Opinions Wanted: Take son or leave home?

[momshadow]

everybody on here has made really good points but the one thing that sticks out for me is whether or not you will have to pull him out of school...you haven't replied to that yet....if his grades are bad and you are pulling him out of school then it is definitely not a good idea to take him...but if the trip is not going to interfere with school then you should and use it as a time where you can talk to him and find out whats going on....

Ok , Ive been there done that with two teen boys. You have to remember that they are becoming "men". There will be constant struggles between the fact that he wants to be in charge and the leader of the pack, and that he know he cant live without you. I know that you think he doesn't mind if he gets to go or not, but what he is really saying is that he needs you more than ever and wants to be part of the family. Ive really been struck lately with the reality of my oldest leaving home and how precious time with them is. And all the family vacas where so worth it and cant be replaced. Ive been lurking around the DCL trip reports and one report hit home so hard that it really reminded me that we don't know how much time we have with our children or our children with us. Yes he needs to know that you expect him to do his best in school, in life and at home. But even thinking of leaving him behind is something that for me wouldn't consider. There is so much more that you can hit the lesson home with. Video games, restriction from friends, no TV, no computer, no music, no bowling Thought I would lighten the mood a little.

 

[bigrich]

As far as school goes he would be missing two days. We have 10 more days to hopefully make the right decision for him.
I guess the message we want for him to get is that we are asking you to do this for us (work hard in school) and we will continue to everything in our power for you. Since you aren't making this a priority then we will hopefully send you the right message that you won't be included in the "fun" stuff until you apply yourself.
Is this asking to much?

It don't help that his birthday is tomorrow either.

 

[eduk8r26]

From the teacher's point of view, if he is going to miss school for any length of time while on the trip, I'd vote "no". An extended vacation with low grades does not go together.

 

[kylieh]

I've been thinking more about this, and I have a couple of other thoughts.

This could serve as a warning to him - "you can come this time, unless your grades don't pick up to a B or C there won't be a holiday again". This may work as you mentioned you go relatively frequently.

If he wasn't expecting to miss a holiday for doing poorly then I don't think he should miss out. It you warned him prior then it doesn't matter.

You know your son better than any of us - on a personal note I was quite rebellious as a teen, and it would of made matters worse if my parents decided to leave me home two weeks before the trip because of my school work without prior warning.

Or, could he miss the first couple of days of the holiday then catch a train/plane to Anaheim by himself (I don't know where you are). His grandparent could put him on the train. He would go to school for those couple of days.

Also, have you discussed this with the grandmother? She may have other plans as you were going to be away?

 

[roxydotty]

Just in case you haven't heard enough advice! Do you know why he is doing bad in school? Not all kids are straight A students, but if it's a lot of D's and F's then he just isn't doing the work. Does he need a tutor and need to be taught how to study correctly? We just cant assume kids know how. Time is set aside every day for study/homework time. Take away tv, video games, time with friends until all homework is done. I just don't think a kid should be kept from going on the family vacation because of their grades. Punish him another way. That's my thoughts!!

 

[brenda1966]

Like Kylieh, if a vacation had been pulled out from under me as a teen, it would have had a very bad effect. It would have thrown me into full blown rebellion mode.

One thing that has not been made clear: Did you tell him months ago that if his report card was bad he would not go on vacation? Did he get a warning? Did he have a concrete consequence that was laid out beforehand?

I think this is where a lot of parenting often mishandled because it is difficult. Springing random consequences on our kids and leaves children feeling angry and betrayed. If the consequence is clear beforehand, then he should suffer it. But if you're suddenly springing the "no vacation" thing on him, then I think it's unfair and disruptive to the family dynamics.

 

[shelemm]

It would never occur to me to link a family vacation with report card grades. Especially if that wasn't spelled out in advance. You received a bad surprise, I know, it's terrible, but your son is still the same bright young man (and good big brother) he was before the bad grades.

Find out what the problem is, and work out a program that will address the problem. A response that does not directly address the problem is unlikely to help.

 

[DesertBell]

I suspect that excluding your son from a family vacation might send him stronger messages than you are aiming for. If this trip was not previously riding on his school performance, than I think it would be unfair to leave him home because of it. Talk to his teachers, work out a plan to help him catch up, and have him do schoolwork on the trip when the rest of the family is relaxing, but please take him.

 

[Lillybelly'sMate]

Maybe someone on this boead can explain to me how rewarding your child when they do something wrong or don't fulfill committments is a good thing. What this comes down to is that you are not willing to teach your child the value of work ethics in exchange for your DL vacation. If you are tell your son (he should be old enough to understand this) that you are going to DL even though he didn't do what he was supposed to, then you are allowing him to fail in life. The message here: it doesn't matter what you do, you will still get to have fun.

You need to make the choice, not him. Either you use this trip to teach him (by not letting him go), or you don't bring DL into the picture at all - find something else to punish him with. I don't care if he needs "familiy time" - you can have family time at home for a lot less money and more often then a once or twice a year trip. You can't try to justify a DL trip as the miracle cure to missing family time lost in the past.

