longer to get the paperwork in. Still I was close to freaking out thinking I had been sent for ROFR before 4/4/16. Well I was not and the seller will not be signing the papers till maybe this weekend or some time next week! Excuse me but WT... I am so angry! I don't know if I should just cancel and get my escrow payment back ( which I can cuz the seller was supposed to sign by 3/31) or should I just continue with the purchase? I understand it is just a timeshare but I also was so close to being a "regular member" to now just a second class member ugh! I hate that. Truthfully the only perk I really wanted was access to the TOTWL for drinks and fireworks All I can say is sometimes I just want to cry!
Thanks

If I were you, I would tell the broker that you are either backing out or offering XXX amount less per point due to the perks being removed. This is the sellers fault and they can take the loss. If not, I'd back out and watch the market. I think prices are going to dip for a bit until people get used to the changes. Either way, you have nothing to lose by waiting now.

 

[magicaldisney]

If I were you, I would tell the broker that you are either backing out or offering XXX amount less per point due to the perks being removed. This is the sellers fault and they can take the loss. If not, I'd back out and watch the market. I think prices are going to dip for a bit until people get used to the changes. Either way, you have nothing to lose by waiting now.

Exactly what Coamfo said. They are a week past the date they were suppose to sign. You might start seeing better prices. Now, let me go to a personal level and say please don't feel like a second class citizen. We have both direct and resale. The resale contract we added on with has limitations that were set in place right before we added on. You have to think of DVC as what is providing your accommodations and nothing more than that. No second class citizen here.

 

[sdlinst]

I was just informed by my broker (via email) that DVC has reverted to their original statement on grandfathering those already in the process of closing on a contract.


From my broker

At close of business today(4/7/16), we were informed by Disney that they changed their position back to the original statement – that any resale purchase agreement submitted to Disney on or before 4/3/2016 would not be affected by the new resale restrictions to Incidental Benefits announced on 4/4/2016 but will be grandfathered in by Disney.

Portion of the letter from Disney that was sent to my broker!

Dear Sir or Madam;


As you are aware, on April 4, 2016, we announced the following important change to our incidental benefits policy: New purchasers of Disney Vacation Club® ownership interests not purchased directly from Disney Vacation Development, Inc. will not have access to Membership Extras, including Member discounts on dining, shopping, Member-exclusive events, and certain special Membership offers, as well as Disney and Concierge Collection options, already restricted for secondary market purchasers as of March 21, 2011.

This note is to inform you that anyone with a contract that was received by Disney Vacation Club by the end of the day on April 3, will be grandfathered in to have the same access to Membership Extras that are available to others who have purchased DVC memberships from sources other than Disney since March 21, 2011. (Note: Those members who purchased from sources other than DVC after March 21, 2011 may not use their points for the “Disney Collection” (select Disney Resort Hotels, Disney Cruise Line and Adventures by Disney) and the “Concierge Collection” resorts. As a reminder, the Membership Extras are incidental benefits offered by DVC and are subject to change.)

 

[Coamfo]

I was just informed by my broker (via email) that DVC has reverted to their original statement on grandfathering those already in the process of closing on a contract.


From my broker

At close of business today(4/7/16), we were informed by Disney that they changed their position back to the original statement – that any resale purchase agreement submitted to Disney on or before 4/3/2016 would not be affected by the new resale restrictions to Incidental Benefits announced on 4/4/2016 but will be grandfathered in by Disney.

Portion of the letter from Disney that was sent to my broker!

Dear Sir or Madam;


As you are aware, on April 4, 2016, we announced the following important change to our incidental benefits policy: New purchasers of Disney Vacation Club® ownership interests not purchased directly from Disney Vacation Development, Inc. will not have access to Membership Extras, including Member discounts on dining, shopping, Member-exclusive events, and certain special Membership offers, as well as Disney and Concierge Collection options, already restricted for secondary market purchasers as of March 21, 2011.

