Shady sales tactics for direct contracts?

[smileyanna]

After reading the "Purchasing DVC" forum over the past few days, I'm curious/concerned about uninformed or shady sales guides at DVC direct. There are active threads right now about guides that seem to have given erroneous information about the current MB incentives (to the buyer's disadvantage) and/or said that only certain use years are available and/or gave questionable guidance on splitting contracts.

Is this typical? Or maybe a result of overwhelmed sales guides dealing with great incentives and more active resorts? I'm currently closing on a resale contract, but keeping on eye on Poly2 for the future and want to know what I could be dealing with. I know many of you had great experiences with your guides, hope these are just outlier stories.

 

[Sandisw]

The suggesting of a particular UY is normal and they have always had one that seemed to be the particular one being offered.

But, if a new buyer asks for and requests the huge get approval for a different one, I have never heard of someone not getting what they want.

We had the same situation when we first bought and our guide got us the approval needed

The other piece, regsrding MB, May have simply been an uninformed guide. But, who knows for sure. It doesn’t benefit a guide to be that wrong

I have bought many direct and to be honest, I think most things are done well.

Last year, they let me buy 300 points split between two different memberships and gave me the incentives for the 300 point level. So, I do think that they try their best to make sure all info is clear.

 

[smileyanna]

I have bought many direct and to be honest, I think most things are done well

Good to have you confirm this, that was my impression/assumption. It also helps to be an informed buyer. After reading these posts, I know that direct guides can't really negotiate on price per point, but may need to be nudged to remember all the contract options, incentives and rebates available.

 

[Sandisw]

Good to have you confirm this, that was my impression/assumption. It also helps to be an informed buyer. After reading these posts, I know that direct guides can't really negotiate on price per point, but may need to be nudged to remember all the contract options, incentives and rebates available.

To be fair, most new buyers are not well versed in UY and that is probably why the standard practice is to offer just a specific one.

But, for those who do have the knowledge, they should..and always have..been allowed to get what meets their needs best.

 

[CarolynFH]

Sometimes I wonder how many experienced Guides didn’t come back after covid as well as whether the Guides are overwhelmed by the volume of activity it seems these current incentives have generated.

 

[NVDISFamily]

I feel very lucky to have accidentally got in with a very experienced guide with many years of experience when I did a cold call to DVC to ask some questions about direct points before purchasing resale. He’s done me some solid favors and even helped me make inquiries when my resale contracts were stuck in ROFR. He treats my kids like royalty when we visit WDW and he puts up with my creative requests to change my deals and stuff. His experience also allows him to have the confidence to say “likely yes” and go get the approval needed to structure deals and such. From what I can gather there has been some changes and many of the guides are really new.

As someone with a fair amount of experience with sales I can say that my radar doesn’t go too crazy with DVC guides and I would give them high marks for doing this in what is a typically grimy and cutthroat area of real estate. With that said, buyer beware. It does help a lot to go into the deals with lots of knowledge, ask for what you want and to hold your ground.

 

[RuntheMouse]

We bought resale contracts to begin with so we didn’t have a guide. In April we went and toured Riviera and met a guide who then became our guide. He has been fantastic. He followed our lead with what we were interested (a small direct for now, Poly 2 later) and never pushed us. He was well versed in the current promotions.

 

[PBandJFamwich]

Our guide has been very knowledgeable but also will be honest and let us know when he needs to confirm with other guides. We we very knowledgeable first time buyers and requested an August or September use year. He was able to get an exception made to get us a UY that worked for us and even was able to last minute get us August specifically which was our preferred of the two.

 

[zavandor]

I have read over the years reports about some guides making mistakes or pushing new buyers toward what's best for DVC and not for the purchaser.
However, overall DVC is still ligh years better than other systems. I have booked a Westgate resort through the II getaways and researching it a bit I found out the resort is lovely but the sales people are awful. Like, tales of hours of high pressure pitch, lies (they make you sign a document that acknowledge that everything they say during the pitch may be false so you cannot sue; yes, really) and even physical and mental harm. I have read of a diabetic person who had to sign a contract in order to leave the presentation because they were having a crisis. DVC is paradise in comparison, but it's still better to do your research here first. There are many people more knowledgeable than guides, here.

 

[Cfabar1]

Yeah, Disney is nowhere near Westgate…. Which is known to be one of the worst systems. I would not stay at one of their hotels. I do find the movie about the Westgate family interesting. It’s called “The Queen of Versailles”.

Disney is highly professional, but at the end of the day it is a buyer-seller transaction in my experience. I am not under any delusions that my guide “Cares” about me. He’s in it to make a good deal and move on to the next client. Which is fine.

