Question about World Passport value/process

[marykay]

I have seen many opinions that II exchanges are not really a good way to use DVC points - we are planning a trip for next April and are investigating our options...Disney Cruise (we would only have enough points for some family members and cash for rest)...II exchange...etc. The only family vacations we have really taken have both been to WDW (at our last we bought DVC). Considering something different this time around...kids are 14, 10, 10 and won't have too many more years with oldest. I called MS and they said I can put in a request for our spring break week, but should have a back-up plan in place such as a ressie with DVC property.

Are we realistic to think that we might have any chance at an II exchange for April 6-13/2008 or would we just be wasting our $75 search fee? We are interested in Cancun or Caribbean or any beachy place with lots of activities (we are not really lay in the sun types).

Do I understand people are saying that the value of DVC points is not equal to value of II resorts?

Any help greatly appreciated!!

 

[CarolMN]

Have you considered VB or HHI? Those are DVC resorts and likely still have availability for next April.

 

[marykay]

I have considered both, and am currently starting a day by day reservation at AKV followed by VB as my back up plan. The more I read here on HH, the more it sounds like we would like it...
can you comment on using points for a cruise or is it better to pay cash?
we are new to all of this...have not yet traveled as DVC members...there is so much to learn!
Again, just wanting to know if people think II exchanges a bad idea? and why?
thanks so much for your reply!

 

[RobDoc]

...Again, just wanting to know if people think II exchanges a bad idea? and why?
thanks so much for your reply!

The perceived "value" of the World Passport Collection exchanges are entirely based on how you value a DVC point. Some insist on placing a value on DVC points based on what they could be rented for - currently in the $10 -12 range on our Rent/Trade Board. Others will value their points on what their maintenance fees cost for the current year. I suspect that the "true" value for most members is somewhere in-between, although I'm among the "maintenance fee" group since our contracts were all purchased for $50 - $60 per point and were paid off long ago. Those who purchased recently at $94 per point should have a different position.

The non-DVC options are just that - options - and, IMO, should be considered in that vein. It's nice to have options for ways to use our points and the Disney Collection, Concierge Collection, Adventurers Collection, and World Passport Collection are just that - options.

No right or wrong, just options!

 

[Dean]

Are we realistic to think that we might have any chance at an II exchange for April 6-13/2008 or would we just be wasting our $75 search fee? We are interested in Cancun or Caribbean or any beachy place with lots of activities (we are not really lay in the sun types).

Do I understand people are saying that the value of DVC points is not equal to value of II resorts?

Any help greatly appreciated!!

There should be many locations for that time. That week really shouldn't be too difficult for any GENERAL location in the western hemisphere though specific resorts or areas my not work out. Where are you looking to go and what unit size do you require?

As for value, many II trades are a down trade using DVC. This is for many reasons including that most resorts are below the level of DVC and can be rented for less than you could rent your DVC points. But lets assume you are comparing two resorts, one DVC, that are equal on the surface. You've got to pay an exchange fee, you have precious little protection if life happens and you can't go and if you do get to go, unit assignments usually put exchangers in the worst units. OTOH, my daughter called this AM from the 5th floor balcony of the Maui Marriott where they're staying in a 1 BR OF unit gotten with a lower level Marriott studio. That's why I always try to be in a position where I'm trading up and not trading down.

 

[Kathi OD]

The non-DVC options are just that - options - and, IMO, should be considered in that vein. It's nice to have options for ways to use our points and the Disney Collection, Concierge Collection, Adventurers Collection, and World Passport Collection are just that - options.

No right or wrong, just options!

When DH and I purchased our DVC we did for one reason and one reason only...so that he would be somewhat forced into taking a vacation every year. He is a workaholic, but there is no way he is going to spend money for something and not use it. We chose DVC over other timeshares primarily because we enjoy WDW and knew that we would want to go at least every other year.

We have traded our DVC points to stay at II resorts several times. In each case, what we got in return for our points was MUCH nicer than what we would get for those same points at DVC. For example, this past April, during Easter week, we stayed in a studio at Sedona Summit in Arizona for 124 points. (btw, everyone should see those Red Rocks for themselves. Pictures do not even begin to tell how amazing that landscape is). A studio at OKW for the same week would have been 109 points, BUT the studio at Sedona Summit was at least twice as big as the OKW studio, It had a separate dining area with full size refrigerator and daily maid service. The bathroom was also at least 1/2 again as large as the ones in an OKW studio and the quality of the furnishings was much nicer than those at OKW. Additionally, had we stayed at any other DVC resort (excluding HH and VB), we would have used the same amount, if not more points for our stay.

