PPO BOG did not cause Early Morning Magic

[VillainFavs]

I've seen this argument a bunch of times and it's so ridiculous I felt a need to vent...

People are saying the whole Early Morning Magic money grab is the result of all us cheaters who made PPO BOG reservations with no intent of ordering a full meal at $25 a head (for a donut, no less!).

Yes, I'll admit it! I have a PPO BOG lined up for our next trip. No way was I ordering four meals. Maybe one. Maybe just a cupcake and a cup of coffee! I wanted to get in the park early. I wanted to line up early for 7DMT. Lock me up! That was my sole purpose for the ADR! I make no apologies!

Now, if Disney truly had a problem with this, there was a simple solution. Make it a true Prix Fixe menu. Charge everyone walking in the door the same price. Then it's my choice to pay it or not. It's $25 a head. Plain and simple. Is it worth it to me or not? My decision. But they didn't do that. So as long as they weren't stopping me, I see nothing wrong with it. And as long as there isn't a Morning Magic event on my day I'll keep my ADR and do just that. If there is an Morning Magic Event, I'll cancel. As I'm sure will most other people. Disney will figure it out soon enough.

What this is really about is they saw the value of EMH. Off-site guests are willing to pay for it. Why just give it away to on-site guests? You can rake in money from others for it!!!

Maybe they'll keep EMH on some days for on-site so they can advertise it still as a perk. Maybe not. Who knows at this point. But this is all about charging for something where they saw an opportunity.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

I'm confused on the "maybe they will keep EMH some days." They never had EMH at the same park every day. It's at different parks. MK never had EMH every day. Some are morning, some are evening. I do know they used to have 2 EMH evenings per week at MK a few years ago. Now they have one. Did they have two morning ones also? I guess I'm not sure why the presence of the paid one on a certain night means all the no extra cost resort guest ones will stop.

I agree the morning event is not there because they want to "punish" the BOG People.

 

[mom2rtk]

OP, I agree. If Disney felt people were "cheating" they would have required prepayment for the meal or at least a purchase for each member of the party.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out the BOG experience was some sort of beta test for the early park event. Additionally I wouldn't be surprised if all of this was some sort of beta experiment for things they want to develop for use when Star Wars Land opens.

It's hard to guess what goes on behind the curtain. But one thing we all know..... the mouse is much smarter than the rest of us..... and always one step ahead.

 

[Hikergirl]

They saw a demand for getting into the park early, make no mistake that is a result from people doing exactly what you are doing. They may very well of had a problem with it, but instead of telling the guest they can't they decided to capitalize on the demand for getting into the park early.
I think you just sound bitter because your loophole isn't going to be a benefit to you anymore.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

the "loophole" will work fine so long as the OP is not planning on the same day as the morning event, which will likely not be available every day. (Still waiting on dates for it.)

 

[VillainFavs]

They saw a demand for getting into the park early, make no mistake that is a result from people doing exactly what you are doing. They may very well of had a problem with it, but instead of telling the guest they can't they decided to capitalize on the demand for getting into the park early.
I think you just sound bitter because your loophole isn't going to be a benefit to you anymore.

Nope, not buying it. Do the numbers. It would make a whole lot more sense to just charge every person in their already-open restaurant a flat fee of $25 a head--or whatever outrageous amount they come up with. They already have a full staff there serving that table of four one plate to share. They could instead be bringing four full-priced plates. No real extra cost to Disney, yet a lot more income.

Instead they're opening a second restaurant and two more rides. They have an entirely different target audience in mind. Their target this time is those who are willing to pay for the perk of EMH. Those who haven't discovered the "loophole" as you call it!

 

[soniam]

I don't think Disney had a problem with it, and I don't necessarily think it's cheating. I wouldn't do it, but mainly from a point of view of a restaurant being a business and employees needing to get paid/tips. That's just me though. I have a second set of "cheater" bands for getting same day fastpasses, so take my opinion for what it's worth I think Disney realized there was a demand for this. Even if the BOG breakfast had stayed prix fixe per person, I think Disney would have realized that they could charge more for a similar thing. I wouldn't take it so personally, unless you personally wrote a letter to Disney explaining exactly how they could be making a lot more money Honestly, do you really care what perfect strangers on a message board think about your personal choices? The same people who say it's cheating may be line cutters Just sayin', not blamin'

 

[GaryDis]

Now, if Disney truly had a problem with this, there was a simple solution. Make it a true Prix Fixe menu. Charge everyone walking in the door the same price. Then it's my choice to pay it or not. It's $25 a head. Plain and simple. Is it worth it to me or not? My decision.

I think you're misunderstanding the MBA mentality.

It's not that they had a direct problem with it. But rather they saw that people booking PPO ADRs were getting more value than people booking post-RD ADRs for breakfast. And when some people are getting more value for the same price, an MBA looks for either a problem or an opportunity. They could see that they were leaving money on the table, and figure out a way to get it.

In other words, PPO BOG caused Early Morning Magic by providing the market research data to both inspire the idea and to prove it was a viable idea.

