Rented points problem

[LIFERBABE]

Sorry to hear your situation is not resolved

 

[Lil' Grumpy]

i 'm so sorry. hope my message of support helped. [ it was
late, & it's a lil'different when writing vs verbal presentation.]

i'm glad you have the strength to fight back. this was not
your fault. and as a fellow owner, this upset me that someone
was mean enough to take advantage of your trust.

good luck for a positive outcome!

 

[JBx3]

I caught this thread late and have not been on the boards for a couple months. We are in the middle of renting points to then buy a disney cruise.

I do not think this idea below has been mentioned yet or covered and I really did not think this totally thru but hope a few of you can. Is the below a solution to prevent fraud on future rentals to people you do not know?

My understanding is that Disney will only approve 1 credit card per room / rental per stay. So what if the owner adds his name to the reservation and places his/her own C.C. on that reservsation? You can then have ALL OTHERS GUESTS eliminated from being able to have C.C. priviledges.

I say the above because in August, I had a reservation for 9 people, 3 of us from our family with C.C. allowed. The other 6 guests were family members but since I took the one spot allowed by Disney at check in to have card priviledges this basically eliminated any other guests from C.C. priviledges and they were all very happy to charge independently as needed (Not tied to the owner of the reservation.

Any thoughts on doind the same thing when the owner is not present on the trip? Any implications?

 

[Chuck S]

I caught this thread late and have not been on the boards for a couple months. We are in the middle of renting points to then buy a disney cruise.

I do not think this idea below has been mentioned yet or covered and I really did not think this totally thru but hope a few of you can. Is the below a solution to prevent fraud on future rentals to people you do not know?

My understanding is that Disney will only approve 1 credit card per room / rental per stay. So what if the owner adds his name to the reservation and places his/her own C.C. on that reservsation? You can then have ALL OTHERS GUESTS eliminated from being able to have C.C. priviledges.

I say the above because in August, I had a reservation for 9 people, 3 of us from our family with C.C. allowed. The other 6 guests were family members but since I took the one spot allowed by Disney at check in to have card priviledges this basically eliminated any other guests from C.C. priviledges and they were all very happy to charge independently as needed (Not tied to the owner of the reservation.

Any thoughts on doind the same thing when the owner is not present on the trip? Any implications?

I don't think it is possible if the owner isn't along. Even if it were, the renter would be free to simply substitute a different CC at check-in and have the keys reprinted.

 

[JBx3]

Yes, I did forgot about the owner being present on the trip and it makes sense! However, we did have a family member at check in try and place a C.C. for charging priviledges and it was approved at the desk since we already had our card being used as the one spot?

Just wishing the rent risk could be reduced and C.C. thing blocked.
Guess good old Disney has all the corners covered, as they always do!

 

[yfchen22]

I rented out several times, had one renter skipped on their credit card charges of a little less than the maximum limit. Did not know about it till I tried to make a reservation several months later. The renter completely ignored us. We went ahead and paid Disney so we can have our own vacation. Is there a way to prevent the renter from using room charge privilege completely? As a owner, can we inform DVC not to accept any credit card for room charges? Anyone?

 

[Chuck S]

I rented out several times, had one renter skipped on their credit card charges of a little less than the maximum limit. Did not know about it till I tried to make a reservation several months later. The renter completely ignored us. We went ahead and paid Disney so we can have our own vacation. Is there a way to prevent the renter from using room charge privilege completely? As a owner, can we inform DVC not to accept any credit card for room charges? Anyone?

Not unless the coming system upgrades in the reservation system will start to allow it. Until then, the ability to charge to the room, when a credit card is presented, is part of any Disney reservation, just like resort delivery and bus service. Disney doesn't doesn't allow DVC owners to decide which onsite perks are extended to their renters, and likely have no interest in doing so, as the owner is held responsible.

 

[CarolAnnC]

I rented out several times, had one renter skipped on their credit card charges of a little less than the maximum limit. Did not know about it till I tried to make a reservation several months later. The renter completely ignored us. We went ahead and paid Disney so we can have our own vacation. Is there a way to prevent the renter from using room charge privilege completely? As a owner, can we inform DVC not to accept any credit card for room charges? Anyone?

Disney encourages KTTW card charging privileges as those spur of the moment park purchases of souvenirs and food & drink are a big money maker for them. I doubt they will ever institute such a policy as it would not be in their best interest..

 

[LIFERBABE]

Disney encourages KTTW card charging privileges as those spur of the moment park purchases of souvenirs and food & drink are a big money maker for them. I doubt they will ever institute such a policy as it would not be in their best interest..

