Price gouging?

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by mitros
Would " Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" fit?

PERFECTLY!!!!!!!

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by JimC
Just a thought. The fact that one can does not mean one should. I don't have the quote exactly right but it is from an old ethics discussion that I remember. I think it underlies a good portion of the give and take on this thread.

Unfortunately I suspect that ethics is considered out of fashion by much of our society.

ITA, now it is "me, me, me" and the "entitlement mentality". I am still old fashioned and will remain that way. I like it better.

 

[tixx]

I go by the golden rule

 

[Cruisin' Susan]

I know this thread is supposed to be over, but I can't resist putting in my two cents worth.

I think any restrictions on our ability to transfer our points will reduce their value, so I hope that never happens.

Maybe the real solution (which would be unpopular, I'm sure) is for DVC to increase the number of points required for holiday times. That way it would be more expensive, but easier, for everyone to get reservations.

I know most people on this board would not make a reservation at peak time just to make a buck. A big reason for that is the goodwill that comes from this board. But realistically, once the word is out that this is an easy way to make $$$ it's going to probably get worse.

 

[Desperado]

It wasn not DVC's intent for points to be purchased and rented out as a regular business venture, and it is in violation of the contracts we signed to use DVC as a business. DVC tried to establish an out for people who may not be able to use thier points due to unforseen circumstances and some individuals take advantage of that generosity and use the loop hole to demonstrate unethical practices.

They can readily expect condemnation from fellow members for such actions, whether they can squeeze in under the rules or not. It is not the intent of DVC to pick prime holiday weeks and sell them on e-bay, and it's not right, whether you want to hear it or not, entitlement mentality or not.

Whether DVC tries to close this unforseen loop hole to address these unethical practices remains to be seen, it may not happen, or worth the effort to address a small group of offenders. But, in my view it's wrong, and detrimental to other DVC members trying to arrange family vacations during holiday seasons. It is not consistent with the intent or purpose of family vacation ownership and DVC membership whether it slips in under the rules or not.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Originally posted by littlestar
Look on Page 38 of our Member Guidebook. It states:

"FYI"

"Because of high demand during certain periods, "Special Seasons" Preference Lists may be established at one or at all Disney Vacation Club Resorts. These lists provide Members an equal opportunity to make reservations during these periods of high demand. Currently, there are no "Special Seasons" Preference Lists in place at any of the resorts. If a "Special Seasons" Preference List is established, you will be notified."

I wonder how this would work?

This seemed to get lost in the discussion, so I will answer it now. The only Special Seasons preference list I recall is the one for New Years and Christmas 1999/2000. On that one, we were given a date that we could start calling for ressies that fell any time in that time period. I believe it was 14 months out. We only had one day to reserve in that time period (New Years Eve), but we got to make the ressie at the 14 month window for the whole thing. I don't think it turned out to be really needed though, because I don't think they filled all ressies before the 11 month window.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Originally posted by Desperado
It wasn not DVC's intent for points to be purchased and rented out as a regular busness venture, and this is in violation of the contracts we signed to use DVC as a business. DVC tried to establish an out for people who may not be able to use thier points due to unforseen circumstances and some individuals take advantage of that generosity and use the loop hold to demonstrate unethical practices. They can readily expect condemnation from fellow members for such actions, whether they can squeeze in under the rules or not. It is not the intent of DVC to pick prime holiday weeks and sell them on e-bay, and it's not right, whether you want to hear it or not, entitlement mentality or not.

HERE, HERE! Very well put, and exactly the way I feel on this topic too.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by dianeschlicht
This seemed to get lost in the discussion, so I will answer it now. The only Special Seasons preference list I recall is the one for New Years and Christmas 1999/2000. On that one, we were given a date that we could start calling for ressies that fell any time in that time period. I believe it was 14 months out. We only had one day to reserve in that time period (New Years Eve), but we got to make the ressie at the 14 month window for the whole thing. I don't think it turned out to be really needed though, because I don't think they filled all ressies before the 11 month window.

There was a lottery for that time but there were several years of a Xmas preference list prior to that.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by Desperado
It wasn not DVC's intent for points to be purchased and rented out as a regular business venture, and it is in violation of the contracts we signed to use DVC as a business. DVC tried to establish an out for people who may not be able to use thier points due to unforseen circumstances and some individuals take advantage of that generosity and use the loop hole to demonstrate unethical practices.

They can readily expect condemnation from fellow members for such actions, whether they can squeeze in under the rules or not. It is not the intent of DVC to pick prime holiday weeks and sell them on e-bay, and it's not right, whether you want to hear it or not, entitlement mentality or not.

Whether DVC tries to close this unforseen loop hole to address these unethical practices remains to be seen, it may not happen, or worth the effort to address a small group of offenders. But, in my view it's wrong, and detrimental to other DVC members trying to arrange family vacations during holiday seasons. It is not consistent with the intent or purpose of family vacation ownership and DVC membership whether it slips in under the rules or not.

