PLEASE READ, because I think I have a real solution to AP issue (no joke)

[Doctor P]

Honest to goodness, I think I have come up with a real solution to the AP issue I raised that would help everyone and I don't think would hurt anyone, AND would be easy to administer. There are three ideas, the first two of which I suddenly realized are used for annual passes in other venues (that's how, somewhat by accident, the solution came to me). Solution #1: Have a grace period of 3-4 days on an Annual Pass. If you buy it on December 22, the official activation date is listed as being December 25 or December 26. This would be a minor tweak, would have benefits for everyone (I think no one would be worse off) and would take away the problem that led me to be upset in the first place without any major change. Solution #2: Offer two different PAP--one that has all the plus features attached to it and one that is the same price as the PAP (or perhaps as much as $50 more) but that is really just an AP but one that is good for one year plus one week (i.e., the activation date stays the same, but it expires one week later the following year--you could still trigger renewals by the activation date to prevent things from getting wacky down the line). So in this case, the pass expires later, but the customer pays a higher price for that privilege. Solution #3: Here is a way that they could easily discount PH and PHP passes if they wanted to and avoid the fraud and future liability for admissions: A DVC discounted PH (actually let's just make a PHP for reasons I outline below) or PHP pass can only be bought with ID and must be put on the room key. It expires at the end of the stay (just like an UPH). Advantage to Disney is that there is no way to transfer the pass, the pass expires, if you require a PHP then many people may be upgrading from a PH, and everyone who buys the pass will have an incentive to use the plus features up during their visit so that visits to the Water Parks and PI and Wide World of Sports may/should increase and help spending patterns.

Have I finally hit on something that might work??

 

[Dean]

While they would help you, the administration on the changes would be significant and IMO, unreasonable from Disney's standpoint. As for the last option, Disney obviously made that decision in implementing the present options. They could have gone that way and decided not to. I'm sure they had their reasons and suspect they are somewhat financially motivated. One thing I refrained from posting on the other thread is something I've told others including on this BBS. That is that one person's gain is not necessarily another person's loss. This applies to perks, discounts and the like such as the new DVC passes and also to amenities, many of which an individual member may not use. I don't pool hop, I no longer have small kids, and I almost never use the bus; yet I pay for items related to those issues. You have to look at the overall picture and decide if it's worth it or not. I'll repeat my previous thought, have you contemplated whether DVC might or might not be right for you?

 

[kweaver]

Originally posted by Doctor P
Honest to goodness, I think I have come up with a real solution to the AP issue I raised that would help everyone and I don't think would hurt anyone, AND would be easy to administer.

Maybe it's just early in the morning...or I'm not understanding this correctly. Please fill me in if I am misinformed or unclear.

Originally posted by Doctor P
Solution #1: Have a grace period of 3-4 days on an Annual Pass. (snip)

What exactly is the advantage to this? As a PHP buyer, I don't see any advantage to me...and it takes away the ability of AP buyers to purchase their APs head of time and activate them during their trip (something AP buyers have always had...even before the DVC discount).

Originally posted by Doctor P
Solution #2: Offer two different PAP--one that has all the plus features attached to it and one that is the same price (or perhaps as much as $50 more) that is really just an AP but one that is good for one year plus one week (snip)

I see where this would help those folks who need to take their vacations during the same single week every year. Unfortunately, other than getting an extra $50 for the pass...there is no win in this for Disney. Also, I believe the overall percentage of people who fall into this category is extremely small. It is doubtful that they would add an additional type of pass that only works for such a small group...but you can try!

Originally posted by Doctor P
Solution #3: Here is a way that they could easily discount PH and PHP passes if they wanted to and avoid the fraud and future liability for admissions: A DVC discounted PH (actually let's just make a PHP for reasons I outline below) or PHP pass can only be bought with ID and must be put on the room key. It expires at the end of the stay (just like an UPH). (snip)

We already have this...as you said, it's called a UPH. A bigger discount is what you are really looking for here. For most people, the UPH is a bad deal either because a) they don't use the extra features anyway or b) they will use the waterpark features the the PHP allows them to save pass days for later if they change their mind or run out of time. I believe the PHP is cheaper, as well (maybe dependant on the number of days that you purchase).

It looks like you (personally) want a pass that has the flexibility of an AP (as it relates to park hopping), but will work within your vacation timeframe. It seems to me, that what would really work for your situation is the UPH. I'd venture to say that you are unhappy with the current price of that pass, and you just want a discount on it to match the new AP discount.

If my understanding is correct, I'd send that in an email to DVC so that they are aware of your needs. (This is exactly what the AP and the potential AP buyers did...BTW...and they had a good arguement...and it worked!) DVC can look at their numbers and decide if it benefits them to offer you a discount.

