Schools will be open through the evening.

[disykat]

Originally posted by debster812

Sorry you think being a parent who has to work outside the home is outrageous, it is my life, and I feel lucky that DS is in as good a program as he is.

All done here.

Debbie

I think you missed Dawn's point. I think she is trying to say that paying for a child's afterschool care SHOULD be a parent's responsibility - not the governments (taxpayers).

The only child care programs I have seen in schools have been privately funded not government - the parents pay. I think it should stay that way and fail to understand why Kerry wants to throw a ton of government money into it.

 

[Pinnie]

The district that I live and teach in has been doing this for years!

We have pre-school classes which is run by the Community Education Department and the parents PAY for the 8.5 month program.

We also have SACC (School Age Child Care) both before and after school until 6:00 p.m. again which the parents contract and PAY for. The instructors, for the most part, are recent university grads with degrees in education, who can't find a teaching job yet. They work for a few $$ an hour with no benefits.

SACC is not a new concept. I had my DSs in SACC years ago (they are now 24 and 22). The district runs the program and it is self supporting, meaning that the fees the parents pay support the program.

pinnie

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by DawnCt1
I heard Kerry's campaign speech last night. I am sorry to hear that the government won't get their hands on your child until he is five years old.

No, we leave that to day care workers. But, in reality, the government does have "their hands" on your children. Try disciplining them outside the government guidelines.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by DawnCt1
Anything that relieves taxpayers of their hard earned money is always a good thing. More entitlements, expansion of programs, etc. Afterall, the government knows best how to spend our money. One of my complaints with the Bush administration happens to be expansion and addition of entitlements, so I am not being inconsistant.

Yep, the war is a prime example of the government spending our hard earned money and funding a war is CERTAINLY FAR MORE IMPORTANT than seeing to our children. Right?

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by GAIL HAYDEN
Yep, the war is a prime example of the government spending our hard earned money and funding a war is CERTAINLY FAR MORE IMPORTANT than seeing to our children. Right?

Red Herring.

 

[faithinkarma]

Originally posted by tonyswife
Red Herring.

You mean the whole thread is not? Yeah, right.

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
You mean the whole thread is not? Yeah, right.

Well, starting a thread to question whether or not government funding of after school care is apprpriate is not. Bringing up an unrelated topic in the middle of the discussion is.

Description of Red Herring
A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue. The basic idea is to "win" an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic. This sort of "reasoning" has the following form:


Topic A is under discussion.
Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A (when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A).
Topic A is abandoned.
This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because merely changing the topic of discussion hardly counts as an argument against a claim.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/red-herring.html

 

[faithinkarma]

Originally posted by caitycaity
ummmmm......

*coughs loudly*

you know the current administration does something really similar to this currently right? it' spart of nclb and it's called the the 21st century community learning centers program. and actually, it was around before bush too, he just decided to reauthorize it under nclb. kerry's proposal is just a proposed expansion of this program.

i don't really see how this is a bad thing, and apparently neither does the current administration since they already fund the damn thing.

Starting a thread complaining about Kerry being for something that Bush is already for is a red herring.......some of us can see that, sorry it eludes you.

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
Starting a thread complaining about Kerry being for something that Bush is already for is a red herring.......some of us can see that, sorry it eludes you.

No, it's not. Pointing out that Bush supports the same program is a legitimate point of discussion in this debate, but the entire debate is not a red herring.

 

[shortbun]

Kerry happened to be commenting on a very successful program
in Columbus, Ohio. It's called "City Kids", I think and it helps
families who find themselves in a difficult place feed and keep
their children safe if they have to work late. Again, it's very successful here and something many cities with large inter-urban
areas could put into place.
Oh, wait-you would have these kids alone at home eating nothing
and in the dark waiting for a parent who is working hard to earn
enough money to house, cloth and feed them to come home.
This is how kids fall through the cracks and get lost or runaway.
Your sarcasm is amazingly shallow-something another poster called me today so I guess it's ok.

 

[faithinkarma]

Originally posted by tonyswife
No, it's not. Pointing out that Bush supports the same program is a legitimate point of discussion in this debate, but the entire debate is not a red herring.

As I said, sorry it eludes you.

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
As I said, sorry it eludes you.

it doesn't elude me, it's not there.

