Sick time

[DisneyHardin]

I feel like if the employee has the days available, it really isn't anyone's business to question if she is really sick or not unless she is out there posting on social media or bragging about fun things she is doing on her "sick" days.

Maybe this co-worker is a private person and doesn't want to share the reason behind her needing to take so many days off. She could be battling something and has lots of doctors appointments.

I'm a teacher and in our district we get 10 sick days per year and they do carry over. I currently have about 140 sick days. Some years I only take 1 or 2, but other years I am out a lot more. A few years ago, I ended up in the hospital with blood clots and missed 7 days and then had tons of follow up appointments. I would have been really hurt to find out that my co-workers were gossiping about me missing so much on a discussion board.

 

[CdnCarrie]

Gently and genuinely, it sounds like you need to take some time off yourself to ease the resentment. Let them pick up the slack for you, really. Don't be a martyr. You need your own R'n'R. If you don't want to take R'n'R, then that's a personal choice, but you can't expect them to also make that same personal choice.

Your coworkers are following workplace policy and not breaking any rules. It can actually be counterproductive for employees to push themselves through pain, stress and/or illness in an effort to avoid taking days off. You also aren't in their shoes and don't know exactly what's up with them or their families. Everyone's life is different. If they're following the rules, I don't think they should be negatively judged.

Thanks. I think so too. I like these people but don't like the resentment that's building.

 

[kdonnel]

My company (I'm assuming corporate wide) has been on a big push to make sure employees feel appreciated. Free lunches/ice cream truck one day/quarterly awards/personal notes from the (local) VP/etc.

At the moment in most industries the employees have the power. As soon as the pendulum sweeps back giving employers the power, employee appreciation programs will be scaled back.

 

[mrodgers]

We get personal time, vacation time, and sick and safe time.

I have used 3.75 hours of sick and safe time this year. It can be used for me, for my kids, for my husband.

If I am sick, since I work from home, I just work from home. And take long lunches to rest.

I have to ask, what is "safe time"?

I take every sick day I need to, which can vary between some or all of my allotted. I’ve never seen a gravestone that had “never took a sick day” on it. I work my butt off when I’m at work, but I’d never be proud of being the best worker slave.

I would also if it didn't pay out. Unused vacation and sick hours are paid out in January. I need it if I want to buy a home. It would just take longer just existing before getting back to a life.

2nd thing is overtime. Take a sick day and any other extra hours worked are at regular time rather than overtime so the paycheck is reduce if I take a sick day or vacation day and I work a lot of overtime so it's significant.

 

[disneychrista]

For those who feel one should take as many (sick) days as they are entitled to - does your employer not limit your sick days to actually being sick or having a medical appointment? Our policy specifically states that you can be disciplined, which could lead to termination for using sick time if you aren’t sick. I know at least two people who have been “caught” and disciplined.

2nd thing is overtime. Take a sick day and any other extra hours worked are at regular time rather than overtime so the paycheck is reduce if I take a sick day or vacation day and I work a lot of overtime so it's significant.

I assume this is due to not “working” the necessary hours to qualify for OT, correct? It is not some backwards disciplinary type thing where they are saying “oh he took a sick now he doesn’t get paid time and a half this week.”

 

[monarchsfan16]

I work in education. I have a significant amount of sick time available to me, having been with my district more than 10 years, with a lot of rollover sick time. Prior to Covid, I averaged 3-4 sick days a year. I pushed through a lot, but sometimes you just can't, and being in special ed exposes me to everything.

This year I used more sick days than I ever have...and it was still "only" about 7 or 8. I had covid thankfully after quarantine requirements were shortened, I had some significant migraine issues, and there was a mental health day because we had multiple family crises happening at that point, and education was a pretty horrifying place to be this last school year, and that combination didn't work very well. We are not allowed to work remotely, even those of us whose jobs could be done remotely for the short term so my covid days all had to be sick time, despite being required to not be physically at work. I also had to use all of my bereavement time, plus some personal time, because if something was going to happen, apparently this was the school year for it to happen. Despite that, because I don't have kids, I missed fewer days than most of my colleagues this year.

