Sad Story from One Who Trusted without Checking!

[Olaf]

It's very possible that the name he has is phony. Especially since she didn't want to show her ID to pick up the money.

 

[DMKEDM]

Another big thank you to all who've posted their sympathy and ideas since my last thank you!

A couple of comments: first, about going to the police: the thought has crossed my mind! But I think it's too soon (even if it does lessen the chances of successful resolution). It's still very possible the renter/poster isn't intending to scam me, but rather something happened to her that prevented her from contacting me...I'm going to give it til at least Monday, and maybe longer, depending on what develops between now & then...I think accusing someone of theft/fraud/scamming is serious and while it sure feels like that is what has happened (and the odds are it is), there's still enough of a chance that there's an explanation that to bring the police in at this stage doesn't feel right...

Also, contacting Western Union doesn't seem right to me, either...they tried to verify the identity of the person picking up the money...they made us jump thru a number of hoops...I believe they acted honorably and reasonably...I guess it would be worth checking to see if they maintain a list of people who use their services who do provable scams...but they certainly did nothing even remotely wrong in this transaction...

Bottom line: it's possible (altho not probable) that the renter/poster will get in touch w/me and there will be an acceptable explanation...right now, I would just like to get my money back (and I'm SO thankful I lost only half of it and not all of it!)...and unfortunately, I don't see any real way for that to happen...for her to refund my money I'd have to give her more information about me than I'm willing to give her at this point...either that or she'd have to use Western Union to wire the money back to me. It doesn't seem real hopeful.

Anyway, again and again, thanks for the sympathy and support...I too wish we had some system whereby we could post successful renting transaction results...sort of like ebay's feedback system...but we don't and I for one don't have enough "nerve" to ask the terrific mods of this board to start up something like that! I don't blame them for not wanting (not be able) to mediate disputes...and I don't want to lose the R/T board, either...I'd rather just "take my lumps" and get past it...pausing to note how wonderful this cyber-community is...you-all really have made me feel loads better...

 

[Olaf]

The sooner, the better. If there's a video camera on the register at Western Union, it's possible that it recorded her. However, those are typically on a loop. The Disboard people might be able to help you with an IP address.

 

[Patricia721]

I feel so bad for you! I think the earlier poster's advice to contact Western Union is excellent. They may have a fraud division that can help you. I think it's certainly worth a try & might prevent this or a similar experience from happening to someone else. The "red flags" do make this look like a scam.

I hope you hear from her & this turns out OK for you. Please keep us posted!

 

[castleri]

Have you contacted the opther peole you said responded to her offer? They may have some info or at least appreciate a heads up from you if they are considering dealing with her. Do hope this all works out and that it is just some unfortunate set of circumstances that kept her from getting back to you and not really a fraudulent action.

 

[DMKEDM]

Not sure if it's within the rules to contact others who posted on her R/T offer thread...I'll check w/the mods...if it is, I'll be sure to PM them...thanks for thinking of that!

 

[jade1]

Have you contacted the opther peole you said responded to her offer? They may have some info or at least appreciate a heads up from you if they are considering dealing with her. Do hope this all works out and that it is just some unfortunate set of circumstances that kept her from getting back to you and not really a fraudulent action.

I agree, plus the past posts hold some possible valuable information-I mean there may be some past posts that may hold some valuable information.

 

[MinnieGirl33]

The sooner, the better. If there's a video camera on the register at Western Union, it's possible that it recorded her. However, those are typically on a loop. The Disboard people might be able to help you with an IP address.

I was thinking the exact same thing.

If I were you I wouldn't give her any more time to disappear. If she is legit then she should have returned your calls. If something wacky happened to her then I am sure she would understand why you filed a police report after her apparent dissappearance with your $870.

I would file a police report ASAP (for fraud), file a report w/WU & find out what your legal rights are.

Even if she used a fake name with you she might have used the same fake name with somebody else (I'm sure you are not the first scam) & you might actually end up helping the police & others by making a report.

Good luck & keep us posted.

 

[TheRustyScupper]

1) I felt sorry for the OP and her sad story.
2) Unfortunately, people get scammed every day.
3) However, I no longer feel sorry for her.
4) Her post said she wouldn't call police, Western Union, or anyone else.
5) That says she is in denial or just wanting to not pursue the problem.
6) Such in-action allows crooks to survive and even prosper.

 

[eileenkeeney]

We are not allowed to state the user id (or name) of someone, even if you are only stating absolute facts?
It has been a long time since I read the rules.

So there is someone, who had points for rent, where exactly half the value of the points is $800, who has a low post count, and the message has several replies indicating someone has pm'd them.

