Security & had a thought.....

[des1954]

Okay - by now I think we all realize that there have been some changes made to the entrances to the Fort. Most of us have come to the conclusion these changes are NOT for the better, as there is nothing to stop non-campers from driving through the Fort either to sight-see or to do some tom-foolery.

Let me run a thought I had past my fellow Fiends to see what you think. TCD - because you are the Google Earth expert, you might want to work your magic on my idea.

I was thinking that Disney could relocate the guard shack altogether to a spot just before the horse trail crossing near the Outpost GC parking area, or back a little further to just before Peacock Pass. That way, they could really control the auto traffic allowed into the Fort - limiting it to Fort guests. There is absolutely no reason for anyone else to drive their vehicle into the Fort, as most of us agree on. Day visitors would be forced to hop an internal bus to get to Trail's End or the HDDR.

I believe there is enough vacant land that the Outpost Bus stop could be re-designed to have the internal buses pull in on one side of the Outpost and all other destinations pull in on the main parking lot side. GC parking would need to be moved, but I think there's enough land to accommodate that, too.

Even though I do go to the Fort about once a week during the cooler weather just to ride my bike, I am also a frequent camper and am not real keen on the changes they have made. There is nothing to stop non-campers from driving their cars into the Fort - whether their intentions are just to look around or for more nefarious reasons. They could make the entrance on the east side of the parking lot a "bus only" entrance, and make the current guard shack more of an information outpost to direct people where to go to check in or where to park to get to the restaurants. The real "guests only" stop point would be the guard station I'm proposing.

I know this would cost Disney some $$$ to do, but, they charge enough for the sites that they should protect their guests a little better.

Any thoughts?

 

[DisCamper]

Back in the old days there was no one in the guard shack that you have to go throw now. Anyone could just go to the parking lot and the KTTW card reader was at the end of the fence were they park the rental carts. That all change after 911. Disney manned the guard shack and moved the KTTW card reader to where it is now. So want I’m saying before just because you got into the parking lot you could not get into the Fort to drive around without your KTTW card. All Disney has to do it go back to that system worked great for years

 

[BradyBz12]

I was thinking that Disney could relocate the guard shack altogether to a spot just before the horse trail crossing near the Outpost GC parking area, or back a little further to just before Peacock Pass. That way, they could really control the auto traffic allowed into the Fort - limiting it to Fort guests. There is absolutely no reason for anyone else to drive their vehicle into the Fort, as most of us agree on. Day visitors would be forced to hop an internal bus to get to Trail's End or the HDDR.

Sounds like a great idea to me!

Unfortunately I agree with whomever said that Disney isn't going to REALLY do anything to keep non-campers from driving in until something really bad happens.

 

[rock_doctor]

Yea, you can't get into the actual campgrounds with your vehicle. You always have to allow access into the parking lot for non-wilderness guests as you have people going to the Hoop Dee Doo. If there has been issues then Disney needs to patrol the loops more often. I was not aware there was more then small thefts going on and that quite frankly should not happen. Campers/RV'rs generally are a special breed who help each other and don't steal from each other. So i don't know how to handle that problem. It just may be a sign of the times and when things improve it will end.

 

[des1954]

Back in the old days there was no one in the guard shack that you have to go throw now. Anyone could just go to the parking lot and the KTTW card reader was at the end of the fence were they park the rental carts. That all change after 911. Disney manned the guard shack and moved the KTTW card reader to where it is now. So want I’m saying before just because you got into the parking lot you could not get into the Fort to drive around without your KTTW card. All Disney has to do it go back to that system worked great for years

You need to remember that they had a guard shack on Vista Blvd before the east entrance to the parking lot back then, too. The west entrance was covered by the Auto Plaza to the MK. We took a camping hiatus from 1987 until 1996, but did frequent the cabins during that time. I honestly don't remember a time that there wasn't someone in the guard shack - if for nothing else than to direct people to either the check-in lanes or to the parking area. But - my memory can be selective at times.

 

[DisCamper]

The guard shack on Vista Blvd was a JOKE. I always came that way and was never stopped. Disney mite have manned the guard shack in the morring but i never saw it.

 

[des1954]

It was a bit of a joke, wasn't it?

Now, I seem to remember in my resort staying days of the early 90's, there being a big hub-bub regarding people posing as resort maintenance people and knocking on doors saying they were there to "fix" something. The real intention was to either rob or otherwise hurt people. I don't know if this actually happened at any Disney resort, but it happened enough across the country that ABC's 20/20 did a news segment on it.

I'm not a pack-rat so I have nothing to prove my next statement. However, in 1992 when we stayed at Port Orleans (now French Quarters) our welcome packet included a letter saying that Disney will never send a maintenance person to your room unless you call to request one, and that you should never open your door to someone claiming to be Disney Maintenance unless you first called. The letter encouraged you to call the front desk and report this situation immediately if someone knocked at your door claiming to be maintenance and you did not initiate the call.

 

[2goofycampers]

Is this a FW specific problem {free loading} or do all WDW Resorts have this problem ?

 

[Nature Mom]

Sounds like a great idea to me!

Unfortunately I agree with whomever said that Disney isn't going to REALLY do anything to keep non-campers from driving in until something really bad happens.

Bad? Worse than theft? That hasn't happened has it?! Wow, this scares me! I have never been concerned about safety when camping other places, because as someone else said, people who camp/rv are more likely to help one another than harm, but after reading a few theft reports and other things here, I am actually more worried about camping at FW than I ever was in a state park (even though most of my fave state parks were also Gary Michael Hilton's fave too ). I know to lock up the valuables in my car, etc., etc., but what about the other stuff that isn't considered valuable (stove, chairs, etc) and most importantly are we SAFE? Can just anyone get into the campground? At any time of the day or night? I am so confused. Please help a newbie.

