OT- carseat experts please weigh in- update pg 3 thanks

[tjmw2727]

My neice is just under 2years old and about 24 lbs and currently in a convertable carseat. It is the type that can be used both front and rear facing and up to 40lbs. She is front facing and constantly getting out of the seat while my sil is driving.

My neice can lower the chest clip enough to roll her shoulders forward and get out of the 5 pt harness. My sil has tried everything to get her to stay in but she is really too young to understand.

My sil thinks that if she can keep the chest clip in the proper place my neice won't be able to escape. Our only thought is to tie a knot in the harness just under the proper place for the chest clip so my neice can't slide it down.

Obviously my sil is concerned with compromising the safety of the seat - which of course does no good at all when dn escapes. It has gotten to the point where she can't take a car ride as dn is out of the seat every 5 minutes.

Is there a product she could try to keep the child in the seat? Unfortuantely, they don't have alot of $$ right now so buying a new seat is a last resort, of course they will do it if there is no other alternative.

FWIW - my sil has tried rewards for staying in the seat but the comprehension just isn't there yet.

Any ideas or advice would be greatly appreciated.

TIA
TJ

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

How the heck is a kid "escaping"????

She needs to get a new car seat and a zero tolerance policy.

This is not meant to be a flame---but she just should NOT be able to escape.

If anything--that car seat strap should be pulled as tight as possible----(like no fingers will fit in at all)---b/c surely that is less dangerous than a kid who just doesn't get it.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Did a google--perhaps some of these posts have a tip you could use:

know you said you tightened up the straps. You should make sure only 1 finger of yours fits between the baby's shoulder and the strap of the seat. Also another thing I see incorrect with a lot of seats is the chest clip psition. Make sure it is at arm pit level. If you make sure you do these 2 things it may help. Otherwise check out this site http://messageboards.ivillage.com/iv-ppcarseats?redirCnt=1 there are lots of people there that know more about seats than I do. Good luck. Melinda
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Houdini's mom, you might need to tighten the shoulder staps even more. The recommendation (I'm a car seat safety technician) is that the straps should be tight enough so that you can only fit 1 finger underneath the stap at the chest/collar bone--that's pretty tight. Turning the car seat around is not going to make a difference, unless she's trying to get out to see you. On that note, you may turn the car seat around if your child is 1 year AND 20lbs--both of these criteria need to be met, not just being 1 year. As an FYI, I'm not familiar with any after market product that will help, however if you do find something, please remember that after market products have not been crash tested with the seat. Good luck. Dana
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Maybe a convertible car seat would work better for you, assuming your baby is the correct age/weight/height to be in the forward-facing position. I'm not familiar with the particular seat you mention, but rear-facing carseats are NEVER safe facing forward - they are not designed fto be secured into the car in that position. Are you sure the seat's straps are through the correct slots for the best fit? Is the slide-buckle up high enough (armpit level)? Maybe you could get an expert to help you assess the fit. RK
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Make sure the shoulder straps are at the right height. As you know, there are three (I think) slots to choose from in threading the shoulder straps through the seat. I was told by the owner at Rockridge Kids (who seems very educated on car seat stuff) that you should choose the slot either at or below the point your child's shoulders sit, so that there is not a lot of space (if any) between the top of the child's shoulder and the point at which the shoulder strap comes out of the seat. Not sure if this adjustment is the cause of your child being able to escape, but worth checking. I don't see how turning the car seat around would make a difference. Best of luck. Tracy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Preventing 2-year-old from opening carseat buckle
Apr 2004
My 2-yr old has figured out how to easily unlatch the chest strap on his carseat (a Britax Roundabout) and now does so frequently while the car is going. Although we continue to try all sorts of behavioral strategies, he's just turned 2 and we're not having great success -- and trips can take forever, with us pulling over every time this happens. Does anyone know of an actual physical gizmo meant to block kids from opening these kinds of latches? Jen


