Refresh strategy - short version?

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Today will be the first day I've messed around with refreshing on MDE in 6 months, but if I recall, it actually won't make a difference if you hit the same time or a different one. Say it's 11am when I do it, and I click on 3:00pm to search. I could be wrong, but if memory serves, it'll look for anything available that day. If it spots anything between 11am (current time) and 4:00pm (one hour after my desired time) it'll just show me those times right away with no wording. However, if the only things it finds are times more than one hour after my desired time, it'll still show those, but above those times it'll say something like "We couldn't find the times you wanted, but here are other times available", and there's a little yellow triangle (or something like that) right next to it. It'll do the same thing over and over and over if you keep hitting 3pm. It'll show you everything available, the only difference is in how it displays it.

That's how I've learned to be able to really do it without having to completely stare at my screen endlessly. If I'm looking for a 4th, 5th, 9th FP+ it's usually for something I want to get on right now or within a few minutes. When I refresh, if I see that little yellow triangle, I already know it didn't find anything within the next hour, so I just refresh again.

Hope that makes sense.
Yeah, for the most part it does not always. I know on our trip earlier this month I would see a FP pop up for 5:00 by clicking 6:00 but the FP wouldn't show up if I clicked 3:30, for instance. There were quite a few times where the results returned were strange based on the time I searched and the way the available times come and go from the list showed me I need to check each time slot, not just 1 or 2. But I can do it without staring at my screen too. I've mastered the click, glance, click, glance, etc. DH has tried and he can not do it. LOL
 
Yeah, for the most part it does not always. I know on our trip earlier this month I would see a FP pop up for 5:00 by clicking 6:00 but the FP wouldn't show up if I clicked 3:30, for instance. There were quite a few times where the results returned were strange based on the time I searched and the way the available times come and go from the list showed me I need to check each time slot, not just 1 or 2. But I can do it without staring at my screen too. I've mastered the click, glance, click, glance, etc. DH has tried and he can not do it. LOL

Yes, that is strange that it'll do that sometimes. I'm not sure if it's because people are taking them or "holding" them or what, but yes, you're right...sometimes you'll see times show up, then go away, then show up, then go away. Kinda like whack-a-mole...
 
Yes, that is strange that it'll do that sometimes. I'm not sure if it's because people are taking them or "holding" them or what, but yes, you're right...sometimes you'll see times show up, then go away, then show up, then go away. Kinda like whack-a-mole...
Exactly like Whack a Mole!
If they didn't come and go so fast, the same exact times coming and going seconds apart, I'd say it was someone holding them. But they come up too fast and go away too fast, for it to be that. Combine that with making your initial selections when you know for a fact the time slot you want is available but you have to search a couple of times to make it appear.
 
Well, this got interesting while I was enjoying my weekend.

Thanks much, especially AngiTN - for filling in more details. Unfortunately, my "simple rules" got more complex. Maybe I'll rewrite them with the notes from here.

Frequent (constant?) refresh is necessary because of some (apparent) glitch or "feature" in the system. That kind of takes away some of the fun of the Disney experience. To be staring at your phone and hoping for pixie dust as you click click click away - watching almost random and inexplicable changes in times happening by the second.

It's interesting of course and valuable to know this works if one is very determined to get a particular attraction in that day.

However, I think I speak for most when I say I wish Disney would recognize the issue and make it more sane.

I assume there are a certain number of fastpasses allocated at each time slot. Now I suppose that total number could be increased if they decide to increase the capacity of a ride (more "cars" and staff, but that would be a one time thing.

Then a certain amount of that inventory would be claimed by ticket holders, and either there is some left or it's all used up. And the only way there could be any available later is if someone returned one.

That's in general how I described it in my original post (forget the method of refreshing - I was simply saying staring at your screen without doing anything wasn't going to suddenly show new availability - you need to do something to "poke" the system to refresh).

