Poly Expansion Watch

[DVCSunDevil]

I personally think the restrictions hurt Disney in the long run. They hurt the resale value of DVC. A healthy resale market would make more people want to buy DVC both on the direct and the resale market.

I don't think Disney really cares too much about the resale market. Those contracts are already purchased. If the resale market dries up because of the new restrictions, the only way to acquire points will be via direct purchase. Which was the point of Disney implementing those resale restrictions in the first place...to help drive direct sales.

 

[js]

I think there needs to be some balance. Without a healthy resale market people (like me) may not be as quick to spend that much money for the long term. While I don't see it as an appreciating investment, it is nice to know I can get out relatively easily if something in our financial picture changes for the worse. Without a resale market and the availability to sell easily if we needed to, we would not have as many contracts (some resale; some direct) as we do.

But DVC is nothing more really than any other TS (I do own two other dedicated 3 bedroom weeks at Orange Lake in Orlando and Waterside in HHI) and for now, DVC is appreciating (we purchased resale in 2009 for $67 pp). Right now, you could still lowball your selling price for a quick sale but you won't get a buyer, Disney will take it back, which maybe they will start to do more often. I really don't know it's all just thoughts in my head while working LOL

 

[js]

I don't think Disney really cares too much about the resale market. Those contracts are already purchased. If the resale market dries up because of the new restrictions, the only way to acquire points will be via direct purchase. Which was the point of Disney implementing those resale restrictions in the first place...to help drive direct sales.

Thank you for saying what I was trying to convey. This is one of the reasons I thought Disney put in resale restrictions.

 

[tseitel]

I imagine it's complicated and expensive to alter the exterior design of Polyflections. I think making it appear a bit more like Aulani's tower would be much more beautiful and fitting to the Poly resort.

Polyflections! I’m cracking up! But that’s exactly what I said, they took the design for Reflections and reused it. No character, no style, a hotel fit for the Las Vegas strip, or anywhere (except a Polynesian village)

 

[redboat45]

I don't think Disney really cares too much about the resale market. Those contracts are already purchased. If the resale market dries up because of the new restrictions, the only way to acquire points will be via direct purchase. Which was the point of Disney implementing those resale restrictions in the first place...to help drive direct sales.

If the resale market dries up then the value of buying direct goes down.

 

[js]

Is it correct that selfishly I would want the Poly2 to have restrictions since this then limits newer resale DVC members to book in that resort (same for Riv)?

However, is it correct that resale RIV can only book at RIV? So that maybe makes it harder and would be same for Poly2 eventually?

Thank you.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

Is it correct that selfishly I would want the Poly2 to have restrictions since this then limits newer resale DVC members to book in that resort (same for Riv)?

However, is it correct that resale RIV can only book at RIV? So that maybe makes it harder and would be same for Poly2 eventually?

Thank you.

That was the point I made on another comment. If someone recently bought direct at, say, VGF because of FOMO on staying at Riviera and future resorts imagine how those people feel if all these new resorts are not new associations with restrictions. Those people would understandably want Poly2 to be a new association with the same restrictions. I don't think it is "selfish", but rather it is the expectation that Disney set when they put those restrictions in place. And because of that, it is was the owners expectation when they spent all that money on a direct purchase.

That's why I think Disney needs to make Poly2 a new association. Not doing so will be opening themselves up a lot of angry owners who spent a lot of money on direct contract since 2019.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

If the resale market dries up then the value of buying direct goes down.

I'm not sure I see your point. If the resale market dries up, then owners who want to buy into DVC will only have one option. That is why Disney put those restrictions into place. They want to hurt resales and drive people to direct purchases. I am not sure I see how "the value of buying direct goes down" if resales were squashed. For Disney, the value would actually go up.

 

[Lisa P.]

Restricted resale RIV points will be sold by members for a lower price and become a cheaper source of points inventory for DVC/DVD to obtain via their ROFR grab. Then those points are resold as Direct Purchase points from DVD at a higher profit. I believe this was the motivation for DVD to institute the restrictions.

 

[Sandisw]

If we are taking bets, I am going to say PV2 will be a separate association with restrictions.
Doesn't the restrictions benefit Disney for the future?

It does and its why I too lean this way. That was a huge change in direction when RIV came out and then the pandemic hit and it just seems like they have the opportunity with this build to get that idea back on track.

 

[Sandisw]

If the resale market dries up then the value of buying direct goes down.

It could but to be honest, the average buyer of DVC...outside of these boards...don't even realize things about resale and don't buy with the mindset of selling and getting there money back. So, I just don't think DVD cares that much about it in the long run.

As long as they can maintain sales at a healthy level...and that level may be less than years prior...they will put in things that make the direct purchase more attractive. The parks are what drive the DVC product (even though we don't buy for parks) so as long as those exist, there will be a DVC buyer out there.