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We had the same problem. I went to Rockridge kids, and Britex makes a snap on piece for this, they gave it to me free. Sally
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
While I haven't had this problem with my two girls in their Roundabouts, I've heard of other people securely duct-taping the two sides of the buckle together, but so that it still slides up and down. Then you can just slide the two stuck pieces down so the straps can be lifted over the child's head to get in and out. Heidi
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When my son started playing with the carseat buckle, I got a small plastic cover at Rockridge Kids to clip over the buckle. It is really tough to open! (I actually haven't used it though because my son seems to have forgotton about the straps.) I'm sure you can pick one up from any store that sells Britax carseats. Jen

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

One more possibility:

Some children can twist out of harnesses at an early age. Others can easily undo the buckle mechanism. Children may also be able to put too much slack in a seatbelt, and some children don't want to use a child restraint or seatbelt at all. Driving is a dangerous activity, and like any other, it requires proper supervision at all times.

Parents can try many things. You can try calling the manufacturer of your carseat to see if they have a buckle that requires more force to release, or a 2-piece chest clip instead of a "paperclip style" chest clip. Using a seatbelt yourself sets a good example. Refusing to put the car in motion unless the child stays in their restraint is another. Also, try to keep your child entertained or distracted if possible, and NEVER make an exception and allow them not to use their child restraint. For severe cases, you can try a safety vest by E-Z-On (800-323-6598) that may be more difficult to remove.

The vest web-site:
http://www.ezonpro.com/index.shtml

 

[NotUrsula]

I think tying knots would be bad, b/c force would cause slack to develop as the knot was pulled tight.

I solved this problem for $1 when my own son did it, and some people told me that ANY alteration to a seat rendered it unsafe, so I offer this solution with my personal opinion that keeping a child in a seat that has been altered VERY slightly in a way that does not affect harness tension is better than accepting a high risk that he won't be properly strapped in if an accident happens. In my own situation, I considered the alteration I made to be a risk I was willing to accept. Your sister would have to use her own judgement about that issue if she tries this method.

I went to WalMart and bought a $1 bottle of "puffy" fabric paint, which is paint mixed w/ vinyl. It reacts to heat by puffing up and becoming slightly 3-dimensional. I applied several small dots of the paint in a line on the straps in the chest buckle area; just enough so that while the buckle would still slide, it would not do it easily or smoothly. I used a blow dryer to make the paint react and puff after it had dried. DS never escaped again.

 

[tjmw2727]

How the heck is a kid "escaping"????

She needs to get a new car seat and a zero tolerance policy.

This is not meant to be a flame---but she just should NOT be able to escape.

If anything--that car seat strap should be pulled as tight as possible----(like no fingers will fit in at all)---b/c surely that is less dangerous than a kid who just doesn't get it.

Thanks for the google tips I will forward them and check out the link provided.

I explained how she was escaping, the baby pulls the chest clip down to the bottom, rolls her shoulders fprward and slides out the middle. I don't know at this point if a new seat will help. The straps are as tight as they can be and she does have the two part chest clip.

As for a zero tolerance policy - how do you suggest she stop a not yet 2yo from doing this?

When this started happening my sil pulled over and stopped every time to put her back in the seat. As of now she isn't riding in the car at all with the dd unless an adult is in the back seat to stop her. This is zero enough for me

Anyway I look forward to more suggestions on keeping a wee one who dosen't understand better in her CRS, thanks.

TJ

 

[tjmw2727]

Thanks Not Ursula - that could work.

We thought of sewing the chest clip into place but this sounds like it would work with the least amount of compromise to the CRS.

FWIW - the straps are tignt, the clip is high but and its a 2 part but she can slide it down to the bottom. I think if we can keep her from sliding it she won't be houdini any more!

TJ

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Thanks for the google tips I will forward them and check out the link provided.

I explained how she was escaping, the baby pulls the chest clip down to the bottom, rolls her shoulders fprward and slides out the middle. I don't know at this point if a new seat will help. The straps are as tight as they can be and she does have the two part chest clip.

As for a zero tolerance policy - how do you suggest she stop a not yet 2yo from doing this?

When this started happening my sil pulled over and stopped every time to put her back in the seat. As of now she isn't riding in the car at all with the dd unless an adult is in the back seat to stop her. This is zero enough for me

Anyway I look forward to more suggestions on keeping a wee one who dosen't understand better in her CRS, thanks.

