Pilgrims and Indians; You've Got to be Kidding!!

[WDWRocksMySocks]

I bet nobody will be protesting on their paid holiday tommorow!

People really need to get a grip.

Seriously!! It's a sad world we live in.

 

[DarthKTrava]

Some people seriously need to get a life!!!

Goes to show there's no cure for the common stupid!

 

[imabrat]

Good grief

I totally agree. Dear God, people will complain about anything and everything these days.

 

[DawnCt1]

I am glad to see that there is no debate on this! All these Dis'ers agreeing?? Can't be!

 

[rentayenta]

Here's a little Thanksgiving tidbit: Thanksgiving is mirrored after the Jewish holiday Sukkot. So really, everyone should be skipping the pork and shellfish this Thanksgiving.

 

[mom23boys]

This world gets crazier by the minute. It truly is frightning.

 

[Oreo Cookie]

Worse than doing away with the costumes, IMO, is that some so-called "adults" can't question and disagree respectfully. Hate mail and getting so out of hand, in view of the children, that the police have to be called? What a bunch of loons. On both sides.

I agree.

It's sad that this happened. Thanksgiving is a time of coming together and sharing. Putting aside ones differences. Kids dressing up in costume and learning the history of thanksgiving is a good thing. Sometimes adults need to just step aside.

 

[WebmasterMaryJo]

This story has been on the news here for the past few days, and a local radio station interviewed a couple of parents. Apparently, one parent objected because the the outfits were not accurate.

The children are taught how the Native Americans taught the Europeans how to get food here, and the two schools celebrate friendship, taking turns being the pilgrims or Native Americans.

But, this year, one parent really made noise in protest, and the schools said that they would still get together, but not use costumes. So, the other parents (majority) argued back and said that they were not willing to change their tradition because one person disagreed.

etc etc

 

[SwedishMeatball]

I remember everybody hoped to be an Indian because they had the cool costumes. Nobody wanted to be a boring Pilgrim. I think it's alright in the early grades to celebrate different cultures merging together for a peaceful meal. Of course it's also important in later grades to teach about all the conflicts which occured. I think some parents lose sight of just letting young children not be bombarded with all of the facts at once. It's every parent's right to instruct their child in addition to what is being presented in the classroom, but I just think it's extreme to expect most Kindergarten students to take in all those complex issues.

 

[Charade]

I remember everybody hoped to be an Indian because they had the cool costumes. Nobody wanted to be a boring Pilgrim. I think it's alright in the early grades to celebrate different cultures merging together for a peaceful meal. Of course it's also important in later grades to teach about all the conflicts which occured. I think some parents lose sight of just letting young children not be bombarded with all of the facts at once. It's every parent's right to instruct their child in addition to what is being presented in the classroom, but I just think it's extreme to expect most Kindergarten students to take in all those complex issues.

It was the buckles. The buckles on the shoes.

 

[SwedishMeatball]

Oh that is just sad. One of his tights is all saggy.

 

[tzolkin]

Ridiculous;those parents should be ashamed of themselves- I mean it's history; the Indians were there as were the Pilgrims-what's the argument about?

I believe the argument is about kids wearing ridiculous costumes that are usually not culturally accurate whatsoever and being told that that's what Indians looked like.

I didn't read all the details of this specific protest, but I guess I'm going to have to be the first one to say that I understand the underlying issues. I allowed my daughter to participate in a similar event when she was in kindergarten, so I wouldn't be one of these protesters, but I did speak with her teachers about it and we pay close attention to what our kids are learning in school relating to white/Indian relations throughout history.

 

[Rora]

Ridiculous.

What is the world coming to?

 

[profdsny]

Maybe next year instead of a feast they can reenact the Pequot Massacre.
That should bring lots of smiles.

http://www.weyanoke.org/tbw-PequotMassacre.html

 

[Charade]

Maybe next year instead of a feast they can reenact the Pequot Massacre.
That should bring lots of smiles.

http://www.weyanoke.org/tbw-PequotMassacre.html

That's exactly what they need in KINDERGARTEN.

 

[CPT Tripss]

Quote:
Originally Posted by profdsny
Maybe next year instead of a feast they can reenact the Pequot Massacre.
That should bring lots of smiles.

http://www.weyanoke.org/tbw-PequotMassacre.html

That's exactly what they need in KINDERGARTEN.

