Question on new point chart

[FuzzyMelton]

As stated it may be in the contract, but the point is your on vacation you take time out of your vacation to go with the guide and there maybe a small percent of people who read the all the papers they give you but people like me took them for their word and they LIED.. Bottom line..A point here and a point there will add up quick over the years..Very upset with disney and I hope when we take our first DVC vacation in march my guide calls me to see how things are and if he doesn't call I will be calling him..Also the biggest point of all is the salesman lied. he told my wife and I that the point chart he showed us would have the exact same numbers on it in thru out our contract.. The only thing that would change would be maint fees..

HERE HERE!!!! Whether it affects you + or - isn't the case. We all planned, were shown and told that the points would not change by our salesperson and now they have. The only way they wen't down was if you stay only on weekends. For the rest of us if you stay <1 week or >1week it was an overall point increase. That means my points go much less than they did before. True, it wasn't a 50% increase, and some will feel the benefit but for my situation it isn't and that is why I and most of the other people are upset.

You fully know that no one has the time or the energy to read that entire contract in leaglease, especially right there during the presentation or paper signing. The salesman stated that we were buying the rest of our vacations at today's dollars. That just isn't true anymore.

 

[Sammie]

The thing is that regardless of what the POS states, DVC sales people should not be making statements that are either out and out not true or evasive.

That is not what DVC used to be like. Other time shares were famous about being evasive about what you were buying and before you knew you were locked into something you really did not want or could use.

Disney's own website states they are above that and they also state they believe in the hertiage and principles of conduct set forth by Walt Disney.

Many of us are just not seeing that type of customer service lately. So while the actual changes do not bother me, the way they are doing business lately does bother me alot.

 

[KLR-wlv]

You're dreaming. If you sell your contract, someone will buy it and spend the money at WDW that you did before. Disney loses nothing. Someone else's dollars are just as green as yours. Nothing will bite them in the butt, all that will happen is that a different family will be staying in the villa that you previously occupied. And Disney won't care one bit.

This is a huge assumption on your part that folks will keep flocking to Disney.Before Eisner came to the company, Disney went through a bad spell of poor management and less than stellar economic decisions. DVC management obviously thinks that DVC is a sure thing that anything they touch turns to gold. Just because something has done well in the past does not make it 100% certain it will continue. In this economy especially. You CAN ruin a good thing. ANd about 40% of the people on the boards think that this move did just that. I realize you are not in that 40%. I guess time will tell how this change effects the larger picture.

 

[Eddie]

Not really sure how this will affect us yet. We usually goe summers but wait a bit to make plans and always find rooms.

Now I never really liked our guide but will say he was forthright in informing us (and I think it was back in 2003 or 4 when we did our tour) that while points have not changed much, I think OKW in 1995 or so was one I remember that DVC could re-allocate the points at some point.,

I think once things calm down people will re-adjust a bit when and how they go to DIS. Just have to do a little tweaking in ones habits.

As noted previously each place only has so many points to sell so I really do not see how anyone thinks more $ comes DIS way.

 

[tx2tn]

It will now cost us considerable more points for the same stay!

That is EXACTLY what Disney was after. A higher profit margin. If they can get US to spend more points for the same product as before, the bottom line is more profit for them. So SAD.

 

[CarolMN]

I don't mean to sound dumb, but I thought they couldn't change how many points it took to book a DVC room I know the week equals the same, but Sun-Thurs is what we always book.
We purchased a small BLT contract that allowed us to book 4 October nights, every other year, in a MK view room. Now we don't have enough & they don't allow add-ons of less than 100 points now.
Not sure what we should do After we do a stay in October (like we planned), maybe we should just sell our 70 point BLT contract & call it a day

If it were me (and if I were willing to buy a few more points to take my preferred trip), I'd call my guide and ask to add whatever number I needed - even though it is less than 100. I would say that it wasn't right for them to change the charts so soon after the sales began and before reservations weren't even being taken! Might not work, but if enough people asked, maybe they would make exceptions for those in your situation. If the guide says no, then ask if they will take the points back and give you your money back (I really doubt that, but again, why not ask).

If you sell, you will lose money, so be sure to think it through before you act.

Sorry you are in this position.

 

[Tara]

That's exactly what we were told. Now with the wait list restrictions & adjusted point charts, I just want out

Our guide very clearly told us that the total number of points in a resort won't change - some seasons can go up and down, but it's a "closed" system in that they can't add (or take away) points overall.

 

[El&Asmom]

That is EXACTLY what Disney was after. A higher profit margin. If they can get US to spend more points for the same product as before, the bottom line is more profit for them. So SAD.