If his grades aren't there, then he doesn't go. If you aren't willing to cancel your trip, then don't threaten him with something you aren't going to follow through with...

 

[abby]

As far as school goes he would be missing two days. We have 10 more days to hopefully make the right decision for him.
I guess the message we want for him to get is that we are asking you to do this for us (work hard in school) and we will continue to everything in our power for you. Since you aren't making this a priority then we will hopefully send you the right message that you won't be included in the "fun" stuff until you apply yourself.
Is this asking to much?

It don't help that his birthday is tomorrow either.

How about asking his teachers for the work he will miss those two days and make him do them before you go? (and of course all the other work that is due before you go) That gives him a reason to get the work done, so he can go.

 

[Harlie]

I have a totally different view.

I think you should just cancel your vacation period and help your son realize his priorities.

If one of our children are acting up and we have something big happening that day as a family we cancel. It is a heavy load for a kid to bear knowing that a fun family activity was cancelled due to their behavior.

I would cancel- period- for the whole family and let your son know that you are not going until one of two things happen 1) he picks his socks up with schoolwork and things are going better and well enough that you won't feel bad for him missing school when he is already struggling or 2) wait until school is out (unless he has to take summer school to get caught up in which number 1 would then reapply)

I may be a mean mom for it but it seems to be the only thing that works in our home for serious behavior.

Also it does not mean that we stop doing things as a family it means we alter what we do to things that can be done at home.

Basically as example the other day we were planning on a trip to Chuck E Cheese's and our DS7 threw a screaming fit/tantrum that night (after they knew of our plans on) While enroute we turned around and went home DS& had a sandwich and went to bed the other two kids stayed up and watched a movie and we ordered in pizza.

DD8 ripped out a page in her agenda that had a note from her teacher about homework that was not done DD did not go to swimming(all kids have lessons at the same time so no one went so she could stay and do her work) or dance lessons until she finally finished her homework.

It is severe but my kids do have a problem with a sense of entitlement and they need to know that they don't need the "extras" and that the family doesn't "need" them Iether. I will say that it does not happen too often that my kids make the same error more then once(they just find new trouble to get into lol!)

 

[Lillybelly'sMate]

Bravo!!!! Bravo!!!!


IAWTP

 

[bigrich]

There is no way it would be fair to his younger brother and sister to cancel the trip. In my opinion he is the one old enough to realize what he is doing and they shouldn't have to bear the burden for his lack of effort. I did consider it though.
Thanks again for letting me know what you would do in this situation. I actually feel like there is no "right answer" for this. He has to learn sometime that hard work gets positive results and lazzines gets negative. Better a lesson through DL than harder lessons down the road.

 

[Zoemakes5]

There is no way it would be fair to his younger brother and sister to cancel the trip. In my opinion he is the one old enough to realize what he is doing and they shouldn't have to bear the burden for his lack of effort. I did consider it though.
Thanks again for letting me know what you would do in this situation. I actually feel like there is no "right answer" for this. He has to learn sometime that hard work gets positive results and lazzines gets negative. Better a lesson through DL than harder lessons down the road.

IMHO, I think that it would not only be "not fair", especially if there's a pretty big age difference between the kids, but also, I think it sends a bad message. I always thought this when I was in school, and that kind of philosophy was used. My thought process on that one was "why should I try and be good and do well if it will make no difference?" someone would always mess it up. As a parent, I can hear "but I was good". I don't think you can send the message "you have to work for it" AND have the philosophy if someone messes up, everyone loses out. Where's the incentive to work for it? Plus, in my house at least, there would be a ton of resentment and bad feelings towards the child that messed it up. As a pre-school teacher for years while I completed my college education, I also think that's alot of power over the family to give to one child. But, that's another discussion entirely.
I know how hard of a decision this has to be for you. I think alot of the responses you've received basically treat a family vacation as an .....well for lack of a better term.....entitlement as a member of the family. I.e. you get to go because you're a member of the family. I personally view anything "extra" that my kids get as a privilege. Most of the time they don't specifically "earn" it (like if they wash the car, they get to go/do xyz), but they have a clear understanding that they will lose privileges if they don't do what they're supposed to do.
Personally, as a teen, if my parents didn't let me go on a trip with the family, whether it be to DL or to the beach, I would have thought "whoa, they're serious here! This is a big deal."
Also, I'm assuming (admittedly, perhaps incorrectly), since you specifically mentioned tracking his grades and talking with him about it, that there was not only bad grades, but some deception or misleading on his part? Maybe not just the poor grades/lack of effort being punished , but the misleading/deception too?
Good luck with whatever you decide! It is sometimes (most of the time!) tough to be a parent!

 

[CoolPool]

I have a totally different view.

I think you should just cancel your vacation period and help your son realize his priorities.

If one of our children are acting up and we have something big happening that day as a family we cancel. It is a heavy load for a kid to bear knowing that a fun family activity was cancelled due to their behavior.

Oh my. I'm glad that works for you! But. If the family vacation depended on my brother's grades we never would have gone anywhere or done anything. He was a C+ at best student with Ds on bad days. Good grief, we'd have become like those families where the son shows up with a shotgun later. Instead, we did family vacations and found his other strong points in good time. He eventually graduated from a very good university, holds a professional job, and has a beautiful home on a resort island in Florida.