 

[redboat45]

I'm not sure I see your point. If the resale market dries up, then owners who want to buy into DVC will only have one option. That is why Disney put those restrictions into place. They want to hurt resales and drive people to direct purchases. I am not sure I see how "the value of buying direct goes down" if resales were squashed. For Disney, the value would actually go up.

meaning Disney wouldn't be able to charge as much because people wouldn't see an out.

 

[Sandisw]

Is it correct that selfishly I would want the Poly2 to have restrictions since this then limits newer resale DVC members to book in that resort (same for Riv)?

However, is it correct that resale RIV can only book at RIV? So that maybe makes it harder and would be same for Poly2 eventually?

Thank you.

I would prefer it to be a new association as well and reduce the number of other owners who can book it at 7 months. And, yes, resale RIV is only good at RIV.

 

[js]

meaning Disney wouldn't be able to charge as much because people wouldn't see an out.

I'm not sure I follow this, but I'm sure it's just me but I don't think Disney cares about everyone and there
are always enough people to pay the higher premiums. Disney is a company and business is business and the bottom line is the bottom line.

 

[js]

I would prefer it to be a new association as well and reduce the number of other owners who can book it at 7 months. And, yes, resale RIV is only good at RIV.

Thank you, I thought it would reduce resale owners giving direct/grandfathered a little more opportunity to book, but I can see in the far future though that it may get harder in many years to come since the people that purchased resale, say at RIV, can only stay there and those people, maybe purchased resale for much less just being happy to stay on Disney property in one resort, RIV.

 

[HIRyeDVC]

meaning Disney wouldn't be able to charge as much because people wouldn't see an out.

you hit the nail here. If people don’t see an out, then less people would buy. And many would argue that Disney’s been doing more to take away the value of buying direct. The ability to book at future resorts just isn’t very compelling yet. Not until 2042I’m guessing.

 

[RebelScum]

I agree with you and Sandisw that if POLY2 gets rolled into the current PVB association, then DVC absolutely has to remove the restrictions associated with Riviera. And that also is one of the reasons why I lean to POLY2 being a new association. I find it hard to believe that DVC is going to admit they were wrong with the Riviera restrictions. Can you imagine what a mess that would be? All the people who spent all that extra money buying direct who would have purchased resale. The people who love Riviera and wanted to buy there, but ended up “settling” and purchasing direct at a less favorite resort because they were worried about about the Riviera resale restrictions. Undoing the restrictions will lead to a lot of very unhappy members. The easier alternative is to make PVB2 a new association. It is much “cleaner” that way.

Not the case for all. I own direct at Riviera, but would love the resale restrictions on it to go away. I have no plan on selling it, but removal of the restrictions should be helpful if I were to sell. Not following the logic that if PVB2 is rolled into the existing condo association that Riv restrictions would need to be undone? Why is that not the same issue for GFV2?

 

[UofMGuy423]

It could but to be honest, the average buyer of DVC...outside of these boards...don't even realize things about resale and don't buy with the mindset of selling and getting there money back. So, I just don't think DVD cares that much about it in the long run.

As long as they can maintain sales at a healthy level...and that level may be less than years prior...they will put in things that make the direct purchase more attractive. The parks are what drive the DVC product (even though we don't buy for parks) so as long as those exist, there will be a DVC buyer out there.

Agreed with this 100%. I know it's anecdotal, but several friends joined DVC direct and had no idea about the resale option and never had considered selling them down the road. They purchased assuming they'll keep them for the life of the contract.

 

[mwhite67]

Polyflections! I’m cracking up! But that’s exactly what I said, they took the design for Reflections and reused it. No character, no style, a hotel fit for the Las Vegas strip, or anywhere (except a Polynesian village)

100% agree. The watered down architecture started with Bay Lake Tower and now Riviera, Grand Destino Tower and Swan Reserve. Might as well stay at Bonnet Creek for 1/2 the price. As someone who's been going to WDW since the 70s, I'm coming to the realization that they will never again invest like they did with the original Poly, Contemp, Wilderness Lodge or Animal Kingdom Lodge. I know it probably doesn't bother a lot of people but I grew up with the resort being a big part of the magic. Feeling transported somewhere else. Disappointing. I just hate that that nice space on the walk over to the GF will now be a giant, loud Hilton with less green space. Money talks. I was gonna finally take the plunge on DVC resale this year but I've backed off with all the examples of bad leadership.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

Not the case for all. I own direct at Riviera, but would love the resale restrictions on it to go away. I have no plan on selling it, but removal of the restrictions should be helpful if I were to sell. Not following the logic that if PVB2 is rolled into the existing condo association that Riv restrictions would need to be undone? Why is that not the same issue for GFV2?

GFV2 was a refurb, not a completely new build. It made sense to roll that one into GFV...it was to explain. But a brand new build, complete with dining and amenities? That would be tough to explain away. It would give a lot less validity to the resale restrictions.