The risk of not stating the user id is that someone (such as myself) may look at the board, find a posting which meets this criteria (which I was able to quickly do) and I may then assume the culprit is that person.

Of course, if the person does this again, they likely will not use the same id anyway, so I guess it may be pointless to mention the user id.
The most valuable information may actually be the details which a person can use to avoid making the same mistake.

Good Luck, I hope you get the reservation you need.

 

[disney-super-mom]

I'm so sorry this happened to you - HOW AWFUL!

Now I'm extremely nervous! I am in the process of renting some points from a member of the Disboards, and although this person is a long-time member with tons of posts, and most likely a very honest individual, I don't know her at all and have yet to actually speak to her on the phone. We've only communicated by email so far.

I was already feeling nervous, but now I'm downright jittery! Actually, when I posted that I wanted to rent points, I made it clear that I wanted to rent from a Disboard vet - someone with a long history here who is an active member. It just makes me feel better to deal in a transaction with someone I've never met who has an established presence here.

Thanks for posting your story! It can make a difference. It already has for me.

BTW, what is the best way to make a payment to a person you're renting from? Anyone have any suggestions?

 

[Chuck S]

I am confused as to why the OP is reluctant to contact the police in the city where she sent the Western Union. The Western Union office should have a surveillance video of the person who claimed the money. I would be on the phone immediately.

 

[DMKEDM]

Chuck S: The reason I'm waiting on contacting the police is twofold:

1. I've lived thru unexpected things like computer crashes and phone outages and emergencies that prevented me from doing what I promised to do at the time I promised to do it. Calling in the police and claiming fraud before I've given the renter/poster at least a bit of time to get back to me to explain what happened seems wrong to me--just in case this isn't fraud, but a problem that can be explained.

2. I've gotten a PM or two from people who think this renter/poster may get back in touch with me after all...she has a "history" (albeit a little one) of difficult-but-successful transactions before. Seems to me that calling in the police at this stage would make a bad situation worse.

Now I know that the longer I wait the less of a chance there is that the police will be able to do anything about this...but I'd feel worse if I called the police with my suspicion of fraud/scam and it turned out she'd been hit by a car, or something else awful happened and that explained why she "disappeared"...

A judgement call, for sure. But not worth $800 to me to risk accusing someone falsely of something as awful as fraud/scamming...

 

[Disneyaholic]

I am confused as to why the OP is reluctant to contact the police in the city where she sent the Western Union. The Western Union office should have a surveillance video of the person who claimed the money. I would be on the phone immediately.

I'm with you, Chuck. As has already been pointed out, using Western Union instead of Paypal or some other means of payment is the first red flag. "Losing" the ID and having the money picked up before you even got off the phone are two more.

To the OP, you've trusted too many times on this to trust any more. If, by some extremely small chance, this WAS a legit transaction, the person will just have to accept your apologies. However, I truly doubt that you will ever hear from her again. I am sorry that this happened to you; I hate to say this, the sympathy is greatly reduced if you don't take measures to help yourself out of this immediately.

I also wouldn't doubt that the cell phone is a pre-paid "disposable" one, which cannot be traced. But I wouldn't wait another minute to start tracking her down, hopefully she slipped up somewhere.

 

[Shoshana]

And IF you report the loss of your $$ to the police, and they find she did not scam you, there will be no negative consequences to her -- you cannot cause her to be hurt if she is "innocent."

On the other hand, if you do not report it immediately, then you risk not only your money, but your credibility, and you implicitly allow her to continue scamming others.

As far as Western Union -- yes, you called and encouraged them to allow her to accept the money without an ID. Thus, they participated in the scam and they were conned as well. Their safety mechanisms should not be so easily violated.

I understand wanting to be a reasonable person, and not wanting to cause undue harm to another. But I think that you have already waited more than another reasonable person might think is appropriate.

 

[Chuck S]

Chuck S: The reason I'm waiting on contacting the police is twofold:

1. I've lived thru unexpected things like computer crashes and phone outages and emergencies that prevented me from doing what I promised to do at the time I promised to do it. Calling in the police and claiming fraud before I've given the renter/poster at least a bit of time to get back to me to explain what happened seems wrong to me--just in case this isn't fraud, but a problem that can be explained.

2. I've gotten a PM or two from people who think this renter/poster may get back in touch with me after all...she has a "history" (albeit a little one) of difficult-but-successful transactions before. Seems to me that calling in the police at this stage would make a bad situation worse.

Now I know that the longer I wait the less of a chance there is that the police will be able to do anything about this...but I'd feel worse if I called the police with my suspicion of fraud/scam and it turned out she'd been hit by a car, or something else awful happened and that explained why she "disappeared"...

A judgement call, for sure. But not worth $800 to me to risk accusing someone falsely of something as awful as fraud/scamming...