Not every decision has to involve the nuclear option. My additional 2 cents.

 

[Disneyenthusiast]

IMO, the time together as family is the most important thing. Grades come and go, but family is forever. Do not let a temporary situation like grades get in the way of lifetime memories (and resentments).

 

[brenda1966]

Wow, in reading some of these responses, i'm glad I didn't grow up in those families!

Cancelling a family vacation because of one child's behavior? Not only is that cruel to the other child, it gives the child who acted badly too much power in the family. I can't even imagine the kind of family dynamics it creates when one child has the power to cancel a family outing because of bad behavior.

I like the idea above that vacations are an entitlement that everyone in the family gets to enjoy. A vacation is as much for ME as it is for my child. There's nothing that she could do that would spoil or cancel my vacation!

Now, her playing video games or watching TV is not something for ME, so that I would take away for her bad behavior because it does not effect me.

So, if you leave your child home for DL, how is that going to help his grades? This is what I'm missing here. It's simply punitive. And it punishes not only him, but the rest of the family and that's why I have a problem with it. It doesn't solve anything, it just creates a lot of bad feelings.

What changes are going to be made in his day to day life that will enable him to bring up his grades? That's where your solution lies, IMHO.

Oh, and 30 years from now do you really want him telling the story to his kids how "mean old Grandma didn't take me to Disneyland because I got a D on my report card?" LOL.

 

[Harlie]

How does it not solve anything when the problem is a child is failing in school. You would seriously pull your kid out of school for 2 days when they are doing poorly and struggling for a family vacation? I don't see that benefits the child. Waiting until the child is improving and postponing it until that time would help the stuggling child.

When it comes to school, in a family if one person is failing the family as a whole is failing. It is up to the parent to get the child the support and encouragement they need to do well or atleast improve.

It also depends on what ones idea of doing poorly is, if a child is failing with F's they need tutoring and extra help and they absolutly do not need to be missing school for any reason. If it is an "average student" that has alsways been an "average student" then I see no problem at all. If it is a "A's and B's student that is suddenly stuggling they need help too and do not need to be missing school. Taking a child out out of school when they are stuggling is just not right no matter how it affects the other people in the family.

I also never went to DL as a kid and I never turn to guns or violence in highschool. If it was a requirement for every child to see Dl in their lifetime to makesure they didn't turn out to be depressed psycopaths then everyone would have gone as a child. Realistically it is not possible for all family's to go and it is also not fair to leave your struggle child behind to be some one else's responsibility when they need their immediate family's help, when stuggling in school. The OP DS is 13 not 16, he is still a child and will still make bad choices unless he is continuously monitored. A 13 year old will no the difference between right and wrong what they lack is the knowledge of consequences that will come about from a bad choice they can not fathom all of the consequences long term from failing school and it is a parents responsibility to help them or help them get the extra help they need.

I hope that my rambling made sense.

As for "punishing the rest of the family" My kids are happy playing board games or reading to us or reading as a family or movie nights just as much as vacation, yes mind you they are still young and not 13, yes they understand that the rest of the family misses out on an activity but they feel bad about it and will often try to make it up to their siblings. As for the innocent children, yes they are disappointed, but they would rather stay at home and make sure their sibling doesn't throw a fit out side of a home or that their sibling doesn't fail. They are explained to why a family outing was cancelled and why it was important do stay home, and they understand and are happy to rent a movie and eat popcorn instead. Again maybe this is because they are still young who knows but it works for us and there is no resentment and I have no worries about my kids going postal about it.

 

[shelemm]

Maybe someone on this boead can explain to me how rewarding your child when they do something wrong or don't fulfill committments is a good thing.
If his grades aren't there, then he doesn't go. If you aren't willing to cancel your trip, then don't threaten him with something you aren't going to follow through with...

Fair enough, I will try to explain. Good grades in school are not something you get or don't get based on sheer dint of effort, like cleaning your room. Don't clean your room, and you get grounded, fair go.

But let's say there is an underlying problem. Disorganization, for example. Threatening consequences is not going to teach someone how to be better organized. If you don't address the problem, all the consequences in the world will do little good.

A good, smart student can get bad grades for a variety of reasons. Sheer reinforcement/punishment cannot address many of those reasons.

 

[Harlie]

Fair enough, I will try to explain. Good grades in school are not something you get or don't get based on sheer dint of effort, like cleaning your room. Don't clean your room, and you get grounded, fair go.

But let's say there is an underlying problem. Disorganization, for example. Threatening consequences is not going to teach someone how to be better organized. If you don't address the problem, all the consequences in the world will do little good.

A good, smart student can get bad grades for a variety of reasons. Sheer reinforcement/punishment cannot address many of those reasons.

I agree if a child is struggling there is usually an underlying problem hence my idea of staying home/postponing the family vacation untill the problem has been properly addressed and they child is improving. I just don't see pulling a struggling kid out of school for a vacation being beneifical.