 

[CarolA]

Am I the only person who doesn't understand this?

And what does option 3 do for us? The point of an AP is to use it year round even when you are not staying at a DVC resort.

 

[jctwizzer]

Congratulations....you've just solved problems most of us don't have

 

[Doctor P]

Actually, it does solve the problems and is up mutual benefit. Option 1, the one I might add is used by Colonial Williamsburg not to mention other places, does not preclude buying your passes in advance or any other option that is currently available and adds NOTHING to the administrative costs at all. When the annual pass is ACTIVATED, you just post date the pass by three days. Do it for everybody as a further enhancement of the passes, and do it every year. As I said, it makes a big difference to some of us, costs Disney almost nothing, and is something that WOULD encourage future trips and more spending. As to option 2, I guess some people didn't read it carefully enough, because I think this is also an excellent option--call it whatever you want, but in effect I am arguing that they could make an "upgrade" available for a fee on the annual passes--a different kind of preferred pass that is good for one year plus one day. I think it would be administratively easy to have this pass, but if you don't agree, then there is another option to do the same thing. If you bring in your annual pass before it's expiration you can get it extended one week (perhaps you could sell it as a separate pass) for $150 ($100 difference between the AP and PAP + $50 more---I wasn't suggesting just a $50 bump obviously since I was saying the cost of a PAP). Option 3 is NOT the same as a PHP for those who do not use the PHP. The PHP has a limited number of options, does not include DQ, and does not allow hopping between plus options--I would maintain these differences. However, I will say that I just suggested Option 3 as a means of showing that, IF IT WERE TO BE DESIRED, and the barrier was the fraud/non expiring issue that you could get around it. I don't think Option 3 is a good one, frankly. I think if they went that direction it would be better to more deeply discount the UPH.

Dean, I'm not sure why anyone would think that if someone went to WDW every year for a week that DVC would not be appropriate for them?? I don't think that is an issue. And, everyone keeps bringing up other perks. I will reiterate that a pass perk is not like the others since the parks are the central differentiating feature of DVC vs. other timeshares.

 

[Doctor P]

Actually, Carol A, I think your point would be a matter of debate as to a DVC discount for annual passes. You might be right, but I would not necessarily assume that, and, as others have posted on other threads, that really defeats the principal purpose for owning DVC. I don't think we need to debate that issue, just pointing out that I don't think the issue is as clear as you might suggest.

 

[Mike]

Does anyone else have a visual of a man, standing in the middle of a dusty old street of a ghost town with tumbleweeds blowing around, yelling at the top of his lungs?

 

[Muushka]

Originally posted by Mike
Does anyone else have a visual of a man, standing in the middle of a dusty old street of a ghost town with tumbleweeds blowing around, yelling at the top of his lungs?

Doctor P. Give it up.

 

[WDWLVR]

Originally posted by Muushka


Doctor P. Give it up.

I agree - you made your point days ago but to keep beating the horse isn't doing anyone any good.

I don't see DVC customizing a plan just to make you happy.

 

[jennybobenny]

I don't care for option #1 - why wait those 3 days? Why can't the AP be activated right away? As for #2 - what will an extra day do? I don't see the real 'benefit'. And as for #3 - what happens if you don't use a day of your PH? If it expires at the end of your stay then you end up losing that day.
I must have missed something but I don't understand what you're trying to fix. We get a discount on APs now. Great if you use them - no biggie if you don't.

 

[tjkraz]

Walt Disney World Annual Passes have been in existence for---what--30 years now? And yet there has been no public outcry for a 53 week pass or a 370 day pass.

Something tells me that DVC adding AP discounts isn't going to change that fact.

 

[perdidobay]

I've got a really really great idea!!!!!!!
Why not ask DVD to take away ALL our perks... that way no one feels slighted!!!!!!!!!!!

BRILLIANT, eh?????

 

[Doctor P]

jenny,

You are understanding the pass system that is often used at other similar places.
When you activate your pass, the pass is active immediately, but they just put it into the system AS IF you activated it three days later so that in effect you have 368 days of use of the pass.

While you may think that I am beating a dead horse, the simple fact is that I am trying to find a win-win situation here for everybody that hurts no one and gets Disney ultimately some extra money. That's how improved decisions can be made.

 

[DrTomorrow]

Man oh man, is this a wild ride!

So, if I understand correctly, Options #1 and #2 turn an AP into an AP + 3 days or 1 week. I guess this addresses those who feel bad that they can't do what a lot of AP purchasers do - fit 2 trips into 1 calendar year. The third option confuses me - not the details, but the need for it at all.

