REALLY Officer? Are you insane?

[Tiger926]

Your right I do not know you. I have a good friend who is a teacher for high risk girls at an inner city school. I am well aware of the challenges.

If a police officer tells you that they are always agressive with certain kids and they are getting roughed up, as that is the way they do business with repeat offenders than I urge you to file a police report as that certainly assult and certainly not allowed and I am amazing that an officer would actually admit that.

Sorry, it doesn't work this way. It's their word against the officer's word. The officers have made comments like this when they were asked for more info: "...as you know how your kids are." LIke I said, when you are dealing with at-risk youth, it's going to happen more, as they are usually high or running from getting caught. Our job is to help them understand that officers are there to help, and if they truly feel they were wronged, then they can report it. I think over the years, we've only had 1 or 2 students file a report, and there were parents involved, and I can't remember what happened in those cases?

You teach people who "love bothering and harrassing police officers". These same people are "mean and aggressive towards the officers". And they also "are behaviour challenged, emotional issues and addiction issues, so they get in trouble with the law a lot". Yet these same persons claim that they were "roughed" up and "beaten" up without any reason.......Yeah...real trustworthy sources.

Also, yes cops do prejudge based on a criminals past. They would be signing their death certificates if they didn't. If they get called out to someone or call in a traffic stop and the person is reported to have a violent past, then they NEED to take extra precaution. You can say they should approach every situation that way if they don't want to die, but that can't happen. One example--you make a felony stop--you have certain protocols for approaching that vehicle including having your weapon out, however you can't approach EVERY vehicle you stop with your weapon drawn. So yes, they have to prejudge and handle the situation as they would if it would be the worst outcome possible, even if it means being rough from the get go.
If you knew someone that everytime you were around them they cursed at you, spit at your and even tried to get physical, next time you are around them you would expect that and adjust for that instead of sitting back and waiting to see if it would happen again. This is even more true when you have to worry about one mistake and your life can be done.

Also~middle of the night someone breaks into your house and you dial 911 and are hiding somewhere as the person is going through your house looking for you. Do you want the police to come in and tackle the person (which is considered roughing up) and do whatever is possible to protect you? Or would you rather them be laid back, come up and ring the door bell and wait patiently for you to come and answer your door? Police HAVE to be aggressive by nature, that is why not everyone is cut out for this type of work.

If your students want to whine and complain about the police officers in your area, the solution is simple. Become a productive law abiding citizen and then they wouldn't have to interact with them unless THEY are the ones calling the police for help.

Being married to LE for 12 years, I can tell you I don't know any who would go and tell someone they roughed up a person just because "thats they way they are". Most felt that there was something there that caused the action and they have to back that up. Maybe a normal citizen would have thought they wouldn't have reacted in that manner, but police work is about intended perception of events as well.

Ummm...what part of this don't you and I agree on? I didn't say anything to the contrary. In our world of at-risk youths, this is what we have seen. Of course they aren't the most trustworthy, so basically you are saying that because they are at-risk and struggle, we as teachers should not value what they have to say? That is ridiculous - you can't build trust, unless you also give it, so we listen and if there is something serious, we take it to admin or social worker, and go from there. It's just like if a child came home and their child told them that they were abused by a teacher. You still need to listen to that child, in order to determine if it's legitimate or not. It's insulting to imply that just because our students are at-risk, that they shouldn't be believed. Nowhere did I say officers should be perfect at all, as that has nothing to do with it. I do expect them to follow laws - especially city by-laws for speeding, noise, etc.

Here is an example from last month - 5 teachers just witnessed a rough-up of our students (2 in person and 3 from the front lawn of school), and it was a case of mistaken identity, and when a teacher questioned one of the officers about whether he was going to apologize to our students, he received a not so nice response. Two teachers were witness to the entire incident as they were walking back from a restaurant, right behind our students, as it was lunchtime. This response just came from one of the officers, but the other 2 in attendance, came up and did apologize to our students and the teachers (one of them accussed the teacher of covering up). They believed the middle-aged person over our students, despite evidence to the contrary. It wasn't until the car load of people showed up that the middle-aged person called to beat up our students (mistaken identity), that the officers finally believed our students. It was not a nice incident, and we had to do damage control for weeks, but that is part of our job. We used it as teachable moment.

I am extremely offended by this post.