 

[Disney John]

As far as the new procedures, which were in place while we were there in August:

During our 3 week stay, we saw dozens of people parking their cars in the overflow lot, carrying coolers, tables, lawn chairs, Pizzas, and towels to the meadows area and beach area. Then they spent the whole day and left. No money spent, no visiting anyone. They even brought in Pizzas from outside the fort and ate them at the meadows picnic tables. There was a huge birthday party at the Meadow shelter one day. The person throwing the party was staying at the fort but the 30 "guests" weren't. They monopolized the pool and slide. they were rowdy and rude. Little kids running everywhere, and their parents not paying any attention to them. One 2 or 3 year old had to be pulled from the water by a stranger because he went down the slide and couldn't swim, and Mom had no idea where he was. Not one of them were Disney resort guests.

To make a long story short, the new "security" procedures don't work.

 

[DisCamper]

For people out there don’t be scared to camp at Fort Wilderness. I spent almost a whole year there most of last year and some of this. We had 8 bikes, 18 chairs, 2 stoves, 2 very nice grills, my golf cart (I left my key in the whole time), cart charger, fire pit, at times 6 coolers and etc. The whole time there I only that one thing stolen. One holiday weekend someone had stolen my beer cooler. I found it the next day by the lake behind the 300 loop with no beer in it. Oh I would come out of the RV sometimes and my cart was gone but that was just friend using it to pick people up or run to the trading post. Because they knew I kept my keys in it all the time. They always left a note on the table.

 

[Nature Mom]

For people out there don’t be scared to camp at Fort Wilderness. I spent almost a whole year there most of last year and some of this. We had 8 bikes, 18 chairs, 2 stoves, 2 very nice grills, my golf cart (I left my key in the whole time), cart charger, fire pit, at times 6 coolers and etc. The whole time there I only that one thing stolen. One holiday weekend someone had stolen my beer cooler. I found it the next day by the lake behind the 300 loop with no beer in it. Oh I would come of RV sometimes and my cart was gone but that was just friend using it to pick people up or run to the trading post. Because they knew I kept my keys in it all the time. They always left a note on the table.

Oh, thanks so much! I admit I had started to panic a bit. What about tent sites, are those just as safe?

 

[Cindy F]

......That way, they could really control the auto traffic allowed into the Fort - limiting it to Fort guests. There is absolutely no reason for anyone else to drive their vehicle into the Fort, as most of us agree on. Day visitors would be forced to hop an internal bus to get to Trail's End or the HDDR.

I thought this was the rule anyway but apparently it isn't.

When we met our friends from the UK this past summer, we told them they had to park out front and we would come get them with a golf cart. We explained that only Fort Wilderness guest cars were allowed and even then it was just to get in and out of the campground. We also told them that only one car was allowed to be parked at the site.

We did it that way for several days until one day they just drove up to our site, parked, and told us that the CM at the front said it wasn't necessary and they could just "drive on through and park at the site enough to where they weren't blocking traffic"

 

[DisCamper]

We had friends come up and stay at the Fort for 3 day in the 2000 loop they have enough stuff on their site for 2 weeks plus HDTVs, bluray disk players and computers in their tents. They never locked up anything even when we went to the parks and never had anything stolen or touched.

 

[2goofycampers]

Oh, thanks so much! I admit I had started to panic a bit. What about tent sites, are those just as safe?

Lock up or use a safety box your valuables and you should be fine.

 

[Nature Mom]

Lock up or use a safety box your valuables and you should be fine.

Of course! That is a given! Thanks so much, these boards are so helpful!!!

 

[MandMLUVMMandDVC]

Is this a FW specific problem {free loading} or do all WDW Resorts have this problem ?

It is NOT a problem at Old Key West, Saratoga Springs, or Carribbean Beach. It IS a problem at the Boardwalk/Beach Club Villas. At the Boardwalk it's always packed with people for the restaurants & 2 clubs, never an issue with the pools. At Beach Club it's the pool that gets abused. The worst part about the Boardwalk is all the people parking in the self parking areas, and then they go to Epcot. You have no idea how much this pizzzes me off!!! My last stay there was NO self parking available, even the overflow area. Our choices were to have my son park my car at DTD & ride a bus back, and then hopefully after Epcot closes get someone to do the reverse & park at the resort, or pay $12 to do valet parking. Basically I was strong-armed into the valet parking. I resent that.

I don't personally know about the other resorts.

 

[des1954]

But.....what about my original question about building a guard station beyond the parking area?

 

[MandMLUVMMandDVC]

But.....what about my original question about building a guard station beyond the parking area?

Yes Deb, I agree that it would be a good idea. They would need a little turn around spot for those that venture out where they shouldn't. Another thing that someone brought up (I think Carol) what about wristbands??? I've stayed at a couple of different places where each guest received a wristband to wear for their entire stay. signs were up that only guests could use the pool (something lacking at FW!!) and employees would peruse the pool looking for those bands. If you didn't have it, get out. What is wrong with that? Maybe exceptions could be made for current guests of other resorts (with kttw cards) and DVCers with member id (waiting for the heat on that one....go ahead!)

 

[Memph1s]

I really like the idea of keeping all but actual paying guest from driving in the campground. It is a difficult problem to balance the needs of legitimate visitors and guest and keep out those that want to trespass or beat the parking fees, or are up to no good. They need to add a full time security person in the lot that would follow up on the people parking without permits or trying to sneak in behind a legitimate vehicle and find out what they are really doing. A lot of the problems would go away after people find out they can't just show up and sneak in. Disney is trying to solve the problem without people and I don't think they can.