Poof! Gone is our Middle School Honor Roll

[declansdad]

You are not going to please everyone and a line has to be drawn somewhere! I think the line should be drawn and people need to make that their goal to get to that line ...sure there are always going to be someone that works harder than others, there always will be no matter what! Frankly I think it is up to the teachers to let the ones that work very hard to let the kids know how hard they have worked ...how about this when I was in choir I worked my little tushie off b/c I did NOT have the best voice and I knew it!! the teacher knew how hard I worked and on the night we were to get awards only a few got them however I got recognized as working the hardest..sometimes all it takes is for the teacher to say it in front of the others and not give an award..trust me that went a long way with me ...did I get a trophy or an award NO, I just got the great job you are working very hard and keep it up...

My point is that the ones that got the line they were supposed to get to got their award and I didn't but I got the job well done. I promise you that meant more to me than an award...

The line is different for everyone.

 

[luvsJack]

The line is different for everyone.

Very, very true and the struggle to get to that line is going to be different.

I don't think every, single kid should necessarily get an award but any child that is putting forth effort should be recognized.

You have to realize that not all kids have a cheering section at home. There are many parents who do not even know what their kids are doing at school, much less whether they have achieved anything doing it. They need that recognition at school. And they need it regardless of what their gpa is.

I used to have a little boy in my preschool class that had horrible behavior. I thought we would never get through the day without him being disciplined. Finally I discovered that all it took was one compliment about his behavior to set the day. From then one, as early in the am as possible I would find something to say ("good job, jeff, you were very helpful". or "thank you for sharing with suzy") All it took was that one bit of recognition for good behavior to make him want to continue that all day long. It worked every day until he went to Kindergarten.

The same thing will work with a child that doesn't put forth quite as much effort as the teacher wants. Just one time of showing them what it feels like to be recognized can make them want to start working harder. Will it work with every child? No. But if it brings one or two from a D or F student to a C or B student; its worth it. And I really don't think its necessarily going to take away from the kid that has always gotten straight A's (although I still think the straight A's should be recognized too).


BTW, I have two sons. One a natural born athlete and the other was always the honor student (never had to pick up a book to do it). The athlete worked 10 times as hard to stay up for the game as the other did to keep his grades.

 

[cheermom1]

The line is different for everyone.

I get that but HOW do you draw a different line for millions of kids??? sorry but I don;t think we can so we have to do a standard ...

 

[arminnie]

I'm a mom with 2 teen daughters, both distinguished honor roll students, both taking honors classes/AP classes. I have one DD who works very hard for her A's. Spends an extraordinary amount of time studying and doing homework and even extra credit if it's offered.

My other DD? Well she earns straight As without really trying. Am I proud of them both? You betcha. Do I tell them how proud I am? Yep. Do I think they BOTH deserve that honor? According to the school district rules, they both meet the qualifications, but I think only one of them EARNED it.

I think BOTH of them earned it, but only one of them had to work extra hard to do so.

Not all of them worked hard and earned it. Some do very little and are rewarded simply because of genetics.

I am truly amazed at the people who think that "effort expended" is somehow more important that "accomplishment achieved".

I had to hire a plumber and an electrician recently at my new home. I'd rather have someone who can FIX my problem rather than someone who works hard and really, really tries but still doesn't get anything to work.

If I hire someone to do my taxes I'd rather have the person who can get it done right (even if it takes them very little effort) than to have someone who works and works and works but doesn't do it correctly.

I thought that the purpose of school was to teach subject matter to a student not to count how much effort they expended. Most of the time there is a correlation between effort and achievement. But not always. I could take music lessons forever and work 24/7 - but I will never be a musician. Should people like me be rewarded for just trying?

On the other hand I can easily ace almost any math or accounting class without even going to class. Should I be forced to do tons of "busy" work when I have total mastery of the subject matter without it?

 

[Plannin'Shannon]

I am truly amazed at the people who think that "effort expended" is somehow more important that "accomplishment achieved".

I had to hire a plumber and an electrician recently at my new home. I'd rather have someone who can FIX my problem rather than someone who works hard and really, really tries but still doesn't get anything to work.

If I hire someone to do my taxes I'd rather have the person who can get it done right (even if it takes them very little effort) than to have someone who works and works and works but doesn't do it correctly.

I thought that the purpose of school was to teach subject matter to a student not to count how much effort they expended. Most of the time there is a correlation between effort and achievement. But not always. I could take music lessons forever and work 24/7 - but I will never be a musician. Should people like me be rewarded for just trying?