Why should they when we the membership basically co-sign for the loans?

 

[mic_KY_mouses]

Anychance of calling the school paper and get them on her? Or a local consumer action reporter either in TN or MA???

While tempting, I would think the OP would be best served now to let the legal process work itself out. The way people think today, the perp might try to counter-sue if pursued too vigorously to offset the repayment that will probably be ordered. I hope the OP (victim) gets expenses covered in the judgement.

 

[ftballfan7]

Disney offers charging to every resort guest with a CC card. If DVC would allow an owner to disallow charging on a rental, then Disney is legally involving itself in the rental process, and it would make Disney legally obligated to disallow the charging privilege to the renter. It is a responsibility they choose not to accept. It is easier, and apparently legal, to hold the DVC owner responsible.

With a cash guest, Disney accepts the responsibility, because Disney is making the profit from the room rental. In the case of a DVC member renting the room, it is the DVC member making the rental profit, thus the member needs to accept the responsibility.

I think that disney should allow the owner to disallow charging on any reservation the owner makes. It is after all the owners reservation. Disney does not allow the renter to make or alter a reservation or add DDP. It would be in everyone's best interest for Disney to carry this one step further and put room charging privileges solely under the perview of the owner, effectively removing themselves from any responsibility either legal or percieved.

If I were a cash guest and making a reservation under my name for a villa, it would be up to me as the the one ultimately responsible for the reservation if I wanted to allow charging privelages to any individual under my reservation. For example, if I rented a two bedroom villa and invited another couple but didn't want to extend room charging privelages to them disney would respect my wishes. This situation should not be any different. The owner, who is making the reservation, should be allowed to block room charging privileges.

This is just my opinion, but it seems reasonable.

 

[CarolAnnC]

I don't forsee them denying any guest checking in on DVC points from putting a credit card on their KTTW card. That charging privilege encourages spending in the parks and that is what Disney wants, bottom line profit.

 

[Chuck S]

I think that disney should allow the owner to disallow charging on any reservation the owner makes. It is after all the owners reservation. Disney does not allow the renter to make or alter a reservation or add DDP. It would be in everyone's best interest for Disney to carry this one step further and put room charging privileges solely under the perview of the owner, effectively removing themselves from any responsibility either legal or percieved.

If I were a cash guest and making a reservation under my name for a villa, it would be up to me as the the one ultimately responsible for the reservation if I wanted to allow charging privelages to any individual under my reservation. For example, if I rented a two bedroom villa and invited another couple but didn't want to extend room charging privelages to them disney would respect my wishes. This situation should not be any different. The owner, who is making the reservation, should be allowed to block room charging privileges.

This is just my opinion, but it seems reasonable.

Disney considers DVC reservations to be "room only" reservation, similar to AP reservations.

It is not reasonable to expect Disney to assist a member in a rental transaction by allowing them to select whether their renter is allowed to charge, anymore than allowing the owner to decide if the renter can use any other resort facility...like pools, or park transportation. It is part of the reservation and service expected.

 

[ftballfan7]

Disney considers DVC reservations to be "room only" reservation, similar to AP reservations.

It is not reasonable to expect Disney to assist a member in a rental transaction by allowing them to select whether their renter is allowed to charge, anymore than allowing the owner to decide if the renter can use any other resort facility...like pools, or park transportation. It is part of the reservation and service expected.

I don't see it as assissting with a rental transaction. It is simply a reservation that is in my name and as such I should have the discretion as to whether I want room charging to be allowed. This is not a perk like pools or park transportation, which are given to everyone without opt-out options. I have never been asked at check-in if I want pool privelages and if so, which members of my party would I like to extend those privelages to.

In any other other reservation (ie cash) room charging is offered to the person who has made the reservation (and is responsible for it), who then decides who if anyone will have such privilages.

To me, this is a no-brainer. It is irresponsible for Disney to allow this to occur. For the record, I have never rented my points and at this time have no plans to do so. I just think this is wrong and could be easily prevented by a simple, common sense change in policy.

 

[CarolAnnC]

To me, this is a no-brainer. It is irresponsible for Disney to allow this to occur. For the record, I have never rented my points and at this time have no plans to do so. I just think this is wrong and could be easily prevented by a simple, common sense change in policy.

But why would Disney institute a policy that does not benefit them? The whole idea of DVC Members renting out their reservations for less than Disney does rubs them the wrong way to begin with. Why would they want to make it easier for the owner at their own expense? I am sure they enjoy the revenue that KTTW card charging provides them..

