OT: DD doesn't like new teacher & has regressed in class UPDATE

[Tiger926]

.

 

[K and K's Mommy]

Wow! There's a lot to address, but I'll give you my opinion. First, I am a teacher although I am a SAHM right now. It sounds like we have a lot of the same philosophies. I don't like giving "prizes" for behavior or correct answers either! I don't really care about test scores (well, maybe my own child's, but I don't think it is a reflection on the school!), and I think primary elementary teachers need to be nurturing!

I used to teach at a Spanish immersion school. This was a choice offered there, and I wasn't a teacher in the immersion rooms. But, from what I know it wasn't unusual for the kindergartners to not be talking a lot yet. They had to feel completely comfortable. It doesn't sound like your DD does. The teacher should definitely not be yelling at them! I can remember on the playground when first grade immersion teachers would rattle off Spanish to a child, and then the child would respond in English. He/she got what was being said, just didn't respond yet.

I wasn't fond of my DS's third grade teacher last year, but I mostly kept my mouth shut. I believe kids have to learn to work with different personalities/ styles. BUT, he was 8, not 5. If you are sure you are not staying at this school, then I might move her now. The nightmares worry me. A five year old shouldn't be that stressed. Little kids usually transition well. Plus, it always seemed the new kids got a lot of positive attention in the younger grades. It might actually be easier to go into next year already knowing some kids.

If you think you might stay at this school, it is time for a conference with the teacher so she knows what is going on at home. Maybe she would be more compassionate! I'm also guessing the teacher is stressed with having a new baby.

Good luck!

 

[Tiger926]

.

 

[seashoreCM]

Generally I do believe in removing children from stressful situations.

There does come a time when the child has to "grow up" and "deal with things". I'm not sure when that is but I think that time is past elementary school.

 

[fimac]

What is the Vice Principal like at the school ? I have found that some will work really hard at trying to resolve a situation like this.

Is there another SK teacher ? Can your daughter be moved to another class ?

Are there any parent volunteers in the class room ? You might be able to find out what they think is going on in the class room.

You can ask for your daughter to be tested with the CCAT. You might be able to away from colouring and work on French reading.

You can also ask for the phone number of the school social worker and ask him/her to come in and observe the classroom.

I have been fighting with the english public board for a while and youngest son did two years of FI before he decided to that he want to move to english. (His grade 1 teacher was wonderful but it took the kids a while to adapt her style. The class was 1/2 split with 6 gifted kids in the grade 1 class. LOL)

Good Luck.

 

[ilandrazdsw]

Your DD sound completely bored! She probably got along with the other teacher so well, no because she was a teacher's pet, rather finished her work and he was able to keep her attention through errands, games, etc. Some teachers get this some don't...it really is sad that there are so many out there that think all children learn the same way...the sit and listen to me way...UGH. The previous teacher made learning fun for her, which in turn made her want to learn.
I agree with PP...is there another teacher/class? I understand your concern for transfering schools now, maybe the same school in a different class would be less stressful for her.
If moving is not an option, could you meet with the teacher and share your student's (and your) concerns? Hopefully she would realize that a little less attitude and a little more challenge on her part could help her to engage. Also, you don't know how many other parents and their children fell the same way. I thought I was the only one who had specific issues with DS' school, teacher, and curriculum, but talking with other parents (not gossiping) I found that I am not alone.
Good luck. Hope you DD can continue to enjoy learning

 

[Tiger926]

What is the Vice Principal like at the school ? I have found that some will work really hard at trying to resolve a situation like this.

Vice Principal is not that helpful at all. I sent her an email about why my daughter and several other kindergarteners didn't receive their milk last week during Pasta lunch (she is in charge of milk program that we pay for months in advance), and she sent me a message that had nothing to do with my daughter. Needless to say, not much help at all.

Is there another SK teacher ? Can your daughter be moved to another class ?
There are 5 other SK classes in the PM, but they are all full. I wouldn't do this as some of them are even more sombre looking than she is.

Are there any parent volunteers in the class room ? You might be able to find out what they think is going on in the class room.
Nope, no parent volunteers. I observe the classroom everyday upon pick up as I can see her classroom through the library as I wait in the school foyer. It's quite noisy, scattered and chaotic, even when I'm there 30 or more minutes before end of day.

