ROFR and Discrimination - Prove it DOESN'T exist

[ILoveMyDVC]

I have some time on my hands today; I'm in a bad mood (very sick little puppy) and anxiety over a sudden life change to buy $$$$ in resale that is nothing short of a pipe dream due to the mystery of ROFR. So please bear with me.
How do we know there is no discrimination with ROFR because Disney says so. Show me a Judge in a court of law...
Maybe the CM is on the boards and doesn't like soneone's politics or a nasy comment or maybe Disey wants a certain racial or ethnic balance? Maybe taking a tour to buy points puts your name in a database that triggers a refusal so you'll be pushed to buy direct. Maybe it is age related. Perhaps they favor one resaler over another. All I know is that there is something gravely wrong with a blind hidden uneven process that causes so much strife. Let it be open and honest. Tell people the rules of the game. It is a game afterall.

 

[RoseGold]

Actually, I'd argue the math is pretty clear and it's pretty public. Just pay more if you want to avoid it.

Sure, a few outliers here and there. I'm more interested in the theories about buying particular building or units or whatever to combine points.

 

[JETSDAD]

It's just business. They're not going after anyone. Most of the time is just about money but there may be some things behind the scenes, such as unit numbers, that could explain some outliers.

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

Actually, I'd argue the math is pretty clear and it's pretty public. Just pay more if you want to avoid it.

Sure, a few outliers here and there. I'm more interested in the theories about buying particular building or units or whatever to combine points.

It should be public and it should take 30 days not 31,

 

[RoseGold]

It should be public and it should take 30 days not 31,

It is public. There's sites with box charts by month for it from the tax records.

 

[Louis morrell]

It is public. There's sites with box charts by month for it from the tax records.

Do you have any links? I'd like to take a look at those out of curiosity.

 

[Bing Showei]

Let it be open and honest. Tell people the rules of the game. It is a game afterall.

You’re taking this too personally.

The “rules of the game” have been the same since 1991. When the owner you’re trying to buy from signed the contract, they agreed that if they eventually sell, Disney reserves the right to step in as the buyer.

As the buyer Disney doesn’t care who you are or what color you are. You’re just a cheap sack of cash that is replaceable with Mickey bucks.

Maybe the CM is on the boards and doesn't like soneone's politics or a nasy comment or maybe Disey wants a certain racial or ethnic balance?

And since we’re advocating open and honest…

What the **** does this even mean? And how would that even work? I’m all for tin foil hats, but this just sounds like an idea that came off the bus from crazy town.

 

[Starport Seven-Five]

How do we know there is no discrimination with ROFR because Disney says so. Show me a Judge in a court of law...

The burden of proof is on the party making the accusation.

 

[CookieandOatmeal]

When buying resale, we all knew that it's never a sure thing that it will go through in the end. That we all have a chance of Disney taking it back. The uncertainty and wait is what we agree to when we are looking for "bargain prices" instead of paying direct prices. I think you need to take a break from constantly checking your email for status updates, checking the ROFR thread because this whole process seems to be really stressing you out.

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

You’re taking this too personally.

The “rules of the game” have been the same since 1991. When the owner you’re trying to buy from signed the contract, they agreed that if they eventually sell, Disney reserves the right to step in as the buyer.

As the buyer Disney doesn’t care who you are or what color you are. You’re just a cheap sack of cash that is replaceable with Mickey bucks.

And since we’re advocating open and honest…

What the **** does this even mean? And how would that even work? I’m all for tin foil hats, but this just sounds like an idea that came off the bus from crazy town.

The rules actually say Disney must have 30 days notice to exercise its right of refusal. Not 35, 40 or, as we are seeing here, 50+ days of tying up someone's money, time and plans.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The rules actually say Disney must have 30 days notice to exercise it's right of refusal. Not 35, 40 or, as we are seeing here, 50+ days of tying up someone's money, time and plans.

In essence what the rule states is that they must be given at least 30 days prior to closing to review ROFR. That differs from only having 30 days to review it. If closing is further out they technically could take until whatever that closing date is however that isn't what they have historically done and they've generally responded in 30 days or less. If they go over they are not in breach of the contract though. In the past a few buyers convinced brokers to make the closing date right at 30 days but that was rare and really not something I'd recommend. Where they fall down more now vs how they handled it in the past is the actual transfer and contract set up/point loading. It used to be a week or less and now it's stretch to multiple weeks.

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

Some of the most frequent advice given on the DIS is to ask a different CM because the answers all too frequently differ. Why do we believe the CMs working ROFR are sacrosanct? We see it all the time. Someone's contract for $102/ppt fails but two days later the 'same' contract for $98/ppt passes.
I don't believe the intent of ROFR back in the day of The Vacation Cub, when I became a member, was to hyper anyalyze every contract but rather to prevent gross under selling.
Sadly, as is true of many things in this lfe and particularly here, people would rather blame the people "looking for bargains" and disparage them versus casting any doubt towards the billion dollar conglomerate that could simply DO THEIR JOBS (hire more clerks if need be) and process the ROFRs on time and within the original intent with some transparency.

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

In essence what the rule states is that they must be given at least 30 days prior to closing to review ROFR. That differs from only having 30 days to review it. If closing is further out they technically could take until whatever that closing date is however that isn't what they have historically done and they've generally responded in 30 days or less. If they go over they are not in breach of the contract though. In the past a few buyers convinced brokers to make the closing date right at 30 days but that was rare and really not something I'd recommend. Where they fall down more now vs how they handled it in the past is the actual transfer and contract set up/point loading. It used to be a week or less and now it's stretch to multiple weeks.