But IF there is a reasonable explaination, the police could surmise that. No charges have to be filed at the moment, but it sure wouldn't hurt for them to start an investigation. If she had been "hit by a car" or had some otherreasonable explaination, then it is unlikely the police would recommend pressing charges.

 

[Patty3]

You are really a very nice considerate person who, from your posts, only wants to see the good in every one. I wish there were more people like you in the world. I really feel bad that this has happened to you. I also wish that you could out this person so others do not fall victim to them, if this turns out badly for you. I myself, are not as kind as you. I would definitely be fuming mad at the sheer thought of being duped by someone who knows how we all trust each other probably more than we should. I would contact the police and Western Union today. Best of luck to you and I hope you get your money back. If you don't just remember, what goes around, comes around.

 

[DMKEDM]

Oh, dear...I guess I posted too much identifying (or not enough) info after all...I'm so sorry...

I cannot say who the renter/poster is...the Disboards mods made it clear I could not...but I can and will be glad to respond to PMs asking about any particular poster...

I will feel absolutely awful if I've unintentially "tarred" another potential renter with this post...

And to the people who think I should call the police or Western Union without waiting...I'm sorry you don't understand my thinking--or perhaps you do, but you simply disagree. I did call Western Union to find out if they keep any kind of records or have any kind of office for situations such as this...I'm waiting for a call back ...

I appreciate the sympathy from those who sympathize, and recognize the right of those who do not sympathize to say so. And I so very much do not want to cast a shadow on any other poster...I hope I haven't inadvertently done that.

 

[brandip22]

As a manager at a bank, I see ID theft and fraud way too much. This sounds like total fraud to me. The no ID to pick up $800? I don't care what code word you tell me, not gonna happen. That also just verifies that this is probably a scam as the phone is stolen or a "friends'" and makes a good reason why she couldn't use her ID. Also, were the other posters who PMd you on her difficulties "older" members or new posters as well? Maybe they are someone who has another screen name and created a new one to scam folks. I guess I'm a bit jaded when it comes to theft and money.

I hate to say it, but I, too, will not feel sorry for someone who refuses to help themselves. I hate it happened, but the OP's post count is pretty low, too and it seems a bit odd to trust so much when only being on the boards since July. Now, to do nothing? I don't get it, but I guess that's just me.

As far as wanting to just "make sure"- if that is the case, why even bring it up here yet? And if she agreed to one thing and is not holding up her end of the bargain or agreement, it's fraud- even if her phone died- she can get to a library to email or PM you. Or, heaven-forbid she got into a wreck- would the other posters have had trouble with her before, too? I can't believe one person has that many issues.

 

[JimMIA]

1) I felt sorry for the OP and her sad story.
2) Unfortunately, people get scammed every day.
3) However, I no longer feel sorry for her.
4) Her post said she wouldn't call police, Western Union, or anyone else.
5) That says she is in denial or just wanting to not pursue the problem.
6) Such in-action allows crooks to survive and even prosper.

I think we'd all do well to take a deep breath and not jump to too many rash conclusions here.

First of all, just because the OP does not post every thought she has or every step she takes here, that does not mean she is not following up calmly, logically, and through appropriate channels. She is.

Second -- all that has happened here so far is that OP is having difficulty with a rather tricky transaction. It should surprise no one that transferring for a reservation 13 months from now is more complicated than a regular rental. It is entirely possible that the person renting the points has encountered some glitch in making that happen. In a perfect world, she'd get right on the phone to OP and explain the difficulty, but that hasn't happened.

Third -- no crime has occurred. In order for this to be fraud or theft, OP would have to be able to prove that the person renting the points never intended to transfer the points in the first place. At this juncture, she can't prove that -- and has rightfully decided to wait rather than make an erroneous allegation.

Fourth -- Western Union has nothing to do with this. They transmitted the money to exactly the person they were supposed to, and they have neither the responsibility nor ability to investigate what happened after they completed their transaction. Of course they will assist any law enforcement investigation, but they would be on thin legal ice getting involved on their own.

Fifth -- there is no mystery about who the person renting the points is. OP knows who she is, and it will be no big challenge to find her if that becomes necessary.

Finally, I think this is a difficult and stressful transaction...but not a rip-off. I think the real problem here is the person renting the points is really not very knowlegeable about their DVC account and they are not very well organized/businesslike. That may cause a lot of heartache (and heartburn), but that's the way some people live their lives.

I think OP is doing exactly what she should be doing at this point in time. She is venting, and working to resolve the issue. Nothing is going to be done on the weekend anyway, so we'll see what next week brings. I hope, and expect, that it will work out fine for everyone involved.