You can ask for your daughter to be tested with the CCAT. You might be able to away from colouring and work on French reading.
I am a Special Education teacher, so I know all about testing - I might not stay in this board, so I wouldn't pursue this avenue at all as I wouldn't want to cost them any unnecessary money. I highly doubt they would do this either at such a young age (we don't do it in my board at this young age). I administer CCAT to my highschool students, but I teach in the opposite board. Thanks for the suggestion, but I don't think this is the way to go. I am going to ask the teacher this week though if my DD can work on French reading while the other kids are coloring and playing. My DD is begging for work, so this would be a good compromise, so thanks for the suggestion - it's on my list to discuss with her teacher.

You can also ask for the phone number of the school social worker and ask him/her to come in and observe the classroom.
My board and this board are underserviced - we only have floating social workers, as there is no money for a school social worker on a permanent basis. I'm not sure what this would solve either as there are more pressing areas in which the social worker needs to be involved in.

I have been fighting with the english public board for a while and youngest son did two years of FI before he decided to that he want to move to english. (His grade 1 teacher was wonderful but it took the kids a while to adapt her style. The class was 1/2 split with 6 gifted kids in the grade 1 class. LOL)
Good for you as a parent for being so involved in your child's education! I teach at-risk kids, and so parents are pretty much non-existent in my school, so good for you. Thanks for your insight - it sounds like you have had some similar experiences. Not sure why people are who not compassionate or nurturing are kindergarten teachers? Not sure if this is your experience, but this is definitely our experience. It's like they are creating little French robots and I don't care for that. Best of luck with your son!

Thanks, Tiger

 

[Tiger926]

.

 

[ilandrazdsw]

My heart goes out to you and you DD. DS is in the same position...bored with some academics and too challenged by others (he's 5 1/2, gr 1...Bah system). Kids will grow up soon enough and the last thing schools/teachers should want it to push to the point of behaviors/not liking the subject (or school in general). Your DD seems to have a really good grasp of education and maturity...could you explain to her to that when she is bored (from known material) to take out a personal book or draw/color?
I was (SAHM for now) a sp ed teacher and it really floors me that teachers still teach to the middle or even more "basic." I wish teahers would realize that before they "complain" about a child's behavior they need to look at the whole picture...what is the child doing/lesson when the behavior begins, what is the teacher doing/how is she acting, and what is going on in the class/with other kids. Amazing how a little concious effort can answer questions. I would guess it is really embarassing when a parent points out the obvious in not so many words.
It would be interesting to find out if the teacher was like this before going on maternity leave, or if it is "issues" of motherhood (lack of sleep, concerns about child, wanting to be home with child) that have maybe changed her attitude/style. If so it is totally understandable, but not acceptable. JMO

 

[rodeo65]

Hi Tiger. Wow this thread jumped at me, although our issues are different, I can relate to your child developing anxiety / unhappiness around school. (and sorry this response ended up being longer than I intended) We have several issues that we are dealing with in terms of our son and his schooling (which also impacts our daughter). We've just changed schools this year for the second time. DS is 7 and DDis 6. They started in Montessori when our son was 3. DD started a year later. Two years later we decided he was just a little boy who needed more structure than Montessori provided. Child directed education is great if your child directs...he did not.

We then moved to an independent school, not realizing the difference between for and not for profit independents. Essentially, we were well sold during our "tour" of this school. His first year (SK) there was reasonable due largely to his amazing teacher, althought the directors and principal really were unkind to him. By his grade one year the stress he was being put under emotionally from these women was out of control and he was developing anxious behaviour including nightmares, extreme reluctance to get up and go to school in the morning, teeth grinding and chewing his tie to pieces. He also was acting out socially. When we'd ask him about it he'd say no one is nice to him so why should he be nice to them.

By April of last year we'd had enough and started looking into the school we had intended to send him for high school. They are independent JK-12 as well as Montessori, and have been a godsend!!! We made the switch for this, his grade two year. The transition took a bit after all he had dealt with and he really challenged his teacher at first, but they have been phenomenal; teacher, principal and learning services coordinator. Everyone has his best interests in front of them. And they respect him - he feels this difference. He has gone from being a very unhappy, anxious and kind of obnoxious boy to an absolute joy. He no longer struggles to get going in the morning, has made friends and has quit most of the oral anxiety.