Unfortunately, until we aren't required to quarantine for every sniffle, I don't see attendance improving among school staff.

 

[mrodgers]

I assume this is due to not “working” the necessary hours to qualify for OT, correct? It is not some backwards disciplinary type thing where they are saying “oh he took a sick now he doesn’t get paid time and a half this week.”

Yes. Not disciplinary. Just that vacation and sick time doesn't count towards the hours worked for 40. I would still get paid regular time, just not as much as if I didn't take the benefit. Holiday time does count to your 40.

I and my boss has fought a few times they wanted to put me on salary non-exempt. The few folks on salary non-exempt lose time by working over. Work an extra 5 hours on a week you had a holiday or took a vacation day, essentially they are getting 3 hours for the holiday rather than the full 8 everyone else does.

I should have kept the first part of your post about limiting sick time. Ours was changed to "flex time" because it's not just for you being sick. You can't get a doctor's excuse for yourself when your child is home from school or you wake up to the well pump blasting hundreds of gallons of water into your basement.

 

[sam_gordon]

I and my boss has fought a few times they wanted to put me on salary non-exempt. The few folks on salary non-exempt lose time by working over. Work an extra 5 hours on a week you had a holiday or took a vacation day, essentially they are getting 3 hours for the holiday rather than the full 8 everyone else does.

As I understand it, there are certain requirements that need to be met before someone can be "salary", usually focused around supervisory roles.

And yes, while salary means you "lose money" by working more than 40 hours, it usually can mean you can also leave early/show up late (say for a doctor or other appointment) and not have to worry about keeping that time.

When I've been moved to salary, I've used my record of OT to negotiate a higher pay scale. When my job changed later back to hourly, I kept the same pay scale.

 

[leeniewdw]

As I understand it, there are certain requirements that need to be met before someone can be "salary", usually focused around supervisory roles.

I've been salary since 1988 and being in a supervisory role was never a requirement. I was in that role for a few years, but I've been an IT individual contributor for the VAST VAST majority of my career. Anyone who has employed me has come out WAY ahead on my hours worked over a standard 40 hours a week. Yes, I can leave for appointments (but I usually make them as early as possible, had one on monday that was 7am).

I'm happy to be salary because it puts me in a higher bonus class for our YE bonuses, but I NEVER worked less than 40 hours and almost always more....for 30+ years.

 

[sam_gordon]

I've been salary since 1988 and being in a supervisory role was never a requirement. I was in that role for a few years, but I've been an IT individual contributor for the VAST VAST majority of my career. Anyone who has employed me has come out WAY ahead on my hours worked over a standard 40 hours a week. Yes, I can leave for appointments (but I usually make them as early as possible, had one on monday that was 7am).

I'm happy to be salary because it puts me in a higher bonus class for our YE bonuses, but I NEVER worked less than 40 hours and almost always more....for 30+ years.

As I said, it's USUALLY because of being in a supervisory role. But there are other elements.
https://www.flsa.com/coverage.html#:~:text=With few exceptions, to be,the U.S. Department of Labor).

There are three typical categories of exempt job duties, called "executive," "professional," and "administrative."
Job duties are exempt executive job duties if the employee

1. regularly supervises two or more other employees, and also
2. has management as the primary duty of the position, and also,
3. has some genuine input into the job status of other employees (such as hiring, firing, promotions, or assignments).

The job duties of the traditional "learned professions" are exempt. These include lawyers, doctors, dentists, teachers, architects, clergy. Also included are registered nurses (but not LPNs), accountants (but not bookkeepers), engineers (who have engineering degrees or the equivalent and perform work of the sort usually performed by licensed professional engineers), actuaries, scientists (but not technicians), pharmacists, and other employees who perform work requiring "advanced knowledge" similar to that historically associated with the traditional learned professions.

The most elusive and imprecise of the definitions of exempt job duties is for exempt "administrative" job duties.

