Pulling kids out of school for trip

[SEA333]

I would assume this all has to do with money. I am sure they do not lose their daily funding for these students as those would be a school activity. However, if we pull them, they lose the funding for the child that day.

And I never thought of that before....I don't see how they can promote one and dismiss the other. But like you said, its sports.

That makes no sense. Pop Warner is a private club organization with no school district affiliations. Whether its Pop Warner or a family vacation or a college campus visit, it's all the same - a school absence. (Btw...Pop Warner is not the end all, be all of football leagues....there are many leagues considered to be in the same caliber as Pop), but it doesn't matter... no matter what youth football affiliation a kid is with, none are considered school-sanctioned activities.

 

[katyjeka]

Students who attend a large school district in Southwestern Va. have been going to POP Warner for several years. Correct, it is not school sponsored but the week they are gone is excused. They allow the kids to make up most of the work before they leave and somehow the children manage to survive the semester. Schools districts no longer place any value on family and care only about money. It is true, if a kids misses school they lose money. Of course this is a totally different issue as schools in the United States have major problems. (This is not an attack on teachers as they are the only thing right in today's school system)As a family we will continue to travel with our kids and teach them the importance of family time. My dh has a great job but must work seven days a week from Feb. until Nov. He is also under contract to work all holidays. We've learned to live with this as its been over 27 years now, but with the exception of a death or birth, he really can not miss. I refuse to lie and make up a death, as many of our friends in the area have, just to get my child excused. According to the rules of our school district our family is never allowed a vacation or only a two day weekend. This makes most vacations off limit to us.

 

[SEA333]

Students who attend a large school district in Southwestern Va. have been going to POP Warner for several years. Correct, it is not school sponsored but the week they are gone is excused. They allow the kids to make up most of the work before they leave and somehow the children manage to survive the semester. Schools districts no longer place any value on family and care only about money. It is true, if a kids misses school they lose money. Of course this is a totally different issue as schools in the United States have major problems. (This is not an attack on teachers as they are the only thing right in today's school system)As a family we will continue to travel with our kids and teach them the importance of family time. My dh has a great job but must work seven days a week from Feb. until Nov. He is also under contract to work all holidays. We've learned to live with this as its been over 27 years now, but with the exception of a death or birth, he really can not miss. I refuse to lie and make up a death, as many of our friends in the area have, just to get my child excused. According to the rules of our school district our family is never allowed a vacation or only a two day weekend. This makes most vacations off limit to us.

Yes, we also have leagues in our area that travel to orlando in Dec that are not Pop leagues (like my kids') that are excused absences, and DS 14 took 3 days of excused absences for his 8th grade Wash DC trip last year....the teachers and sponsors of the trip emphasized that this was counting as absences, unlike a field trip or 6th grade outdoor ed, and that it was vitally important that the kids show up the morning after they flew home (they got in at about 11:30pm due to delays) because the school district, while working *with* the trip program, did not consider the trip to be school sponsored.

So, its not just sports, like some posters say. Its so easy to villanize a footbal program, but they are not the only ones taking trips. In addition to DC, our school pulls choir kids every 4 years to go to Europe, and the band goes to disney every other. All of these are non school sanctioned, but our school is smart enough to understand that a well rounded education is essential to the growth of a person, and recognizes that these trips offer valuable insight to the students education. Sports included.

 

[3princes+1princess]

I agree, all of those listed, some of what are done at our school, are valuable for a well rounded education. But so is family time and vacations. Even to disney However, I cannot afford to send my children on a lot of these activities that are school sponsored.....my son's opportunity to go to DC cost about $1500, and I could take my whole family to DC for that much (luckily we have lots of hotel points due to my husbands job and long long travels). My sons show choir trip to Disney (for 3 days) is $2500, which is about half the cost of our 9 day trip as a family. (again, lucky to have a timeshare to exchange into and flight points).

And I also agree, if it is not too much for the kids to make up the work from these school sponsored/endorsed trips, then why should it be for a family week? The playing field needs to be leveled for this.

