Scotland Meets Thread (formerly Scotland: A Brave Adventure)

I did receive a call from Bruce at ABD and we discussed the itinerary change. I asked for permission to share his e-mail with the DISboards and he said I could. We had a very pleasant conversation and it was quite apparent he truly cares that each guest has an amazing experience and wanted to address all concerns. He plans to call/write each person who expressed disappointment over the change. Per our phone conversation, he did say that an * was indicated for a few dates that coincided with the Military Tattoo with a change to Stirling Castle for the farewell dinner. It was realized recently though, that Stirling Castle would not be a good choice logistically for a farewell dinner on day 8. We leave Inverness early that day and spend a good amount of time on coach to get to Glamis Castle and then back to Edinburgh. By the time we arrive at The Balmoral, we'd be looking at another hour and a half each way to go have dinner at Stirling Castle. Below is Bruce's e-mail.

Dear Terrie,

Greetings from sunny Burbank, California! My name is Bruce and I'm the Regional Manager for Adventures by Disney's trips in Europe, Asia, Africa and Australia. One of my other claims to fame is that since ABD's inception in 2005 I've had the privilege to be the trip developer for many of our trips worldwide, including Scotland. Scotland is near and dear to my heart , as I had spent time visiting the sights in Edinburgh and the fabled Highlands with my family when I was a teenager (I have Scottish heritage through my father's mother, the Drummonds of Perthshire!). A number of years later as a young man I had quite an adventure riding my bicycle around the country for several weeks. That trip happened to coincide with Heather Season. You might've heard this but there's no more stunningly beautiful place on the planet than Scotland on a sunny day with the landscape carpeted from one horizon to the other in blooming purple heather. That's when I truly became captivated by all things Scottish, it's history, people and culture as well as the unforgettable landscapes.

And that's why it was all the more exciting for me in early 2012 when I and a few others on the ABD team became engaged in the development of our new trip in Scotland. That process was initiated when we caught wind that Pixar's Brave was nearing completion and would have it's theatrical release in late June, 2012. We had one of those "Wow" moments  a Pixar film themed around the life of a young woman in ancient Scotland. How cool was that? And how amazing would it be to build a trip around that concept? Well, one of the many thrills for me in bringing our trip to life was flying up to Emeryville in the Bay Area, to Pixar's headquarters, and interviewing the amazing Mark Andrews, Brave's director with his room-busting outsize personality, to get his take on all the best places to visit in Scotland, and how we could build an itinerary that would fulfill the dual goals of assuring our guests would see the classic sights of Scotland and deliver a magical experience that connected our trip in significant ways to the stories, images, fun and drama of Brave. Oh  we also had to deliver ABD's fabled quality of experience from start to finish, that was critical too. Never before in ABD'S history did we have an opportunity to design an itinerary around the story lines in a movie, in fact a movie which in itself was a work of true creative genius. So this was one very fun, challenging and extraordinary experience for us. And such will it be for the fortunate guests who join us for the adventure.

In any event, because of my involvement with our Scotland trip, and also because of my role as Regional Manager, your email was forwarded to me, and, well, I will confess, it broke my heart a little bit. Mostly because I understood how upset you were, and that I was the reason behind that (I'll explain why in a minute), but also because the essential feeling expressed was one of complete disappointment with ABD, rather than expressing, well, maybe intrigue or curiosity over the choice of venue we had made for our farewell banquet. Obviously, your heartfelt concerns have grabbed my attention, and I am absolutely committed to addressing them as best as I can.

Probably the most important thing I need to mention - and this is the reason why I'm the one responsible for your being upset  is that I wrote the letter you recently received that discussed the change of venue for the farewell event. I clearly see now  in reaction to your concerns, and the same concerns now coming to us from other guests as well  that the letter wasn't clear or specific on the vital question as to why we abandoned Stirling Castle  the original venue we had selected to replace Edinburgh Castle during the period of the Tattoo  and why we would instead be featuring a "library" in Edinburgh. Which  fair enough  at first glance doesn't sound like the least bit of an even swap. So that lack of clarity, that lack of my telling a complete and compelling story, was decidedly a critical "miss" on my part. I apologize for that.

