OK, I'll say it... we are too sensitive

[LSUmiss]

My 94 year old grandmother uses the term “colored” as well. When I tell her that’s racist, she responds by saying she can’t be racist because she has 2 great nieces she adores who were adopted from Africa. I know she isn’t being intentionally racist, but her refusal to change when confronted by it is frustrating.

I think this sums up the thread. It’s fine to not know. It’s not fine to refuse to change once you know &, worse, justify it b/c that’s how it was & you didn’t know. I don’t mean your grandmother directly just your comment about it.

 

[sam_gordon]

Silly stunts like sexual assault

The thing is I do think sometimes it gets out of hand, but the bigger change is that you can’t hide from reprehensible acts anymore b/c info is out there & will get out. No one is perfect, of course, but most the of things that get dug up that become a big deal should have always been a big deal. In the age of social media, there is no way to hide for long.

But at what point does it not matter any more? Should it have been a "big deal" back then? Possibly, depending on what you're talking about. But people change. You've changed, I've changed, we've all changed. From our values to our morals to our ethics to our beliefs. Every one of us has changed to a certain degree. So at what point do our former beliefs no longer matter to what is going on today? Or should everyone be expected to apologize publicly for every "bad thing" we've done?

 

[LSUmiss]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colored

The acceptable term for a person of color at the time of your grandparents (like my own born in 1918 and 1920) was colored. That's why it was still used until most recently by older generations and I can't fault them for that as new terminology does take time to work through the populace.

And this is a good example of how things change. I don’t think anyone would advocate for a statue to come down b/c someone used the word colored at a time that it was the acceptable term. But being racist was never ok even if ppl were (are).

 

[LSUmiss]

I believe social ideas and terminology change absolutely. But sticking to outdated terms and ideals is pretty bigoted.

As a non-racial example. I’m an older millennial. When I was growing up Mentally retarded or retarded was proper terminology (and as I grew up was also used in a derogatory manner). It has since become an outdated term in favor of intellectual disability or referring to the specific disability such as Down’s Syndrome. Retarded is only considered an insult and has become a pretty ugly word.

For me to say “well, it was fine when I was growing up. Calling somebody mentally retarded is a medical term” I’d just sound like an *******. Just like saying well saying colored people was fine and refusing to adapt makes you a racist in 2019.

Perfect example, but there are ppl out there who would say you’re being too sensitive.

 

[LSUmiss]

But at what point does it not matter any more? Should it have been a "big deal" back then? Possibly, depending on what you're talking about. But people change. You've changed, I've changed, we've all changed. From our values to our morals to our ethics to our beliefs. Every one of us has changed to a certain degree. So at what point do our former beliefs no longer matter to what is going on today? Or should everyone be expected to apologize publicly for every "bad thing" we've done?

I think it depends on the severity of the behavior.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I think this sums up the thread. It’s fine to not know. It’s not fine to refuse to change once you know &, worse, justify it b/c that’s how it was & you didn’t know. I don’t mean your grandmother directly just your comment about it.

I think, though, that people we're expecting to know better, and act better, have to be of sound mind.

Someone in their 90s has a brain that's atrophied and very often is has elements of confusion or dementia.

I'm thinking of a younger patient recently who was spewing horrible racial names to staff, but he was not of sound mind because of a condition he had. My heart broke for these people, but they were professionals and understood that this person couldn't be held to the same standard as that of a person of sound mind.

The question, I suppose, is, how and when do you know whether someone is of sound mind or not?

I also agree with Planogirl and Sam that none of us are perfect but many of us (of sound mind) have grown and changed with the times. But not everyone is up to date on every little thing that others who are on social media and such may be, especially if they're a little older. Others mentioned it earlier in the thread, too, that someday it's going to be US who are being told we're out of touch when we're saying things we know today to be ok. And I think Makenzie is right when she says that racism is more than just using a perhaps out of date word without ill intent.

Again, to me, what's really important is how we actually treat people.

 

[Southernmiss]

I think, though, that people we're expecting to know better, and act better, have to be of sound mind.

Someone in their 90s has a brain that's atrophied and very often is has elements of confusion or dementia.

I'm thinking of a younger patient recently who was spewing horrible racial names to staff, but he was not of sound mind because of a condition he had. My heart broke for these people, but they were professionals and understood that this person couldn't be held to the same standard as that of a person of sound mind.

The question, I suppose, is, how and when do you know whether someone is of sound mind or not?