Yeah, kindigarden is a bit young for the ugly reality of American history, but that's no reason to sugar coat history. And just when do we tell them the facts? 6th grade? 9th? 12th? In college? Never?
Maybe Col Jessup was right . . .

 

[C.Ann]

This kind of stuff absolutely infuriates me..

There is nothing left in this country that hasn't been ruined/banned by PC nonsense or special interest groups.. But whenever anyone mentions the concept of "opening a can of worms", the adamant response from those in favr of such nonsense will always come back with, "Oh - it will never to come that.."

Yeah - right.. It's called "tunnel vision" folks - but people are too naive to see it for what it is until it ends up on their doorstep/school/work place/neighborhood/ whatever...

 

[profdsny]

This kind of stuff absolutely infuriates me..

There is nothing left in this country that hasn't been ruined/banned by PC nonsense or special interest groups.. But whenever anyone mentions the concept of "opening a can of worms", the adamant response from those in favr of such nonsense will always come back with, "Oh - it will never to come that.."

Yeah - right.. It's called "tunnel vision" folks - but people are too naive to see it for what it is until it ends up on their doorstep/school/work place/neighborhood/ whatever...

Why is telling the truth "PC"? And why being respectful to people "PC"?

 

[okeydokey]

Here's an article from the Boston Globe that explains how those that work at Plymouth Plantation deal with stereotypes.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/ma.../11/24/learning_more_than_history_at_plimoth/

PLYMOUTH - It may be 2008, but staff members at Plimoth Plantation's Wampanoag Homesite regularly have to ask little boys to stop war-whooping and little girls to remove costume feathered headdresses and beaded dresses brought from home.
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Parents must be admonished for making jokey greetings like "How" or calling the performers "Chief," "Squaw," or "Indian." Just last week, an adult chaperone of a school group had to be corrected for asking Tim Turner, a staff interpreter who is a member of the Cherokee Nation, where he bought his alcohol.

"I told him straight out that wasn't appropriate, especially not in front of children," said Turner, who wore traditional native dress of breechcloth, moccasins, and skunk pelt while talking to tour groups last week. "I don't have a problem making people feel stupid if that's what's necessary."

Visitors' gaffes - deliberate or accidental - are not laughed off or ignored here, especially during Thanksgiving season, when 70,000 visitors are expected during the month of November. Confrontation and reeducation is a near-daily chore at one of the state's top tourist attrac tions for many of the homesite's approximately 15 staff members all of whom are Native American, or as they prefer to be called, Native people.

Plimoth Plantation now makes these requests for "cultural sensitivity" explicit in five languages on its website, and a main thrust of the revamped orientation film watched by the nearly 400,000 guests who tour the site, and the nearby Mayflower II, each year.

Signs erected in 2005 urge visitors en route to the homesite, where costumed guides cook over open fire and build dugout canoes called mishoons, to "please avoid harmful stereotypes."

"Our job is to educate people and break down stereotypes one person at a time coming down that hill," said Paula Peters, Plimoth Plantation's associate director of marketing and a member of the Mashpee Wampanoag Tribe. "Our mission is to give people a powerful, personal experience with history. The issues are painful, maybe, because it involves the very beginning of America."

For generations, American schoolchildren were steeped in the myth that Pilgrims sealed their relationship with their Indian helpers at a cheerful "thanksgiving" meal in 1621. Today, historians agree that the relationship between English settlers and the Wampanoag was complex, that the Native people attending the ceremonial meal probably outnumbered colonists by 2 to 1, and that nobody ate pumpkin pie or cranberry sauce.

Since Massachusetts overhauled its public school curriculum more than a decade ago, Plimoth Plantation has become a standard field trip for many of the state's third-grade classrooms. Along with the courageous Mayflower journey and other proud aspects of Pilgrim history, visitors learn about the Wampanoag culture that flourished for thousands of years before the Pilgrims arrived, and the brutal treatment the tribe suffered at the hands of settlers.Continued...

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Public perceptions are slow to change, and old prejudices carried by adults and bolstered by children's films such as Disney's "Pocahontas" and DreamWorks' "The Road to El Dorado" have made progress slow, many Native Americans complain.
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COMMENTS (39)

Even the acclaimed, meticulously researched 2006 New York Times bestseller "Mayflower," by award-winning author Nathaniel Philbrick, was criticized by native groups for its reliance on Anglo-centric sources, which Philbrick addressed in a new postscript in the paperback edition, published this year. "There is a desperate need for a book by the Wampanoag people . . . to tell their side of the story," he wrote.

