Security & had a thought.....

[Elliott]

I can think of 2 ways to fix this problem.

1. Pass out the candy that Lars gives out.
2. Ask to see their KTTW cards before handing out candy.

I am unfamiliar with Lars candy, assuming it is a laxative of some sort, but your 2nd idea is very do-able. Those fiends going at Halloween could print up a few hundred flyers explaining the problem of non-guests taking advantage of campers awesome generosity during "Trick-or-Treating" and ask that all those hunting candy carry KTTW cards and those handing out candy only do so to those with KTTW cards. It wouldn't take too long for a few people on golf carts to circulate these through the fort, taping them on TT's, RV's and picnic tables. I am sure management wouldn't be too happy about this, but screw 'em. If they can't protect the trust of the paying guests then we can do it ourselves.

 

[Magicbus]

Ask to see their KTTW cards before handing out candy.

Oh no, I won't be staying at the Fort on Halloween, no Snickers for me? Besides, how would I ever get into the Fort with such tight security. I know, I'll tell security I know TnBob.

 

[Disney John]

I like many of the ideas floated around here. And I am glad that I am not the only one that feels that the fort lacks in security.

All of the extra gates and wristbands are great BUT....... until you have someone working there that has a backbone and is not afraid to approach the offenders and ask them to leave, you will still have all of the issues. What we really need IMHO is a "real cop". An Orange county deputy acting as a "park ranger". That way, if someone sees a group of people going to the overflow lot after the pool slide closes, they can approach them and advise them that they need to be resort guests to use the pool. Something that a Disney Security guard would never do.

Real Police can also take down plate numbers and give them to the gate and tell the gate security guard not to let the vehicle in, in the future. You wouldn't need that cop there very long before the word gets out.

I can tell you that the Orange county deputies that took my report, had some good ideas, (like cameras in the parking lots etc...) and they also weren't blinded by the Disney "magic". They see where improvements can be made. They are the professionals that are paid to prevent crimes and enforce laws. Bring them into the fort (at least for a while) and see if that helps.

 

[Disneylitch]

The most upsetting thing to me is when Security is staying in a loop while they are working and do not follow the rules they are paid to enforce. What's so hard about driving the correct direction in the loop, only 2 cars allowed per site, etc. Security could be great if they would just enforce the rules. I don't see what the big deal is with doing your job. If you see underage drivers driving golf carts, don't ignore them, do something about it. When a "guest" shows you their key card, actually read it. Don't assume that the dates are correct. If they don't want to enforce the pool hopping situation, then just allow everyone to pool hop. Maybe if this was allowed again, it wouldn't be as fascinating to visit other pools. I don't know about you, but I have no desire to ride a bus just to visit another pool. Just too much trouble for me. Hopefully, if Security did their job all of the time, then management would follow through also.

I have a question in regard to guests vising your campsite. Is there a limit or a charge for having guests visit you? I know you are allowed 10 people per campsite.

 

[2goofycampers]

, only 2 cars allowed per site

I have a question in regard to guests vising your campsite. Is there a limit or a charge for having guests visit you? I know you are allowed 10 people per campsite.

I have always been under the understanding 1 car per site .

I only know of a charge if they spend the night.

 

[Tnbob]

I'll tell security I know TnBob.

Oh that will get ya far

 

[des1954]

The most upsetting thing to me is when Security is staying in a loop while they are working and do not follow the rules they are paid to enforce. What's so hard about driving the correct direction in the loop, only 2 cars allowed per site, etc. Security could be great if they would just enforce the rules. I don't see what the big deal is with doing your job. If you see underage drivers driving golf carts, don't ignore them, do something about it. When a "guest" shows you their key card, actually read it. Don't assume that the dates are correct. If they don't want to enforce the pool hopping situation, then just allow everyone to pool hop. Maybe if this was allowed again, it wouldn't be as fascinating to visit other pools. I don't know about you, but I have no desire to ride a bus just to visit another pool. Just too much trouble for me. Hopefully, if Security did their job all of the time, then management would follow through also.

I have a question in regard to guests vising your campsite. Is there a limit or a charge for having guests visit you? I know you are allowed 10 people per campsite.