Another time we stayed at Tree Tops in Gatlinburg, TN. We had a 2 bedroom equivalent of a townhouse...2 story, fireplace, balcony up and downstairs, on and on for less than 100 points for the week, and we were there during 4th of July week (high season for them). This was several years ago, and so I'm sure the points would be more now, but the point is that our accommodations have always exceeded what we expected.

So, the question really is what type of value to you attach to your points. Is it the actual dollar value or the flexibility to visit new locales in nice resorts with less out-of-pocket expense. Each owner has to decide what is best for them. For us, it's definitely the flexibility our points provide for us to go on vacation and stay somewhere nicer than the Holiday Inn.

 

[salmoneous]

I have seen many opinions that II exchanges are not really a good way to use DVC points

I think if you are a DVC member, II exchanges can be a pretty good value for your points.

However, we get questions from folks considering DVC and planning to stay at II resorts frequently. If that's the case, you can get an even better value by buying into a II resort directly.

 

[Dean]

For example, this past April, during Easter week, we stayed in a studio at Sedona Summit in Arizona for 124 points.

But that is relatively off season and one can easily rent a studio for $500-700 for the week during that time. If one knows that and still wants to exchange, their choice.

Another time we stayed at Tree Tops in Gatlinburg, TN. We had a 2 bedroom equivalent of a townhouse...2 story, fireplace, balcony up and downstairs, on and on for less than 100 points for the week, and we were there during 4th of July week (high season for them). This was several years ago, and so I'm sure the points would be more now, but the point is that our accommodations have always exceeded what we expected.

That would have been under the old system. But even then you would have either have had to be searching for a studio and got a 2 BR OR exchanging at under the 60 day window where you essentially traded a studio for a 2 BR. Neither are applicable anymore. That exchange today would be 270 DVC points even in flexchange time but is still a fairly easy exchange for any non DVC II or RCI member with a 2 BR unit that cost them $500 to PURCHASE and yearly fees of about $500 a year. I also don't think that resort is comparable to DVC, neither does II as it is not 5*.

 

[Kathi OD]

But that is relatively off season and one can easily rent a studio for $500-700 for the week during that time. If one knows that and still wants to exchange, their choice.

That would have been under the old system. But even then you would have either have had to be searching for a studio and got a 2 BR OR exchanging at under the 60 day window where you essentially traded a studio for a 2 BR. Neither are applicable anymore. That exchange today would be 270 DVC points even in flexchange time but is still a fairly easy exchange for any non DVC II or RCI member with a 2 BR unit that cost them $500 to PURCHASE and yearly fees of about $500 a year. I also don't think that resort is comparable to DVC, neither does II as it is not 5*.

I actually think the Tree Tops resort was much nicer than the DVC resorts (my opinion as I don't like the hotel feel of most of the DVC resorts). And no, we weren't under the 60 day window, but that's besides the point. Because my point was that depending on how you value your ownership. I don't consider the dollar value at all - way too much time & energy involved - I just want to go somewhere new & different and stay somewhere nicer than the Comfort or Holiday Inns without breaking the bank. DVC allows me to do that as you can get very nice accommodations outside the DVC program and visit other locales that you might not consider if you didn't own DVC. My feeling is that if you go somewhere and you enjoy your stay, then it was well worth whatever Disney value I "lost."

 

[Dean]

I actually think the Tree Tops resort was much nicer than the DVC resorts (my opinion as I don't like the hotel feel of most of the DVC resorts). And no, we weren't under the 60 day window, but that's besides the point. Because my point was that depending on how you value your ownership. I don't consider the dollar value at all - way too much time & energy involved - I just want to go somewhere new & different and stay somewhere nicer than the Comfort or Holiday Inns without breaking the bank. DVC allows me to do that as you can get very nice accommodations outside the DVC program and visit other locales that you might not consider if you didn't own DVC. My feeling is that if you go somewhere and you enjoy your stay, then it was well worth whatever Disney value I "lost."

