*Rant* My daughter's teacher is going to fail her before school even starts...

[golfgal]

This is the exact reason my kids will NEVER do band.

I didn't understand when I was in middle school why my mother wouldn't let me go on, all she said was that she didn't want me to march. When I notified my band director, I went from first chair to last in a matter of weeks, I never won another challenge - I know I didn't suck that bad considering I held first chair for the last 2 years. My flute was also stolen for almost 2 weeks. I told the director I was quitting the next day if I didn't get it back. It was "left" in the same spot I always kept it the next day. Needless to say, our program didn't handle rejection well.

Flash forward a few years. I returned to the school I graduated from as a paraprofessional for 2 blind teens. Both of them marched. The boy played trumpet (limited vision, but enough to march) and the girl was on the drum line. As school progressed and her goals changed (she wanted desperately to break into the top 10 in her class) she found out that band was taking up too much time for her course load.

She talked to the instructor and he wrote a horrible letter to her counselor and the school principal saying that myself and her teachers were failing her because she didn't have time for band. Taking great offense to his comments, I responded by reminding him the academics ALWAYS come first and there is no way I would let my child (as in my child, not my student, her mother was of the same opinion I found out) be struggling academically and be allowed to continue in an EXTRAcurricular that required more time than a part-time job. He then tried guilting her into staying by telling her she was letting the WHOLE band down if she walked away (my student is very sensitive and doesn't like people being upset with her). She nearly had a breakdown due to the pressure. Ultimately she walked away and ended up graduating 3rd in her class - she missed Saluatorian by 0.028 of a point.

Over the last 2 years he's lost 25% of his band kids due to the unreasonable requirements for the class. I will say they do understand that kids have some commitments and require them to attend 4 of the 6 home games in order to pass. I think it's a little steep to require them to attend all of them. The band had to switch competitions circuits too due to lack of enrollment this year. They finished their last competition last week. The competitions were probably the worst requirement of all. Most of our kids would have to be at the school at 4 a.m. to load the bus and wouldn't return until 1-2 a.m. after the competition. Ridiculous!!!

So you are ready to condemn EVERY band program because you had ONE bad instructor? We have 3 full time band directors, one band director from another school (an hour away) that comes to work with our band, we have 4 college students studying to be band directors all work with our band every year and NONE of them are like this AT ALL. They are wonderful instructors that expect a lot out of the kids yet still make it so much fun that the kids can't WAIT for band to start each year.

 

[allison443]

I guess I don't understand why OP said she tried to check the schedule but it wasn't available. Okay, so she knew there could be a possibility of conflict, but since the schedule wasn't ready she just went ahead and planned the vacation anyway? Then she can't be surprised there was a conflict.

Also, I'm very surprised someone with a 3.8 would be willing to take a C. Is it given less weight or something?

 

[jen0610]

Wow, 16 pages and counting.

Just want to add what may be a radical idea: families can have "family time" without a multi-day Disney vacation, or even a vacation at all. If we were really only limited to 1 week/year when DW and I could both take vacation, and that time would conflict with our kids' graded activities for which they have already made a commitment, we'd cancel our WDW vacation and plan something that worked with their schedules.
Don't flame me, bro.

This is SOOOOOO worth repeating.

 

[kwitcherkicken99]

So you are ready to condemn EVERY band program because you had ONE bad instructor?

You didn't read on.... \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/

I won't say all directors are like this, but there is no way my kids will ever do band considering we have no intentions of moving and my kids will be raised in the school system that has program that is the focus of my complaint.

I have seen 1st hand what dedicated and caring teachers do for their students and how it makes the kids shine. My girl had 2 very special teachers her last year - their techniques of integrating what she needed to be successful ended up benefitting her entire class and all of the kids were better off for it, but that in no way excuses this guy's behavior of personal attacks against his colleagues, teachers and paras + her counselor, and the guilt that he placed on her. It's just not right.

P.S. - It wasn't one bad experience with 1 instructor... it was 2 with 2! My personal issues from when I was in band and again for my student. Both teachers are still a part of the program. It was always funny that my flute went missing one day and when I told him that I was going to drop band the next day my flute magically reappeared. It was also "funny" that I held 1st chair for two years, I only lost the seat twice and regained it the following week, and magically was moved to the back of the bus in a matter of weeks. I did everything I was supposed to and practiced religiously. I was penalized for my parent's decision to not let me continue. It wasn't cool.

 

[declansdad]

Teachers don't fail students nor do they pass students; students do that on their own. In this case, your daughter is breaking the rules and the consequence is an F. That isn't the fault of the teacher.

 

[golfgal]

Wanting to take a vacation with your child is not snowflake mentality, OMG you people think that almost anything is snowflake.