The Regulatory definition provides that exempt administrative job duties are

(a) office or nonmanual work, which is
(b) directly related to management or general business operations of the employer or the employer's customers, and
(c) a primary component of which involves the exercise of independent judgment and discretion about
(d) matters of significance.

 

[disneychick0412]

If we call in sick, we have to use PTO, we're not allowed to use our Sick hours unless we contract COVID or are down with something serious. I just checked, I have 355 hours of SICK time available to me that I can never use unless it's serious.

This sounds like my company. We used to have separate accounts for sick, vacation, and holidays, but they combined it all into PTO. At that point our sick bank became the "extended illness bank" and we couldn't use it unless it was something serious. I had 380 hrs when they switched over. Last month I got covid and thought it would have to be paid out of PTO but it was paid out of the extended illness bank which I was really happy about.

I'll just say, I'm jealous of those of you who have the option to work from home! I am a receptionist who registers patients, does prior auths with insurances and so on so working from home is not an option.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Just that vacation and sick time doesn't count towards the hours worked for 40. I would still get paid regular time, just not as much as if I didn't take the benefit. Holiday time does count to your 40.

When I worked at the insurance company as hourly it was physical hours worked. Holidays meant no overtime that week either because you weren't physically working more than 40 hours. So any week you took time off meant no overtime. One time an epic snowstorm came and shut the metro down and they wanted people to make up their hours on the weekend and no you didn't get overtime that week either because again you had to be physically working the 40 hours.

They did increase flex time but there were still a lot of stipulations to it. Flex time was only really good for a short appointment that you knew wasn't going to take hours and hours or if you needed just a wee bit of time but not a huge amount.

 

[Minnesota!]

I have to ask, what is "safe time"?

For businesses within St Paul. I think it is an amazing benefit!

On January 1, 2018 all Saint Paul employers with employees working in Saint Paul must provide Earned Sick and Safe Time (ESST) to their employees.

ESST can be used for an employee's absence from work due to illness, medical appointments, or critical safety issues, including domestic violence, sexual assault or stalking. All employees working in the City of Saint Paul, for employers located in the City of Saint Paul, are eligible for the benefit, including full time, part-time and temporary workers.

 

[disneychick0412]

For those who feel one should take as many (sick) days as they are entitled to - does your employer not limit your sick days to actually being sick or having a medical appointment? Our policy specifically states that you can be disciplined, which could lead to termination for using sick time if you aren’t sick. I know at least two people who have been “caught” and disciplined.



I assume this is due to not “working” the necessary hours to qualify for OT, correct? It is not some backwards disciplinary type thing where they are saying “oh he took a sick now he doesn’t get paid time and a half this week.”

That's what I was wondering as well. Our "sick days" are when we call in sick for the day, and you get an occurrence for calling in. A certain number of occurrences, you get written up. Eventually you would be terminated. Not sure how many it would take for that. If you call in sick and miss 3 days, that's just 1 occurrence. If you call in sick, come back for a day and then call in again, it would be 2 occurrences. Having a pre-planned medical appointment is not considered sick time, its just a PTO day off.

 

[mrodgers]

As I understand it, there are certain requirements that need to be met before someone can be "salary", usually focused around supervisory roles.

And yes, while salary means you "lose money" by working more than 40 hours, it usually can mean you can also leave early/show up late (say for a doctor or other appointment) and not have to worry about keeping that time.

When I've been moved to salary, I've used my record of OT to negotiate a higher pay scale. When my job changed later back to hourly, I kept the same pay scale.

No, not regular salary, non-exempt. I am the last one in my position to stay hourly because I'm the one who doesn't travel. They have wanted to put me on it several times. Boss said no for the 2 of us (2 of us in department, 4 in this tech position) but then that guy got promoted as kind of the coordinator so he did go non-exempt.

Non-exempt you make overtime just like hourly except on Labor Day week, I get paid for all hours worked plus holiday, 40 regular and 2 overtime, if I stay over on Wednesday 2 hours for some reason while if my coworker the coordinator sticks around with me, he still only gets paid 40. We both worked the same amount of hours.