Sorry for that. I have already explained my responses in follow up posts. The OP sounded surprised that an officer would do this, and my point is why be surprised? Anyone, in any profession, can have a mental break. Not sure why people think certain groups of people are immune to it, especially those who put their lives on the line, day in and day out. The same thing comes up in my profession of teaching - people are surprised when a teacher sexually abuses a child. Why is that? No one is immune to it. I already apologized for my hasty response, and hopefully have cleared that up.

Tiger

 

[need2cruise]

Not to mention wearing a 30 pound belt for at least 12 hours a day. Spit at, punched, kicked, swore at, shot at, called a pig 10 times a day, listening to cop eating donut jokes 10 times a day (boy they never get old!), and slaughtered daily in the media.


All for the same pay as a teachers salary (at least where I live).

Oh--but along with this you are expected to be God. You must strive for 100% perfection. No mistakes are permitted or you will be considered lower than the criminals that you are protecting everyone else from.

I guess people forget that police are humans. They make mistakes same as everyone else.

 

[LSmith]

Sorry, it doesn't work this way. It's their word against the officer's word. The officers have made comments like this when they were asked for more info: "...as you know how your kids are." LIke I said, when you are dealing with at-risk youth, it's going to happen more, as they are usually high or running from getting caught. Our job is to help them understand that officers are there to help, and if they truly feel they were wronged, then they can report it. I think over the years, we've only had 1 or 2 students file a report, and there were parents involved, and I can't remember what happened in those cases?

You told me that the officers admitted it to YOU so it's you and the students word against the officer. You are a teacher and could/should file a complaint if this is true.

Here is an example from last month - 5 teachers just witnessed a rough-up of our students (2 in person and 3 from the front lawn of school), and it was a case of mistaken identity, and when a teacher questioned one of the officers about whether he was going to apologize to our students, he received a not so nice response. Two teachers were witness to the entire incident as they were walking back from a restaurant, right behind our students, as it was lunchtime. This response just came from one of the officers, but the other 2 in attendance, came up and did apologize to our students and the teachers (one of them accussed the teacher of covering up). They believed the middle-aged person over our students, despite evidence to the contrary. It wasn't until the car load of people showed up that the middle-aged person called to beat up our students (mistaken identity), that the officers finally believed our students. It was not a nice incident, and we had to do damage control for weeks, but that is part of our job. We used it as teachable moment.


Ok so 5 teachers witnessed a rough up of one of your innocent students and none of you will file a complaint, you are using it as a "teachable moment"? Unbelievable. Really.

 

[need2cruise]

Sorry, it doesn't work this way. It's their word against the officer's word. The officers have admitted it to us several times in this type of manner: "...as you know how your kids are."




Ummm...what part of this don't you and I agree on? I didn't say anything to the contrary. In our world of at-risk youths, this is what we have seen. Of course they aren't the most trustworthy, so basically you are saying that because they are at-risk and struggle, we as teachers should not value what they have to say? That is ridiculous - you can't build trust, unless you also give it, so we listen and if there is something serious, we take it to admin or social worker, and go from there.

Here is an example from last month - 5 teachers just witnessed a rough-up of our students (2 in person and 3 from the front lawn of school), and it was a case of mistaken identity, and when a teacher questioned one of the officers about whether he was going to apologize to our students, he received a not so nice response. Two teachers were witness to the entire incident as they were walking back from a restaurant, right behind our students, as it was lunchtime. This response just came from one of the officers, but the other 2 in attendance, came up and did apologize to our students and the teachers (one of them accussed the teacher of covering up). It was not a nice incident, and we had to do damage control for weeks.



Sorry for that. I have already explained my responses in follow up posts.

Tiger

This may be a difference in where I live and where you live. Here, the officer would have been put on leave and the incident investigated. If the officer was neglient and screwed up the identity, there would be a public apology and the officer would be facing losing their job. However, if the officer did do the ground work and wasn't neglient, then there would still be an apology. At least on the depts around me that I personally know of. However, questioning an officer on the scene minutes after an incident when emotions are high is not usually a good idea. That goes for any situation really. Like if that same student wasn't mistaken identity and was deserving of what happened and that same teacher approached and told that student to apologize, I'm sure the response would be similar. I deal with diffusing high stress situations and the first 15 minutes immediately following high emotions and stress is not the time to start jumping in on people. I'm not saying the cop was right and the teacher was wrong.....just saying wrong time/place.

I can understand about giving trust when dealing with at risk youth. However, they are also the ones who will do or say anything to someone they respect to keep that respect too as I'm sure you are well aware of.

If you are seeing situations where students are being physically attacked in your prescence and you know they were not in the wrong. Instead of approaching the officer, call their supervisor and file a complaint. It will get that officers attention quicker than someone trying to take the action in their own hands.