While I totally agree with you, I also know a few of the loop attendants that have worked at the Fort for many years. They have been instructed not to confront guests about questionable issues. It is up to the attendant to determine if the offense is severe enough or unsafe enough to radio security over, and let security handle it from there. The workers in the Fort, other than security, have learned to look the other way because they would get too frustrated otherwise. Management would always side with the guest in the event of a complaint.

I feel society over-all has taken a down-turn. Society has been taught that they are entitled to things rather than having to earn the right or pay for privileges. While there have always been selfish, me first/me only people, it seems to me like this is becoming the norm rather than the exception. But that's the opinion of someone who has more years behind her than ahead. (a.k.a. "old fort")

I hesitate to bring this up on the camping board but, anyone can get into any resort just to use a pool. It's not just the Fort. Saturday night we went to Riverside just to sit and people watch. All I needed to show the guard was my drivers license & told him we were going to grab a bite at the food court. There was nothing to prevent me from using the pool when we were there. The only difference with the Fort is that it's easier to blend in picnicking than at the other resorts.

Obviously Disney doesn't care, or they would have put an end to it. I think someone else suggested that we inundate the front desk with complaints and send e-mails complaining. If enough of that is done, maybe the security issue would be re-visited and rules would start being enforced. JMHO - which that and a buck would buy me a cuppa joe at Mickey D's.

 

[bigdisneydaddy]

Not once in all my trips to WDW have I EVER had to show ID to get on a bus and Like DES1954 says, never had any trouble getting into another resort. While we dont pool hop, we do like to sample the other resorts by eating at them, I suspect that Disney is more concerned in keeping that revenue than they are in making any serious inroads into security.

On several occasions I have called security, not once have they ever done anything other than speak to the person, once they walk away its game on again. It gets to be frustrating for someone like me who for the most part is a straight by the numbers person.

 

[Magicbus]

Not once in all my trips to WDW have I EVER had to show ID to get on a bus

Some people do think that they're supposed to show the bus driver a card or buy a ticket. That's ancient history. Anyone on WDW property can ride.

 

[clkelley]

There has been only 2 times that I have been asked to show resort ID when boarding transportation.

Both of those times were to board the Resort Monorail at MK closing. As always it was just a glance. I wasn't even staying at a monorail resort, but had dinner reservations at a monorail resort.

 

[Tri-circle-D]

Deb-

Sorry to be so late in delivering on my assignment.

But, here's your photo.

The area marked with the green circle is the area you are suggesting as a possible place for a new guard shack.

The area marked with the red circle is where the card reader Discamper is referring to was located. I remember this card-reader. It hasn't been all that long since it was removed. While it was still possible to enter by shadowing behind the vehicle in front of you, I believe it did have some impact on keeping people from driving in to the Fort.

For the location Deb proposed to work, there would have to be some roadwork done in order to allow the buses to get in and out.

One way to eliminate some of the bus traffic would be to have the external buses leave and arrive at the Settlement Depot. This used to be the case for the MGM (as it was called then) and Animal Kingdom buses. There is a big golf cart parking area already there, and the buses could travel back and forth to WL in less time. I never understood why they don't do this already. This alone would cut down on folks who park for free in the FW lot and use it as a hub for WDW transportation.

I agree with those who have stated that the most effective way to keep folks who don't belong from entering the campground is to have a live person stop them. But, that will cost money, and there is not way that Disney will spend money for something that brings them no return on the investment.

If anyone is interested in this GoogleEarth image from April, 2002 shows the old gate:

Also, notice that in order for buses to enter the oval area in front of the Outpost Bus Stop, they had to enter the campground, and then turn around. They did not enter directly from the parking lot, as they do now.

Here is an image from January, 2005, which shows the area adjacent to the bus stop under construction. I don't remember this at all, but you can see that there is a construction fence up and work being done:

And, here's an image from March, 2006. Here, you can see that the old oval area seen in the 2002 photo is gone. This allowed buses to enter directly from the parking lot, as they do now:

TCD

 

[des1954]

The only construction I recall in 2005 was when they repaired the Outpost bus structure that suffered some damage in the 2004 hurricanes. And I think that was the year they upgraded the golf cart parking and added a concrete sidewalk from the check-in building to the Outpost bus stop. It was previously unpaved and had mulch that was always washed away with the rain. That's about all I remember.