I guess I shouldn't complain, my school district has no such policy and I can take my kids when and where I want (and I homeschool two of them). But if it was not the case, I would be fighting it. It just makes me mad when I still believe it is all based on money and funding. And I feel bad for those people who don't have a choice on this.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I would assume this all has to do with money. I am sure they do not lose their daily funding for these students as those would be a school activity. However, if we pull them, they lose the funding for the child that day.

And I never thought of that before....I don't see how they can promote one and dismiss the other. But like you said, its sports.

It's also an "event" the teachers can plan around.



Let's say each teacher has a week every October when a big chunk of the class is gone for football, a week every November when a big chunk is gone for a band trip, and a week in March when a big chunk is gone for a cheer camp.

That's 3 specific events that all impact a large chunk of the student body and require extra planning on the teacher's part.

Now, compare that to having every student miss one random week throughout the year, and not the same week as any other student. Now, instead of asking the teacher to do extra work 3 times a year, you're asking for it every week. So, it's not really an apples & apples comparison.

 

[katyjeka]

I can give the teacher our trip date on the first day of school thus allowing them months to get work prepared for my children. Most people know weeks if not months ahead of time when their vacation is. Just because it isn't a large group going is no excuse. I'm sorry but I feel it's the teachers responsibility to have makeup work available to the student. The same high school student who failed a semester because of a five day vacation would have passed if it was a school sponsored event. If you believe otherwise, I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

[North of Mouse]

Really? She misses five days of school and fails a semester. Okay, a class is an hour long, so five hours of classroom instruction and I'm guessing homework at night which could still be completed. I guess I'm the only one who sees a problem with this.

I agree! There's more to this story than just missing 5 days of instruction in a semester and failing that semester.

We took our three out of school every year (yes, even in high school). They were willing to work extra hard to get all missed materials, plus the ones given ahead of time. We had very good working relations with their teacher and principals and have never given us any trouble.

We made sure from K. on that our children were respectful, not trouble makers and always did their work on time. The teachers and principals in turn always were respectful of us. And yes, all honor students.

 

[mjkacmom]

I can give the teacher our trip date on the first day of school thus allowing them months to get work prepared for my children. Most people know weeks if not months ahead of time when their vacation is. Just because it isn't a large group going is no excuse. I'm sorry but I feel it's the teachers responsibility to have makeup work available to the student. The same high school student who failed a semester because of a five day vacation would have passed if it was a school sponsored event. If you believe otherwise, I've got a bridge to sell you.

Your vacation should not make more work for the teachers. Even on school sponsored trips, it is up to my kids to gather the work they missed afterwards (which is usually easier for the teachers), and make it up in a timely fashion.

 

[jerseygal]

Your vacation should not make more work for the teachers. Even on school sponsored trips, it is up to my kids to gather the work they missed afterwards (which is usually easier for the teachers), and make it up in a timely fashion.

Two different high school had policies in place and STRONGLY discouraged students from vacationing during non school vacation times!
Both sons played Varsity Athletics, different sports and we could not vacation during Thanksgiving, Christmas, Easter Break, or winter break in February.
Did we like it? No, sometimes we longed for a vaca during those times.
Not only could we not vacation as a family during those weeks, we had to wait until mid August when sport camps/work schedules were done. Every vaca we took, was in the middle of August...

Both high schools were very rigorous and both sons didn't think it was "worth" it , trying to make up papers, missed classtime, tests, etc...

Oh well, those years fly! First non summer vaca will be this December for DH and I since youngest DS is now away at college. Guess that you can say "we paid our dues"!

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I agree! There's more to this story than just missing 5 days of instruction in a semester and failing that semester.

We took our three out of school every year (yes, even in high school). They were willing to work extra hard to get all missed materials, plus the ones given ahead of time. We had very good working relations with their teacher and principals and have never given us any trouble.

We made sure from K. on that our children were respectful, not trouble makers and always did their work on time. The teachers and principals in turn always were respectful of us. And yes, all honor students.

It was pointed out that under a block scheduling scenario, missing 5 days is equivalent to missing 10 under a traditional schedule.