Bottom line is that we will be getting less for our money because we will NOT be adding on. Therefore we will be going for fewer nights using the same amount of points. We will spend less at the parks and more time at home not spending money at Disney.
If the DVCs were already operating at close to 100% occupancy, I'm not sure how this change will help them. I can't see too many current owners adding on just so that they can take the same vacation they always took only now they need more points to do it. Most people will be far too bitter to spend their money on a product that just last year they already had free and clear. I sure know that I won't. We'll just have to deal with the fact that our points won't go as far as they once did, and take shorter vacations because of it.

Maybe in a few years, when newbies come in never having seen the old charts, it won't matter as much. With the way the economy is, and the continued increase in costs for DVC, I wonder if they took too big of a risk with all of these "member enhancements".

 

[alisonslp]

It looks like we will be paying more for each of our vacations since we had planned to go only Sun-thurs to save on points. So I'm personally not happy with the decision.

BUT I really don't think this was some big scheme from Disney to get people to buy more points. First of all, if you need more points, chances are you're going to buy them from an existing owner, since you only need a few. WDW doesn't make out on this. Second, I think they truly were trying to help the owners who want to take long weekends (to fit 1 or 2 trips during the school year). I'm betting that they have have a lot of complaints about the large disparity between the week day and weekend points. Currently, the weekends are extremely expensive in comparison. I know I cringe when I look at those high points! By readjusting, it makes it easier for owners to enjoy the weekend experience. I know that once the change takes place, we likely will not worry as much about whether we stay S-R vs coming in or leaving on a Sat.

BTW, our guide fully informed us of the possibility of major reallocation, though he down played it saying it has only happened once in several years.

I can't remember who wrote this, but I totally agree that WDW likely has plans to eventually totally even out the points across a week. They just have to do it in steps as per the contract. If so, then it will certainly be alot more expensive (at lease 25% more) for anyone typically stays S-R.

One last thought. WDW can't be thinking this will bring in more revenue - if anything it will be less because families will be cutting a day or two off their vacation due to the reallocation (that is particularly true if WDW goes to equal points across the week) - that means less ticket and food money for the days lost.

Alison

 

[mickeymom629]

How does this get more $ for Disney? If they have a certain number of points to sell, how does re-arranging the points chart do that? The points chart is simply how we use them.

"To help address a growing Member interest in weekend stays" - Is there really a "growing number"? It seems like most of us who do not stay the weekends, because of the higher points, understood this from the beginning and never complained. The points are still higher and I will still not want to use my points for weekends.

Now, unfortunately, my Sun-Thurs trips will cost me more. I guess Disney isn't caring about the Member interest who were fine with avoiding the weekend. And, again, how does this generate more money for Disney?

I wonder how many DVC members prefer weekend only trips as compared with member who prefer Sun-Thurs trips. It seems to me that the people who were staying for the weekend were probably staying for the whole week and have plenty of points.

 

[Inkmahm]

That is EXACTLY what Disney was after. A higher profit margin. If they can get US to spend more points for the same product as before, the bottom line is more profit for them. So SAD.

Again...

One more time - this is a point reallocation, not a point increase. In fact some of us will see a decrease in the number of points needed for our stay.

 

[Inkmahm]

As noted previously each place only has so many points to sell so I really do not see how anyone thinks more $ comes DIS way.

Exactly!

 

[Inkmahm]

This is a huge assumption on your part that folks will keep flocking to Disney.Before Eisner came to the company, Disney went through a bad spell of poor management and less than stellar economic decisions. DVC management obviously thinks that DVC is a sure thing that anything they touch turns to gold. Just because something has done well in the past does not make it 100% certain it will continue. In this economy especially. You CAN ruin a good thing. ANd about 40% of the people on the boards think that this move did just that. I realize you are not in that 40%. I guess time will tell how this change effects the larger picture.

Explain how someone selling their contract at BWV, VWL, BCV etc to someone else requires any kind of assumption about people flocking to Disney.

The contracts are already sold by Disney. The resorts are 100% sold. Someone will be using the points, whether it is the current owners or the new owners if someone decides to sell their contract.

 

[tecodis]

I was under the same assumption as you. When we purchased a year ago our guide told us (as a selling point) that although the cash rate can increase year to year, the point values will remain the same. The only weeks that would change would be easter and thankgiving, depending on when they fell. Obviously our guide misled us. A friend explained to me today that they can change the point values for days as long as they don't change the overall point total for the resort. Where they have raised the daily point value for the weekdays they have offset it for weekends. Where some weeks go up other weeks go down. It makes sense to me but I don't explain very well, hopefully you can make sense. It affects us too as we usually stay 12 nights as opposed to 14 missing one weekend. It will now cost us considerable more points for the same stay!

Hmmm...seems many of you seemed to get some very questionable guides.