It's a delicate balance between education and visitor relations, said Linda Coombs, associate director of the museum's Wampanoag Indigenous Program. Recently, she asked a 9-year-old girl who arrived in a homemade beaded costume to remove the garment before visiting the homesite, reducing the child to tears and upsetting her mother.

"It was hard, because the last thing on this girl's mind was giving offense; she was trying to 'honor the Indians,' " said Coombs, a 30-year veteran of Plimoth Plantation and a member of the Aquinnah Wampanoag community of Martha's Vineyard. "I did what I had to do for the sake of my staff, and correcting the stereotype." Such costumes are not tolerated because Native people find them to be a mockery of traditional dress. "We're here to explain how people feel. It makes people feel made fun of," Coombs said.

The awkward situation was salvaged by another cultural gesture, said Coombs. "I said to her, 'I understand you are giving up something that is important to you, so I'd like to give you a gift.' " She presented the girl with a beaded necklace from the gift shop to represent their coming to an understanding.

One of the most important changes at Plimoth came in 2006, when the museum quietly reoriented the visitor experience to show a welcome film explaining the museum's intent to balance Pilgrim and native stories, and lead visitors to the small Wampanoag homesite first. The site is modeled after the family home of Hobbamock, who acted as guide and interpreter for the first Plimoth colonists.

Homesite staffers dress in traditional garb, but speak in modern-day English, and tell visitors their real names.

"Kids are always asking me about my 'native' name, and expect me to say something like, 'Stands With Trees,' " Turner said. "So, I tell them to lean in real close, and then I whisper, 'It's . . . Tim.' They get a kick out of that."

The close encounter with Turner and other native interpreters was an eye-opener, said Karen Geraghty of Bridgewater, on a visit to the homesite with her friend, Beth Peterson, and their children last week. "The kids are really engaged here," she said. "We are learning a lot about indigenous people."

After a self-guided tour, tourists walk to the much larger 1627 English Village, where interpreters in thatched-roof houses recreate Pilgrim personas.

The change in the visitor experience "is definitely helping," said Wampanoag interpreter Darius Coombs. "They used to go to the Pilgrim village first, and they'd just be getting used to what is a game - speaking to people in character - and they'd come here. This isn't a game. This is real native people showing their culture."

The museum is also willing to push the envelope when necessary to get its awareness message out. It recently allowed Mo Rocca, a correspondent for "The Tonight Show with Jay Leno" to film a visit to the Wampanoag homesite with two waitresses from Hooters for a comedy segment. One of the so-called Hooters girls from the skit greeted a native staffer with "How!" She was promptly corrected by staffers, as the cameras rolled.

The museum cooperated with the segment, scheduled to air Wednesday evening because of its mission to educate, said Jennifer Monac, Plimoth Plantation's public relations manager.

The museum even lays out its own mistakes for public consumption. "Thanksgiving: Myth and Meaning," an ongoing exhibit, displays a 1960 photo of the museum's Thanksgiving re-creation with no indigenous people present, only high school students wearing red body paint. "At that time the museum was not aware that 'playing Indian' was offensive to Native People," the display notes.

Linda Coombs said confronting the less-than-ideal past is vital. "The Plantation strives to be as accurate as possible, which is a process," she said. "We learn from our mistakes too."

Erica Noonan can be reached at enoonan@globe.com.

 

[tw1nsmom]

It sounds like both sides were acting like idiots.

I have no real problem with kids wearing Pilgrim/Native American costumes at Thanksgiving. My kids just had a Thanksgiving Feast at school and many of the kids dressed up. It was adorable. I would like the school to address the more accurate portrayal of history in a little more detail each year as the children get older and can handle some of the more disturbing facts, but that doesn't mean that young children need to stop enjoying the more traditional aspects of the holiday.

However, the school made a decision and those bonehead parents (on both sides) who decided to protest in front of the school/children should be smacked up side the head.

Slightly OT, but I'm going to say something that's going to be unpopular here. I wish some of these festivals/parties at school would be scaled back a little and it has nothing to do with being PC. My kids spend so much time at feasts/assemblies/parties/carnivals....that when you add up all the days and hours spent on these activities, their 180 days of instruction turn into something like 140 days. I'm pulling my kids for a few days in December to go to Disney since their teachers have said that they don't really do anything much for week before Christmas. Two of the days they'll miss will be an all day assembly and an all day winter carnival. I just think all these big events are excessive.