Perspective to buyers from a 14 year DVC owner

[karen4546]

We bought a measley 125 points in May of 2019. We booked our Welcome Home @ Beach Club villas (2 studios/5 nights). We will say our purchase cost $25000 initially (direct) but used 150 points on the studios.value of first booking $450/night x 5 nights x 2 (this is a sold out resort for F&W =$4500. Purchased 3 Gold Annual Passes (I had a Platinum Pass but daughter and husband did not) that value is around $300/pass since we are not FL residents so $900 value.

2020 Copper Creek September 5 nights. value $2250. - $980 dues = value $1270 March 2020 5 nights at AKV Jambo - 2 studios = value $3500 (350/night) total 220 value $4770

2019 resort stay value: $5400 dues were paid in closing
2020 resort stay value: $ 5750 dues $980 = $ 4770
2021 resort stay nil dues $-980
2022 resort stay 2 value studios at Jambo for 5 nights value $3500 dues -$980=$2520

I would say the value of my 35 nights from SEptember 2019 to 2022 are anywhere from $350/night to $400 (@ AKV-20 nights BCV-10 nights, and CCV-5 nights). If you factor in 2 years of Gold AP savings for 3 people, merch and food discounts at $1200 then I would say I am @ $12910 and expect our "break even" to be in 3 more years. That is calculating a savings of $500/AP x 3 people.

IS that Disney Math? Definitley. Regrets on DVC purchase - nope. Well one..... I need more points (but those will be resale).

 

[davidl81]

We bought a measley 125 points in May of 2019. We booked our Welcome Home @ Beach Club villas (2 studios/5 nights). We will say our purchase cost $25000 initially (direct) but used 150 points on the studios.value of first booking $450/night x 5 nights x 2 (this is a sold out resort for F&W =$4500. Purchased 3 Gold Annual Passes (I had a Platinum Pass but daughter and husband did not) that value is around $300/pass since we are not FL residents so $900 value.

2020 Copper Creek September 5 nights. value $2250. - $980 dues = value $1270 March 2020 5 nights at AKV Jambo - 2 studios = value $3500 (350/night) total 220 value $4770

2019 resort stay value: $5400 dues were paid in closing
2020 resort stay value: $ 5750 dues $980 = $ 4770
2021 resort stay nil dues $-980
2022 resort stay 2 value studios at Jambo for 5 nights value $3500 dues -$980=$2520

I would say the value of my 35 nights from SEptember 2019 to 2022 are anywhere from $350/night to $400 (@ AKV-20 nights BCV-10 nights, and CCV-5 nights). If you factor in 2 years of Gold AP savings for 3 people, merch and food discounts at $1200 then I would say I am @ $12910 and expect our "break even" to be in 3 more years. That is calculating a savings of $500/AP x 3 people.

IS that Disney Math? Definitley. Regrets on DVC purchase - nope. Well one..... I need more points (but those will be resale).

One thing I find about DVC is that you will always "need" more points lol!

 

[808blessing]

I just thought to myself what a Disney snob. Lol!
My first contract I thought what a deal. This math works and I am set. Super good financial decision. I am so satisfied.
The second one, not so much but perfectly fit as a complement for what would work in the future. I wanted it. The money was there. Why not add on? The deal was direct so Mathematically least desirable, but probably last one I will keep and/or a rental stream or pass down after I sell the “great deal contract #1). The third one was pricy -not a ripoff but a splurge cause I only do sensible or frugal things—but it was EXACTLY what I wanted right now and for the next two decades. After much time on the calculator and even more time with mental math justifying, I simply owned my satisfaction. I have prioritized money for what I need in my monthly budget and savings and I am grateful I also have the opportunity to get what I want. It is hard for me to spend but there was a reckoning for what was the happiest way to spend my discretionary money. On these kinds of vacations. Everyone assigns their own value. The math is math and then you apply your own subjective circumstances and values to it. You do that part for yourself, not others.

 

[crisi]

One thing I find about DVC is that you will always "need" more points lol!

We haven't and have discovered that now that our kids are gone, we have too many points (and we only bought 150). Thus four days with four people in a Grand Villa just to use up our points. We aren't huge Disney people (although snobs) and have used our points for every other year trips - but we've taken a lot of other vacations during that time as well. (Africa, I always say this, but if you ever get a chance to do a safari, do it!)

