Renter's "etiquette" - please advise! (long)

[JimMIA]

A phone call made to MS made by a renter takes the same amount of time as a phone call made by a DVC member. It doesn't matter who dials the phone

I agree with this point. In fact, if there is any discrepancy between what the renter wants, and what MS can give them, having the DVC owner call will probably result in a whole rash of unnecessary phone calls. If you take the typical arrangements for ME, for example, you can see all the questions and complications direct contact with MS could pose. Imagine an owner trying to set that up for a renter. Or, imagine an owner going back and forth with a renter helping them make up their minds about whether the dining plan is best for them.

On the other hand, I always make my ADRs directly with Disney Dining -- specifically to relieve that burden from MS. I know MS can do it, but I choose to spare them that time and effort so they can spend their time helping folks with ressies.

 

[cseca]

Call MS to confirm your reservation if you must (I'd just ask for the confirmation), but all other issues need to be handled throught the member (a pack and play will be in your room). MS aren't supposed to take requests from anyone but the member. For this reason, get your requests down with the first call.
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I agree with renter to call MS to confirm. Because tho I've never been one to "buy" points, if I were I would want to check for sure.

But I've rented out my points twice before and always set a written contract. Also to set up ME service MS actually told me to have the renter called themselves with the information. I honestly don't mind helping my renter set them up but they might not feel comfortable giving me all kinds of info.
So I told my renter exactly that, to call MS directly and set it up.
Not because I don't want to help, but because MS told me to.

 

[bobbiwoz]

On the other hand, I always make my ADRs directly with Disney Dining -- specifically to relieve that burden from MS. I know MS can do it, but I choose to spare them that time and effort so they can spend their time helping folks with ressies.

Me too! However, this is because I do my best vacation planning with DH and that's on weekends!

I have no problem with renters calling MS to confirm their reservation. I also think the MS doesn't "mind" those people are probably a very good source of future revenue as members!

Bobbi

 

[bcoyoh]

Molly, I just want to say THANK YOU for starting this thread. And also THANK YOU to everyone who has given information about how this process should be handled.

I am also thinking about renting points for a trip in May and have learned so much from this thread.

Again, a huge THANK YOU
Beth

 

[Doctor P]

A phone call made to MS made by a renter takes the same amount of time as a phone call made by a DVC member. It doesn't matter who dials the phone; if there is a question about a reservation, someone will be on the line. I am certain that the person I am renting from would rather not be my own personal travel agent. He has a life. And I think that your tone was very rude...

This is the one of the most asinine statements I have ever heard. It is also offensive to me as an owner. We as owners pay for MS out of our dues. Every phone call to a toll free number costs money, and the CM's who answer the calls cost money. Calling to confirm a reservation is an EXTRA call that a member would not normally make, therefore by a renter calling to confirm a reservation they not only are making an extra call that taxes member services and costs me money as an owner, they are tying up the line when a member could be making a reservation or getting member services. And owners should be ashamed at suggesting that their renters should call MS, IMHO. I would, however, have LESS problem with renters emailing MS for confirmation.

 

[TCPluto]

This is the one of the most asinine statements I have ever heard. It is also offensive to me as an owner. We as owners pay for MS out of our dues. Every phone call to a toll free number costs money, and the CM's who answer the calls cost money. Calling to confirm a reservation is an EXTRA call that a member would not normally make, therefore by a renter calling to confirm a reservation they not only are making an extra call that taxes member services and costs me money as an owner, they are tying up the line when a member could be making a reservation or getting member services. And owners should be ashamed at suggesting that their renters should call MS, IMHO. I would, however, have LESS problem with renters emailing MS for confirmation.

Member services encourages the renter to call. If the reservation was made with points, haven't the dues been paid which then pay to service those points? The answer is yes.

Sorry Doc, I don't follow your line of thinking. I also, think it not appropriate to start calling others assinine and telling people they should be ashamed of themselves. Belittling others will not likely further your cause/point.

 

[jim and meesie]

That difference is also why some owners who rent points either don't send copies of the confirmations or block out their member numbers.

I received a copy of my reservation from the member I am renting from and it has no "member number" blocked out or otherwise on the reservation confirmation (on DVC paper). I had no need to pretend to be a member because as far as I understand any member can make and pay for any reservation for any "guest" of their choice. If there was anything wrong or unethical about renting points I wouldn't do it. At this point I feel great about the member I am dealing with, very comfortable even though I have sent close to $1000. to someone I have never met. The way I see it this is similar to renting a "vacation home" from a private owner, it requires alot of trust and any reference that will justify that trust makes me feel good about the transaction. By the way, my call to MS to confirm my reservation took less than one minute if there is anyone who wants to be reimbursed for the cost to their dues ($10.00 hr MS time prorated to a minute equals about 10.7 cents, ammortized across all dues paying DVC members = less than one ten thousandth of one penny). By the way, I am staying at DVC because I am considering buying in (try before I buy). If I buy I have already figured out that I would lose money personally if I bought in just to rent out!!!