 

[faithinkarma]

ROFL...if it eludes you , how would you know?????

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
ROFL...if it eludes you , how would you know?????

Explain exatly how the entire thread is a red herring then, since I am apparently so dumb.

 

[DawnCt1]

Originally posted by gymnasticsmom68
Aren't the parents, who have their kids staying after school, working while the kids are there, and wouldn't that make them taxpayers?

And wouldn't the parents with no children staying after school be tax payers also. And they should have to pay for your children staying after school?

 

[DawnCt1]

Originally posted by debster812
Yep I do. From 3pm to 6pm. As I work in a town that is 40 minutes away from the town we live in. Would you like to volunteer to come to MA every day and watch DS until DH or I can get home?

Sorry you think being a parent who has to work outside the home is outrageous, it is my life, and I feel lucky that DS is in as good a program as he is.

All done here.

Debbie

What I think is outrageous is that the taxpayer would be expected to pay for your children, when it is clearly a parental responsibility.

 

[DawnCt1]

Originally posted by GAIL HAYDEN
Yep, the war is a prime example of the government spending our hard earned money and funding a war is CERTAINLY FAR MORE IMPORTANT than seeing to our children. Right?

Defending this country against the Islamo Fascists that want to see America destroyed and all of our children dead is far more important than anything. Education would then be a moot point.

 

[DawnCt1]

Originally posted by disykat
I think you missed Dawn's point. I think she is trying to say that paying for a child's afterschool care SHOULD be a parent's responsibility - not the governments (taxpayers).

The only child care programs I have seen in schools have been privately funded not government - the parents pay. I think it should stay that way and fail to understand why Kerry wants to throw a ton of government money into it.

You are exactly correct. I have no problem with the schools remaining open but they should be supported financially by those who benefit from their services.

 

[ThreeCircles]

Originally posted by DawnCt1
If school breakfast, school all day, after school activities, etc aren't enough, Sen. John Kerry will support having schools open through the evening for working parents. I say that isn't fair. What about the parents who work nights and weekends. I think that schools should be open 24/7 and start when the child reaches his first birthday. We don't have a farming culture anymore, so kids to remain in school all summer with two weeks allowed during the parents' vacation from work. I hope that they plan an evening meal too.

 

[ThreeCircles]

Here's the real proposal with all of DawnCt's misleading, propaganda removed...


During a roundtable discussion at a Columbus child care facility Wednesday, Democratic Presidential candidate John Kerry discussed his plan to help working families make ends meet by offering a tax credit for child care and expanding afterschool programs.


As parents work longer hours, families need high-quality child care and afterschool programs more than ever before. Unfortunately, quality child care costs more than a public university, and many afterschool programs do not have enough space for kids, do not stay open late enough or do not meet transportation needs.
Today John Kerry pledged to ease this strain on families with a two-part plan.

“Our kids need a safe place to go while their parents are at work, and parents need peace of mind,” Kerry said. “They need to know that while they’re at work, their kids are safe.”

President Bush proposed cuts that would deny 500,000 children afterschool opportunities, leaving families with nowhere to turn.

“All across this country there are families who would like to enroll their kids in afterschool and child care programs, but they can’t because budgets are tight,” Kerry said. “And for this Administration in Washington, afterschool is just an after-thought. They don’t understand how important it is to working parents. Well, we do. We know how much afterschool and child care matter for working families, and that’s why I have a plan that will help families do the right thing for their kids.”

First, Kerry’s plan will increase the Childcare Tax Credit and for the first time make it available for moderate-income families and stay-at-home moms. Designed to help families pay for work-related childcare expenses, the Childcare Tax Credit has failed to keep up with the skyrocketing cost of child care. Kerry will increase the value of the tax credit by $800 for a typical middle-class family with two children in child care.

Second, Kerry will create the “School’s Open ‘Til 6” afterschool program, expanding afterschool opportunities and ensuring they meet the demands of overstretched parents. Kerry’s plan focuses on three goals: first, meeting the needs of working parents by keeping afterschool programs open late and offering transportation; second, fostering strong values through mentoring and community service; and third, improving educational quality. Kerry’s plan will serve 3.5 million children, an increase of more than 2 million children from the level today.