 

[Chuck S]

I have never been asked at check-in if I want pool privelages and if so, which members of my party would I like to extend those privelages to.

The renter is not part of "your traveling party," they are on a reservation, in their name, made using your points as payment for that reservation. The right to charge with a credit card is a function of that reservation.

In any other other reservation (ie cash) room charging is offered to the person who has made the reservation (and is responsible for it), who then decides who if anyone will have such privilages.

Actually, the charging privlege on a cash reservation is not offered solely to the person that made and paid for the reservation. If the person that made the reservation declines, any other adult in the traveling party can give their credit card for room charging. As long as a CC is offered, there will be room charging.

If you disagreed with the clause in the ownership contract that specifies that owners are to be held responsible for omissions of their guests/renters, the option was to not sign the contract, and not purchase DVC.

Could they modify the policy? Certainly. But there is no compelling reason for them to do so. It is not their responsibility to make sure an owner reads and understands the contract during the rescission period.

 

[Reaseyann]

I can't believe that people do this kind of stuff - and I don't understand why Disney can't find some way to charge the people who actually spent the money. I feel sure they would find a way to charge them if they didn't have the owners to hold responsible!

 

[Chuck S]

I can't believe that people do this kind of stuff - and I don't understand why Disney can't find some way to charge the people who actually spent the money. I feel sure they would find a way to charge them if they didn't have the owners to hold responsible!

Of course people do this kind of stuff, there are always those who chose to cheat the system, unfortunately.

As far as Disney finding a way to hold the renter responsible...why should they? They didn't make the profit on the room rental, the DVC owner did. With a cash reservation, Disney makes the profit on the room night, and even "discounted" room nights make substantial profit.

 

[JBx3]

I don't see it as assissting with a rental transaction. It is simply a reservation that is in my name and as such I should have the discretion as to whether I want room charging to be allowed. This is not a perk like pools or park transportation, which are given to everyone without opt-out options. I have never been asked at check-in if I want pool privelages and if so, which members of my party would I like to extend those privelages to.

In any other other reservation (ie cash) room charging is offered to the person who has made the reservation (and is responsible for it), who then decides who if anyone will have such privilages.

To me, this is a no-brainer. It is irresponsible for Disney to allow this to occur. For the record, I have never rented my points and at this time have no plans to do so. I just think this is wrong and could be easily prevented by a simple, common sense change in policy.

I sure agree with all of your comments! And I see it as you see it, a no brainer! I understand everyone elses comment that it is not in the best interest of disney since it wants to make money and encourage spur of moment purchasing but really....I have traveled many years, for example, sharing of rooms at national sales meetings, where both people checked into same room are responsible for their own charges separately and one not held accountable for anothers actions.

Sorry....this is just another example of how Disney cares about their own business much more than their customers! With technology and online check ins this is a simple fix with a tab clicked on stating no room charges allowed. It really is that simple. This is why as DVC owners, watching every move DVC makes is very critical and will determine the length of my ownership. Although all is covered in the contracts signed, I really think it is just nuts to side with Disney on stuff like this, no wonder why the deck continues to be stacked and "soft perks" continue to disappear. Most DVC customers are also admirers of Disney as well and both Disney and DVC know this, so they continue to make sure the deck is stacked becuase their "customer" allows them to do so!

At the very least, they could allow the DVC owners to at least request C.C to be charged everey $500 or so to help "protect" their DVC customer, yet also allow Disney to reap their money grab as well.

 

[ftballfan7]

If you disagreed with the clause in the ownership contract that specifies that owners are to be held responsible for omissions of their guests/renters, the option was to not sign the contract, and not purchase DVC.

Could they modify the policy? Certainly. But there is no compelling reason for them to do so. It is not their responsibility to make sure an owner reads and understands the contract during the rescission period.

I Do not disagree that Disney can do this as a result of the contract language. And, as I said, I have no intention of renting my points. However, the right thing to do would be to change the policy placing the repercussions of this behavior where they belong, or not allowing the situation to occur in the first place. The policy as it stands is ripe for misuse and fraud. One could argue culpability on Disney's part as they are obviously aware that this happens, yet have taken no steps to prevent it.

Would a change cost Disney a few bucks? Probably, although most people recognize that there is no fiducairy difference between charging your credit card through your room key or simply charging your credit card. My point is it is not ethical to hold the owner resposible in this situation, when a change in policy could prevent it.

What ever happened to doing the right thing?