 

[LSmith]

This may be a difference in where I live and where you live. Here, the officer would have been put on leave and the incident investigated. If the officer was neglient and screwed up the identity, there would be a public apology and the officer would be facing losing their job. However, if the officer did do the ground work and wasn't neglient, then there would still be an apology. At least on the depts around me that I personally know of.

Trust me it is the same here in Toronto and the GTA and if Tiger doesn't know this then I'm going to use this as a "teachable moment".

 

[mrsxsparrow]

Okay I'd like to admit that I've only skimmed most of the responses, but I just wanted to say a few things.

First of all, I don't really feel like my community overreacted. Was it annoying? Yes. Do I think they could have handled things differently? Yes. But the last time an officer was shot in our immediate area was at least 25 years ago. Most people were able to get back to their homes before I was, but since it happened on our block, we were the main focus of investigation. Nine school were on lockdown, but in the beginning they thought it was school-specific, rather than just an incident that happened by the school. Although I will admit not letting kids go to the bathroom was a little excessive.

Second of all, I have the highest respect for police officers. I know they have one of the toughest jobs out there. Part of this is why I find the clear mental instability of one of them unacceptable. I know it is bound to happen to some in such a high stress job -- I'm a psych major, I get it. But shouldn't we then make all the mental health tools we have available to them? I know there's a psychological evaluation before an officer is sworn in, but are there any after that? Maybe there should be. Do officers get some type of therapy or stress relief? Maybe they should. My point is that there should be something in place so that if an officer -- who probably used to be a good, upstanding, respectable man (or woman) -- breaks down, they don't do something like this. OR we can prevent them to getting to that point of desperation entirely.

 

[need2cruise]

Okay I'd like to admit that I've only skimmed most of the responses, but I just wanted to say a few things.

First of all, I don't really feel like my community overreacted. Was it annoying? Yes. Do I think they could have handled things differently? Yes. But the last time an officer was shot in our immediate area was at least 25 years ago. Most people were able to get back to their homes before I was, but since it happened on our block, we were the main focus of investigation. Nine school were on lockdown, but in the beginning they thought it was school-specific, rather than just an incident that happened by the school. Although I will admit not letting kids go to the bathroom was a little excessive.

Second of all, I have the highest respect for police officers. I know they have one of the toughest jobs out there. Part of this is why I find the clear mental instability of one of them unacceptable. I know it is bound to happen to some in such a high stress job -- I'm a psych major, I get it. But shouldn't we then make all the mental health tools we have available to them? I know there's a psychological evaluation before an officer is sworn in, but are there any after that? Maybe there should be. Do officers get some type of therapy or stress relief? Maybe they should. My point is that there should be something in place so that if an officer -- who probably used to be a good, upstanding, respectable man (or woman) -- breaks down, they don't do something like this. OR we can prevent them to getting to that point of desperation entirely.

Great post! Once the initial testing is done, a lot of depts do not have anything else in place to assist afterwards although I do believe larger depts such as those in Chicago, NY, etc probably have better capabilities for this then most other depts, but that is speculation on my end. Most of your normal, average police depts do not offer any mental health help. If you want help, you go on your own and pay on your own. But along with that, you also take a risk on losing your job because then the public will be upset that an officer has to seek mental health help and should lose their jobs because they are not fit to serve. It is a no win situation and why many do not seek external help. There does needs to be importance placed within the dept on mental help and requesting it or obtaining it... absolutely, but not many depts do that because of 1)the publics view points and the outcry that would come out of it 2)funding.

 

[bumbershoot]

I've seen some confusing threads, but this one takes the cake.

Tiger talks about a study done in her area BY the police force, that showed that it's a high stress job and that the police officers can have serious problems because of it.

Then a bunch of spouses of police officers talk about how it's a high stress job and that they can have problems because of it.



But they are also yelping at Tiger for talking about the PROOF of what they, themselves, are saying?

It's very confusing. I don't understand how a study showing the same thing they are saying can be offensive.

Ok so 5 teachers witnessed a rough up of one of your innocent students and none of you will file a complaint, you are using it as a "teachable moment"? Unbelievable. Really.

OK seriously. If all those adults were there to see something wrong happen, and when the adults approached the officer to ask for an apology for his behaviour, and he responded rudely, and if this situation isn't the only situation where they saw problems with the local officers....WHERE is the trust going to come from, that a complaint would be taken seriously? I'm sure they feel that it would all fall on deaf ears, as it seems that in their area in their situation, there is a pattern of behaviour that isn't endearing the police officers to the students OR teachers.