 

[Jfine]

I don't think you can say pre park BOG didn't cause it. We don't know. I doubt it was the only factor, but who knows. Maybe another change is that Disney will change BOG to a prix fixe. Maybe they just saw this as an opportunity to get more people (pre park ADR and the new option) paying to get in the park early. Maybe they thought they were just giving the customer a better option. We don't know what Disney was thinking and it seems really hard to tell what they're thinking, especially right now.

 

[HopperFan]

I don't understand why you are upset ... I really haven't seen anyone blame the people who are doing what you are doing so much as blaming Disney for allowing it. I blame Disney for building a stunning restaurant and in 3.5 years it's still a cluster. I blame Disney for not opening breakfast as published. As a stockholder I blame Disney for not operating the restaurant to it's maximum potential and generating the income it could to run that big thing. Now if you are using their loophole they very knowingly created, how would anyone blame you. I have only seen people talking about the action, not the guest. The action exists because of Disney.

NOW to your point that it's not the PPO ADR's fault that these are happening, I disagree. For decades people have killed themselves over CP and CRT reservations ... not just for the restaurant, but to be on empty Main Street and be first in line to important rides. Then came New Fantasyland and this huge beautiful castle that cost MUCH LESS than the other two options, and now was offering PPO Breakfast. Better yet it was steps to the Mine Train and A&E. People are killing themselves to get in to these places, especially BOG due to setup. Disney most certainly watches the behavior of guests and see there is a demand so strong they could benefit from it.

But you know ever since they announced the cupcake and ala carte drinks at breakfast .... I've been are they out of their minds?!?! making this situation even worse. Something you said made me think ... maybe this was bait. Get more and more people in a frenzy (which Disney does well) about getting that breakfast ADR so they are in the park early. And then - boom - offer a morning event that gives you a mini-EMH with breakfast. Testing us. For the last few years it seems everything is a test to see how well received. They want to open more things to offsite because they are important and with more offsite options now and coming, they need to keep them hooked. Disney isn't building hotels, just DVC so they have to keep dangling the carrots so offsite guests stay committed to Disney days.

If people bite on this then they know they can sell EMH. They didn't do it at BOG because they didn't need something that size, they didn't need to create a market for that since this isn't every day, and if they are using this to gently adjust things .. maybe they are going to change up BOG in some way. I say either make it TS or make it true Prix Fixe, only using the ballroom if need be.

They are always testing the waters, always seeing where folks will bite or push back, and if they can find a way to actually generate income during EMH - why shouldn't they? They haven't been there forever, at one point you paid for them and are drastically less than they were.

The rabid behavior of guests to get into the parks early, on to the mine train early, clearly not interested in breakfast (BOG) has given them the info on demand that could pull this off. We'll see but I think they just might do it.

 

[DebbieB]

I've seen this argument a bunch of times and it's so ridiculous I felt a need to vent...

People are saying the whole Early Morning Magic money grab is the result of all us cheaters who made PPO BOG reservations with no intent of ordering a full meal at $25 a head (for a donut, no less!).

Yes, I'll admit it! I have a PPO BOG lined up for our next trip. No way was I ordering four meals. Maybe one. Maybe just a cupcake and a cup of coffee! I wanted to get in the park early. I wanted to line up early for 7DMT. Lock me up! That was my sole purpose for the ADR! I make no apologies!

Now, if Disney truly had a problem with this, there was a simple solution. Make it a true Prix Fixe menu. Charge everyone walking in the door the same price. Then it's my choice to pay it or not. It's $25 a head. Plain and simple. Is it worth it to me or not? My decision. But they didn't do that. So as long as they weren't stopping me, I see nothing wrong with it. And as long as there isn't a Morning Magic event on my day I'll keep my ADR and do just that. If there is an Morning Magic Event, I'll cancel. As I'm sure will most other people. Disney will figure it out soon enough.

What this is really about is they saw the value of EMH. Off-site guests are willing to pay for it. Why just give it away to on-site guests? You can rake in money from others for it!!!

Maybe they'll keep EMH on some days for on-site so they can advertise it still as a perk. Maybe not. Who knows at this point. But this is all about charging for something where they saw an opportunity.

I wouldn't say it's the result of "cheaters". I'm sure they would have thought of it on their own. I think they must have someone new in charge of finance and they are thinking up all the ways they can bring in more revenue. If they didn't like people buying one meal and then jumping on 7DMT, they would have set a per person charge or closed off 7DMT before park opening. I don't think a per person charge for BOG would bring in as much revenue as charging $69 a person. They may end up doing both.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

No one has been cheating at BOG.

But BOG represents visible demand. They would be blind not to see that.

Where I think the PPO BOG crowd has been a problem isn't related to this new offering. I have heard tales of some early diners behaving badly if 7DMT isn't running early, or needs an extra run on checklist, berating CMs because they paid for a PPO to get there first or ride before rope drop. And that's not a way to treat those CMs when "free ore-rope drop ride!" was never part of the BOG PPO promise. An expensive doughnut was.