This note is to inform you that anyone with a contract that was received by Disney Vacation Club by the end of the day on April 3, will be grandfathered in to have the same access to Membership Extras that are available to others who have purchased DVC memberships from sources other than Disney since March 21, 2011. (Note: Those members who purchased from sources other than DVC after March 21, 2011 may not use their points for the “Disney Collection” (select Disney Resort Hotels, Disney Cruise Line and Adventures by Disney) and the “Concierge Collection” resorts. As a reminder, the Membership Extras are incidental benefits offered by DVC and are subject to change.)

The sellers have not signed the contract yet, so there is no way it could be sent to Disney for ROFR.

 

[gatorskin76]

If I were you, I would tell the broker that you are either backing out or offering XXX amount less per point due to the perks being removed. This is the sellers fault and they can take the loss. If not, I'd back out and watch the market. I think prices are going to dip for a bit until people get used to the changes. Either way, you have nothing to lose by waiting now.

This is great advice. I would think you should be able to get at least a slightly better price with the new situation.

 

[Cinderella624]

Thank you all for advice. I'm somewhat ok with not being allowed to attend extra offerings and such but, I think I'm angry over the fact that they waited. It's a decent purchase points banked from 2015 then this years points too. I think just the push up if any closing is cutting it short for me to book the 2015 points. They expire jan 2017. Although it does still "sting" losing out due to their neglect.

 

[CraigInPA]

At this point, it is up to you to decide if you want to continue and ignore the late signing as if it had never occurred. Most real estate brokers will tell you that people miss deadlines all the time, and there are clauses to allow them to "make it up". However, those are after both parties sign the agreement of sale, which hasn't happened. Technically, you haven't entered into a contract and can walk away from the deal.

So, you're now back to negotiating the price again. Personally, I'd ask for $5 a point reduction and see what they say. They know they screwed up, and the recent changes have resales in flux. So, they'll likely offer *something* to keep you in the deal.

 

[mynameisnobody]

If you still want to deal with this seller tell the broker to cancel this contract and then make another offer at a lower price as CraigInPA suggests. If they don't take it just walk away and look for another deal. If they're having this much problem getting the contract signed I can't imagine what it would take at closing to get everything signed.

 

[Cinderella624]

Thank you guys for your input. I sent back a new offer $6 less per point and to sign papers by 4/12/16 or I'm out! . I figured eh what the hell if they really want to sell then here ya go.. Well **** they accepted and the real estate co is going to fedex all the papers to them to get it all back by Wednesday. Now I should have offered lower but whatever. At this point it's great if all goes thru but if disney uses their ROFR then that's the way it goes! After all the stuff I've been thru this passed week I lost my pixie dust and see the real pic now! Duh! So if I get it great if not .....whatever.. Have A Magical Night!

 

[Disney Dad ADL]

Thank you guys for your input. I sent back a new offer $6 less per point and to sign papers by 4/12/16 or I'm out! . I figured eh what the hell if they really want to sell then here ya go.. Well **** they accepted and the real estate co is going to fedex all the papers to them to get it all back by Wednesday. Now I should have offered lower but whatever. At this point it's great if all goes thru but if disney uses their ROFR then that's the way it goes! After all the stuff I've been thru this passed week I lost my pixie dust and see the real pic now! Duh! So if I get it great if not .....whatever.. Have A Magical Night!

$6 per point is totally worth losing the perks, you came out ahead IMO.

It's not completely clear yet if you lose access to Totwl either, so I wouldn't lose hope yet.

 

[Cinderella624]

Thanks Dis dad! I feel pretty ok too as long as Disney dosent take it now!

$6 per point is totally worth losing the perks, you came out ahead IMO.

It's not completely clear yet if you lose access to Totwl either, so I wouldn't lose hope yet.

 

[CarolMN]

Good luck with ROFR - and I also am of the opinion that you'll still be able to access the TOTWL. The jury is still out on that one!

 

[Cinderella624]

Thank you!

 

[Disney Dad ADL]

Good luck with ROFR - and I also am of the opinion that you'll still be able to access the TOTWL. The jury is still out on that one!

I came across this tidbit from dvcnews.com from 2011.

http://dvcnews.com/index.php/resort...lt-declared-including-top-fo-the-world-lounge

The important statement is this:

"By declaring these commercial phases for the DVC inventory, DVD is formally submitting them as part of the Bay Lake Tower leasehold condominium that belongs to the DVC membership. The space being occupied by Cove Bar and the Top of the World Lounge are now considered part of the common areas belonging to all Bay Lake Tower owners."