I grew up in an area with awful police officers. My mom repeatedly called the police on my father, and EVERY TIME they came out, my dad took them outside, schmoozed them as only he can do, joked around with them, and they would leave. He, a strong 6'2" man, never once was arrested or warned, even though his small bruised 5'1" wife, then ex-wife, wanted them to do it. After awhile, she just didn't call anymore. If he called to threaten that he was coming over (I was 4 when they divorced, but he hadn't lived with us since I was 2 or before, but he haunted her for a few years after she divorced him), we took off. Didn't call the police; they had proven that they wouldn't do anything. She just took shelter with her friends.

There was no reason for her to believe that a complaint would do anything. This was caused by the officers that came over.

Years later, SHE was the shelter for women she came across who were dealing with the same situation, because we lived in the same area with a heavy old boy's network.


How can you expect a group of people to make official complaints, when they very likely feel that such an action would bring those same officers down even harder on their group?



As for how I feel, you're darned RIGHT I expect perfection from police officers. I expect that their behaviour is exemplary. I expect that they won't let people off. I was given a warning once, instead of a ticket, and while I was glad I wasn't going to have to deal with an out of state ticket while in a rental car, I was disappointed that this guy decided to ignore the fact that I was going at least 10 miles over the limit, just because I honestly and too-much-informationally (b/c that's how I am) blurted out that I wasn't paying attention to the speed because I was so busy looking up at the GORGEOUS West Virginia mountains (total truth, that state is gorgeous and very distracting). I even asked "are you sure?" because it bothered me that he took his job so casually.


So to me, what everyone is saying (that is backed up by the study) is understandable, b/c it's a high stress job, but it should never have gotten to this point. There should be counselors available at all times, and NO shame at all in making use of them. There should be ways for them to blow off steam at the end of a shift, in a healthy productive manner, so they aren't taking yesterday into tomorrow. There shouldn't be people THAT close to the edge, that they shoot themselves and cause such an uproar, because they should be getting taken care of ALREADY.

And it bothers me to no end that it isn't like that. Don't know why it doesn't bother the people themselves, or their loved ones.

 

[need2cruise]

To the PP, it is not a requirement to write every person that is pulled over a ticket. A ticket is usually given if the officer feels it will curb the behavior. However, if the officer feels that pulling over and talking will fix the problem that it IS within the scope of their job to give only a warning. That's why they have "warning tickets" printed up.

http://www.indystar.com/article/201...g-death?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|IndyStar.com

Read this article. See if this is a job you would want to sign up for and the type of people in society you want to work with every single day.

Perfection is reached by NOONE. Period. To expect it of anyone is stupid, plain and simple.

 

[Tiger926]

Sorry, it doesn't work this way. It's their word against the officer's word. The officers have made comments like this when they were asked for more info: "...as you know how your kids are." LIke I said, when you are dealing with at-risk youth, it's going to happen more, as they are usually high or running from getting caught. Our job is to help them understand that officers are there to help, and if they truly feel they were wronged, then they can report it. I think over the years, we've only had 1 or 2 students file a report, and there were parents involved, and I can't remember what happened in those cases?

You told me that the officers admitted it to YOU so it's you and the students word against the officer. You are a teacher and could/should file a complaint if this is true.

Here is an example from last month - 5 teachers just witnessed a rough-up of our students (2 in person and 3 from the front lawn of school), and it was a case of mistaken identity, and when a teacher questioned one of the officers about whether he was going to apologize to our students, he received a not so nice response. Two teachers were witness to the entire incident as they were walking back from a restaurant, right behind our students, as it was lunchtime. This response just came from one of the officers, but the other 2 in attendance, came up and did apologize to our students and the teachers (one of them accussed the teacher of covering up). They believed the middle-aged person over our students, despite evidence to the contrary. It wasn't until the car load of people showed up that the middle-aged person called to beat up our students (mistaken identity), that the officers finally believed our students. It was not a nice incident, and we had to do damage control for weeks, but that is part of our job. We used it as teachable moment.

Ok so 5 teachers witnessed a rough up of one of your innocent students and none of you will file a complaint, you are using it as a "teachable moment"? Unbelievable. Really.

Trust me it is the same here in Toronto and the GTA and if Tiger doesn't know this then I'm going to use this as a "teachable moment".