But what's described (refresh 100 times in 5 minutes, with many different results) shows it's NOT the simple "available inventory changing" model. I'm in analytics and I've programmed a lot over several decades. I can't conceptualize how that can happen UNLESS they decided to put an element of randomness in this for the purpose of a certain enforced "fairness". That is - people looking during the day COULD find something that randomly popped up.

ANYWAY - this post violates my TL:dr objection.

SUMMARY - you can get lucky if you're willing to keep refreshing very frequently - even though you may be missing the park experience as you do that. Staring at my phone and clicking 100 times in 5 minutes, and maybe doing that very often as the day goes on - after paying $100 just to be in the park - seems like a poor tradeoff at best.

AGAIN - it's interesting and potentially valuable to know it can be done, and I can see how frequent visitors wouldn't mind (you've experienced the parks many many times). But for someone like me, going for "only" my ninth time in 30 years - first time with grandchildren!! - I think I'll put my phone away and concentrate on their faces.
 
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I will mention that the only time I'm searching for other passes is while we are waiting for something else. Or walking from place to place. I'm not staring at the phone instead of, watching an attraction or show, for example. It's very easy to refresh almost in the background. Very easy to stay present in the trip and look for FP

As for the results, you can play around with it for yourself anytime. Don't even have to be at the park. Sit at home someday and check out FP availability for a ride. Search between Morning, and 2, 3 time slots. It won't take long to catch on to what I was referring to. All this below happens in 3 minutes
Here's a FP I played with for 2, for Barnstormer for this morning.
Notice if you can, the time stamp at the top of the screen. There is no time change between the snips but just check out how the FP options change. These are in the order I searched. They just aren't logical for people to have been changing. Just between #1 and #2, there is no time change, literally half a second. A 10:30 search thought the earliest FP was at 12:25 but a search for Morning a half second later shows not only a 10:30 FP, but a 10:55, 11:45, and others earlier than 12:25. Then in #3, and back to 10:30, shows again, only FP starting at 12:05, still just a second or two later
Search #1
D5ED52DD-6F72-4E49-B09A-B010A3429DEF.png

Search #2
49F95584-B435-495A-9F46-F4F474871F22.png

Search #3
726A4375-1261-4E23-A8F8-F5BE5A5012FE.png


But, before you think, well, Morning search must return better times than a specific slot. Nope, see here
Search #4
950D558E-C099-406A-981F-615A0D60D74C.png


And then here, an 11:00 search only shows a time at 12:35 (so watch thinking it will show you times before and after your time slot)
B0B78D07-0B1F-40C3-A5E5-CE19505FEF9A.png


And again, 10:30 shows this
55A18AAE-399C-49D9-9FBC-052AD49CD935.png


But morning shows
27A8F5EF-9AA6-4E22-A3DD-337F41821707.png
 
AngiTN -
Yes, I realize people wouldn't be refreshing while enjoying an attraction - just during dead time like waiting in lines or walking. And of course what is considered "dead time" varies from person to person. For us - as I mentioned we'll be with grandchildren for the first time - every moment is potentially special.

When the heat starts getting to them and they start getting crabby, I can see that as a GREAT opportunity to let their parents handle it while I say "sorry, I'm trying to get another FP!":)

Thanks for the demonstration AngiTN! Very interesting and confusing. I wonder if anyone has ever uncovered the "method" in the system that causes that? It certainly appears to be some programmed randomness.
 
I wonder if anyone has ever uncovered the "method" in the system that causes that? It certainly appears to be some programmed randomness.

I don't believe there is randomness built in. For the most part it is just people changing plans, moving around their FP's, cancelling that day to make FP's for another day, etc. There may be some crowd control abilities built in (add FP's to move people to certain areas or certain parks). I think if there are plenty of times available and you keep checking that it may offer you some different options as it only shows a few specific options at a time but that if you click on the ride itself you will likely see most of those times showing as available in the larger list.
 


I don't believe there is randomness built in. For the most part it is just people changing plans,
I'd like to think that's it - but the experience that AngiTN demonstrated seems to indicate it's not likely to be just that.