Plus, it could be just as simple as that even under a traditional schedule. I know in my HS 7 unexcused absences was an "incomplete", no credit. We had one kid not graduate after accruing 21 tardies (equivalent to 7 absences) in a class that he was passing. His final tardy coming on the very last day of school.

 

[pigletgirl]

It's also an "event" the teachers can plan around.



Let's say each teacher has a week every October when a big chunk of the class is gone for football, a week every November when a big chunk is gone for a band trip, and a week in March when a big chunk is gone for a cheer camp.

That's 3 specific events that all impact a large chunk of the student body and require extra planning on the teacher's part.

Now, compare that to having every student miss one random week throughout the year, and not the same week as any other student. Now, instead of asking the teacher to do extra work 3 times a year, you're asking for it every week. So, it's not really an apples & apples comparison.

Correct.

I firmly believe that it's best not to miss any large chunk of time for vacation. Teachers have an allotted amount of time to teach different concepts and it isn't fair to the other students if the teacher has to go over everything again because someone was absent due to a vacation.

 

[katyjeka]

I understand its the child's job to gather missed worked and have no issue with this. But of course the same teacher will rearrange a schedule for a school sponsored activity as the above mentioned. I guess a solution is to vacation when a group is having a school sponsored event(sports, choir, cheerleading, etc) and several students will be away on the trip. Oh, I forgot my child will be unexcused and probably fail the semester while the other students have no issue. They somehow ALWAYS find a way to make up the missed work. I apologize to the school system that my dh works for a living, including summers. His vacation is the first three weeks of December, no exceptions!!! Its been this way for 27 years and I don't see it changing anytime soon. If we didn't "break" the schools rule we would never get to vacation. They are our children and we have a right to show them as much of the world as we choose. This debate will go on forever so I surrender. We refuse to feel guilty or that we've ruined our children's education because of a five day absence. Total nonsense.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I understand its the child's job to gather missed worked and have no issue with this. But of course the same teacher will rearrange a schedule for a school sponsored activity as the above mentioned. I guess a solution is to vacation when a group is having a school sponsored event(sports, choir, cheerleading, etc) and several students will be away on the trip. Oh, I forgot my child will be unexcused and probably fail the semester while the other students have no issue. They somehow ALWAYS find a way to make up the missed work. I apologize to the school system that my dh works for a living, including summers. His vacation is the first three weeks of December, no exceptions!!! Its been this way for 27 years and I don't see it changing anytime soon. If we didn't "break" the schools rule we would never get to vacation. They are our children and we have a right to show them as much of the world as we choose. This debate will go on forever so I surrender. We refuse to feel guilty or that we've ruined our children's education because of a five day absence. Total nonsense.

No need to get in a huff - folks are just pointing out there IS another side. As with anything in life, those who follow the rules are most often put in a pinch by the rules. It sucks. But at the same time, ya gotta have SOME rules. It's just how it is.

 

[seashoreCM]

How do the kids feel about missing school to go to Disney?

Would they themselves think they would find it really stressful to get the missed work done eventually? Would they themselves rather stay home and stay in school to keep that key position in the school play or on the football team?

Or would they themselves want to go to Disney no matter what it took?

Now as far as snow makeup days go, I am on the side of families in keeping any earlier made vacation plans anyway. Here the school should allow the kids to make up the work. But the kids have to actually make it up in timely fashion. But I would not expect teachers to create a different version of a test for the studen(s) who were on vacation on the makeup day when the test was given.

 

[SEA333]

I agree, all of those listed, some of what are done at our school, are valuable for a well rounded education. But so is family time and vacations. Even to disney However, I cannot afford to send my children on a lot of these activities that are school sponsored.....my son's opportunity to go to DC cost about $1500, and I could take my whole family to DC for that much (luckily we have lots of hotel points due to my husbands job and long long travels). My sons show choir trip to Disney (for 3 days) is $2500, which is about half the cost of our 9 day trip as a family. (again, lucky to have a timeshare to exchange into and flight points).

And I also agree, if it is not too much for the kids to make up the work from these school sponsored/endorsed trips, then why should it be for a family week? The playing field needs to be leveled for this.