 

[diznyfanatic]

This is the one of the most asinine statements I have ever heard. It is also offensive to me as an owner. We as owners pay for MS out of our dues. Every phone call to a toll free number costs money, and the CM's who answer the calls cost money. Calling to confirm a reservation is an EXTRA call that a member would not normally make, therefore by a renter calling to confirm a reservation they not only are making an extra call that taxes member services and costs me money as an owner, they are tying up the line when a member could be making a reservation or getting member services. And owners should be ashamed at suggesting that their renters should call MS, IMHO. I would, however, have LESS problem with renters emailing MS for confirmation.

Bolding mine. Wow. I'll take a wild stab at the premise that the reason Disney specifically allows and encourages members to rent their points in the first place is because there must be some number crunching going on that supports the theory that a fair number of those renters may become buyers. In fact, it is THE reason I rented points for my upcoming trip. I wanted to try DVC in order to facilitate my decision.

Using that argument, renting in and of itself causes more phone calls by members to MS. Afterall, the owners are making additional calls to inquire about availability and to place reservations that they wouldn't otherwise be making.

If owners are experiencing problems contacting MS via phone, do you really think renters have a shot at a timely email response to confirm their reservation in order to proceed with the transaction?

If I do ultimately decide to purchase at DVC, you can be sure that one of the first things I will suggest as an owner will be for Disney to establish a dedicated phone line for renters that is paid for by the renter via a toll call. Paying an extra few bucks for a phone call is fine with me if it means I don't have to be referred to as either offensive or a bottom feeder.

I would also respectfully suggest that if members are experiencing the issues with MS as indicated here, it be taken up with Disney to improve the service that, as we all know by now, your dues are paying for.

 

[Doctor P]

If owners are experiencing problems contacting MS via phone, do you really think renters have a shot at a timely email response to confirm their reservation in order to proceed with the transaction?

And your presumption is that they SHOULD receive such a timely response. I do not have that presumption. I'll tell you one thing that would straighten the whole thing out--you have to enter the member number to be put into the queue for MS. If you don't have it, then you go to the end of the line and no call from that queue is answered until the member queue is empty, regardless of whether the member called in after the renter or not.

 

[bamagirl@hrt]

Members have a hard enough time trying to get in to Member Services without non-members calling in to see if they still have a reservation. And can they request Magical Express. And how about balloons for little Billy since his birthday is only 25 days away. Yada, yada, yada.

It's not called Renter's Services. It's called Member Services. If you need something, contact the member and they should be the one calling MS, not you.

Why should I use the member I'm renting from as my personal travel agent? She has a life & family of her own, while I'm perfectly capable of making a phone call. I'd be happy to call a non-1-800 number if it was provided, but it isn't. I called member services to confirm my ressie and add the dining plan. I TOLD the CM that I was renting (didn't even stretch it by saying I was a "guest"). She was super friendly. And you know what? She even offered to help me make ADRs when my 180 day window opens! I thanked her, but I will be taking care of that myself.

I've been reading the DVC boards for quite awhile. I spent a lot of time educating myself about DVC and renting before I made the move to rent. I have read many times that some DVC members feel that Disney treats them as second class citizens. I find that interesting, as it seems that some DVC members now treat rentees as second class citizens.

I'm just thankful that I found someone not only willing to rent her points, but who is also very excited about my trip to stay at the BCV. She's been helpful every step of the way for this first time renter.

 

[diznyfanatic]

And your presumption is that they SHOULD receive such a timely response. I do not have that presumption. I'll tell you one thing that would straighten the whole thing out--you have to enter the member number to be put into the queue for MS. If you don't have it, then you go to the end of the line and no call from that queue is answered until the member queue is empty, regardless of whether the member called in after the renter or not.

Guess it wouldn't be enough to solve the problem by having a dedicated TOLL phone line for non-members to use paid for by non-members. But, then again, your solution adds the total dislike and disdain for non-members that my suggestion and solution doesn't supply.

 

[Doctor P]

I don't have a problem with your solution at all, actually, but I would like to see it handled by charging a rental fee to the member instead, but that wouldn't happen.

BTW, don't presume that I have a disdain for nonmembers. I have a disdain for owners whose actions cost me money, and I have a disdain for the failure on the part of powers to be to enforce the terms of our contracts and declarations we all signed as owners. Renters are not entitled to the privileges and benefits of members according to our contract and declarations. In my opinion, that applies to the benefits of using MS. Let me make it clear--GUESTS are entitled to such benefits, but our declarations make a clear distinction between guests and renters.