I also agree with Planogirl and Sam that none of us are perfect but many of us (of sound mind) have grown and changed with the times. But not everyone is up to date on every little thing that others who are on social media and such may be, especially if they're a little older. Others mentioned it earlier in the thread, too, that someday it's going to be US who are being told we're out of touch when we're saying things we know today to be ok. And I think Makenzie is right when she says that racism is more than just using a perhaps out of date word without ill intent.

Again, to me, what's really important is how we actually treat people.

I had a conversation with my 20 year old like this recently.

There are changes he wants to see in his world that he has realized won't happen until some of the older generations are not around anymore.

 

[luvsJack]

Silly stunts like sexual assault

The thing is I do think sometimes it gets out of hand, but the bigger change is that you can’t hide from reprehensible acts anymore b/c info is out there & will get out. No one is perfect, of course, but most the of things that get dug up that become a big deal should have always been a big deal. In the age of social media, there is no way to hide for long.

What are you talking about? I never mentioned sexual assault or anyone who committed such a thing

 

[BLAZEY]

I understand what you are saying, but I'll say again: If you believe that the racists of the time didn't know that they were wrong, and that that was the majority of people in the country, I'm going to say that you are wrong. And to me, that shows that racism was not acceptable, at least not morally, back then. You are, of course, entitled to your own opinion, and that is mine.

Except they had the LAWS of the USA confirming their belief that it was. IF is was so widely seen as wrong and immoral WHY did it take 40+ MORE years to repeal all of the racist laws and not without protest? IF the majority of people felt that it was wrong during that time, the laws would have been abolished much more quickly and without much protest, however neither were true.

 

[DeniseJH]

But at what point does it not matter any more? Should it have been a "big deal" back then? Possibly, depending on what you're talking about. But people change. You've changed, I've changed, we've all changed. From our values to our morals to our ethics to our beliefs. Every one of us has changed to a certain degree. So at what point do our former beliefs no longer matter to what is going on today? Or should everyone be expected to apologize publicly for every "bad thing" we've done?

"So at what point do our former beliefs no longer matter to what is going on today?"

If you are/were a racist: when you've shown reform. When you've owned up to them and shown that you realize those beliefs were wrong. If you are in the public eye, then yes - the apology needs to be public. Otherwise it's between you and your family, friends, etc.. Again, I'm speaking about racism. Every other "bad thing"? Depends on the thing.
Also, not everyone changes.

 

[DeniseJH]

Except they had the LAWS of the USA confirming their belief that it was. IF is was so widely seen as wrong and immoral WHY did it take 40+ MORE years to repeal all of the racist laws and not without protest? IF the majority of people felt that it was wrong during that time, the laws would have been abolished much more quickly and without much protest, however neither were true.

The laws were/are made by the rich and the powerful. Blacks didn't have a vote back then - so your point is invalid.

 

[BLAZEY]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colored

The acceptable term for a person of color at the time of your grandparents (like my own born in 1918 and 1920) was colored. That's why it was still used until most recently by older generations and I can't fault them for that as new terminology does take time to work through the populace.

Same with my grandparents, born in 1922, both have passed away, but I clearly remember them using the term "coloured people".

 

[Pea-n-Me]

"So at what point do our former beliefs no longer matter to what is going on today?"

If you are/were a racist: when you've shown reform. When you've owned up to them and shown that you realize those beliefs were wrong. If you are in the public eye, then yes - the apology needs to be public. Otherwise it's between you and your family, friends, etc.. Again, I'm speaking about racism. Every other "bad thing"? Depends on the thing.
Also, not everyone changes.

Doesn't one show their beliefs through their actions?

 

[BLAZEY]

The laws were/are made by the rich and the powerful. Blacks didn't have a vote back then and neither did women - so your point is mute.

Wrong, women got the vote in the US in 1920.

 

[DeniseJH]

Wrong, women got the vote in the US in 1920.

Yeah, I changed that already.

 

[DeniseJH]

Doesn't one show their beliefs through their actions?

"When you've owned up and shown."

 

[LSUmiss]

What are you talking about? I never mentioned sexual assault or anyone who committed such a thing

I didn’t necessarily mean that you meant that. But that’s among some of the things older ppl are being held accountable for from their pasts.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

"When you've owned up and shown."

What??

 

[luvsJack]

Same with my grandparents, born in 1922, both have passed away, but I clearly remember them using the term "coloured people".

My grandparents did the same thing. Taking a bag of groceries to elderly “colored” lady down the road because she had been sick and couldn’t get out. They helped a lot of people in the community of any race. They were never thought of as anything resembling racist. But they still used the term that was the term of their time.

 

[luvsJack]

I didn’t necessarily mean that you meant that. But that’s among some of the things older ppl are being held accountable for from their pasts.

No it wasn’t what I meant at all. I meant actual stupid college stunts.