When I was considering my initial purchase, my guide never indicated that any given vacation period would remain the same number of points year after year. She certainly indicated that the total number of points on the chart couldn't change though. As she advised, if they increase in one place, they have to decrease in another. The addition of available inventory (new rooms) at that resort is the only way total points available to rent would change ~ I suspect this will be the case when SSR adds the treehouse villas this year.

My guide was the best! Kudos to Diane M. at the DTD store in Chicago!!

 

[Inkmahm]

Hmmm...seems many of you seemed to get some very questionable guides.

When I was considering my initial purchase, my guide never indicated that any given vacation period would remain the same number of points year after year. She certainly indicated that the total number of points on the chart couldn't change though. As she advised, if they increase in one place, they have to decrease in another. The addition of available inventory (new rooms) at that resort is the only way total points available to rent would change ~ I suspect this will be the case when SSR adds the treehouse villas this year.

My guide was the best! Kudos to Diane Manuel at the DTD store in Chicago!!

I'll give the same Kudos to our guide- Byron H. (not sure if the DIS likes us to give full names...) He told us the very same thing your guide did which matches the contract we signed.

 

[palhockeymomof2]

HERE HERE!!!! Whether it affects you + or - isn't the case. We all planned, were shown and told that the points would not change by our salesperson and now they have. The only way they wen't down was if you stay only on weekends. For the rest of us if you stay <1 week or >1week it was an overall point increase. That means my points go much less than they did before. True, it wasn't a 50% increase, and some will feel the benefit but for my situation it isn't and that is why I and most of the other people are upset.

You fully know that no one has the time or the energy to read that entire contract in leaglease, especially right there during the presentation or paper signing. The salesman stated that we were buying the rest of our vacations at today's dollars. That just isn't true anymore.

Wow...so sorry your sales person said that...When we bought in 2001 our sales person never said the point charts would not change.....she was very informative and we discussed the possiblity of our vacation times/size of the villa we would use.... changing as our kids got older.....we didn't sign while a disney..brought the paperwork home....to read & then sign....

 

[Kmango]

As stated it may be in the contract, but the point is your on vacation you take time out of your vacation to go with the guide and there maybe a small percent of people who read the all the papers they give you but people like me took them for their word and they LIED.. Bottom line..A point here and a point there will add up quick over the years..Very upset with disney and I hope when we take our first DVC vacation in march my guide calls me to see how things are and if he doesn't call I will be calling him..Also the biggest point of all is the salesman lied. he told my wife and I that the point chart he showed us would have the exact same numbers on it in thru out our contract.. The only thing that would change would be maint fees..

Good heavens, you gave them many thousands of dollars on their word? If anything is the moral of this whole brouhaha, it's "Read things before you sign them. All of them. Ask questions if you don't understand them."

 

[tx2tn]

If you bought and plan and the only time you can go is in that time period and or days of the week then it is a increase....

EXACTLY! And the fact of the matter is that a majority of people will see an increase. Disney knows this. They have the data.

YES YES YES, some will see a decrease, but the majority will not. Disney is counting on that.

If I can only go SUN-THUR, then I will be able to stay at my resort fewer days than before. The value of that contract has been degraded. That's what I am upset about. You can't look at the overall point system to see the effects of this allocation, you have to look at the majority and see how it affects them.

 

[Buckeye Fan]

Our guide very clearly told us that the total number of points in a resort won't change - some seasons can go up and down, but it's a "closed" system in that they can't add (or take away) points overall.

Unfortunately, I was negatively impacted as a VB owner. However, I can honestly say that I knew it was a risk. Our guide specifically told us that the total number of points for a resort could be re-allocated in any way, at any time, but that Disney rarely made changes. He even used the example that a week in a 1-BR may go up, but that a studio, 2-BR or GV would have to go down. He also mentioned the season/holiday changes as well. So, for me personally, I'm not upset at Disney or my guide. It's just unfortunate I'm impacted by the changes.

We purchased 150 points at Vero so we could reserve a 2-BR Sunday - Thursday each year. Now, I don't have enough points to do that now. I probably will look at a resale in the near future (25 - 50 points) to make up the difference. The fees at Vero are so high, though!

 

[White_Sox_Fan]

Hmmm...seems many of you seemed to get some very questionable guides.

When I was considering my initial purchase, my guide never indicated that any given vacation period would remain the same number of points year after year. She certainly indicated that the total number of points on the chart couldn't change though. As she advised, if they increase in one place, they have to decrease in another. The addition of available inventory (new rooms) at that resort is the only way total points available to rent would change ~ I suspect this will be the case when SSR adds the treehouse villas this year.

My guide was the best! Kudos to Diane M. at the DTD store in Chicago!!

A agree, I have the same guide and fully understood the potential restructuring of the point charts. I apparently am also in the minority and read the complete POS within the 10 days cancellation period.