TJ

When I read it--I just couldn't believe it.

Zero tolerance is simply not putting up with it as the postings suggested.

I just misread her age--my girls are older and if that happened.....we'd resort to our version of discipline.

 

[tlbwriter]

Do not tie knots in the straps or put anything (like paint) on them. If the harness is already two-finger tight, she might try getting some self-stick Velcro and putting the hook side on the top edge of the chest clip, if that's where the child is pushing. It's uncomfortable to little fingers.

 

[tjmw2727]

When I read it--I just couldn't believe it.

Zero tolerance is simply not putting up with it as the postings suggested.

I just misread her age--my girls are older and if that happened.....we'd resort to our version of discipline.

I understand - I have seen it and I still can't beleive it!! She does it in such a short time, my sil buckles dear neice in and by the time she gets in front, starts to buckle her seat belt and looks into the rearview DN is out.

Keep in mind that sitting beside my dear neice is my 4yo dear nephew - in a 5 point harness and happy as a clam. Like I said, for now, she isn't riding in the car without an adult in the backseat. Not to convenient but necessary!

They are going to try taking the seat out of the car to"practice" in the home to see if they can change the habit.

tlb - I am not sure I know what you mean, the chest clip isn't flat. Its rounded and clips together in the middle.

It looks like the one in the ad for these covers. I am also not sure a rough feeling would stop her
http://www.gracobaby.com/catalog/pr...arness Covers&modelNumber=AC013&CategoryID=13
I have some stickey back velcro on hand so I will check it out.

TJ

 

[stacy6552]

I hate to sound judgemental on the DIS, but then again your friends not a Disser so here goes.....She's not seriously loosing to a two year old is she? She's not too young to understand a good solid, "NOOOOO!" 2 year olds are able to predict consequences if they are consistant.

 

[tlbwriter]

tlb - I am not sure I know what you mean, the chest clip isn't flat. Its rounded and clips together in the middle.

In that case, just try to put it wherever she is putting her fingers. Also, I'm sure they've already tried this, but just in case... does she have something to hold or play with to keep her hands busy?

 

[tjmw2727]

I hate to sound judgemental on the DIS, but then again your friends not a Disser so here goes.....She's not seriously loosing to a two year old is she? She's not too young to understand a good solid, "NOOOOO!" 2 year olds are able to predict consequences if they are consistant.

Ok - no one is loosing anyone, I am not even sure you read my post??

My neice is getting out of her carseat in the car. I am looking for solutions to help my sister in law keep her daughter secure in the carseat. Not disipline advice as my sil is very good at that.

My neice is not yet 2 and my sil is working very hard to teach her to stay in the seat. In the meantime it isn't something we are willing to trust her life on so for now. As I have said three times now... my neice is not riding in the car without an adult beside her to keep her in the seat.

So if you have advice on keeping her in the seat I am all ears.

THanks
TJ

 

[tjmw2727]

In that case, just try to put it wherever she is putting her fingers. Also, I'm sure they've already tried this, but just in case... does she have something to hold or play with to keep her hands busy?

Ok - worth a try. One of the things SIL is trying is having special "safe" carseat toys that can only be used in the carseat. Unfortunately, my neice really dosen't get that concept yet. Great idea to practice when sil has the seat inside though - thanks.

TJ

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Ok - no one is loosing anyone, I am not even sure you read my post??

My neice is getting out of her carseat in the car. I am looking for solutions to help my sister in law keep her daughter secure in the carseat. Not disipline advice as my sil is very good at that.

My neice is not yet 2 and my sil is working very hard to teach her to stay in the seat. In the meantime it isn't something we are willing to trust her life on so for now. As I have said three times now... my neice is not riding in the car without an adult beside her to keep her in the seat.

So if you have advice on keeping her in the seat I am all ears.

THanks
TJ

I understood what she was saying---I would have screamed so loudly--they would have heard me all around the world. At that age--it frightens them, perhaps makes them cry....but by golly it works.

Not that I'm suggesting to terrorize the child or anything . But when I raise my voice over a safety issue with my kids--they heed and they do not repeat.

