Please do NOT go to Disney World if you (or your children) are sick

[bgohre]

You've planned your trip for a year now. You've done everything possible to get your kids excited and ready to go. The day you leave your daughter wakes up and says she doesnt feel well, are you staying home?

Lets be honest, unless you make multiple trips a year or live in the area, you're going.

 

[princessmom29]

See...

THIS is precisely the reason I am becoming a doctor, people!: because the general public cannot keep themselves healthy unless they are given the FACTs (and understand them!!).

Now... with that said, lets look at the FACTs (and not whatever our ears decide to filter out...):

As of October, H1N1 flu has caused approximately 100 CHILDREN to die (with 9 of those occurring this week). This is in comparison about 80 kids who die throughout the ENTIRETY of the average flu season. So, what does that mean (... those of you who think H1N1 is no worse than the "average" flu, listen up)? It means that more kids have already died from H1N1, as opposed to the number of kids who die from the "average" flu (and it's only October!). The reason is this: More people develop pulmonary complications from swine flu than the "normal" flu strain... There's something about this H1N1 that causes some peoples' lungs to go psycho. It's when the lungs fill with fluid that people begin to present with the pneumonia symptoms that the scary side of H1N1 rears it's head. And the scariest part is that we know relatively little about this virus (they only isolated and reconstructed the virus for lab study in 2005)-- we don't know why some people are getting sicker than others. This is the same strain of flu that killed so, so many people during the Spanish Influenza outbreak of 1918 (don't remember it in History? Look it up). It is DEFINITELY more serious. Guys, we are talking about a global pandemic influenza. In the words of Ming Ming, This is serious.

Now... on the other hand, do we need to all spazz out and coop ourselves up in a bubble till Spring? No way! Just get your facts straight and exercise COMMON SENSE. If you or your child begin to present flu-like symptoms, for God's sake don't take them out somplace and infect others!... get them promptly treated and then keep them isolated (or relatively so), until at least 2 days after fever disappears without Tylenol. Some people choose to get the vaccine and that is fine if that is your choice (I am still on the fence about it). I can say for myself that I will be watching my 3 year old like a hawk and taking some extra precautions this year (but not going overboard).

So I guess my rant is for this reason: I don't CARE how much MONEY you sunk into this trip!!-- There is FAR more at stake than a 5-thousand-dollar family vacation, people!! This flu spreads like wildfire and PEOPLE ARE DYING. Mothers and fathers are dying and leaving their kids confused and grieving. Parents are burying their children. Please please exercise some common sense. If you think you have the H1N1 virus, please stay at home until you are better.

(Sorry to get all worked up, but someone neeeded to...)

Thanks for listening to my over-the-top rant session.

There is really no statistical difference in the number of deaths from H1N1 versus seasonal flu, and while therre is a segment of the population that is having pulmonary complications, the majority of those are people with underlying pulmonary risk factors like athsma or smoking, not people with no risk factors. It is in all likelyhood NOT the same H1N1 that killed people in the spanish flu outbreak, but how could we possibly even know that if the virus was not isolated for study until 2005?? There are no samples of spanish flu for a comparision study! It is theorized that it was an H1N1 strain, but not necessairly this one. Viruses mutate too quickly for one to remain unchanged since 1918 anyway. That is why there is a new flu vaccine every year. The strand mutates to the point that the previous vaccine in no longer effective. Flu is a constantly changing illness, and this is just another manifestation of the flu. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[snickerboo]

"Don't worry, we have asthma, not H1N1...now stop staring at me". What do you think of that?

Can you make one for my dd, too? LOL Since she was a toddler, I have had to tell people that around her because her asthmatic bark can be so bad it makes people think she's got some horrible disease!

Lets be honest, unless you make multiple trips a year or live in the area, you're going.

No, I am not. If my daughter wakes up Tuesday morning with a high fever, sore throat and body aches, we won't be going.

It is not the end of the world to cancel a Disney trip. It is the end of the world for a parent when their child dies. Period. It might be very rare that a child dies from this but it is definitely happening all around every one of us. I'd never deliberately drive my car at a child, why would I deliberately expose them to a potentially fatal disease. What's the difference?

 

[Withacy]

I live in new jersey - northern NJ- and cannot find one blessed place that has the shot vaccine for H1N1. I think that the flu.gov site is a joke. In NJ, everywhere is TBD - to be determined - with a couple of towns tentatively scheduling clinics for November. However, because they are so few and far between, they are being inundated with requests from citizens around the state.