With that said, I want to reassure you that our commitment to our guests' experiences on our adventures is without question a world class commitment. It's one that I believe we deliver almost without fail in destinations across the globe. First of all, we are part of the Walt Disney Company, with its brand promise of heritage, traditions, safety, fun, family values and Magical Moments. At ABD we have an inherent commitment to delivering on everything TWDC stands for, and we are very clear what that is. But even beyond that, we are Adventures by Disney, which has since our very beginning, when we only operated two trips, in Hawaii and Wyoming, garnered the highest accolades from our tens of thousands of guests, many of whom have enjoyed a host of other Disney experiences against which they compare our "product" - and consistently find us to be the Best, and their Favorite Disney experience of all. I trust you will believe me when I say that ABD's unwavering goal is to always exceed our guests already high expectations. This is not an idle boast, it's not an easy plateau to reach, and I'm not saying we do this 100% without fail, but I will say we are pretty doggone good at it.

All of which is to say that we would not ever consciously take away something wonderful  for example, a gala dinner in a real castle in Scotland - and offer a pathetic substitute that is woefully inadequate compared to the original promise of an extraordinary experience. This commitment to "always exceeding our guests expectations" also applies to the case of the Military Tattoo, the Castles and the Signet Library.

I would be delighted to have an opportunity to discuss all this with you further if you would care to do so. I would love to share the story behind our choice of the Signet, and describe for you why the Signet is in fact a wonderful, an amazing, a perfectly suitable choice for our farewell banquet. Let me put it this way: there are "libraries" and then there is  The Signet Library. This is without question a Disney-suitable, ABD-sanctioned, first class venue, and one that's fully worthy of the promise of ABD's Scotland trip in all regards.

Please let me know a good time to reach you.

Thanks Terrie, and I'm looking forward to discussing ABD's Scotland: a Brave Adventure with you!

PS  Before we chat, please imagine having dinner in this rather exclusive, magical setting. There is somebody quite famous who had a posh luncheon there with 80 or so of her closest friends and family not so long agao. Her name is Elizabeth II, Queen of England. She hosts this luncheon in the Signet Library every year, as she spends the first two weeks of June in Edinburgh every season - staying at her home there, Holyroodhouse Palace, which we will be taking you to see along with other sights in Edinburgh. Among many other interesting things, we'll be sharing the engaging story of the Order of the Thistle, and what that means for Scottish history, and for the noble and royal families of Scotland. And the role played in this by the Signet Library as the venue for the Royal Gathering of the Order of the Thistle. We (ABD) have engaged the same chef and catering service for our event. I assure you this is quite exclusive and, well  maybe even on a par with dining in a castle (our dining venue in Edinburgh Castle, while sumptuous, is not nearly so posh as this, although it is, admittedly, in a castle).


signet_zps9bd9eea4.jpg


And here is Elizabeth, all Pomp & Circumstance, exiting the Signet Library on her way into St. Giles Cathedral (13th century Gothic masterpiece, which stands next to the Signet Library, which is connected to Scotland's original Parliament building, so it's all terribly dripping with Scottish history in the most prime spot on Edinburgh's fabled Royal Mile:) to attend a ceremony commemorating the ancient Order of the Thistle, in the company of her husband Prince Phillip, her grandson Prince William and sister Princess Anne. You too will be walking in this very spot. I love the plumed hats! And note the astroturf style Red Carpet, well done!


Queen_zpseb11c99e.jpg
Queencarpet_zps622dbc88.jpg


A final observation: we will be taking you to see Edinburgh Castle on a privately guided tour, in the afternoon of Day 2 of the ABD trip, following our activity at Dovecot Studios.

Cheers, -Bruce

I, for one, am very impressed with Bruce's email: both the thoughtfulness and his clear passion for ABD and the traveler experience.
 
Sure! Why not :thumbsup2 Without the travel hacking blogs and forums we would have never had enough miles either. But, then again that was part of the strategic plan to get DH to agree to this trip when we hadn't budgeted for it. We'll probably be in "steerage" for our flight to the DCL Alaska cruise in 2014.

I'm relatively new to the DisBoards and just stumbled across the email thread. Would it be possible for you to send me those websites / links as well? We are planning on doing the DCL Westbound Transatlantic cruise next September and since it is a one way airfare, miles seems to be the only way to get there without it costing a TON.

Thanks very much! Cristi
 
I, for one, am very impressed with Bruce's email: both the thoughtfulness and his clear passion for ABD and the traveler experience.

I was too! He was no less passionate or concerned over the phone. He really felt bad about not making it clear in the letter we all received, that the private tour of Edinburgh Castle would still take place and the back whole story of why The Signet Library was chosen over Stirling Castle. I was upset over the thought of not having the Edinburgh Castle tour on the itinerary. However, the Stirling Castle replacement I found acceptable. By the time I heard about the change to the Signet Library I was beyond upset and simply fuming. My initial letter to ABD was not what one would label as "polite concern" :furious: His courteous and eloquent response toned me down a few notches right off the bat :lmao: Once we spoke and he explained everything I was perfectly ok. I thanked him very much for the time he took to write such a nice e-mail and follow up with a phone call. To me, that goes a long way.