Why? Why is everyone afraid of making the closing dates so far beyond the 31 day mark? Because Disney will punish them?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Some of the most frequent advice given on the DIS is to ask a different CM because the answers all too frequently differ. Why do we believe the CMs working ROFR are sacrosanct? We see it all the time. Someone's contract for $102/ppt fails but two days later the same contract for $98/ppt passes.
I don't believe the intent of ROFR back in the day of The Vacation Cub, when I became a member, was to hyper anyalyze every contract but rather to prevent gross under selling.
Sadly, as is true of many things in this lfe and particularly here, people would rather blame the people "looking for bargains" and disparage them versus casting any doubt towards the billion dollar conglomerate that could simply DO THEIR JOBS (hire more clerks if need be) and process the ROFRs on time and within the original intent with some transparency.

I'd be more than happy to agree with you if DVC were actually outside of the rules outlined in ever POS since the start. As I listed above though they are not.

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

When buying resale, we all knew that it's never a sure thing that it will go through in the end. That we all have a chance of Disney taking it back. The uncertainty and wait is what we agree to when we are looking for "bargain prices" instead of paying direct prices. I think you need to take a break from constantly checking your email for status updates, checking the ROFR thread because this whole process seems to be really stressing you out.

Nah, I lost ROFR
1. When I took the tour last month and subsequently ignored their calls for the add ons at $165/pt (I mean I did drink the can of Coke) and
2. as soon as I wrote this email thread.

I have my original points from 1994.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Why? Why is everyone afraid of making the closing dates so far beyond the 31 day mark? Because Disney will punish them?

No. Things can come up that have nothing to do with DVC - it may be something with a seller or something with a buyer or something with a loan if that is been gotten or it could be a contract isn't right and it comes back for points missing or extra or whatever. Just technical glitches. Or a few other reasons I could think of. As a seller I wouldn't agree to it because once that closing date passes then the buyer would be free to walk and it might have been nothing at all in the control of the seller and they were acting in good faith the entire time. It also can go the other way and the seller could legally walk on the buyer. Let's say there's been a sudden jump in resale prices and now the seller feels remorse at selling so low. A little glitch of some sort that takes it past closing and they could pull out. And the ROFR date could come unknown time and once it does the title company has to pull everything together for closing and that might not be possible to do in less than a few hours if the schedule is too tight and suddenly the date is gone. For the most part I think DVC does act in good faith with the ROFR process in keeping it to 30 days or less.

DVC is supposed to be fun and maybe when you started on the resale track it was fun for you but I think that quickly disappeared. I'm sorry that it is causing such stress and hope it isn't ruining DVC for you.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Nah, I lost ROFR
1. When I took the tour last month and subsequently ignored their calls for the add ons at $165/pt (I mean I did drink the can of Coke) and
2. as soon as I wrote this email thread.

I have my original points from 1994.

So today you were ROFR'd on everything you have submitted?

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

So today you were ROFR'd on everything you have submitted?

Rhetorically

 

[ILoveMyDVC]

No. Things can come up that have nothing to do with DVC - it may be something with a seller or something with a buyer or something with a loan if that is been gotten or it could be a contract isn't right and it comes back for points missing or extra or whatever. Just technical glitches. Or a few other reasons I could think of. As a seller I wouldn't agree to it because once that closing date passes then the buyer would be free to walk and it might have been nothing at all in the control of the seller and they were acting in good faith the entire time. It also can go the other way and the seller could legally walk on the buyer. Let's say there's been a sudden jump in resale prices and now the seller feels remorse at selling so low. A little glitch of some sort that takes it past closing and they could pull out. And the ROFR date could come unknown time and once it does the title company has to pull everything together for closing and that might not be possible to do in less than a few hours if the schedule is too tight and suddenly the date is gone. For the most part I think DVC does act in good faith with the ROFR process in keeping it to 30 days or less.

DVC is supposed to be fun and maybe when you started on the resale track it was fun for you but I think that quickly disappeared. I'm sorry that it is causing such stress and hope it isn't ruining DVC for you.

I took my 6 month old puppy to be spayed last Friday. She was given 1 pain killed to be cut in half and given the next day in 2 doses, By sunday she was throwing up. The pill caused an ulcer in her GI tract that ruptured her stomach and she went septic. We were told by the state's premier emergency vet hospital she would die. She made it through the surgery. She is still hospitalized a week later, now with pneumonia. DVC was taking my mind off of it. We were making real plans. But it's not real. I have 4 pending contracts that are pipe dreams.
ONE should be due but it is not because Disney suddenly can't afford its payroll or they are "working" (laundry, home schooling, Days of Our Lives) from home.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I took my 6 month old puppy to be spayed last Friday. She was given 1 pain killed to be cut in half and given the next day in 2 doses, By sunday she was throwing up. The pill caused an ulcer in her GI tract that ruptured her stomach and she went septic. We were told by the state's premier emergency vet hospital she would die. She made it through the surgery. She is still hospitalized a week later, now with pneumonia. DVC was taking my mind off of it. We were making real plans. But it's not real. I have 4 pending contracts that are pipe dreams.
ONE should be due but it is not because Disney suddenly can't afford its payroll or they are "working" (laundry, home schooling, Days of Our Lives) from home.

I'm so sorry about you puppy! I'm on the other end with my 16.5 yo "puppy" who has been my heart dog and wondering how much longer I have as the decline is obvious. I hope yours pulls thru and you get many wonderful years with her.