So how does that make http://www.flu.gov/ a joke? It's a source of information - and a good source too - not the source of the vaccine. If your local providers don't have the vaccine, why does that make the website a joke?

Compared to some of the rather idiotic "information" being spread here, I'd rather people went to the official web site.

 

[ironz]

There is really no statistical difference in the number of deaths from H1N1 versus seasonal flu, and while therre is a segment of the population that is having pulmonary complications, the majority of those are people with underlying pulmonary risk factors like athsma or smoking, not people with no risk factors. It is in all likelyhood NOT the same H1N1 that killed people in the spanish flu outbreak, but how could we possibly even know that if the virus was not isolated for study until 2005?? There are no samples of spanish flu for a comparision study! It is theorized that it was an H1N1 strain, but not necessairly this one. Viruses mutate too quickly for one to remain unchanged since 1918 anyway. That is why there is a new flu vaccine every year. The strand mutates to the point that the previous vaccine in no longer effective. Flu is a constantly changing illness, and this is just another manifestation of the flu. Nothing more, nothing less.

Younger people and PREGNANT women are getting some bad outcomes. Several pregnant women have died. Or are in hospitals on ventilators. I know, because I read xrays/CT scans for 7 days straight on one.

I think MOST people will use common sense...if you have allergies, etc...then fine. But if you are sicker than normal with flu symptoms, please don't go spreading it. There is another current post about people who just were in WDW and ended up in the hospital. Not from being careless but because someone else's germs were being spread.

Use common sense. It's not all about you, as our society seems to think these days.

 

[Wall-E1]

There is really no statistical difference in the number of deaths from H1N1 versus seasonal flu, and while therre is a segment of the population that is having pulmonary complications, the majority of those are people with underlying pulmonary risk factors like athsma or smoking, not people with no risk factors. It is in all likelyhood NOT the same H1N1 that killed people in the spanish flu outbreak, but how could we possibly even know that if the virus was not isolated for study until 2005?? There are no samples of spanish flu for a comparision study! It is theorized that it was an H1N1 strain, but not necessairly this one. Viruses mutate too quickly for one to remain unchanged since 1918 anyway. That is why there is a new flu vaccine every year. The strand mutates to the point that the previous vaccine in no longer effective. Flu is a constantly changing illness, and this is just another manifestation of the flu. Nothing more, nothing less.

The poster that you quoted gave you statistical data showing the difference in deaths between H1N1 and Seasonal flu. Approximately 100 children have died form it this season, and that compares to about 80 dying in a regular, full season. We are only in the beginning of the season. We are not near the peak yet. That statistic is very alarming. If you look at the CDC home page on seasonal flu, they say that most states currently have widespread influenza, with most of those cases being H1N1. Take the CDC and media warnings seriously. This could be a very deadly season. Protect your children. Get vaccinated for H1N1. Don't take the warnings lightly.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

You've planned your trip for a year now. You've done everything possible to get your kids excited and ready to go. The day you leave your daughter wakes up and says she doesnt feel well, are you staying home?

Lets be honest, unless you make multiple trips a year or live in the area, you're going.

No. That is what trip insurance is for. If a member is sick.

100 children have died already, and the flu season has just begun.

* During the 2003-04 season, 153 flu-associated deaths in children were reported to CDC. (This data was collected by CDC.)
* During the 2004-05 season, 47 deaths in children were reported to CDC. (This is the first year that influenza mortality in children became a nationally reportable condition.)
* During the 2005-06 season, 46 deaths in children were reported to CDC.
* During the 2006-07 season, 76 deaths in children were reported to CDC.
* As of June 14, 2008, 83 deaths in children occurring during the 2007-08 season have been reported to CDC.

 

[ogreenlee]

It comes on pretty quick. You'll know you or your child has it because you will, all of the sudden, feel bad. It's not something that takes 2-3 days to really get going. ONce the first symptom starts.. you're on your way (if it's the flu, that is). Either you'll spike a fever or your throat will start hurting. My DD6 came home from school complaining of a sore throat. She was warm. I'm not sure why no one called me from school, but oh well. By that night, her fever shot up to 104. This was all in a matter of 5-6 hours. I asked if her throat hurt that morning, and she said, "No.. it started hurting after lunch." So this was a quick onset. Yes, she may have been contagious before that, but there was no coughing or sneezing. Just a sore throat.

So, more than likely, you'll know. If you get on the airplane and your kid looks at you and says, "My throat hurts." Then be prepared.