I'm relatively new to the DisBoards and just stumbled across the email thread. Would it be possible for you to send me those websites / links as well? We are planning on doing the DCL Westbound Transatlantic cruise next September and since it is a one way airfare, miles seems to be the only way to get there without it costing a TON.

Thanks very much! Cristi

PM sent to you!
 
I, for one, am very impressed with Bruce's email: both the thoughtfulness and his clear passion for ABD and the traveler experience.

I'm very impressed too. But I must be chopped liver, because I can't get a response from ABD unless I write to compliment them on something. I've taken 4 ABDs and have the 5th booked and I am totally ignored. Makes me sorry that I booked the 2014 trip. It will probably be my last.
 

I'm very impressed too. But I must be chopped liver, because I can't get a response from ABD unless I write to compliment them on something. I've taken 4 ABDs and have the 5th booked and I am totally ignored. Makes me sorry that I booked the 2014 trip. It will probably be my last.

Sorry to hear that :( To be fair, I know I am not the only one who expressed disappointment. They have received calls and e-mails from others about the same issue so that may be a factor. I initially called and spoke with someone who did not really address the issue other than to confirm there was a change and did not really seem to care much about my concerns. When I asked if I could be referred to someone else to express my concerns I was told that they would pass on the message. Naturally, I found that unacceptable and sent out an e-mail to ABD, messaged their FB page and then e-mailed the Senior VP. Regardless, I agree that someone at ABD should have responded to you at least in the name of courtesy.
 
I just received pretty much the exact same reply, which isn't quite as personalized when copied in full, LOL. I am going to take him up on his offer to talk to him though. He doesn't address why we weren't made aware of it from the outset, nor does the explanation for the choice of the library address my fundamental complaint that they are not on par experiences. As lovely as a building as it might be, Signet is *not* a castle. I for one would much rather have a quick stop at the hotel and go to Stirling rather than a few hours at the hotel to go to Signet. I'm also confused because I thought some of the affected dates were doing Stirling.
 
I just received pretty much the exact same reply, which isn't quite as personalized when copied in full, LOL. I am going to take him up on his offer to talk to him though. He doesn't address why we weren't made aware of it from the outset, nor does the explanation for the choice of the library address my fundamental complaint that they are not on par experiences. As lovely as a building as it might be, Signet is *not* a castle. I for one would much rather have a quick stop at the hotel and go to Stirling rather than a few hours at the hotel to go to Signet. I'm also confused because I thought some of the affected dates were doing Stirling.

Please let us know what he says. He told me that the * was there or supposed to be there from the outset with the Stirling Castle swap for Edinburgh Castle for certain dates in late July and most of August. I told him I never saw the * for Stirling until well after we had booked and we booked the first week it was announced.

With regards to the Stirling swap and subsequent Signet Library swap: The Scotland Brave Adventure trip was put together based on the movie which was new for the ABD team and also with much less time than they normally take to put together a new adventure. The Pixar Brave team was consulted for their feedback as they had already been to Scotland in order to scout out scenes for the movie. In addition to consulting the Pixar team for the itinerary ABD also consulted with the Historic Scotland agency. They were the ones who suggested Stirling Castle as an alternative to Edinburgh Castle during the Military Tattoo dates. Once ABD realized that Stirling Castle would incur much more driving logistically and possibly make tour guests not too happy with all time spent in a coach they went back to the Historic Scotland agency for advice. It was the Historic Scotland Agency that suggested The Signet Library as beautiful venue that is of historical and cultural significance.

Personally, I am in agreement with you. I don't mind an extra 3 or so hours in a coach to have dinner in a castle given the choice. Maybe you can ask Bruce if we are allowed to have a vote. Between my family, your family and Calfan's family that is 10 of us voting for Stirling Castle :thumbsup2
 
I'm going to stick my nose in and say that you guys could also suggest one of the private castles as an alternative to the Signet Library. Dundas Castle, for example, is just along the road in South Queensferry and is lovely: http://www.dundascastle.co.uk/ There are a number of privately owned castles close to Edinburgh that hire out for private events. They aren't as grand as Edinburgh or Stirling, but if it's a castle that you're after rather than a library (however distinguished), there are other options. I know it's too late for this year, but maybe they'd look into it for next summer.
 
I'm very impressed too. But I must be chopped liver, because I can't get a response from ABD unless I write to compliment them on something. I've taken 4 ABDs and have the 5th booked and I am totally ignored. Makes me sorry that I booked the 2014 trip. It will probably be my last.
This makes me tremendously sad. Who did you send your letters to?