My feeling is that it is sooo important to find the right fit early on. As we went through these past few years, my father told me over and over how his grade 3 teacher had put him off school entirely and it wasn't until he dropped out at 16 and realized what the real world was like that he went back, finished and developed an appreciation for education. I agree with pp who said that kids have to learn to adapt to different personalities and teaching styles, but 5 (or 6 or even 7) is so young to understand that teachers are people too. My son was completely overwhelmed by the feelings of fear and anxiety that those directors and principal instilled in him that his personality changed. I am so happy that he is returning to the sunny boy we know him to be.

Your daughter seems well adjusted in the fact that she says she understands that the teacher is tired with a new baby, but that doesn't mean her day is pleasant. It's my experience with our own situation that your daughter's peace of mind is really important to her thriving at school, regardless of her abilities. Our son is extremely advanced in some areas and struggles with others which also throws some challenges into the mix, but the right staff "gets" that and works with him.

I wish you luck in finishing this school year and deciding on the best course of action for next. Oh, and fellow Ontarian too.

 

[seashoreCM]

I am going to add another two cents worth. I have only my own childhood experience, i.e. zero parenting experience, but I will say it anyway.

Teeth grinding and tie chewing mean something is really going wrong. When th child is really upset about going to school in the morning, then something is at least somewhat wrong. Suggesting that teachers are not nice to him means something is somewhat wrong. I would pull the kid from school (even if no Disney trip is involved) for at least a few days while trying to sort things out.

You really need to spend a day observing what goes on in class.

 

[mjkacmom]

To be honest, my biggest concern would be that my child was mean to other children, making them cry, and causing them to not want to play with my child, to such an extent, that the teacher had to have a conference with me. Especially so young! I've had children in public school for almost 7 years, and yes, we've encountered teachers that weren't the greatest (my oldest dd was bored to death with her rigid, uncreative, and somewhat mean 1st grade teacher, but she learned that all teachers aren't the greatest, and we still need to behave, which wasn't easy for her).

None of my children learned must academically until about the 3rd grade - they started school knowing what they needed to know by the end of kindergarten - but I think it's important to learn how to get along with others, follow directions, control impulses, follow directions, etc.

 

[Nanu57v]

I've read through your post, and feel bad for your situation. It seems like the French school is amazing "in theory" but not now. I'd switch her at the earliest possibility. I had a negative Kindergarten experience, and though I still excelled in school, I'm still (at 29 years old) terrified of my K teacher when I bump into her.

 

[Tiger926]

.

 

[rodeo65]

Hi Seashore and Tiger, I think there was a mix up. It was my son who had the problem with the grinding and chewing, not Tiger's daughter. And yes, we certainly did move him. His new school and staff are amazing and all of the stress caused anxious behaviors have been eliminated.

 

[Sillyminny40]

My ds12 was in a huge class of 30+ kids and they split the two classes into 3.
He was always in trouble, being yelled at (yes he is bright and finishes quickly and then bored), being sent to office.
THEN the split and he got a new teacher. Wonderful, kind, quiet man who just is terrific with these kids. Seems the two teachers "dumped" most of the kids they did not want with him. Albeit they are in a smaller class.

Teachers DO have conflicts so change, do whatever you have to to make it better. I am a former jr high teacher. All the best.

 

[Tiger926]

Hi Seashore and Tiger, I think there was a mix up. It was my son who had the problem with the grinding and chewing, not Tiger's daughter. And yes, we certainly did move him. His new school and staff are amazing and all of the stress caused anxious behaviors have been eliminated.

That's good to hear. Glad all worked out with your son.

My ds12 was in a huge class of 30+ kids and they split the two classes into 3.
He was always in trouble, being yelled at (yes he is bright and finishes quickly and then bored), being sent to office.
THEN the split and he got a new teacher. Wonderful, kind, quiet man who just is terrific with these kids. Seems the two teachers "dumped" most of the kids they did not want with him. Albeit they are in a smaller class.

Teachers DO have conflicts so change, do whatever you have to to make it better. I am a former jr high teacher. All the best.

Oh, yes, I know all about teacher conflicts as part of my job as a Special Education teacher is to work with teachers and students in ways to resolve these conflicts. That's highschool though, and working with young children is harder in this respect. We spoke again a bit ago about being mean as we read a book with a mean person in it (by the way, my DD is using mean words, not any physical issues at all) or a 'bully' as my DD called him. She said sometimes she is mean with her friends, and they are mean with her, but she promised to not be so mean. I reminded her that she needs to not be mean at all, so we'll see. Teacher seemed to allude to the fact that it's typical stuff like: "I"m not your friend" and "I can do it better than you". I'm sure it's because this is a way to control the situation for my DD, like a defense mechanism. It's not acceptable in our home, so we are working on her to understand that it's not acceptable anywhere - that's hard at this age as this age appropriate behaviour according to everything I read, see and hear. They had issues at her morning school, and teacher is constantly working it out with boys and girls, each and everyday in a variety of strategies. I'll find out from new teacher how she is handling it - she says just using timeouts, which I know do not work, so I am going to work with her on figuring out another consequence.