 

[smileyanna]

DVC clearly isn’t approaching the sales tactics of other timeshares, and that’s good. I still think that being uninformed about incentives or rebates (amazingly always to the buyers detriment!), or having to “ask a supervisor” about getting a use year that is universally granted IF the buyer holds their ground is kind of gross.

Commissions create incentives, and it is what it is. Question is, has there been a change or some turnover in the training/bonus structure/salespeople that is making this worse? Or (more likely) I’m paying more attention to the bad stories as I consider a future direct purchase.

 

[Her Dotness]

Sometimes I wonder how many experienced Guides didn’t come back after covid as well as whether the Guides are overwhelmed by the volume of activity it seems these current incentives have generated.

This could be a substantial reason for what may seem to be deceptive or deceitful sales tactics. There likely are a good many new guides not yet well-versed in The Disney Way.

When we were at WDW in fall '21, we stopped by the historic Tomorrowland ticket booth that's now a DVC kiosk. The CM there advised us that our guide was among those laid off who didn't return. He also said that many of the most experienced and dedicated guides retired or were forced into other work to keep roof/food status.

Not startling news by any means but a situation likely to produce erratic service for a few years as some new guides remain while others go elsewhere.

 

[accm]

We already had a resale contract when we purchased our direct contract. There were no questions/approvals required to match our UY. Since we were buying a sold out resort, our guide had to check if they had the points available, but that was it. We had a great experience with our guide. We decided to add more points after having signed the contract, and he had no issues with modifying the contract to add the points on. A month or so later, when they had a promo at BLT (the home resort for our first contract), he called us to ask if we wanted to switch our points to BLT.
If I like the look of price/point charts for Poly2, I'll be giving him a call again, as our previous experience with him was great.

 

[PalmettoPath]

We have had four direct purchases since 2012 and, like anywhere else in life, there are good sales people and poor ones. We have had great smooth experiences with a knowledgeable guide and an utter mess that required the execs to step in and clean up the mess from a guide who really mucked up the contract. We have had four deals and four different guides. They don't seem to stay around long as each time our guide is gone within a few months and we are assigned a new one. So no way to get any relationship, it's purely transactional. All in all, however, the experiences have been good three of the four times.

 

[Sandisw]

Yeah, Disney is nowhere near Westgate…. Which is known to be one of the worst systems. I would not stay at one of their hotels. I do find the movie about the Westgate family interesting. It’s called “The Queen of Versailles”.

Disney is highly professional, but at the end of the day it is a buyer-seller transaction in my experience. I am not under any delusions that my guide “Cares” about me. He’s in it to make a good deal and move on to the next client. Which is fine.

I believe that the reason for supervisor approval is for accounting reasons. When points are declared, they do attach a UY to them in the different units.

In order to sell you points, they need to have enough in one unit to create a deed of your size.

While DVD has given themselves the power to adjust UYs, it’s not something the guide would have the ability to do.

So, when they are suggesting a certain one, it is very possible it is because they know that UY has plenty of points to fulfill all requests at that time.

The other UYs may have them too but as things sell, those options could decrease. They also match the UY of a current owner and may make certain UY held back for thst.

Now, the MB program may be playing a roll in attempting to get a new buyer a fall UY.

But, I would not worry too much about a guide needing the approval as there can be a lot of behind the scenes shuffling that might need to happen to make it work.

That’s why I said they have always made it happen but that doesn’t mean the next level of supervisor didn’t need to do something as well.

 

[Brian Noble]

It is useful to remember that DVC is a timeshare--nothing more, nothing less. And for most people, timeshare is a product that is sold, not bought. DISers are often the exception to that, but that's not surprising.

 

[Stargazer65]

Are they allowed to sell you a different use year direct, if you are already a member?

 

[Sandisw]

Are they allowed to sell you a different use year direct, if you are already a member?

Yes, but it requires you to buy the new member minimum since it’s a new membership and it also requires supervisors approval to make sure you understand what it means to be different membership and all that goes with it.

That’s why I said, the whole supervisors approval for certain things is not a big deal. I relate it to our local supermarket who ID everyone buying adult beverages just to keep it consistent.

 

[Stargazer65]

Yes, but it requires you to buy the new member minimum and it also requires supervisors approval to make sure you understand it is a different membership and all that goes with it.

Do you get existing member incentives, or are you treated as a new member?

 

[Sandisw]

Do you get existing member incentives, or are you treated as a new member?

You qualify the the member incentives, but since it’s new membership and not an add on, it requires the membership minimum.

When I bought last year in a new June UY, I had to buy the 150 and it had to be one contract..could not be split because it was a new membership for me.

The 150 I added on to my Dec UY could have been split into smaller contracts because they were add ons

I was even given the 300 point incentive price for the points, even though they went into two different memberships!