Also, if you spend $5000 on a trip to Disney and you don't buy travel insurance.. well, that's not a very smart move. After I found out that it'd be a PITA to get your money back after you're there and cancel, I added insurance. Disney has a great cancellation policy, if you cancel before the trip starts.. even the day before. When it gets bad is when you're on Day 3 of your 10day trip, and you get the flu. With travel insurance, you get to go home and have the remainder taken care of. I'm willing to bet that if you didn't use your tickets while you were there sick, you'd be reimbursed the entire amount.

I've had to use travel insurance 3 times. I haven't had a problem getting my money back yet.

 

[Toad_Passenger]

The poster that you quoted gave you statistical data showing the difference in deaths between H1N1 and Seasonal flu. Approximately 100 children have died form it this season, and that compares to about 80 dying in a regular, full season. We are only in the beginning of the season. We are not near the peak yet. That statistic is very alarming. If you look at the CDC home page on seasonal flu, they say that most states currently have widespread influenza, with most of those cases being H1N1. Take the CDC and media warnings seriously. This could be a very deadly season. Protect your children. Get vaccinated for H1N1. Don't take the warnings lightly.

The statistics for children are alarming, but the overall statistics (when you remove age) are very similar to the seasonal flu.

I understand the whole "children are our future" thing, but no one seems to raise this much ire when Grandma and Grandpa are dying, by the 1000's, from the seasonal flu every year.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

This flu isn't taking out the elderly. In the nursing homes they say that pneumonia/flus can be the friend of the elderly.

This flu targets healthy people. It is a russian roulette in viral form.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

The statistics for children are alarming, but the overall statistics (when you remove age) are very similar to the seasonal flu.

I understand the whole "children are our future" thing, but no one seems to raise this much ire when Grandma and Grandpa are dying, by the 1000's, from the seasonal flu every year.

Sometimes it is time for grandma to pass. Mine did from pneumonia. It was a good thing. She was in pain all of the time, and because of this she passed quickly.

If this is not the peak of this flu, it is scary how parents may have to plan their child's funeral. Been there done that. It sucks. Far more than my grandma's ever did.

 

[Wall-E1]

The statistics for children are alarming, but the overall statistics (when you remove age) are very similar to the seasonal flu.

I understand the whole "children are our future" thing, but no one seems to raise this much ire when Grandma and Grandpa are dying, by the 1000's, from the seasonal flu every year.

Exactly. That's why I was stressing to "protect your children" and get them vaccinated. This strain seems to be most severe on the very young and the very old, right now(of course this could quickly change and become more severe). Now, with senior citizens, they are always at more risk than others due to age and age related ailments.

 

[princessmom29]

The poster that you quoted gave you statistical data showing the difference in deaths between H1N1 and Seasonal flu. Approximately 100 children have died form it this season, and that compares to about 80 dying in a regular, full season. We are only in the beginning of the season. We are not near the peak yet. That statistic is very alarming. If you look at the CDC home page on seasonal flu, they say that most states currently have widespread influenza, with most of those cases being H1N1. Take the CDC and media warnings seriously. This could be a very deadly season. Protect your children. Get vaccinated for H1N1. Don't take the warnings lightly.

If you look at the RMS errors for the data quoted on seasonal flu deaths versus H1N1 deaths the margin of error is very close to the difference between the 2 measurments, thus there is no statistical difference between the measurments. Determination of cause of death is not an exact science, and errors are made. Depending on which agency's report you look at there are differing opinions on wether we have reached the peak of this outbreak. My point is not that no one is getting sick, but that for the vast majority of people is it very mild and easily treated in a couple of days. The cases of serious complication are extremely rare.

 

[princessmom29]

Exactly. That's why I was stressing to "protect your children" and get them vaccinated. This strain seems to be most severe on the very young and the very old, right now(of course this could quickly change and become more severe). Now, with senior citizens, they are always at more risk than others due to age and age related ailments.

children are always at greater risk as well due to their still developing immune systems.

 

[summerlady]

I live in new jersey - northern NJ- and cannot find one blessed place that has the shot vaccine for H1N1. I think that the flu.gov site is a joke. In NJ, everywhere is TBD - to be determined - with a couple of towns tentatively scheduling clinics for November. However, because they are so few and far between, they are being inundated with requests from citizens around the state.

Also, cannot find a private ob in NJ that has requested and/or received the shot. I go to one of the larger practices in the northern part of the state and they didn't order it. Same with a lot of the pediatric practices.

I think that this is really ridiculous, considering that here is the chance to vaccinate a highly dense population (one of the most dense in the country) prior to a massive outbreak of the H1N1 flu.