Thanks so much, Tiger

 

[Tiger926]

Update

We have decided to remove our DD from this school effective this Friday. She will stay at her Montessori school full time, in the same classroom (she has a phenomenal teacher) for most of the time, except for 2 afternoons a week in a much less intensive French Immersion classroom down the hall. Spoke with classroom teacher and VP from French school today, and they seemed disappointed as they said that my DD is very bright, and shouldn't be having issues with the French language. This is my point, but I don't think they got it - it's not cognitive issue at all.

We spoke about all of the problem areas I have with the school being so huge, overcrowded, program is much more intensive then they presented to us, lack of academic focus in kindergarten, etc., but I couldn't really discuss with teacher her need to be more compassionate, patient and nurturing, as that is just not something that you can really discuss. She is coming back from maternity leave, and I know that it's hard for her at the moment.

She felt badly and disappointed, but then said that it sounded like we thought very much about this important decision, and she respected it very much. Once she heard that our DD was having nightmares about her class and didn't want to attend, she realized that it was much worse of a situation than I had spoken to her about. Actually, yesterday at my DD's Montessori school, she had issues when it got ready for them to walk across the street as she said she didn't want to go to her French school, so her Montessori teacher emailed me last night very concerned.

At this point, we are very happy with our decision. Our DD hugged us profusely, and it looked like a great weight had been lifted off of her shoulders as we spoke about it. She made the teacher a beautiful card and handmade a beaded bracelet for her - she painstankingly picked out each bead!

I am proud of us for making this difficult decision, but it needed to be made as this school was not a good fit for our DD. We are going to enroll her in Montessori elementary for next year as well, so at least we have the next few years to make the right decision in regards to her educational pathways.

Thanks to all for your insight and words of wisdom, Tiger

 

[Nanu57v]

Happy to see it worked out!

Update

We have decided to remove our DD from this school effective this Friday. She will stay at her Montessori school full time, in the same classroom (she has a phenomenal teacher) for most of the time, except for 2 afternoons a week in a much less intensive French Immersion classroom down the hall. Spoke with classroom teacher and VP from French school today, and they seemed disappointed as they said that my DD is very bright, and shouldn't be having issues with the French language. This is my point, but I don't think they got it - it's not cognitive issue at all.

We spoke about all of the problem areas I have with the school being so huge, overcrowded, program is much more intensive then they presented to us, lack of academic focus in kindergarten, etc., but I couldn't really discuss with teacher her need to be more compassionate, patient and nurturing, as that is just not something that you can really discuss. She is coming back from maternity leave, and I know that it's hard for her at the moment.

She felt badly and disappointed, but then said that it sounded like we thought very much about this important decision, and she respected it very much. Once she heard that our DD was having nightmares about her class and didn't want to attend, she realized that it was much worse of a situation than I had spoken to her about. Actually, yesterday at my DD's Montessori school, she had issues when it got ready for them to walk across the street as she said she didn't want to go to her French school, so her Montessori teacher emailed me last night very concerned.

At this point, we are very happy with our decision. Our DD hugged us profusely, and it looked like a great weight had been lifted off of her shoulders as we spoke about it. She made the teacher a beautiful card and handmade a beaded bracelet for her - she painstankingly picked out each bead!

I am proud of us for making this difficult decision, but it needed to be made as this school was not a good fit for our DD. We are going to enroll her in Montessori elementary for next year as well, so at least we have the next few years to make the right decision in regards to her educational pathways.

Thanks to all for your insight and words of wisdom, Tiger

 

[rodeo65]

Glad you found a decision that worked for you. It's wonderful that your daughter is happy with the change, it will make it a much easier transition.

Our son was absolutely happy with changing schools, although there was a little bit of adjustment for the first month or so but he was starting grade 2 and had some established friendships that he was missing. Your daughter is going to be in the Montessori that she is already accustomed to so I'm sure will be happy all around.