Owner liability

[Alice Sr.]

I remember reading a thread about a DVC owner being held responsible for charges made by the renter while staying at DVC property. The renter had given a credit card at check in so they could use their room keys to charge. At the end of their stay the credit card was declined and the DVC owner received a bill for all the charges. Is this still true? I have thought about renting some points but not if I am going to be liable for someone elses charges. I tried a search to locate the original post but couldn't find it.

Thanks,
Alice

 

[Deb & Bill]

The Public Offering Statement states that "Each Owner shall bear in their entirety any expenses for repairs or replacements to the Condominimum Property occasioned by the specific use or abuse of such Owner or any lessee, guest, exchanger, tenant or invitee of said Owner."

I found this at the very end of the Condominium Rules and Regulations of Disney's Beach Club Villas, A Leasehold Condominium, page 101 of the POS dated 2/2002.

So you are responsible for any damages caused by people who rent your points and by RCI guests who use your points as an exchange.

 

[bookwormde]

This is the reason why I would never rent out points. In reality there seems to be only a few rare instances where this is an issue, but with my muck I would be one of them.

bookwormde

 

[dbs1228]

True if there is real damage to the unit, but as charging charges to the room and get stuck with a guests "purchases" is less likely. If a guest have their cc swiped at the front desk for charging privelages they automatically put a dollar amount hold against that credit card (I beleive it is based on how many days you are staying) . Not that someone couldn't get "around" it. I think once given your cc and sign the front desk form (and charge slip for purchases) you as the resort guest are responsible.

 

[disneynutz]

True if there is real damage to the unit, but as charging charges to the room and get stuck with a guests "purchases" is less likely. If a guest have their cc swiped at the front desk for charging privelages they automatically put a dollar amount hold against that credit card (I beleive it is based on how many days you are staying) . Not that someone couldn't get "around" it. I think once given your cc and sign the front desk form (and charge slip for purchases) you as the resort guest are responsible.

Less likely but it could happen. There are a lot of members renting their points for the first time without requiring references. I see the problems increasing as time goes on.

Bill

 

[5forDiz]

True if there is real damage to the unit, but as charging charges to the room and get stuck with a guests "purchases" is less likely. If a guest have their cc swiped at the front desk for charging privelages they automatically put a dollar amount hold against that credit card (I beleive it is based on how many days you are staying) . Not that someone couldn't get "around" it. I think once given your cc and sign the front desk form (and charge slip for purchases) you as the resort guest are responsible.

Less likely maybe, but credit card scenario has & can happened despite perceived 'safeguards' & if it is an issue they'll be going straight to the member (account frozen, etc) because they don't have to bother with person who was member's guest or renter; the issue becomes the member's to straighten out - your renter/guest YOUR PROBLEM.

 

[Deb & Bill]

True if there is real damage to the unit, but as charging charges to the room and get stuck with a guests "purchases" is less likely. If a guest have their cc swiped at the front desk for charging privelages they automatically put a dollar amount hold against that credit card (I beleive it is based on how many days you are staying) . Not that someone couldn't get "around" it. I think once given your cc and sign the front desk form (and charge slip for purchases) you as the resort guest are responsible.

A slimey person could call their credit card company and report their card stolen right after it was used at the front desk to check in. All they do is keep their charges to under $1500 and it doesn't get charged until checkout day.

 

[JimMIA]

I remember reading a thread about a DVC owner being held responsible for charges made by the renter while staying at DVC property. The renter had given a credit card at check in so they could use their room keys to charge. At the end of their stay the credit card was declined and the DVC owner received a bill for all the charges. Is this still true? I have thought about renting some points but not if I am going to be liable for someone elses charges. I tried a search to locate the original post but couldn't find it.

Thanks,
Alice

The case you are referencing was not a rental. The owner had made a reservation for one of his relatives (brother or BIL) using points. At checkin, the guest left his credit card info for room charges, but when he checked out a mistake was made with the accounting and the charges (several hundred bucks) were never billed to his credit card. Apparently the $1,500 authorization was just released.

Months later, the owner tried to make a reservation and was told his account was frozen because of an unpaid bill. The matter was eventually resolved, but DVC apparently handled it pretty poorly considering it was their mistake in the first place.

I think this is a very rare occurence - this is the only instance I've heard of room charges being a problem. But if DVC makes a mistake at checkout, it's pretty clear the owner is ultimately responsible.

 

[disneynutz]

If the amount of damage at BLT is any indication of how people can be, renting can have risks.

As the number of rentals increase, there are bound to be some bad apples.

It's not known who is causing the issues at BLT, Cash Guests, Renters, or DVC Members, but we have been in rooms where the damage looked almost intentional. Broken light fixtures etc.