Sayhello
 
This makes me tremendously sad. Who did you send your letters to?

Sayhello

A couple just through Contact Us and one to the Senior VP. Latest was with regards to the photo CD and the possibility of getting access to all of the missing photos, since there were so many activities and even complete days where there were none on the CD. Maybe they can't do it, but they could at least reply and say so. Honestly, I thought I would get a call back just from my survey responses. I'm okay going to Europe with ABD (at least one more time), but I wouldn't take another trip to a less developed country with ABD again. They left me in a situation where I feared for my life and the life of my child and apparently they think that's okay.
 
I'm very impressed too. But I must be chopped liver, because I can't get a response from ABD unless I write to compliment them on something. I've taken 4 ABDs and have the 5th booked and I am totally ignored. Makes me sorry that I booked the 2014 trip. It will probably be my last.

I feel your pain, Bobo. It's a love-hate relationship for us.
 
Please let us know what he says. He told me that the * was there or supposed to be there from the outset with the Stirling Castle swap for Edinburgh Castle for certain dates in late July and most of August. I told him I never saw the * for Stirling until well after we had booked and we booked the first week it was announced.

With regards to the Stirling swap and subsequent Signet Library swap: The Scotland Brave Adventure trip was put together based on the movie which was new for the ABD team and also with much less time than they normally take to put together a new adventure. The Pixar Brave team was consulted for their feedback as they had already been to Scotland in order to scout out scenes for the movie. In addition to consulting the Pixar team for the itinerary ABD also consulted with the Historic Scotland agency. They were the ones who suggested Stirling Castle as an alternative to Edinburgh Castle during the Military Tattoo dates. Once ABD realized that Stirling Castle would incur much more driving logistically and possibly make tour guests not too happy with all time spent in a coach they went back to the Historic Scotland agency for advice. It was the Historic Scotland Agency that suggested The Signet Library as beautiful venue that is of historical and cultural significance.

Personally, I am in agreement with you. I don't mind an extra 3 or so hours in a coach to have dinner in a castle given the choice. Maybe you can ask Bruce if we are allowed to have a vote. Between my family, your family and Calfan's family that is 10 of us voting for Stirling Castle :thumbsup2

I will definitely keep you guys posted, and thanks for the extra info. I will bring up the vote, LOL--it's actually more than 10, my sister is brining two of her kids so that makes 13 :)

I'm going to stick my nose in and say that you guys could also suggest one of the private castles as an alternative to the Signet Library. Dundas Castle, for example, is just along the road in South Queensferry and is lovely: http://www.dundascastle.co.uk/ There are a number of privately owned castles close to Edinburgh that hire out for private events. They aren't as grand as Edinburgh or Stirling, but if it's a castle that you're after rather than a library (however distinguished), there are other options. I know it's too late for this year, but maybe they'd look into it for next summer.

Stick away, LOL! Yes, exactly. There are so many other interesting places they might have chosen. I will definitely mention it. Thank you!

This makes me tremendously sad.

Me, too. That is not good--especially when you are paying such a premium for service.
 
A couple just through Contact Us and one to the Senior VP. Latest was with regards to the photo CD and the possibility of getting access to all of the missing photos, since there were so many activities and even complete days where there were none on the CD. Maybe they can't do it, but they could at least reply and say so. Honestly, I thought I would get a call back just from my survey responses. I'm okay going to Europe with ABD (at least one more time), but I wouldn't take another trip to a less developed country with ABD again. They left me in a situation where I feared for my life and the life of my child and apparently they think that's okay.

I think it is unacceptable that a mother and child were left stranded at the airport in Peru and there wasn't a personal apology made to you when you returned home. It is so unlike what we expect from ABD. I feel terrible about your experience. :(

"SingingMom" ....Sent from my iPad using DISBoards
 
I'm going to stick my nose in and say that you guys could also suggest one of the private castles as an alternative to the Signet Library. Dundas Castle, for example, is just along the road in South Queensferry and is lovely: http://www.dundascastle.co.uk/ There are a number of privately owned castles close to Edinburgh that hire out for private events. They aren't as grand as Edinburgh or Stirling, but if it's a castle that you're after rather than a library (however distinguished), there are other options. I know it's too late for this year, but maybe they'd look into it for next summer.

Great suggestion! I wouldn't mind that at all. It is a lovely castle!!!! Personally, I have a lot of faith in the power of "Disney magic" when Disney decides to try and make something happen. If they are willing, I am sure a castle somewhere could be found even at this date.