Which is another thing about understanding what you are giving up. Some people never want to go anywhere other than Disney - maybe they will use points at Aulani once or twice....and that is great. You are really likely to end up with more points than you originally planned as you discover bigger rooms and all the wonderful seasons to visit Disney and maybe even share your love of Disney with friends and family. But there is a whole world out there if you are interested, and you'll have a limited number of vacation days and dollars to spend seeing it. Some people do that, remaining in the Disney bubble with Disney Cruises and Adventures by Disney trips - we've done both and they are great - but expensive travel options and not a great regular use of DVC points most of the time.

 

[davidl81]

We haven't and have discovered that now that our kids are gone, we have too many points (and we only bought 150). Thus four days with four people in a Grand Villa just to use up our points. We aren't huge Disney people (although snobs) and have used our points for every other year trips - but we've taken a lot of other vacations during that time as well. (Africa, I always say this, but if you ever get a chance to do a safari, do it!)

Which is another thing about understanding what you are giving up. Some people never want to go anywhere other than Disney - maybe they will use points at Aulani once or twice....and that is great. You are really likely to end up with more points than you originally planned as you discover bigger rooms and all the wonderful seasons to visit Disney and maybe even share your love of Disney with friends and family. But there is a whole world out there if you are interested, and you'll have a limited number of vacation days and dollars to spend seeing it. Some people do that, remaining in the Disney bubble with Disney Cruises and Adventures by Disney trips - we've done both and they are great - but expensive travel options and not a great regular use of DVC points most of the time.

The biggest downside to DVC that I see (especially true once you get higher in the point count) is how many of your vacations get tied into Disney trips. We have so many points now that money wise it always makes sense for us to take a Disney trip since rooms are paid for as opposed to going somewhere else. We have done Aulani three times now which I think is a great use of DVC points (we also always have enough United miles to fly the family for free so we basically get a "free" Hawaii vacation every two years). But overall when we think about vacations Disney is normally what we land on. Now don't get me wrong it's super easy to rent your points and use that cash to cover the cost of travel somewhere else, and I like that DVC gives us that option.

 

[crisi]

It has been easy to rent out your points to cover other vacations, but you have to get over the psychological hump of "lets do something else." Hawaii is nice. Thailand or Fiji are also wonderful, but there isn't a DVC resort in Thailand or French Polynesia - so it becomes three trips to Oahu because its really easy to book your DVC trip - missing the other islands unless you hop. That is one of the wonderful things about DVC and Disney - vacations take little thought (especially when you've been enough that you understand the systems and don't need to participate in the mad ADR/Fastpass rush - I dread learning a post pandemic WDW - it will be different), but its also one of the downsides. Once you have enough points to make every vacation a DVC vacation, doing anything else is extra effort. This fall we are going to Peru - we will go for less than a WDW vacation will cost - yes, even with DVC (granted travel is really cheap right now).

Again, its great if you want to spend many - or all - of your vacations in Mickey's bubble. But point plan appropriately if you want to see other places.

 

[4luv2cdisney]

It has been easy to rent out your points to cover other vacations, but you have to get over the psychological hump of "lets do something else." Hawaii is nice. Thailand or Fiji are also wonderful, but there isn't a DVC resort in Thailand or French Polynesia - so it becomes three trips to Oahu because its really easy to book your DVC trip - missing the other islands unless you hop. That is one of the wonderful things about DVC and Disney - vacations take little thought (especially when you've been enough that you understand the systems and don't need to participate in the mad ADR/Fastpass rush - I dread learning a post pandemic WDW - it will be different), but its also one of the downsides. Once you have enough points to make every vacation a DVC vacation, doing anything else is extra effort. This fall we are going to Peru - we will go for less than a WDW vacation will cost - yes, even with DVC (granted travel is really cheap right now).

Again, its great if you want to spend many - or all - of your vacations in Mickey's bubble. But point plan appropriately if you want to see other places.

This is why I really hope Disney returns "new and improved" but it's not looking like that so far. We enjoy Disney more than "other travel". Nothing else really satisfies everyone in our household. Together, we do Disney. There are girls trips, guys trips and our now adult children can do whatever they want on their own / in addition to. But DH and I really only have plans for Disney trips even in retirement. We are not the most compatible when it comes to traveling elsewhere. So, if Disney goes downhill, we will be in a bit of a pickle. lol

Even at WDW, there are very strong likes / dislikes with some of us and we have always done a lot of "divide and conquer" throughout the day. That is much harder when an entire morning or afternoon or day is revolving around an event or activity someone isn't really into. So, yes, WDW is very "easy".