That may be but not for the reasons you might want. The main reason they would not want this is to avoid competition. They also don't want an active and viable resale market, but not for your or my benefit. The issue of intent is what defines a business venture. I'd say that those that want it to be any rental for a "profit" are participating in a bit of wishful thinking. My interpretation is that anything short of hanging out a shingle and opening an office, would not get DVC going on this issue. They other is that they would not be able to legally stop renting as long as they are doing so. Since there's no definition in the POS, the courts would interpret this very liberally in all likelyhood giving the benefit of any doubt to the member and not to DVD.

 

[gscott8075]

Originally posted by golfnut1264
gscott...doesnt ebay regulate the resale of tickets to 20%...yes they do..and you sold for 4x face value..you start out you comments like mr.righteous and you sold ravens tickets on ebay for 4x the valu when ebay has specific regulations...nobody does the dvc as a buisness...check out the numbers they dont jive...people sell excess points whether during busy times or slow times but if you thinks somebody is making a living selling points than you are uniformed...it is not money maker..selling points helps offset costs..maitenance fees,buy in price.interest on purchase, at $10 a point you are lucky to make $3 a point...at $3 point profit if you sold 1000 points a year which is an awful lot you would make $3000 a year..hardly a buisness..

Mr. Righteous? Uninformed? eBay rule violator? Golfnut - This type of response is exactly what is wrong with this board - A reasonable post resulted in a personal attack which based on erroneous facts and mis-quotes.

1. Please check your facts before you refer to another poster as uninformed. Ebay policy is clearly listed under event tickets. Limits, if any, are determined based on a jurisdictions' laws. There is no eBay limit on Maryland event transactions. Further, there is no limit on a Pennsylvania seller selling tickets to a Maryland event. There is a full chart by state - please refer to it before accusing someone of violating a rule or a law.

The tickets sold for what a willing bidder was willing to pay. That is how ebay works.

I was fully in compliance with eBay policy and Maryland and Pennsylvania laws with this sale.

2. I never stated that anyone "made a living" selling points. I stated that it is a violation of DVC policy to rent points with a business intent.

3. Previous threads have described how they rent all or most of their points every year. To state nobody does DVC is a business is not accurate. I do not believe many people do - but it is more than "nobody."

 

[gscott8075]

Originally posted by golfnut1264
gscott...doesnt ebay regulate the resale of tickets to 20%...yes they do..and you sold for 4x face value..you start out you comments like mr.righteous and you sold ravens tickets on ebay for 4x the valu when ebay has specific regulations...nobody does the dvc as a buisness...check out the numbers they dont jive...people sell excess points whether during busy times or slow times but if you thinks somebody is making a living selling points than you are uniformed...it is not money maker..selling points helps offset costs..maitenance fees,buy in price.interest on purchase, at $10 a point you are lucky to make $3 a point...at $3 point profit if you sold 1000 points a year which is an awful lot you would make $3000 a year..hardly a buisness..

Mr. Righteous? Uninformed? eBay rule violator? Golfnut - This type of response is exactly what is wrong with this board - A reasonable post resulted in a personal attack which is based on erroneous facts and mis-quotes.

1. Please check your facts before you refer to another poster as uninformed. Ebay policy is clearly listed under event tickets. Limits, if any, are determined based on a jurisdictions' laws. There is no eBay limit on Maryland event transactions. Further, there is no limit on a Pennsylvania seller selling tickets to a Maryland event. There is a full chart by state - please refer to it before accusing someone of violating a rule or a law.

The tickets sold for what a willing bidder was willing to pay. That is how ebay works.

I was fully in compliance with eBay policy and Maryland and Pennsylvania laws with this sale.

2. I never stated that anyone "made a living" selling points. I stated that it is a violation of DVC policy to rent points with a business intent.

3. Previous threads have described how they rent all or most of their points every year. To state nobody does DVC is a business is not accurate. I do not believe many people do - but it is more than "nobody."

 

[disneycrazed139]

<i>originally posted by Johnnyfedora</i>
It's funny that when Disney charges a DVCer an inflated number of points to make a DC or DCL exchange, that's OK. But when an owner trys to get the most of a rental it's evil.

When I saw the title of this thread, I thought it was about Disney, not renters.

This is just one of those things that bugs the heck out of some people. I still can't understand why and am pretty sure I never will. Your points and my points are for us to do as we wish, and other owners can use theirs any way they see fit, as well. If a reservation is snatched up by a non-owner buying on ebay, that person has just as much entitlement to the reservation date as anyone else. Wherever there is one renter who gets the reservation, there is one who doesn't for that same time, regardless of whether they are an owner, a renter who paid a premium, or a renter who got a free ride. I have yet to see an argument that has convinced me that there is something wrong with the practice and I have yet to see a really inflated price on a rental anyway. I would say any price that offers a major discount (which a rental almost always will) is a good deal. Doesn't bug me a bit.

 

[TnRobin]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

This discussion has gotten totally out of hand. Please continue this Debate on a more appropriate board.