A couple just through Contact Us and one to the Senior VP. Latest was with regards to the photo CD and the possibility of getting access to all of the missing photos, since there were so many activities and even complete days where there were none on the CD. Maybe they can't do it, but they could at least reply and say so. Honestly, I thought I would get a call back just from my survey responses. I'm okay going to Europe with ABD (at least one more time), but I wouldn't take another trip to a less developed country with ABD again. They left me in a situation where I feared for my life and the life of my child and apparently they think that's okay.

I am stunned that would they even allowed something like that to happen. To not apologize for it though and make personal contact is simply inexcusable.

I will definitely keep you guys posted, and thanks for the extra info. I will bring up the vote, LOL--it's actually more than 10, my sister is brining two of her kids so that makes 13 :)

Oh 13! Even better! You are welcome and I do hope you are able to convince them that we should get a vote :thumbsup2


Oh, that is SO much better than a librabry! I don't care how far it is!

I think it is unacceptable that a mother and child were left stranded at the airport in Peru and there wasn't a personal apology made to you when you returned home. It is so unlike what we expect from ABD. I feel terrible about your experience. :(

I totally agree!
 
That looks fantastic. Did ABD give you any indication of whether you would have similar entertainment in the new venue? I had to look up what samphire is, but what the heck does "tea, coffee and tablet" mean?

He did not mention that to me when we spoke so I don't know.

I was wondering the same thing! On our Military Tattoo package is states that we will have Drinks and canapé reception in the courtyard of the Queen Anne room Three course set dinner with wine followed by coffee and tablet I have no idea what a "tablet" means :confused3 To me, a tablet is something used to write on or something like an iPad :rotfl2: Since neither of those are edible I've been calling it "coffee and surprise."
 
He did not mention that to me when we spoke so I don't know.

I was wondering the same thing! On our Military Tattoo package is states that we will have Drinks and canapé reception in the courtyard of the Queen Anne room Three course set dinner with wine followed by coffee and tablet I have no idea what a "tablet" means :confused3 To me, a tablet is something used to write on or something like an iPad :rotfl2: Since neither of those are edible I've been calling it "coffee and surprise."

Google never fails me. I searched for "tea, coffee, and table" and after sifting through some images of people drinking coffee while using an iPad I came across a photo of something that looks like peanut butter fudge and this description:

Tablet is very, very sweet and you can only eat a wee bit at a time. It comes in a variety of flavours, but the most common is vanilla. It is loaded with calories, but still worth a wee taste! You can usually buy this at local shops and it'll probably be sold at any Highland Games you might attend.
 
Google never fails me. I searched for "tea, coffee, and table" and after sifting through some images of people drinking coffee while using an iPad I came across a photo of something that looks like peanut butter fudge and this description:

Tablet is very, very sweet and you can only eat a wee bit at a time. It comes in a variety of flavours, but the most common is vanilla. It is loaded with calories, but still worth a wee taste! You can usually buy this at local shops and it'll probably be sold at any Highland Games you might attend.

Normally, I consider Google as a BFF for the unknown! However, since I'm an adventurous eater, I wasn't really bothered by not knowing what it was. I'm willing to try Haggis and I know what THAT is :eek: Thanks for sharing, it sounds tasty!
 
Just wanted to give you guys an update on the itinerary change saga. I had a chance to speak with Bruce yesterday from ABD--*really* nice guy BTW--and he gave me a little more insight into how the recent change from Stirling to the library had come about (pretty much what Calypso had reported back). The bottom line is that with the long day and the extra driving time to Stirling (that ABD hadn't fully appreciated until recently), he felt that a dinner at Stirling would make an already long day too long. Although some of us wouldn't mind, he had to make the decision with all travelers in mind. In other words, we don't get to vote, LOL. I appreciated that although he was adamant that the library was wonderful and a gorgeous venue in its own right, he didn't try to debate the fact that it's "the same" as the castles. The focus really was more on the fact that the drive to Stirling made it impractical. I disagreed and told him I would make sure to report back at the end of the trip and let him know whether I changed my mind. I'm always happy to offer my opinion :)

Bottom line: the decision has been made for now and until the library trips later this summer return with feedback, it's not going to change. Am I happy about it? No--I really wanted the after hours castle dining experience. But I definitely feel better after talking to him and learning the reasons for the decision. The conversation did much to alleviate the other concern I had about the timing of the change as well. The decision to move away from Stirling was recently made, and it doesn't feel like they were consciously trying to hide the ball. I still wish I'd been better informed of the tattoo/Edinburgh Castle issue at the onset, but I guess that's one of the risks with signing up on the first day for a new itinerary.

BTW, they do read these boards so are voices are definitely being heard.
 














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