And don't go to disney if you have the flu. Its contagious, no matter what you armchair doctors think and what rationalization you are using.

You're not alone. I live in Sussex County and there's a H1N1 clinic scheduled for this coming weekend at the county college, but they're only vaccinating people (and kids) up to age 24, by appointment only because they only have 5,000 doses of the nasal. Our family doctor isn't getting the vaccine at all, so I guess DH and I are going to have to wait until after our vacation, hopefully we won't get sick before or during. We both had the vaccine way back in 1976 and our doctor told us that we may have some immunity because of that.

 

[princessmom29]

Younger people and PREGNANT women are getting some bad outcomes. Several pregnant women have died. Or are in hospitals on ventilators. I know, because I read xrays/CT scans for 7 days straight on one.

I think MOST people will use common sense...if you have allergies, etc...then fine. But if you are sicker than normal with flu symptoms, please don't go spreading it. There is another current post about people who just were in WDW and ended up in the hospital. Not from being careless but because someone else's germs were being spread.

Use common sense. It's not all about you, as our society seems to think these days.

pregancy would be a n underlying pulmonary risk factor because of the increased blood volume and increased load on the polmonary system to provide oxygen exchange for the baby. It makes since that there would be an increase in pulmonary complications for them. It is true of pregnant women with seasonal flu as well.

 

[Wall-E1]

If you look at the RMS errors for the data quoted on seasonal flu deaths versus H1N1 deaths the margin of error is very close to the difference between the 2 measurments, thus there is no statistical difference between the measurments. Determination of cause of death is not an exact science, and errors are made. Depending on which agency's report you look at there are differing opinions on wether we have reached the peak of this outbreak. My point is not that no one is getting sick, but that for the vast majority of people is it very mild and easily treated in a couple of days. The cases of serious complication are extremely rare.

I have not seen the data that you are talking about. However, I fully believe that we are well ahead of the normal number of children's deaths for this point in the flu season. The numbers may be closer based on the RMS data that you are referring too. I just am not willing to play russian roulette with my child's life over some RMS differentials. With the danger that this strain presents, it is foolhardy to advise others not too take this threat seriously. That's just my opinion. Of course, I am a germaphobe.

 

[princessmom29]

I have not seen the data that you are talking about. However, I fully believe that we are well ahead of the normal number of children's deaths for this point in the flu season. The numbers may be closer based on the RMS data that you are referring too. I just am not willing to play russian roulette with my child's life over some RMS differentials. With the danger that this strain presents, it is foolhardy to advise others not too take this threat seriously. That's just my opinion. Of course, I am a germaphobe.

I am not advising anyone not to take is seriously, just not to panic over it. We are using all of our normal precautions against getting sick, but are not going overboard with it. All of the hand sanitizer ect in the world cannot protect you against airborne transmission. 80% of transmission on this one is airborne. People should stay home if they are ill, but not everyone does. Your only choices are stay locked in your house or take your chances. Your only real defense outside of the vaccine which we will be getting if and when we have the opportunity is to get plenty of rest and proper nutrition. Handwashing does help with contact transmission, but you are much, much more liley to get it from airborne transmission. I am a teacher whose last career was in biochemistry so germaphobe is not in the job description.

 

[Wall-E1]

I am not advising anyone not to take is seriously, just not to panic over it. We are using all of our normal precautions against getting sick, but are not going overboard with it. All of the hand sanitizer ect in the world cannot protect you against airborne transmission. 80% of transmission on this one is airborne. People should stay home if they are ill, but not everyone does. Your only choices are stay locked in your house or take your chances. Your only real defense outside of the vaccine which we will be getting if and when we have the opportunity is to get plenty of rest and proper nutrition. Handwashing does help with contact transmission, but you are much, much more liley to get it from airborne transmission. I am a teacher whose last career was in biochemistry so germaphobe is not in the job description.

Unfortunately, I don't go from normal to concerned. I go straight from normal to full fledged panic. It's a mental thing, not related to the flu. So, I just might begin construction of that underground lair that I have been thinking of building. I'll stock up on my Spaghetti - O's and Strawberry Frosted Pop Tarts and prepare for the end of civilization.

For normal people, I would agree with you. Don't panic, but be sensible and take precautions.

I commend you for teaching biochemistry. I find it a fascinating field and would surely have a nervous breakdown if put in a room full of live petri dishes.

 

[ogreenlee]

that live vaccine mist freaks me out.

i'm bringing the purell spray. you cough on me, i spray your face.