 

[DebbieB]

No one has been cheating at BOG.

But BOG represents visible demand. They would be blind not to see that.

Where I think the PPO BOG crowd has been a problem isn't related to this new offering. I have heard tales of some early diners behaving badly if 7DMT isn't running early, or needs an extra run on checklist, berating CMs because they paid for a PPO to get there first or ride before rope drop. And that's not a way to treat those CMs when "free ore-rope drop ride!" was never part of the BOG PPO promise. An expensive doughnut was.

Along the same lines is people booking an 8:00 ADR at Crystal Palace to have the empty main street to walk down and then complain when park opening is moved to 8:00am.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Along the same lines is people booking an 8:00 ADR at Crystal Palace to have the empty main street to walk down and then complain when park opening is moved to 8:00am.

Yep.

All that Disney have ever guaranteed with PPO breakfasts is breakfast. Everything past that has been pixie dust, some of which has been taken for granted.

 

[bashuck]

I have never commented on this subject as I'm not passionate about it but will say I recall plenty of complaints about them changing the park opening up and that ruining their plans rather that people stating/implying others are bad for making the reservations for the purpose of getting in early. I also recall plenty of people complain about how they didn't get the priority over the rope drop crowd at mine train like they 'deserve'.

 

[aaarcher86]

Wouldn't be surprised if a fixed BOG price is the next big change.

 

[SteveMouse]

And restricting access to the attractions for Early Morning to only those who purchased- done easily enough with MagicBands and FP lines (or add a reader to the standby lines for use during early mornings).

 

[snayak]

I've seen this argument a bunch of times and it's so ridiculous I felt a need to vent...

People are saying the whole Early Morning Magic money grab is the result of all us cheaters who made PPO BOG reservations with no intent of ordering a full meal at $25 a head (for a donut, no less!).

Yes, I'll admit it! I have a PPO BOG lined up for our next trip. No way was I ordering four meals. Maybe one. Maybe just a cupcake and a cup of coffee! I wanted to get in the park early. I wanted to line up early for 7DMT. Lock me up! That was my sole purpose for the ADR! I make no apologies!

Now, if Disney truly had a problem with this, there was a simple solution. Make it a true Prix Fixe menu. Charge everyone walking in the door the same price. Then it's my choice to pay it or not. It's $25 a head. Plain and simple. Is it worth it to me or not? My decision. But they didn't do that. So as long as they weren't stopping me, I see nothing wrong with it. And as long as there isn't a Morning Magic event on my day I'll keep my ADR and do just that. If there is an Morning Magic Event, I'll cancel. As I'm sure will most other people. Disney will figure it out soon enough.

What this is really about is they saw the value of EMH. Off-site guests are willing to pay for it. Why just give it away to on-site guests? You can rake in money from others for it!!!

Maybe they'll keep EMH on some days for on-site so they can advertise it still as a perk. Maybe not. Who knows at this point. But this is all about charging for something where they saw an opportunity.

Your point is exactly right, they could have just changed BOG to prix fix (though $25 is light, if I were Disney its be $50/$35 kids minimum). Except now, people are still able to make ADRs anywhere (CRT, BOG, etc) and pay $$$$ for that experience and STILL compete with EMM crowds - win/win for Disney.

Be glad they thought 1.5 early morning hours was half Disney After Dark and were gracious enough to include a buffet breakfast! ("I am altering the deal, pray I don't alter it any further" #Vader).

We have some friends visiting Disney in December this year, who we would like to join, and for is it's becoming - do we put the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ towards a house or go on one Disney vacation. Sad.

(no, the vacation would not cost as much as a house down payment, but a good amount, depending on how long we actually wanted to spend in the parks, could be an extra $800 over 4 days...)

 

[pens4821]

I disagree. They saw an opportunity from people taking advantage, and that's why they made this. Yeah, you're right, they could've just charged $25 per person. But why do that when you can charge $70? People doing this gave Disney the idea to charge extra for breakfast and a ride, it'll be up to people to decide if they continue it or not (by early hours sold).

As others have said. How many times are there posts here about Disney changing hours and messing up their early plans? IMO if you book a meal your meal should be your plan. Not what you're getting out of it in the end.

In this case riding the popular rides is the plan, and breakfast second. If you don't like it, book breakfast and ride when it fits your schedule which is how it should be.

 

[CandiceF]

We had a PPO BOG breakfast in November and loved it! We don't rope drop and wanted 1 day to be in the park before opening to walk down a fairly empty Main Street and get our pictures taken. We only ordered 2 of the Meat and cheese trays to split between DH, myself and our 3 little ones. With the pastries that came with the meal it was a nice light breakfast for us. We took our time eating and finished about 10 minutes before park opening. We are not big breakfast eaters so QS and splitting meals is perfect for us. I don't think we took advantage as we are light breakfast eaters and usually eat in our room or split QS breakfasts. Thy could always make all meals at BOG TS if they wanted to avoid this. I don't see why splitting QS for breakfast is any different than splitting QS for luck or dinner.