 

[mrodgers]

When I worked at the insurance company as hourly it was physical hours worked. Holidays meant no overtime that week either because you weren't physically working more than 40 hours. So any week you took time off meant no overtime. One time an epic snowstorm came and shut the metro down and they wanted people to make up their hours on the weekend and no you didn't get overtime that week either because again you had to be physically working the 40 hours.

They did increase flex time but there were still a lot of stipulations to it. Flex time was only really good for a short appointment that you knew wasn't going to take hours and hours or if you needed just a wee bit of time but not a huge amount.

Ours count towards the 40 because we are manufacturing. Christmas and 4th of July use to be the only holidays we shut down. There was a discrepancy that I would have to think about how it worked out but, where since we worked 12 hours and rotations fell in the middle of the week, one crew would make bank because the holiday would be at the end of their week while another crew would get penalized because it was the beginning of their week. Company decided, a good thing, to count all holiday pay towards the 40 hour for overtime.

 

[mrodgers]

For businesses within St Paul. I think it is an amazing benefit!

On January 1, 2018 all Saint Paul employers with employees working in Saint Paul must provide Earned Sick and Safe Time (ESST) to their employees.

ESST can be used for an employee's absence from work due to illness, medical appointments, or critical safety issues, including domestic violence, sexual assault or stalking. All employees working in the City of Saint Paul, for employers located in the City of Saint Paul, are eligible for the benefit, including full time, part-time and temporary workers.

I'd never heard of that. That sounds sad that companies have to provide that, as in it's sad there's a need for them to provide such a benefit. I can't imagine it would be used much. Saint Paul sounds like somewhere I definitely do not ever want to have to live.

 

[ronandannette]

That's what I was wondering as well. Our "sick days" are when we call in sick for the day, and you get an occurrence for calling in. A certain number of occurrences, you get written up. Eventually you would be terminated. Not sure how many it would take for that. If you call in sick and miss 3 days, that's just 1 occurrence. If you call in sick, come back for a day and then call in again, it would be 2 occurrences. Having a pre-planned medical appointment is not considered sick time, its just a PTO day off.

So essentially you have no paid sick days? Or you do but using them is against company policy? That all sounds crazy - how does somebody pre-plan being genuinely sick?

 

[disneychrista]

I'd never heard of that. That sounds sad that companies have to provide that, as in it's sad there's a need for them to provide such a benefit. I can't imagine it would be used much. Saint Paul sounds like somewhere I definitely do not ever want to have to live.

I don't understand your statement. Why would you never want to live in a place that requires Sick leave if you happen to be become of victim of a violent crime?

Are you thinking it is offered because St. Paul has a higher than average violent crime rate? My employer has this as part of their sick leave policy. I am guessing crime rate is not a factor.

 

[tvguy]

As I understand it, there are certain requirements that need to be met before someone can be "salary", usually focused around supervisory roles.

And yes, while salary means you "lose money" by working more than 40 hours, it usually can mean you can also leave early/show up late (say for a doctor or other appointment) and not have to worry about keeping that time.

When I've been moved to salary, I've used my record of OT to negotiate a higher pay scale. When my job changed later back to hourly, I kept the same pay scale.

I was salaried for 16 years. The company got sold and many salaried jobs became hourly. In California, there is a minimum pay you have to get to be classified as salaried. The new owners discovered that many of the salaried workers did not make the minimum to be classified as salaried. Current California law requires a salaried employee to be earning at least twice the current minimum hourly wage of $15 an hour ($62,400 a year). To the best of my knowledge, nobody in my job classification met that test.
I was making a lot more hourly, because they had to pay me double time for holidays, 1.5 overtime pay, and if I didn't get my meal break within 3 to 5 hours of the start of my shift, they had to pay me a one hour penalty plus 1.5 overtime for everything less than 3 hours, and more than 5 hours from the start of my shift. There were many times I ended up working without a meal break so that ended up being 1 hour straight time plus 3 hours time and a half as the penalty for the missed meal.