 

[culli]

I won't get into the math but the thing you hit on for my family is the trips. My kids are now 18,16,14 and 10 - we have been going since 2007 and the memories are incredible. I love when they popup on Facebook and I get to look at them. It also helps me know how much my kids had at Disney and most of those are not park related but the relaxed "2nd home" feeling we all had hanging out and doing non-park stuff. I don't think I would have gone 2-4x's a year without DVC and as my kids get older, they still want to constantly go to Disney. With travel hockey, baseball and various other activities in pleasantly surprises me that my "young" adults are still Disney kids and still their #1 destination.

 

[culli]

This is why I really hope Disney returns "new and improved" but it's not looking like that so far. We enjoy Disney more than "other travel". Nothing else really satisfies everyone in our household. Together, we do Disney. There are girls trips, guys trips and our now adult children can do whatever they want on their own / in addition to. But DH and I really only have plans for Disney trips even in retirement. We are not the most compatible when it comes to traveling elsewhere. So, if Disney goes downhill, we will be in a bit of a pickle. lol

Even at WDW, there are very strong likes / dislikes with some of us and we have always done a lot of "divide and conquer" throughout the day. That is much harder when an entire morning or afternoon or day is revolving around an event or activity someone isn't really into. So, yes, WDW is very "easy".

Exactly! You articulated how we feel...its just easy and has something for everyone. I love the Disney "bubble" isolating you from the world.

 

[crisi]

This is why I really hope Disney returns "new and improved" but it's not looking like that so far. We enjoy Disney more than "other travel". Nothing else really satisfies everyone in our household. Together, we do Disney. There are girls trips, guys trips and our now adult children can do whatever they want on their own / in addition to. But DH and I really only have plans for Disney trips even in retirement. We are not the most compatible when it comes to traveling elsewhere. So, if Disney goes downhill, we will be in a bit of a pickle. lol

Even at WDW, there are very strong likes / dislikes with some of us and we have always done a lot of "divide and conquer" throughout the day. That is much harder when an entire morning or afternoon or day is revolving around an event or activity someone isn't really into. So, yes, WDW is very "easy".

For us, my youngest would rather wander through museums. My oldest would rather sit on a beach. I want to experience a lot of different things - different scenery, different cultures, but I love History, especially European History, like my youngest, I can spend days in a museum (and have, I've spent at least four in the British Museum alone in the past five years). And I think mountains are amazing. Peru gets my husband and I continent bingo. My husband is fond of great food....Disney is the least amount of work - and when the kids were little it was great....but its no one's favorite vacation - it has no museums, no beach, no mountains (unless you count the roller coasters) and for History you have the Hall of Presidents. And the food is fine.....

Nothing wrong with the Disney bubble, when in it I love it, but it isn't our thing for every single vacation. It was when the kids were little, and we have lots of fond memories that make us want to visit every few years. And now that we are older, Hilton Head or Aulani are lovely places to snowbird for a week or two...and we have work anywhere jobs...so points get used. But I'm sure not looking for another contract. And yeah, if Disney doesn't come back with at least the quality that it had, I'm not sure how often we will be visiting WDW - probably to see new stuff (we haven't seen the Star Wars improvements yet).

 

[808blessing]

We took extensively planned vacations (by me) for the first ten years of DD life with a side trip to a Disney park for 7 of those years. I traveled a lot in the decades previously and I thought I didn’t want to take an easy route for family vacations and “do the same thing” for a considerable sum of savings every year. We ended up loving lots of places and explored all kinds of nooks and crannies in Italy, New York, Texas, Hawaiian Islands, Japan, Paris, Canada. Well, I’m wanting to rest with the plans for a long while and I’m done, wanting to retire into the Disney bubble with a side ski trip and international hop every few years. If DH wants to plan then I’ll be up for it. If not, I’ll be at Disney doing that thing I like to do. It hits the spot everytime and I’ve come to know the dance well. With DVC I can envision many, many variations on the golden trip.