 

[isyt]

I almost hate to get involved in this one but I have rented points out many times (have met alot of nice people that way) and I always make the reservation and give them the confirmation number. As soon as I get the written confirmation I mail it to them (never thought of blocking my number). I have probably rented to maybe 15 people or so and I know a few of them have called to confirm but they are sending me money and I am not sure I would send someone money without a little checking. I guess if someone was going to call ms to add on the dining plan what difference does it make if its me or the renter making the same call? I have always offered to make any requests or even dining for my renters but it is fun for me. I do have renters spending thousands in December and I always encourage refrences or do whatever it takes to make someone comfortable. I do have alot of extra points I rent because we are planning for our retirement (many months in the world). So to the OP whatever you feel will make you comfortable in sending a stranger money is the way to go.

I also always tip mousekeeping!!

 

[Muushka]

Our member number is never on our written confirmation. Is it on anyones?

 

[Stitch1404]

Why would you black out your member number? When you call MS they still ask for your address, phone number, and last 4 of your SS#, so how could anyone really use your member number without know all the other information?

 

[RobDoc]

Just to recap:

1) Subletting a reservation is fine, BUT ... only the member can make name changes on the reservation, so make sure they are willing/able to make these changes for you. I'd confirm that in advance and ask for it to be in your contract. In addition, "emergency" and short notice reservations may be difficult to rent - just be aware.

2) Definitely request a written contract spelling out all details of your agreement. You should also have a phone number, home address and email address where they might be contacted.

3) MS is usually happy to talk with those who have a reservation number and will verify the reservation, add requestss, assist with the Dining Plan and make DME arrangements. You can also call the resort directly for requests and verification. This has been confirmed by CMs at the DVC resorts. Just have the DVC confirmation number handy and they can assist without having to call MS.

4) No need to contact the member afterwards - unless you want to thank them for a great stay!

Mousekeeping does not expect gratuities, but they are always happy to accept them. We do tip on T/T and full cleanings as well as whenever they provide additional services.

Years ago, the member number was printed on the confirmation letter. In recent years they have stopped that practice, probably for security reasons. Even though other info is requested with calls to MS, no one needs the member number for anything - unless they also know the other information.

Good luck with your rental.

 

[Doctor P]

Let me just add a tidbit that I found in the POS/Condominium declarations. If you rent points, you MUST use a written contract and it "must set forth an acknowledgement and consent on the part of the lessee--sublessee--tenant to use, occupy, and possess such Vacation Homee in conformance and compliance with the provisions of this [condominium] Declaration, as well as the Articles of Incorporation, Bylaws, the Condominium Rules and Regulations and the rules and regulations of the Disney Vacation Club."

Hmmm... I wonder how many people are complying.

 

[RobDoc]

Let me just add a tidbit that I found in the POS/Condominium declarations. If you rent points, you MUST use a written contract and it "must set forth an acknowledgement and consent on the part of the lessee--sublessee--tenant to use, occupy, and possess such Vacation Homee in conformance and compliance with the provisions of this [condominium] Declaration, as well as the Articles of Incorporation, Bylaws, the Condominium Rules and Regulations and the rules and regulations of the Disney Vacation Club."

Hmmm... I wonder how many people are complying.

That provision goes on to state:

"In the event an Owner fails to secure a written leasing or rental agreement, the Association reserves the right to request the lessee-sublessee-tenant to execute an acknowledgement to use and occupy the rented or leased Vacation Home in confromance and compliance with the Condominium Documents and these Comdominium Rules and Regulations."

 

[Doctor P]

That provision goes on to state:

"In the event an Owner fails to secure a written leasing or rental agreement, the Association reserves the right to request the lessee-sublessee-tenant to execute an acknowledgement to use and occupy the rented or leased Vacation Home in confromance and compliance with the Condominium Documents and these Comdominium Rules and Regulations."

That is very true, but what that language means from a contract law standpoint is that is one remedy that DVD can choose to use against the owner. It should in no way be construed as a substitute for the previous language, nor does it relieve the owner from the responsibility of such a written contract. The legal phrasing that is used in this clause of the declarations is among the strongest wordings that can be chosen in drafting a legal document (there are about four levels of wording, and this one is the strongest).

My point is that this is, once again, a case where the rules are in place and not being enforced.

 

[jim and meesie]

That is very true, but what that language means from a contract law standpoint is that is one remedy that DVD can choose to use against the owner. It should in no way be construed as a substitute for the previous language, nor does it relieve the owner from the responsibility of such a written contract. The legal phrasing that is used in this clause of the declarations is among the strongest wordings that can be chosen in drafting a legal document (there are about four levels of wording, and this one is the strongest).

My point is that this is, once again, a case where the rules are in place and not being enforced.

OOOOOH, are you a Doctor a lawyer or both? It's all starting to make more sense.