Your choice of course but I'd submit that the effort to investigate exchange options appropriately is far more effort though it can also be a lot of fun. And then there's those poor souls that just trust that whatever they get through DVC will be just grand, they will often be disappointed. Then there's the II lottery when you never know if you're going to get what you want or when you will. Personally I wouldn't give up a single DVC points without considering what it's value is and what I'm getting in return but I guess that's just me.

 

[marykay]

thanks for your info, I guess that I am really not extremely concerned that we get exactly dollar for "point" value, but that we don't show up somewhere with II and find it is run down with little to offer - having spent a fair bit of time looking at the II properties on line, some of them really do sound kind of bad...is near a beach...sometimesthe pictures of the rooms and description of the activities don't sound like there is much to offer. OTOH some of the properties sound wonderful...we liked the sound of any of the Royals at Cancun or the Harbour Side Resort at Nassau, Bahamas...those both almost look too good to expect an exchange to come through.
I'm curious, if I have a week booked with DVC and put in an exchange request, does my "DVC week" show up somewhere that II members can look at and decide if they want to exchange? If so, would I have more trading power or success if I had a very desirable ressie as opposed to a questionable one (HH).
We would need a 2 BR (there are 5 of us), so either way it would cost

 

[marykay]

Oops!, had some trouble with my browser...what I was saying was that it would cost me 280 points for a week at HH, and for a week at AKV (sv)/VB it's going to cost 347 points for the week!! II will cost either 252 or 270 points depending on whether they consider April 6-13th mid or high season.

 

[Dean]

thanks for your info, I guess that I am really not extremely concerned that we get exactly dollar for "point" value, but that we don't show up somewhere with II and find it is run down with little to offer - having spent a fair bit of time looking at the II properties on line, some of them really do sound kind of bad...is near a beach...sometimesthe pictures of the rooms and description of the activities don't sound like there is much to offer. OTOH some of the properties sound wonderful...we liked the sound of any of the Royals at Cancun or the Harbour Side Resort at Nassau, Bahamas...those both almost look too good to expect an exchange to come through.

And that's my goal, to try to help people understand the information, they can make their own decisions. Definitely check out the resorts beyond the II and DVC literature, you'll be glad you did. Timeshare Users Group is a great resource to do so but there are others like Timesharing Today, redweeks, tripadvisors.

I'm curious, if I have a week booked with DVC and put in an exchange request, does my "DVC week" show up somewhere that II members can look at and decide if they want to exchange? If so, would I have more trading power or success if I had a very desirable ressie as opposed to a questionable one (HH).
We would need a 2 BR (there are 5 of us), so either way it would cost

There are other "costs" and negatives to the exchange system such as unit assignments. To answer you question, no, there is no way for members to see what you're offering. It wouldn't make any difference because the person who gets what DVC is offering won't be the same one you get the week from. II runs that behind the scenes and they can see all that's being offered and match them up as they see fit. In the past April 6-14 (week 14, Sunday to Sunday) would have been the last week of MID season at Marriott's Grande Ocean and likely for all the Marriott's there. But the points difference is not that much so unless you didn't have the 270, I wouldn't let the decision be made on that alone. That week will also be easier than upcoming weeks.

 

[marykay]

thanks dean, we won't make decision on 252 vs 270 points -we have to go April 6-13th so whether mid or high season, we'll take it. The info on how the exchanges work helped - not sure what you meant by unit assignments,though. And I will check out TUG for more info on the timeshare properties

 

[Dean]

The info on how the exchanges work helped - not sure what you meant by unit assignments,though.

Lets say you trade for Marriott's Barony Beach in HH which has ocean front, ocean side (aka ocean view) and garden view units. Their unit assignments are in the order of owners first, Marriott exchangers, cash renters (from Marriott) then other exchangers. They give priority to those staying multiple weeks or in multiple units within that framework. Thus exchangers tend to get the GV units which for BB are far inferior in location though actually nicer rooms. Comparing to Surfwatch, the GV units there are not nearly as much of a downgrade. Some non marriott resorts take this even further. So one of the keys to investigating a resort is how they do unit assignments and what's the worst you are likely to get.