 

[pavicich]

Don’t forget the 10-20% off at many dining and shopping locations. This adds up over the years!

 

[sethschroeder]

Don’t forget the 10-20% off at many dining and shopping locations. This adds up over the years!

@RoseGold

I am neutral buy resale or direct but I will say those discounts can be found through other methods such as Disney Visa. Not all of the discounts and not as big of a discount but not enough to really add up that much especially since in normal times you can get Tables in Wonderland as a resale owner.

My big thing with direct is ticket discounts and access to everything no questions asked.

 

[gisele2]

I loooove ramen. So much that I have a delivery of Japanese ramen every month. It is like Christmas every time I open the box.

More seriously, bought 2 timeshares, hope to start using them in 2022 for a big family trip and yes hope to bring grand-children one day if the life is good enough to grant me some. Did not have to cut anything to buy them, would not have bought it if it meant sacrificing other things important to us.

 

[eleven24]

The math has never worked for me. The OP says he paid $37,890 total for the 14 trips covering 70 nights. That's $541 per night average since 2008. The dues alone were $17,090 or $244/night.
If instead, he invested his $20,800 (even in an S&P index), he would have $58,591.
He could have rented DVC points and stayed in the same DVC accommodations for the same $244 per night. We do so frequently (and have the $58,591 to spend on other things).

Don't get me wrong...if you have the disposable finances, and choose to buy DVC, great for you. It's like buying an expensive car. It may not be necessary, but some choose it as a luxury. I just have trouble when people try to justify it as an "investment". It's not an investment. It's a purchase. More power to you if you can do so. Heck, if I inherit a great sum, I would love to leave DVC to my children.
For now, I'll spend the equivalent of your 'dues' on my vacation and keep the initial investment for myself.

Exactly right. If my original post came off as me suggesting it was a good financial investment, that was not my intent. The purpose was to those considering buying and offering up my real world usage vs cost as a data point that I didn't have when making my decision.

From an monetary investment vehicle, there's no question there are better options. For me, it was a family investment vehicle. One that ensured the work/life balance was enforced. One that would make it so we HAD to go on vacation every year. One that the kids knew not if, but when we come back next year. It just puts a whole different perspective on each visit. I can't explain how owning DVC made that difference. I just know that my previous park experiences before DVC were marathon days of exhaustion fitting in every possible ride we could to the point where I needed a vacation when I got home from my vacation. Since owning DVC my family has taken a more laid back approach to the parks. If it's too hot, we go back to the room and make lunch in the kitchen or hang out at the pool. If wait times are too long, we explore areas of the park we might never have seen.

Can one have all of that without owning DVC? Absolutely. Can one invest and use the gains from those investments to book the same exact trips I did and have more in the bank today? Absolutely. Would I have booked all of those trips - even the "backpack weekend" trips with my son?

Probably not. I would've likely said "maybe later, I'm too busy with work right now".

Therein lies the value of DVC for me. The fact that I can walk away right now with what I initially paid for it.... makes that decision one I'd do all over again.

 

[crisi]

Exactly right. If my original post came off as me suggesting it was a good financial investment, that was not my intent. The purpose was to those considering buying and offering up my real world usage vs cost as a data point that I didn't have when making my decision.

From an monetary investment vehicle, there's no question there are better options. For me, it was a family investment vehicle. One that ensured the work/life balance was enforced. One that would make it so we HAD to go on vacation every year. One that the kids knew not if, but when we come back next year. It just puts a whole different perspective on each visit. I can't explain how owning DVC made that difference. I just know that my previous park experiences before DVC were marathon days of exhaustion fitting in every possible ride we could to the point where I needed a vacation when I got home from my vacation. Since owning DVC my family has taken a more laid back approach to the parks. If it's too hot, we go back to the room and make lunch in the kitchen or hang out at the pool. If wait times are too long, we explore areas of the park we might never have seen.

Can one have all of that without owning DVC? Absolutely. Can one invest and use the gains from those investments to book the same exact trips I did and have more in the bank today? Absolutely. Would I have booked all of those trips - even the "backpack weekend" trips with my son?

Probably not. I would've likely said "maybe later, I'm too busy with work right now".

Therein lies the value of DVC for me. The fact that I can walk away right now with what I initially paid for it.... makes that decision one I'd do all over again.