Not sure what else to say to you, as you seem to have some serious issues with my posts? Clearly, what we considered a rough up, is not what the police consider a rough up. They are the trained experts in the field, and reacted based on the information they were given, end of story. How in the world are you going to prove that it was a bit excessive? It seemed excessive to us, but we aren't trained officers. If our students were indeed the criminals they were looking for, and had weapons on them, then the force and manner in which they swarmed our students would be appropriate, I would think? As well, I already said one of them accused a teacher of lying, so how do you reason with someone like that?

You seem to be describing some perfect world, IMHO. We can't file a complaint - what is the complaint going to say? If our students had come out with bruises or such, I'm still not sure we could make a complaint. The officers are experts at their job, and reacted as they saw fit, with the info they had. And this is exactly the teachable moment we used. People do the best with what situation is before them, end of story. Just like they did in the OP's community with the lockdown. I really don't follow your line of thinking at all...

This may be a difference in where I live and where you live. Here, the officer would have been put on leave and the incident investigated. If the officer was neglient and screwed up the identity, there would be a public apology and the officer would be facing losing their job. However, if the officer did do the ground work and wasn't neglient, then there would still be an apology. At least on the depts around me that I personally know of. However, questioning an officer on the scene minutes after an incident when emotions are high is not usually a good idea. That goes for any situation really. Like if that same student wasn't mistaken identity and was deserving of what happened and that same teacher approached and told that student to apologize, I'm sure the response would be similar. I deal with diffusing high stress situations and the first 15 minutes immediately following high emotions and stress is not the time to start jumping in on people. I'm not saying the cop was right and the teacher was wrong.....just saying wrong time/place.

I can understand about giving trust when dealing with at risk youth. However, they are also the ones who will do or say anything to someone they respect to keep that respect too as I'm sure you are well aware of.

If you are seeing situations where students are being physically attacked in your prescence and you know they were not in the wrong. Instead of approaching the officer, call their supervisor and file a complaint. It will get that officers attention quicker than someone trying to take the action in their own hands.

We are trained in crisis intervention as we teach at-risk students, so no, the officer wasn't questioned within 10 mins of the incident. This whole incident took a long time to process. They patted down and swarmed on our kids because they took the word of a middle aged person over our students. She admitted that she lied and threatened them, once the carload of hers sons pulled up to handle business.

What you describe is a perfect world, and that is not how things work around here, whether it be police officers or teachers. In most of the real world, adults are taken at face value over teens. It's the officer's word over the teens, and that is why the other 2 officers came over and positively handled the situation, in the same manner we do in our school. Mistakes happen, apologize, learn from them and move on. It was interesting though, as the 2 officers came over and apologized to the teachers - the teacher who was accused of lying, took the apology, but both teachers said it wasn't them who they needed to apologize to, but our students, and the officers agreed it was a point well taken, and immediately went over to the boys and smoothed things over very nicely.

I've seen some confusing threads, but this one takes the cake.

Tiger talks about a study done in her area BY the police force, that showed that it's a high stress job and that the police officers can have serious problems because of it.

Then a bunch of spouses of police officers talk about how it's a high stress job and that they can have problems because of it.



But they are also yelping at Tiger for talking about the PROOF of what they, themselves, are saying?

It's very confusing. I don't understand how a study showing the same thing they are saying can be offensive.




OK seriously. If all those adults were there to see something wrong happen, and when the adults approached the officer to ask for an apology for his behaviour, and he responded rudely, and if this situation isn't the only situation where they saw problems with the local officers....WHERE is the trust going to come from, that a complaint would be taken seriously? I'm sure they feel that it would all fall on deaf ears, as it seems that in their area in their situation, there is a pattern of behaviour that isn't endearing the police officers to the students OR teachers.

I grew up in an area with awful police officers. My mom repeatedly called the police on my father, and EVERY TIME they came out, my dad took them outside, schmoozed them as only he can do, joked around with them, and they would leave. He, a strong 6'2" man, never once was arrested or warned, even though his small bruised 5'1" wife, then ex-wife, wanted them to do it. After awhile, she just didn't call anymore. If he called to threaten that he was coming over (I was 4 when they divorced, but he hadn't lived with us since I was 2 or before, but he haunted her for a few years after she divorced him), we took off. Didn't call the police; they had proven that they wouldn't do anything. She just took shelter with her friends.

There was no reason for her to believe that a complaint would do anything. This was caused by the officers that came over.

Years later, SHE was the shelter for women she came across who were dealing with the same situation, because we lived in the same area with a heavy old boy's network.