Thanks for your Google Earth magic! I also proposed a guard shack further back wilderness blvd just before Peacock Pass. That way, they could redesign the Outpost and have internal buses on one side and external buses on the other. I think there's enough room to do that. But, they won't. It costs money & Disney is expert at making money, not spending money.

 

[John VN]

With the closing of the kennel resulting in available land for possible construction along with the relocation of the entrance gate/card reader be an indication that this land might be used to update the flow of traffic for retuning park buses and guests?

 

[Magicbus]

be an indication that this land might be used to update the flow of traffic for retuning park buses and guests?

I don't think so. As I wrote previously, if anything major which requires permits, studys, etc, is going on, Disney is somehow keeping it a big secret. And if that's all they're doing, why keep it under wraps?
With the aux. entrance being reopened, bus flow is ok except at the actual Outpost bus stops.

 

[2goofycampers]

Our first WDW visit was in 1991, the first couple years we had to show our KTTW card to get on all transportation.

 

[AuburnJen92]

Our first WDW visit was in 1991, the first couple years we had to show our KTTW card to get on all transportation.

And it had been that way since I had remembered it too. You had to have a park pass (valid) or a resort card of some kind to use the system. OR, you could buy a transportation ticket for the day. At any junction where you got on, you were checked. (AND WE LIKED IT!)

 

[Disneylitch]

I've never been to The Fort at Halloween, but I have been reading the threads about the amount of "outsiders" trick or treating. My questions is, are they really "outsiders" or just visiters of registered quests. If you can bring an unlimited number of quests in at no charge, that would certainly add up, particularly when The Fort is crowded. Just a thought. I know in the campgrounds near me, there is a charge if you want to bring in a guest for a day. This might help to aleviated the problem. I have read that the pool was extremely crowded on Labor Day. Was that due to registered guests or their invited visiters for the day? Maybe this is a bigger part of the problem than people using the pool that aren't staying on Disney property.

On another note. We were talking to a loop attendant on our last visit when a golf cart, driven by an adult with kids, was driving the wrong way in the loop. The attendant told hime very politely that he needed to turn around and drive the correct direction. The driver just looked at him and kept going. The guests know that nothing is going to be done. This just doesn't make sense to me. If you aren't going to enforce the rules, than just get rid of them.

 

[caveat lector]

Deb-

Sorry to be so late in delivering on my assignment.

But, here's your photo.

The area marked with the green circle is the area you are suggesting as a possible place for a new guard shack.

The area marked with the red circle is where the card reader Discamper is referring to was located. I remember this card-reader. It hasn't been all that long since it was removed. While it was still possible to enter by shadowing behind the vehicle in front of you, I believe it did have some impact on keeping people from driving in to the Fort.

For the location Deb proposed to work, there would have to be some roadwork done in order to allow the buses to get in and out.

One way to eliminate some of the bus traffic would be to have the external buses leave and arrive at the Settlement Depot. This used to be the case for the MGM (as it was called then) and Animal Kingdom buses. There is a big golf cart parking area already there, and the buses could travel back and forth to WL in less time. I never understood why they don't do this already. This alone would cut down on folks who park for free in the FW lot and use it as a hub for WDW transportation.

I agree with those who have stated that the most effective way to keep folks who don't belong from entering the campground is to have a live person stop them. But, that will cost money, and there is not way that Disney will spend money for something that brings them no return on the investment.

If anyone is interested in this GoogleEarth image from April, 2002 shows the old gate:

Also, notice that in order for buses to enter the oval area in front of the Outpost Bus Stop, they had to enter the campground, and then turn around. They did not enter directly from the parking lot, as they do now.

Here is an image from January, 2005, which shows the area adjacent to the bus stop under construction. I don't remember this at all, but you can see that there is a construction fence up and work being done:

And, here's an image from March, 2006. Here, you can see that the old oval area seen in the 2002 photo is gone. This allowed buses to enter directly from the parking lot, as they do now:

TCD

Dude, this is just plain cool. Your skills are wizard like.

 

[DisCamper]

Here what you had to show to get around WDW

 

[G'day Disney]

Golf Cart charger stolen from cart parked at Outpost this week Unfortunately we were not aware of theft issues at the Fort.