I think that is what that poster meant and what I was trying to get at.

Over 18 months..a child can begin to learn right from wrong.

For example--in the house...does she open locked doors, escape the high chair? Does she say No a lot and not listen? If yes, it is an overall problem.

Or is the car seat the only venue that she does this in? If it is--then whatever discipline is applied in the house needs to be applied in the car.


Another thing--what if they brought a DVD player into the picture---and it can only be played if she stays locked?

 

[tjmw2727]

I understood what she was saying---I would have screamed so loudly--they would have heard me all around the world. At that age--it frightens them, perhaps makes them cry....but by golly it works.

Not that I'm suggesting to terrorize the child or anything . But when I raise my voice over a safety issue with my kids--they heed and they do not repeat.

I think that is what that poster meant and what I was trying to get at.

Over 18 months..a child can begin to learn right from wrong.

For example--in the house...does she open locked doors, escape the high chair? Does she say No a lot and not listen? If yes, it is an overall problem.

Or is the car seat the only venue that she does this in? If it is--then whatever discipline is applied in the house needs to be applied in the car.


Another thing--what if they brought a DVD player into the picture---and it can only be played if she stays locked?

Yes - ok it was the loosing her thing that I didn't understand.

Good questions, she dosen't say no much and listens fairly well. This is a dear almost 2yo that plays happily by herself, is easy going, sits at the table and eats very well, in a chair or highchair. IMHO she has appropriate behavior for a 2yo - except for this one issue. I thinkmy sil is a great mother.

In any case, I hate to sound snarky but I really am not looking for discipline advice. I don't think it my place to tell my sil how to disipline my neice - IMHO its not my business.

I didtell her I would ask her for advice on the carseat as I usually get great input from my fellow disers.

She does have a DVD player in the van but they only use it on long trips. Besides not using it would not be fair to her brother - who is 4 and loves his carseat.

TJ

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Hmmmm...don't know. Wonder if a police station could be of any help?

I would hesitate anything added to the seat that in an emergency makes it difficult to remove the child.

That vest found earlier might be the best bet. It might be prudent for your SIL to call and check it out and confirm with a car seat safety expert if it can safely be used.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

She does have a DVD player in the van but they only use it on long trips. Besides not using it would not be fair to her brother - who is 4 and loves his carseat.

TJ

I know you don't want to provide discipline advice...

Sometimes it isn't fair but has got to be.

 

[tjmw2727]

Hmmmm...don't know. Wonder if a police station could be of any help?

I would hesitate anything added to the seat that in an emergency makes it difficult to remove the child.

That vest found earlier might be the best bet. It might be prudent for your SIL to call and check it out and confirm with a car seat safety expert if it can safely be used.

Thanks - I was looking at the vests and is shows older kids - preschoolers without a CRS. Are these used with a traditional CRS or instead of - I wonder. Despite the challenge I think my sil would prefer a seat with side and top protection.

I remember when a friend had a problem with her son unbuckling she got a cover and problem was solved. I was hoping I could find a product like that for sil and dear neice but nothing looks right

Hopefully the inside the house "teaching marathon" will be successful!

TJ

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

How about a new car seat that has a bar that goes over the head--so even if the arms come out of the chest harness...she's still stuck in the car. When she stops...she can move back to her "big girl" car seat.

A harness shield combination system can have either a T-shield (attached to the shoulder straps) or a tray-shield (swings down over the child s head). Harness/shield combinations were marketed as being more convenient than a 5-point harness to use and the shield does help to keep the straps flat.

The big padded bar of the swing-down tray-shield looks safer to some parents, but in fact is no safer than a 5-point harness or T-shield. In fact, the tray shields are generally more difficult to adjust to the correct snugness on many children and no type of shield is recommended for very small infants. In a small vehicle, the tray-shield may not be able to swing all of the way up to get the child in and out of easily. In addition, children tend to get too big for the tray-shield before they reach the seat's upper limit and they do not allow as much freedom of movement for the child to read books or play with toys.

For very small babies, a seat with either type of harness/shield system should not be used. This is because it will not allow for as snug a fit as a 5-point harness and the infant's face or chest could possibly contact the shield.