Why can't she schedule a vacation if she didn't get the info. Should we just wait around for the school to dictate everything, I guess that makes schools snowflakes. If you have requested the dates time and time again and you can't or they won't give you the info, to bad for them and I would absolutely be taking it to the highest level and fwiw I have never complained about anything in my entire life and my oldest is in 8th grade, not one time. So I am hardly a helicopter parent., . They have a responsibility to keep parents informed of what is going on. No way should we just sit here and wait for them to decide when we can go on vacation.

I am still in total amazement of how you guys can defend getting graded before the actual start of school. Not punished or kicked off but actually graded, it doesn't seem legal to me.

I am in total amazement that you can't figure out that this is PART of her grade and that this girl made a commitment to the band and the mom scheduled a vacation KNOWING it would conflict with at least ONE game. The DD should never have been signed up for band in the first place if the mom knew they could ONLY take vacation those 2 weeks for the entire year (which I find hard to believe) AND that she is ok working for a place that will ONLY let her take vacation those 2 weeks of the year yet it isn't ok for a band director to require kids be at a handful of performances during marching band

 

[mhsjax]

This is SOOOOOO worth repeating.

Sorry that gets old after a while. You have to have some fun in life. why does everyone here seem to begrudge that family a vacation.

We have had plenty of time as a family, but guess what, hubby had a heart attack last summer then knee surg then this summer another knee surg and then out of town for a month for work. Sorry but yeah, I am going on vacation and nothing and nobody will stop me, my kids deserve it and so do we. Oh and by the way, we aren't going to WDW but my kids have given up more than anyone here knows and they are going on vacation because THEY WANT TO. and my DD coach knows the circumstances and is letting us out of our first mandatory practice. So there is a happy medium and not everything is black and white.

 

[StacyMarie]

What I find most ironic about this whole discussion is that over on the Budget Board, in the Back to School thread, there are teachers who are complaining about parents who don't like the rules and then go and complain to the principal. I click over here and find a parent who does not like the rules and is going to complain to the principal. I would HATE to be a teacher in this snowflake environment. They are absolutely not compensated well enough.

School and all that it entails is your daughters job. Your job will not allow you to take vacation any other time. Why should a separate set of rules be applied to your child?
You should have not scheduled vacation without knowing for sure what your child's commitment was. You did anyway and now you or your child has to take the hit. Either she fails, she drops an activity that she has invested time in and can help her college applications or you forfeit some money on a trip. Those are your only options. Pick one and move forward.

On another note, I cannot imagine a situation in which I would set my kid up so that the absolute best grade they could get was a C. Especially a kid who is grade focused and high achieving like your child. Every family is different and every body views grades differently but in this house, knowing that no matter how hard you try, the best you can get is a C would just never, ever fly.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

I am not asking for a separte set of rules or an exception to the rules, I am asking for rules that are clarified and fair ACROSS THE BOARD! Exceptions have been made for favorite students to make up when a performance is missed by writing a report. This offer was not extended to my daughter. There is no written contract that is signed by the band members and the families like our choir has for the students. I signed a choir contract that has a 30-page class requirement manual attached to it for the upcoming school year in JUNE. There is no rule book for band. There is no contract. There is just the rules the band director makes up as he goes along, they change whenever he wants them to and he enforces them sometimes and not others. This discussion would not be even taking place if this teacher made their students sign contracts regarding what their requirements are before the class begins. To give my child an F in the class for the trimester on the first day of school because she missed 2 football games that happened before school even started and EVEN THOUGH she attended all 13 pre-grame practices M-F from noon to 5 and a 5-night overnight required 350.00 band camp where they practice 90% of the time they are there is not a fair practice. Shouldn't the band camp hours count toward her grade. That is 20 days of practice before the football games that she does not get credit for, but missing those 2 football games result in an F.

As for "setting my child up" to take a C, it was her choice and a decision I allowed her to make. She would take the C and then be able to do extra on top of that to most likely be able to bring the C up into the B range. If an F is given, there is no amount of extra credit that she could do to get the grade up into the level she would like it to be before the end of the marking period.

 

[golfgal]

You didn't read on.... \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/



P.S. - It wasn't one bad experience with 1 instructor... it was 2 with 2! My personal issues from when I was in band and again for my student. Both teachers are still a part of the program. It was always funny that my flute went missing one day and when I told him that I was going to drop band the next day my flute magically reappeared. It was also "funny" that I held 1st chair for two years, I only lost the seat twice and regained it the following week, and magically was moved to the back of the bus in a matter of weeks. I did everything I was supposed to and practiced religiously. I was penalized for my parent's decision to not let me continue. It wasn't cool.

I don't find it funny at all. I find it that the teacher knew you were not going to continue with band so he gave that chair to someone that was. I wouldn't put a lot of time and effort into teaching a student that was going to quit the next week either. What if your kids want to do band, are you going to say no?

 

[KathyTX]

Due to general rudeness and arguments, this thread is closed.