On the other hand I can easily ace almost any math or accounting class without even going to class. Should I be forced to do tons of "busy" work when I have total mastery of the subject matter without it?

You said it much better than I could. Reward students for effort with something like a "Most Improvement" award? Sure. But to do away with academic honor rolls completely because some kids have an unfair advantage? No way.

 

[luvsJack]

You said it much better than I could. Reward students for effort with something like a "Most Improvement" award? Sure. But to do away with academic honor rolls completely because some kids have an unfair advantage? No way.

But how many "most improved awards" can they give? The name sort of implys a one shot deal. Most classrooms are going to have more than one kid that deserves some recognition for had work. Besides do you really think that "most improved" and "academic achievement" sound the same?

I don't believe honor rolls should be done away with, but the same kids over and over getting all the "glory" while the ones that struggle for every passing grade don't--that's just not right.

There must be a happy medium some where.

 

[luvsJack]

I think BOTH of them earned it, but only one of them had to work extra hard to do so.



I am truly amazed at the people who think that "effort expended" is somehow more important that "accomplishment achieved".

I had to hire a plumber and an electrician recently at my new home. I'd rather have someone who can FIX my problem rather than someone who works hard and really, really tries but still doesn't get anything to work.

If I hire someone to do my taxes I'd rather have the person who can get it done right (even if it takes them very little effort) than to have someone who works and works and works but doesn't do it correctly.

I thought that the purpose of school was to teach subject matter to a student not to count how much effort they expended. Most of the time there is a correlation between effort and achievement. But not always. I could take music lessons forever and work 24/7 - but I will never be a musician. Should people like me be rewarded for just trying?

On the other hand I can easily ace almost any math or accounting class without even going to class. Should I be forced to do tons of "busy" work when I have total mastery of the subject matter without it?

Those are people you have hired that have learned their craft. And they are adults as are you. That is a different world than the world of children.

Children need to have their self esteem and self confidence built up. Some have to be shown that "yes, you can do this". And they need a certificate handed to them that says "see, you are smart and we do see you working hard".

Should every kid get that certificate? No. Should it take away from the honor roll kids? No. But there should be something for the kids that work had and struggle and it should be just as important as any award given for any grade.

If any of you could be with a struggling child one time (struggling to learn how to hit a ball, add, read, or how to keep his hands to himself), and see that light bulb go off and the smile on that kid's face when he realizes that "YES! I can do this!" You may have a different idea of those certificates that are handed out.

 

[MsLeFever]

Exactly!! I think it was embarassing. Now most kids don't want to put the time into an experiment if they can win easily. They picked the winner out of a hat.

So it really was just a door prize - they ought to just call it that! I remember winning a science fair as a junior high student and it was such a high that I really worked hard on the projects every year!

 

[ticktock]

Very, very true and the struggle to get to that line is going to be different.

I don't think every, single kid should necessarily get an award but any child that is putting forth effort should be recognized.

You have to realize that not all kids have a cheering section at home. There are many parents who do not even know what their kids are doing at school, much less whether they have achieved anything doing it. They need that recognition at school. And they need it regardless of what their gpa is.

I used to have a little boy in my preschool class that had horrible behavior. I thought we would never get through the day without him being disciplined. Finally I discovered that all it took was one compliment about his behavior to set the day. From then one, as early in the am as possible I would find something to say ("good job, jeff, you were very helpful". or "thank you for sharing with suzy") All it took was that one bit of recognition for good behavior to make him want to continue that all day long. It worked every day until he went to Kindergarten.

The same thing will work with a child that doesn't put forth quite as much effort as the teacher wants. Just one time of showing them what it feels like to be recognized can make them want to start working harder. Will it work with every child? No. But if it brings one or two from a D or F student to a C or B student; its worth it. And I really don't think its necessarily going to take away from the kid that has always gotten straight A's (although I still think the straight A's should be recognized too).


BTW, I have two sons. One a natural born athlete and the other was always the honor student (never had to pick up a book to do it). The athlete worked 10 times as hard to stay up for the game as the other did to keep his grades.

Even little kids know when they're being ********ted. My son came home with awards in Kindergarten and when I started to praise him he said "Everyone gets those, it's not anything real." From the mouths of babes.

America's academics have been declining for years and what do we do? Lower the bar so everyone can be included in mediocrity. Teachers know who is working their butts off and should have an award for those students. But to take away the actual achievements of the few and spread the praise around to everyone just to make it "fair" helps NO ONE.