A UPH - which we can get now with a modest DVC discount, offers: Unlimited admission to Magic Kingdom, Epcot, Disney-MGM Studios, Animal Kingdom, Blizzard Beach, Typhoon Lagoon, Pleasure Island, Disney Quest and Disney's Wide World of Sports.

A PHP - which you suggest should expire and be coded on the room key, offers: Unlimited admission to the Magic Kingdom Park, Epcot, Disney-MGM Studios, and Disney's Animal Kingdom Theme Park PLUS a choice of visits to the following: Blizzard Beach, Typhoon Lagoon, Pleasure Island, and Disney's Wide World of Sports Complex.

[Ticket info courtesy of allearsnet.com]

These two sound the same, except one has a finite number of PLUS choices but offers DQ, and the other is unlimited. I'm with kweaver - you'd be better off pushing for a better UPH discount.

As for Mike's comments re: tumbleweeds, I have a different but similar visual. It harkens back to my college days, when folks would stand outside classroom buildings, yelling at the top of their lungs, trying to engage students and faculty in obscure philosophical / religions debates. Same tune, different key....

 

[luvindisneyworld]

My head hurts

 

[crisi]

I'd rather see a better UPH discount, myself. I'm in the same boat, the AP discount isn't going to me much good, the UPH remains a better deal (and for us, a better deal than PHs - last year it was $2 more per ticket for UPHs over the cheapest hoppers available through a broker, but we had the option of DQ - which we didn't use - and the freedom to "blow a day" going in for dinner). Because we go every other year, none of Doctor P's options do us any good. But it would be nice to see a similar (25% vs. 10%) discount with UPHs (not that I expect them, I think the "deal" I get on my room is enough).

And for those telling him to give it a rest, you now know how it was perceived by a few that a few people here seemed to be constantly whining about lack of AP discounts. Doctor P was a relatively good sport while you asked for them, now you have them. Permit him to do the same. Don't like it, don't open his threads.

 

[cgcw]

Originally posted by perdidobay
I've got a really really great idea!!!!!!!
Why not ask DVD to take away ALL our perks... that way no one feels slighted!!!!!!!!!!!

BRILLIANT, eh?????

This is what I fear could happen. And, I certainly hope not!!!

But if they hear gripe after gripe after gripe, they just may to simplify everything.

Wouldn't that be a shame?

 

[Beca]

Originally posted by Doctor P


While you may think that I am beating a dead horse, the simple fact is that I am trying to find a win-win situation here for everybody that hurts no one and gets Disney ultimately some extra money. That's how improved decisions can be made.

Doctor P...here's what I am not getting. If Disney were to allow extensions on AP's by not officially activating them until a few days after the date of first use, wouldn't that mean that some people would only have to buy a pass every other year, rather than every year? Wouldn't that cost WDW significant amounts of money? Maybe I am misunderstanding this, but I always thought the "discount" received when purchasing an annual pass anywhere was because 1) it is a a one-year and one-year ONLY pass, and 2) it tends to be offered to those who find they want unlimited use of the park over many years.

What I am not understanding, is from a business prospective...why would it be a good move for WDW to arrange it so that people only have to buy passes every other year?

Not to mention, the discount is REALLY good. We are going in Dec, and a 5-day pass is costing us $245 ADVANCE price. After Jan, an annual pass would only cost us $58 more...shoot, it is worth the money just IN CASE I get the chance to go back...plus, all the associated discounts...rooms, World of Disney (I ALWAYS spend a minimum of $300 dollars there....that's $30 of my "extra" cost right there). I guess you could look at it as, "Buy 6 days, get the rest of the year free...plus room and shopping discounts that you wouldn't normally have."

I admire your tenacity in trying to find something that works...I'm just not following your logic on this one. If you can see what I am not following, please help me understand.



Beca

 

[kweaver]

Originally posted by DrTomorrow
Man oh man, is this a wild ride!

True...but it's been very fun and engaging! We must have one of these threads every once in a while...to break the monotony of all of the regular DVC 'stuff'. While I have felt like I've been beating my head against the wall throughout this discussion...I've had a good time.

Originally posted by crisi
And for those telling him to give it a rest, you now know how it was perceived by a few that a few people here seemed to be constantly whining about lack of AP discounts. Doctor P was a relatively good sport while you asked for them, now you have them. Permit him to do the same. Don't like it, don't open his threads.

I'll gladly let Dr. P continue...but let's all remember that the folks who wanted an AP discount had a good argument for one...that gave both DVC members and Disney something to be happy about. It seems to me that they banded together and presented the facts to DVC in a professional manner.