I am sure that if the occupant was required to pay for the fixture over the dining table or the chipped cabinet door, the cost would be hundreds of dollars. If the renter doesn't leave a CC on their room folio and refuses to pay, the Member is responsible.

Bill

 

[LIDisneyFan]

Although I was not the poster in question, this happened to me last year when I rented out points. Although the card is 'swiped' at the beginning of the stay, the hold will come off at some point (apparently). When my renter checked out, their card was charged, and rejected. My DVC account was frozen (no reservsations, banking, etc) until it was piad.

Fortunatly, when I c alled them, the renter immediately called the hotel and paid the charges, unfreezing my card

My new rules include indicating on the reservation that no room charging is premitted.

 

[CarolMN]

My new rules include indicating on the reservation that no room charging is premitted.

But if the guest gives the front desk a credit card when asked, or enters one for online check in, your rules aren't going to prevent room charging.

 

[JimMIA]

But if the guest gives the front desk a credit card when asked, or enters one for online check in, your rules aren't going to prevent room charging.

Exactly.

How many times do we tell potential renters that their transaction is strictly between them and the owner they rent from? Well guess what? That applies both ways. You can specify whatever rules you want between you and a renter, but not one of them is binding on Disney.

And Disney will let them room-charge because it generates additional sales and profits for Disney. Any problems that creates for you are your problems.

 

[LIDisneyFan]

Not true.

When making the reservation, you specify "No Room Charge Privileges". Make sure it is on your confirmation. Then it is binding on Disney.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Not true.

When making the reservation, you specify "No Room Charge Privileges". Make sure it is on your confirmation. Then it is binding on Disney.

Nah, not going to happen. The CM at the desk will ask the guest if they would like to leave a card on file for charging. The guest will say yes and it will be a done deal.

Unless the Disney attorneys get to sign off on your agreement, it will never be binding on Disney.

 

[mikron2]

I have been renting for 6 years and this is always a concern.

 

[dianeschlicht]

In 13 years of membership, I have never had the need to rent out points, and I have to say that this very topic is the reason I hope I never have to rent out points!

 

[n2mm]

Not true.

When making the reservation, you specify "No Room Charge Privileges". Make sure it is on your confirmation. Then it is binding on Disney.

I agree, not going to happen. Just last week we stayed at the BLT and the reservation was under my daughter's name (also a member on my account). She declined charging when she did her online checkin and when we made the reservation. After we checked in and I joined her reservation in the 1 bedroom, I went to the front desk and asked that I apply MY cc to the room and have charging priviledges added to mine and my husbands key card. No problem. I've done this several times when we have overlapping reservations where I'm already there, she shows up and we move from our room to her bigger room.

One of the other things I always remember is the clause you now sign at check in regarding smoking in the room and the fee you will be charged if it happens.

I remember the OP's story very well because having read this story (that did have a happy ending) I knew then I would never rent out any of my points, even to some of my own relatives (actually I wouldn't rent to almost all of my relatives). It openned my eyes to my liability.

 

[crisi]

Personally, I think the risk is really relatively small. In all my years here we haven't heard many stories of it happening and none where it hasn't been cleared up. Like the risk of the owner cancelling the reservation before the renter arrives - it just doesn't happen very often.

I suspect that renters really don't damage the rooms beyond what is normal, and that renters by and large pay their bills at check out. Because most people are decent human beings.

But it certainly is the case the in the contract the owner is responsible for charges and damages incurred by any guests or renters. And at any time Disney can choose to start holding us responsible.

I think the chances that you rent to someone who turns out to be renting for a trip for his college aged kid and his friends, who scratch up the tub with the keg and stain the walls with a silly string fight incurs damages large enough for Disney to chase you down is the highest. (Don't ask me how I know that the keg will scratch the tub and silly string stain the walls - and why that incurs a $3,000 bill from a hotel).

 

[Alice Sr.]

I guess in the end it, like the market, it boils down to the amount of risk you are comfortable with (or how lucky you think you are). I'm going to let .... (snip)......points go (they expire the end of the month), rather than rent them. It would just tick me off to no end if I rented points and then got stuck paying for someone else's good time.

 

[yfchen22]

Several years ago, we rented our DVC points to someone. Talked and emailed her several times through out the transaction. Everything went well until their credit card was declined after they checked out of Disney. The credit card bill was very close to the payment we received for the rental. The renter somehow disappeared and we couldn't contact them. Disney froze our account until we paid the bill. I guess we are responsible for the renter's unpaid bills. We just rented our points recently after many years of staying away from rental market. Hopefully we have better luck this time. It's either renting out or selling and I am not ready to part with DVC yet.