I guess I shouldn't complain, my school district has no such policy and I can take my kids when and where I want (and I homeschool two of them). But if it was not the case, I would be fighting it. It just makes me mad when I still believe it is all based on money and funding. And I feel bad for those people who don't have a choice on this.

Oh, we are so on the same page. My kids, my decision. I love all of my kids' teachers, and have been/am personal friends with many of them over the years, and while I practice what I preach by telling my kids their job is to be the best student they can be so their teacher can be the best teacher *they* can be 99.9% of the time, the fact of the matter is that sometimes the teacher is going to *not* take into consideration the fact that I'm not really up for the "family" ocean animal project we've had to do for the third time when each kid has gone through 1st grade, or the working lighthouse project that no 5th grader can possibly do on their own without a (electrically inclined) parent helping wire it (again, times three kids), I will not take into consideration the schools feeling on my FINAL decision on when I take my kids on vacation. I will take them into consideration when thinking about the trip, but the final decision is mine and mine alone.

We surprised the kids with a disney trip last Nov, and I talked to all of their teachers about it before I went and told them I want to make it as easy as possible so whatever they felt comfortable with, class/homework wise, I would make sure the kids were caught up. But never once did I ask for their permission or care what they thought about us going (although every one stated in one way or another that they were super excited and happy for the kids...and all wanted to see the reveal!). Either I'm another really lucky one with a good district, or some districts are really that horrible, or people exaggerate the "worst case" here on the boards. Ill just go with "I'm really lucky!"

 

[SEA333]

How do the kids feel about missing school to go to Disney?

Would they themselves think they would find it really stressful to get the missed work done eventually? Would they themselves rather stay home and stay in school to keep that key position in the school play or on the football team?

Or would they themselves want to go to Disney no matter what it took?

Now as far as snow makeup days go, I am on the side of families in keeping any earlier made vacation plans anyway. Here the school should allow the kids to make up the work. But the kids have to actually make it up in timely fashion. But I would not expect teachers to create a different version of a test for the studen(s) who were on vacation on the makeup day when the test was given.

I get what you are saying, but seriously, i just have to comment (and not saying you are suggesting that you would do this)...no true football parent would EVER schedule a family vacation during football season! The semi-unique thing about football is there are only a handful of games per season - that translates to a whole lot of practice and training for a little bit of gameplay. No way would any real football mom do this to her player. And I would hope the same would be true for any other big commitment like a lead role in a play or other activity that has a huge prep time for a small window of opportunity. That's just silly, and really not even worth joining if a vacation is more important.

 

[MrsCobraBubbles]

I have no problem with pulling kids out of school for vacations. Yes, education is important, but so is family time. Our school district tolerates it, but they discourage it. We received a threatening letter the last time we went to Disney, threatening to turn us in to the truancy officer for missing 8 days (non-medical excused) of school. 8 days out of 180!!! I hate dealing with the school on this sort of thing, and I'd love to homeschool again, but my oldest wants to be in school with his friends. So we jump through the hoops and then go enjoy our vacations!

 

[richmo]

Was talking to a high school Chem teacher about this very subject over the weekend. He said they refer to grades kids get after coming back from a school year vacation as the 'Disney 'D'', even if it wasn't a Disney vacation.

 

[jerseygal]

YES, I guess that some say that there is a college out there for everyone , BUT THE MORE COMPETITIVE PROGRAMS....
For competitive schools, Disney "D"s just don't "cut" it on transcripts!
With every graduation class, colleges seem to get more and more competitive!
IMO, in addition to grades, SAT scores, activities, sports, and teacher recommendations, employment, colleges DO LOOK at tardies, absences, etc!

 

[richmo]

Was talking to a high school Chem teacher about this very subject over the weekend. He said they refer to grades kids get after coming back from a school year vacation as the 'Disney 'D'', even if it wasn't a Disney vacation.

...Disney "D"s just don't "cut" it on transcripts! ...

To be fair, I don't know if the Disney 'D' I referred to was for just the next test or the whole marking period. I hope it isn't the latter. Also, I would think high school Chemistry would be one of the roughest courses to catch up.