To make the students who aren't as bright or hardworking think they are just as good as the best and brightest sure as heck isn't fair because reality is going to kick them in the teeth when they find out that employers don't hand out checks the same way politically correct schools hand out awards. We don't need to coddle their fragile egos to get them to achieve.

Asian students test consistently higher than most others academically but have the lowest level of self esteem. They work hard because they are afraid to fail. Others have the lowest test grades but the highest self esteem because they've been told they were great and also come from a background were academic achievement isn't the norm so they have nothing to compare to. "The teacher says I'm great even though I can't do the same work that Cho Chang can so I'm going to be an engineer just like Cho! Yeah! "Hope that kid manages to get a government job once the politically correct lobby pushes them through college because a real employer won't pay them for their high self esteem.

 

[luvmy3]

No, not everyone has to be on the honor roll. But why does the honor roll only have to be about grades? Why can't it be about hard work?

It's not always as simple as "work harder and you can be this amazing too".

Because The Honor Roll IS about grades, whether they are a result of their hard work, or their natural abilities combined with their hard work. There can be other ways to reward and acknowledge those who work hard, but it shouldn't be on the same level as those who excel at it.

 

[Mermaid02]

Why does the honor roll have to be anymore than a posted piece of paper in the hallway? That's what it was when we were in school (way back when ) there were no breakfasts, no certificates, no candy bars being handed out- it was more of a personal satisfaction kind of thing. Kind of like a pat on the back at work from your boss when a presentation goes well.

 

[castleview]

I don't believe honor rolls should be done away with, but the same kids over and over getting all the "glory" while the ones that struggle for every passing grade don't--that's just not right.

That's not necessarily true. Many kids are go on and off the honor roll through out school. I was one of them and it encouraged me to get back on it if I fell off. My opinion on the OP's situation is to kill the breakfast, keep the honor roll.

As a parent, I find myself getting annoyed at where school resources go. Our district has a fantastic intervention program for kids struggling with reading and math. Yet, nothing is done for the rest of the kids.

 

[luvmy3]

Why does the honor roll have to be anymore than a posted piece of paper in the hallway? That's what it was when we were in school (way back when ) there were no breakfasts, no certificates, no candy bars being handed out- it was more of a personal satisfaction kind of thing. Kind of like a pat on the back at work from your boss when a presentation goes well.

Its really just a choice, the school can honor those students anyway they want. I don't see any problem with a school having a ceremony to award academic achievement. I would rather see that then those monthy ceremonies to award "character"

 

[tinkntraining]

Why does the honor roll have to be anymore than a posted piece of paper in the hallway? That's what it was when we were in school (way back when ) there were no breakfasts, no certificates, no candy bars being handed out- it was more of a personal satisfaction kind of thing. Kind of like a pat on the back at work from your boss when a presentation goes well.

IMO, it changed from being a posted piece of paper in the hallways when it was decided that "good test scores/passing percentages" equalled funding for the school. You want money for books, supplies, programs? Get those scores up. And let's prove they deserved it by putting 80-90% of the kids on honor roll. Then lets have a ceremony so all the parents/community can see how well we're doing. So the state will notice us and give us funding.

Nutshell.

BTW, I think the honor roll shouldn't be watered down AND I think exceptional kids (either in effort, or talent, or skill, or citizenship or improvement) should be recognized somehow for their achievements, too. How to do that, is a question each school district will have to determine.

 

[declansdad]

Those are people you have hired that have learned their craft. And they are adults as are you. That is a different world than the world of children.

Children need to have their self esteem and self confidence built up. Some have to be shown that "yes, you can do this". And they need a certificate handed to them that says "see, you are smart and we do see you working hard".

Should every kid get that certificate? No. Should it take away from the honor roll kids? No. But there should be something for the kids that work had and struggle and it should be just as important as any award given for any grade.

If any of you could be with a struggling child one time (struggling to learn how to hit a ball, add, read, or how to keep his hands to himself), and see that light bulb go off and the smile on that kid's face when he realizes that "YES! I can do this!" You may have a different idea of those certificates that are handed out.

These same statements can be said about adults in school. I have students in my classes that are recognized not simply because they worked hard but because that hard work and dedication allowed them to develop the skills that show they can achieve what is required. And marks in the high 90s are not what is required.

Typically the student that is a high academic achiever is book smart, things come naturally to them. The same can be said about the natural athlete, they don't have to work at it, it is already there. The other students/athletes recognize the need to work hard if they want to perform at a higher level. These are the people that make up the bulk of our society and are most likely the people who are in charge. The have a much more balanced outlook and have experience many more things. This is what makes them the better employee/team member.

Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone, but it does apply to a large majority.

 

[Mermaid02]

Its really just a choice, the school can honor those students anyway they want. I don't see any problem with a school having a ceremony to award academic achievement. I would rather see that then those monthy ceremonies to award "character"

Hang around the mall on a Friday night and listen to the way the kids talk- character is seriously lacking in our youth. I wouldn't roll my eyes about a kid showing kindness, gratitude or being humble. I would roll my eyes at a bunch of snowflake parents who are po'd because the school's honor roll breakfast was canceled.

 

[DisneyKT]

Why does the honor roll have to be anymore than a posted piece of paper in the hallway? That's what it was when we were in school (way back when ) there were no breakfasts, no certificates, no candy bars being handed out- it was more of a personal satisfaction kind of thing. Kind of like a pat on the back at work from your boss when a presentation goes well.

ITA. Put in a paper. That should be enough. If you want to take your own kid out go ahead.

 

[castleview]

I would rather see that then those monthy ceremonies to award "character"

Oh, but that's sooo subjective. Do you give that to a normally misbehaving kid who all of a sudden starts acting decent? Or do you give it to the reliably good kid who you tend to forget about it because they never give you any trouble? And won't that make the future criminals feel bad about themselves if they don't get a character award?

 

[Tinkmom75]

Just so you know, I am in favor of one ceremony to award all kinds of achievments from athletics, character and academics.

I am not trying to offend anyone, and for the PP whose brother really struggled I think his efforts should be acknowledged also. So with my flame suit on I ask do people realize that being academically gifted can also be grueling in school. The amount of busy work thrown at these kids who have mastered a subject is awful. I have heard from our district "they will have to do busy work in their jobs". While this is true and I agree to some extent it can be awful. If you were made to recite ABC's all day long how do you think you would feel. That is what is it like for some academically gifted student. Also, there is major funding and laws for those who are academically challenged, but not much for academically gifted students. Also, when I talked to my district about my DS I was basically pooh poohed. Perhaps these children with natual abilities would work harder for achievements if they were challenged harder at an earlier age. Then we could have different "lines" that measure effort. But, it might offend another child or that childs parents if there were honors classes based on academics because then you might be indicating that the other Johnny is average. Come on, everyone does have different abilities that's what make us so great. My DS may be brilliant, but he is not a social outgoing person, and in the job market this could hinder him even more. I see all the time where the loudest, showiest person is promoted even though they have no clue what they are doing.

ETA: It seems like the private schools and charter schools around here do better at athletics and academics because they select the best. Competition is encouraged.

 

[Sorsha]

Hang around the mall on a Friday night and listen to the way the kids talk- character is seriously lacking in our youth. I wouldn't roll my eyes about a kid showing kindness, gratitude or being humble. I would roll my eyes at a bunch of snowflake parents who are po'd because the school's honor roll breakfast was canceled.

See, here is where your definition of "snowflake" parent and mine disagree.

If a parent has a child who has worked hard and done well in school, one who has achieved the honor roll and is rightfully proud of it, and that parent wants the child to achieve public recognition, THAT is not a "snowflake" parent. There is nothing wrong with being publically proud of my child's accomplishments.

Now, my DD15 isn't very good at spelling. She always tries hard, but she just can't spell worth a darn. Perhaps I get angry when she doesn't get put on the honor roll too. She should be recognized and made to feel special too, I mean obviously it isn't her fault she can't spell, she must have inherited it from her dad - the world's WORST speller. IF this were the way I view things (disclaimer - I DON'T), THEN I would be a "snowflake" parent - see how special my little snowflake is, even if she really is just an average student, dagnabbit!! Someone oughta recognize my beautiful snowflake cause *I* think she is perfect!

Kids need to learn that sometimes, some people are going to be better at things than they are. Sometimes, others will get recognition, and they won't. Same DD15 tried out for the volleyball team this year. Previously, in her very small middle school, she had played for 3 years on the volleyball team - loved it, played well. Suddenly, this year, little fish in BIG pond in the gigantic high school. She tried out, did her best, was obviously outplayed, and didn't make the team. Was she disappointed? Yes. We all were. But no one went running to the volleyball coach, demanding that they cancel the season because too many girls didn't make the team. the best players get the recognition of playing on the team, others, who may have tried just as hard, but didn't have quite the skills or ability, DID NOT. That's life. Lesson learned. Same with honor rolls, those who work hard, and some that don't work hard but have inate ability, get recognized. As it should be. Some don't. Work harder, try harder, or live with not being on the honor roll. THAT'S LIFE.