The enforced vacation this is a big deal to a lot of people. The being able to stay in a multi room unit for a "reasonable" amount of upper middle class money is a big deal. There are lots of reasons why DVC can be a great VALUE.

 

[Galun]

The math has never worked for me. The OP says he paid $37,890 total for the 14 trips covering 70 nights. That's $541 per night average since 2008. The dues alone were $17,090 or $244/night.
If instead, he invested his $20,800 (even in an S&P index), he would have $58,591.
He could have rented DVC points and stayed in the same DVC accommodations for the same $244 per night. We do so frequently (and have the $58,591 to spend on other things).

That’s the wrong math. First, you included initial buy in cost in the cost per night calculation, when op can easily sell those points now for a profit vs initial cost - at 13 years closer to contract expiration. Second, where do you find point rentals at the cost of annual dues? I’ve owned for over a decade and there has always been a $7-8 difference per point between rental cost and dues cost.

The OP chose to use the points for vacation, but here’s how the math would work out if the points were rented out.

initial investment: $20800
current value of contact after 10% broker commission: $24400
13 years of renting out points at $7 spread: 200x7x13 = $18200
Total return over 13 years: $24400+18200-20800 = 21800
internal rate of return: 5.67%

that’s pretty good rate of return as a real estate investment.

 

[MomOTwins]

Exactly right. If my original post came off as me suggesting it was a good financial investment, that was not my intent. The purpose was to those considering buying and offering up my real world usage vs cost as a data point that I didn't have when making my decision.

From an monetary investment vehicle, there's no question there are better options. For me, it was a family investment vehicle. One that ensured the work/life balance was enforced. One that would make it so we HAD to go on vacation every year. One that the kids knew not if, but when we come back next year. It just puts a whole different perspective on each visit. I can't explain how owning DVC made that difference. I just know that my previous park experiences before DVC were marathon days of exhaustion fitting in every possible ride we could to the point where I needed a vacation when I got home from my vacation. Since owning DVC my family has taken a more laid back approach to the parks. If it's too hot, we go back to the room and make lunch in the kitchen or hang out at the pool. If wait times are too long, we explore areas of the park we might never have seen.

Can one have all of that without owning DVC? Absolutely. Can one invest and use the gains from those investments to book the same exact trips I did and have more in the bank today? Absolutely. Would I have booked all of those trips - even the "backpack weekend" trips with my son?

Probably not. I would've likely said "maybe later, I'm too busy with work right now".

Therein lies the value of DVC for me. The fact that I can walk away right now with what I initially paid for it.... makes that decision one I'd do all over again.

I like this post--it makes DVC seem kind of like how I felt about the pre-covid dining plan (which I loved). It was great to do the all the math at the end of the trip and realized we saved a couple hundred dollars. But better than that was the feeling of "oh we can order anything we want on the menu and have a milkshake (kids) or cocktail (me) and dessert too because it's all paid for." It just feels more like vacation that way somehow.

 

[davidl81]

I just know that my previous park experiences before DVC were marathon days of exhaustion fitting in every possible ride we could to the point where I needed a vacation when I got home from my vacation. Since owning DVC my family has taken a more laid back approach to the parks. If it's too hot, we go back to the room and make lunch in the kitchen or hang out at the pool. If wait times are too long, we explore areas of the park we might never have seen.

This right here 100%! For us DVC changed our trips so much. No worries about rope drop to park closing, heck there are a lot of days we may only go to a park for like 3 hours. We just go with the flow now. If the kids want to swim, cool we go down to the pool and let them swim all day. If lines are long at the park we will hit a few rides and go back to the room. It has just changed our view on Disney vacations 100%.

 

[princesscinderella]

This right here 100%! For us DVC changed our trips so much. No worries about rope drop to park closing, heck there are a lot of days we may only go to a park for like 3 hours. We just go with the flow now. If the kids want to swim, cool we go down to the pool and let them swim all day. If lines are long at the park we will hit a few rides and go back to the room. It has just changed our view on Disney vacations 100%.

Same for us too! We usually have annual passes and will rope drop and go back to the room after lunch and then go back to the parks for dinner after relaxing for a bit. We have done 5 COVID no parks resort only weekend stays and we have had so much fun and relaxation that my hubby said how will we ever go back to the parks for rope drop. We have universal APs but haven’t gone back there yet.