Granted - there are thousands of people potentially moving stuff around - and not just those at the parks but people within their 90 or 60 or 30 day window.

If that's the case - if there really are that many changes for any given attraction within such small time frames of refreshing - WOW! is all I can say.

However, as much as I hate this expression - it is what it is. (And it always is, isn't it?)
 
Just to add on FWIW, I did this constantly during our just-ended trip, and never felt like I was always stuck staring at my iphone - just the few minutes we spent standing in line for each attraction. As soon as we checked in to each FP, I'd start checking for our next one, and usually would get a satisfactory result before we got onto the ride. So yes, as our FP planner I was on the MDE app a lot (those portable chargers came in handy), but I never felt like I was missing anything, especially since FP lines are rarely as interesting as the standby ones anyway.
 
Just to add on FWIW, I did this constantly during our just-ended trip, and never felt like I was always stuck staring at my iphone - just the few minutes we spent standing in line for each attraction. As soon as we checked in to each FP, I'd start checking for our next one, and usually would get a satisfactory result before we got onto the ride. So yes, as our FP planner I was on the MDE app a lot (those portable chargers came in handy), but I never felt like I was missing anything, especially since FP lines are rarely as interesting as the standby ones anyway.
Right. It seems like you'd have to spend a lot of time but you really don't. 2,3 minutes
 
Just to add on FWIW, I did this constantly during our just-ended trip, and never felt like I was always stuck staring at my iphone - just the few minutes we spent standing in line for each attraction. As soon as we checked in to each FP, I'd start checking for our next one, and usually would get a satisfactory result before we got onto the ride. So yes, as our FP planner I was on the MDE app a lot (those portable chargers came in handy), but I never felt like I was missing anything, especially since FP lines are rarely as interesting as the standby ones anyway.

Totally agree with this. I also found it rather fun, like a game. What can I get? How soon?
That said, I will be teaching DS (15) and DH how to do it this September, so it's not just on me.
 
If I understand all these posts, refresh works best day of or nite prior. Grab the ride I want no matter the tiMe then modify it by refreshing. What if I want a ride thats unavailable? Thxs
 
If I understand all these posts, refresh works best day of or nite prior. Grab the ride I want no matter the tiMe then modify it by refreshing. What if I want a ride thats unavailable? Thxs
it works best day of. Even rides that say unavailable will occasionally pop up if you keep trying.
 
If I understand all these posts, refresh works best day of or nite prior. Grab the ride I want no matter the tiMe then modify it by refreshing. What if I want a ride thats unavailable? Thxs
Yes, day off tends to return the most results, since that's when folks tend to do the most changing.
If the ride you want is unavailable, and you are picking your 4th (or more) FP of the day, just pick anything and modify that. Especially helpful for Tiered parks.
For instance, at AK, if you'd like a FoP FP, grab any Navi FP you can find and then modify it rather than search for a FoP every time. No idea why but Modify just seems to work easier/faster/better (no idea which, maybe all 3) than a from scratch search.
But even if you can't get any Tier 1, you can grab a Tier 2 and as you modify, a Tier 1 will show on the results if there is one available.
 
Granted - there are thousands of people potentially moving stuff around - and not just those at the parks but people within their 90 or 60 or 30 day window.

I'm surprised no one called me out on this. It goes down as the dumbest thing I ever posted on the DIS Boards. Maybe the dumbest thing I EVER said.

Unless somehow people in the past can be modifying FPs while I'm at the park doing it for today.
:rolleyes1
 
I'm surprised no one called me out on this. It goes down as the dumbest thing I ever posted on the DIS Boards. Maybe the dumbest thing I EVER said.

Unless somehow people in the past can be modifying FPs while I'm at the park doing it for today.
:rolleyes1
Well, I think the statement is still true because you can modify for any day, not just the day you are in the park. So there is potential for a new FP to show up on any given day, due to someone else modifying their plans. I know I do this all the time. But it is true that the MOST modifications occur in a 24 hour window from the current day
 
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