How can you expect a group of people to make official complaints, when they very likely feel that such an action would bring those same officers down even harder on their group?



As for how I feel, you're darned RIGHT I expect perfection from police officers. I expect that their behaviour is exemplary. I expect that they won't let people off. I was given a warning once, instead of a ticket, and while I was glad I wasn't going to have to deal with an out of state ticket while in a rental car, I was disappointed that this guy decided to ignore the fact that I was going at least 10 miles over the limit, just because I honestly and too-much-informationally (b/c that's how I am) blurted out that I wasn't paying attention to the speed because I was so busy looking up at the GORGEOUS West Virginia mountains (total truth, that state is gorgeous and very distracting). I even asked "are you sure?" because it bothered me that he took his job so casually.


So to me, what everyone is saying (that is backed up by the study) is understandable, b/c it's a high stress job, but it should never have gotten to this point. There should be counselors available at all times, and NO shame at all in making use of them. There should be ways for them to blow off steam at the end of a shift, in a healthy productive manner, so they aren't taking yesterday into tomorrow. There shouldn't be people THAT close to the edge, that they shoot themselves and cause such an uproar, because they should be getting taken care of ALREADY.

And it bothers me to no end that it isn't like that. Don't know why it doesn't bother the people themselves, or their loved ones.

Thank you! Tiger

 

[luvmy3]

Exactly! Heck, I'm sure many of these people on here would quit their jobs if they had to wear a bullet proof vest and carry a gun to work each day to guarantee they came home each night.

Not to mention wearing a 30 pound belt for at least 12 hours a day. Spit at, punched, kicked, swore at, shot at, called a pig 10 times a day, listening to cop eating donut jokes 10 times a day (boy they never get old!), and slaughtered daily in the media.


All for the same pay as a teachers salary (at least where I live).

Oh--but along with this you are expected to be God. You must strive for 100% perfection. No mistakes are permitted or you will be considered lower than the criminals that you are protecting everyone else from.

I guess people forget that police are humans. They make mistakes same as everyone else.

To the PP, it is not a requirement to write every person that is pulled over a ticket. A ticket is usually given if the officer feels it will curb the behavior. However, if the officer feels that pulling over and talking will fix the problem that it IS within the scope of their job to give only a warning. That's why they have "warning tickets" printed up.

http://www.indystar.com/article/201...g-death?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|IndyStar.com

Read this article. See if this is a job you would want to sign up for and the type of people in society you want to work with every single day.

Perfection is reached by NOONE. Period. To expect it of anyone is stupid, plain and simple.

Who here said they could or wanted to do their job?

 

[Spoodleink]

It has nothing to do with being an injured party. However, I know that what you are saying is an exaggerated truth or a story you have picked up from hearing someone else talk about. Because, unless you were traveling behind this cop and keeping up, you would not know how fast they were driving. Also, the only way to see this cop flash his badge to the other officer would be to stop your car and get out and watch...which would be near impossible if you were going 80 mph to keep up to match the speedometer to know how fast they were going to begin with. So there are some inconsistencies with the story. It is not one that was witnessed firsthand unless you were either cop or a passenger in the car.

I said this is an officer I know, HE TOLD ME he has done this on more than one occasion. Maybe he was lying to me about says something about his judgment too.

Does it happen, yes I am sure it does. It happens in EVERY profession! You'd be crazy to think that no judge or political figure ever used their clout to get out of a ticket! Heck, people lie all the time to get out of tickets! People use their clout to get or get out of situations all the time. One career is not better than the other for this. To say it is wrong for police to and then saying it is ok for everyone else is hypocritical.

I didn't say other people don't use their influence, I think it's wrong for them to do it to as well. Under your logic if I get pulled over for speeding should I tell the officer not to give me a ticket because someone else was speeding ? I never said one career is better or worse than an other. I said the police are given a lot of power in our society and because of that they are rightly held to a higher standard. That is a fact it wasn't a condemnation of anyone.

 

[crashbb]

Tiger talks about a study done in her area BY the police force, that showed that it's a high stress job and that the police officers can have serious problems because of it.

Then a bunch of spouses of police officers talk about how it's a high stress job and that they can have problems because of it.



But they are also yelping at Tiger for talking about the PROOF of what they, themselves, are saying?

My issue is that the sturdy Tiger has cites, as stated, can not (should not) be used as proof for the claims being made. So, either the study is so flawed as to be meaningless or Tiger is citing it out of context. Her further clarifications about the study, haven't helped clear up the issue.