It appears that TotWL is considered a Common Element (and therefore paid for by annual dues). Therefore, as a BLT owner with Ownership Interest, you are also part owner of the TotWL.

Based on this, I don't believe it is possible to restrict access to TotWL to BLT owners, whether resale or direct. Access to DVC members who are staying elsewhere though is a different matter. TotWL was restricted to BLT residents only when it first opened, so clearly they can restrict access to non-BLTers.

 

[disneynutz]

I came across this tidbit from dvcnews.com from 2011.

http://dvcnews.com/index.php/resort...lt-declared-including-top-fo-the-world-lounge

The important statement is this:

"By declaring these commercial phases for the DVC inventory, DVD is formally submitting them as part of the Bay Lake Tower leasehold condominium that belongs to the DVC membership. The space being occupied by Cove Bar and the Top of the World Lounge are now considered part of the common areas belonging to all Bay Lake Tower owners."

It appears that TotWL is considered a Common Element (and therefore paid for by annual dues). Therefore, as a BLT owner with Ownership Interest, you are also part owner of the TotWL.

Based on this, I don't believe it is possible to restrict access to TotWL to BLT owners, whether resale or direct. Access to DVC members who are staying elsewhere though is a different matter. TotWL was restricted to BLT residents only when it first opened, so clearly they can restrict access to non-BLTers.

Important to note that they were originally excluded and not included in the common areas then Disney decided that they wanted BLT owners to pay for the maintenance and up keep while keeping the profit from the bar and lounge sales. In addition to changing the responsibility they leased the space to themselves all without the BLT owners having to agree to the changes.

Point is, Disney can change the DVC rules, change the perks, change pretty much everything as they see fit to benefit Disney without any approval from the DVC owners.

Bill

 

[Disney Dad ADL]

Important to note that they were originally excluded and not included in the common areas then Disney decided that they wanted BLT owners to pay for the maintenance and up keep while keeping the profit from the bar and lounge sales. In addition to changing the responsibility they leased the space to themselves all without the BLT owners having to agree to the changes.

Point is, Disney can change the DVC rules, change the perks, change pretty much everything as they see fit to benefit Disney without any approval from the DVC owners.

Bill

Certainly they can add Common Elements per Florida Statute 718.110:
"(6)The common elements designated by the declaration may be enlarged by an amendment to the declaration."

But is it legal to take away a Common Element? Once you own something, I would imagine it's much more difficult to take it away because it becomes part of your Ownership Interest. If you own the pool, I don't think they can just randomly decide to take it away from you once they've given it to you. I couldn't find anything mentioning that specifically for that so far except:

Florida Statute 718.107
(1) The undivided share in the common elements which is appurtenant to a unit shall not be separated from it and shall pass with the title to the unit, whether or not separately described.
(2) The share in the common elements appurtenant to a unit cannot be conveyed or encumbered except together with the unit.
(3) The shares in the common elements appurtenant to units are undivided, and no action for partition of the common elements shall lie.

It seems to prevent common elements to be taken away?

 

[disneynutz]

Certainly they can add Common Elements per Florida Statute 718.110:
"(6)The common elements designated by the declaration may be enlarged by an amendment to the declaration."

But is it legal to take away a Common Element? Once you own something, I would imagine it's much more difficult to take it away because it becomes part of your Ownership Interest. If you own the pool, I don't think they can just randomly decide to take it away from you once they've given it to you. I couldn't find anything mentioning that specifically for that so far except:

Florida Statute 718.107
(1) The undivided share in the common elements which is appurtenant to a unit shall not be separated from it and shall pass with the title to the unit, whether or not separately described.
(2) The share in the common elements appurtenant to a unit cannot be conveyed or encumbered except together with the unit.
(3) The shares in the common elements appurtenant to units are undivided, and no action for partition of the common elements shall lie.

It seems to prevent common elements to be taken away?

Don't know but Disney has people who know the laws and legal ways to get around things if they want to. They added the $95 booking fee for trades, changed the banking rules, and the modified the required points to stay in some of the units.

Bill